WWYD: Dream Job but Toxic Culture
Several months ago I landed what is essentially a dream job for having basically just started my career. Like many of you, I want to do my own small deals and maybe some more complex syndications down the road. My position is great for preparing me for that because (1) the REPE firm I'm at follows an investment thesis I really believe in and want to emulate, (2) the firm is relatively small so I get to dip my hands in a lot of different aspects of the business and gaining valuable experience, and (3) the firm is attracting a lot of outside capital from big names and I've already gotten in on the ground floor. On top of all of this, (4a) my pay is solid and gives me a comfortable life for a single, young professional, (4b) the hours are around 40-45/week, maybe 50 during quarter closes, (4c) there's a good deal of autonomy and freedom to make decisions, and (4d)
All of this said, the culture sucks. There aren't egregious violations of personal boundaries or anything like that. But there's a lot of hostility, hypocrisy/fake smiles, understaffing, high turnover, office politics (stronger: strategizing), and unsurprisingly, little room to build friendships and trust. The absolute worst aspect of the firm, to me, is the hypocrisy. Example: MD will tell a group of employees that he LOVES our firm SO much because we don't play politics and we're all important pieces to the company. Then he'll tell his SVP that so-and-so should watch their step and show more respect to leadership because the person is easily replaceable. (Oh, and side note, the "executive leadership" all trip over each other like toddlers to get the CEO to like them.) (Another side note: You should see the baring of teeth from leadership over the two weeks following someone submitting their notice of resignation.)
The very unfortunate part is that I can't meaningfully change the culture from the bottom-up (without risking my job) and I can't escape participation. As "lucky" as I might be to have a peripheral place in the inner-circle, now I'm just a yes-man because if I just stay silent and try to ignore the politics, my "loyalty" will be questioned and I'll end up being one of their targets (and this group is the one that pulls weight in the company). They (at least some) are literal narcissists, including - might I add - my direct superior.
It's definitely taking a toll on my mood and confidence at work. I watch my step a lot more these says after realizing what goes on behind the scenes. I also can't F'ing wait until the weekend and dread (kind of a strong word at this point in time... probably more like "resist") going into work when Monday rolls around. I'm starting to cherish the 64 hours I have once 5 PM on Friday hits.
I'll leave this question to you all pretty open-ended, as I'd like to get different perspectives rather than answers about what I should do.
What would YOU do?
My advice would be to deal with it and realize that you picked an industry where you'll have to navigate big egos and stupid office politics. It sounds like you're at a good company and need to learn how to play the game and deal with the "narcissists". Hint.. that's pretty much every company and the better you get at stroking egos and dealing with hypocrisy the better you'll do in this industry. Tbh you sound like you're adjusting to the real world and seeing how things actually play out unless I'm missing some egregious behavior from your colleagues. Keep your head down and work hard, if things get too bad you can always look elsewhere.
I'd have an opposite view to CRE_Guy. I'm at a place with a lot of this and it's really grinding me down, each day is pretty attritional. Every firm has big egos at it but there's a big difference between big egos and toxic culture. You can learn to deal with or avoid big egos, toxic culture is hard to avoid as it's typically office or firmwide. Keep working away and look to capitalise on the experience, but keep in touch with recruiters for when good opportunities come up. We spend too much time in work each week to be unhappy with it.
Re the good hours, you joined during a very quiet period. Once markets get back to normal this will most likely ramp up considerably (unless more long tenured employees have said otherwise).
I think part of the issue for me is that it's not clear to me that someone who just started their first job can tell the difference between people having big egos and having a toxic work culture.
It's definitely possible it's toxic, but it could just be they're not used to an office environment where you're going to get some of that regardless.
My advice - jump ship. Life is too short to deal with something you dread 9-5. I was in a similar culture at a PE firm I worked for. It was horrible. I was not a happy camper. I left after a short period. There are many firms you can find that will help you achieve your future goals.
Having worked in environments that turned toxic after great success, nothing you do will change the place.
The consolidation of power occurred. A cultural revolution purged dissent. The perpetrators reap the rewards. The opportunists follow party line. Past key contributors are minimized and scrubbed from the history books.
Glass Onion was a great movie that demonstrates this. Welcome to the side of business they don’t teach in school.
Suggested reading, Google: high conflict personality. Before you enter any relationship (business, love). And if you are a HCP, recognize that and control it. If you suspect a HCP, better to be prepared. Business is a ruthless arena. Corporate Machiavelli is also a good read. He used to post here (until he supposedly died; his Twitter is gone so maybe he did die of his terminal illness; RIP).
I’ve found these observations to be accurate. Something they don’t teach in school.
It sucks but this kind of culture might be more normal than not. This personality / mindset generally succeeds in your industry, impacts culture, cycle on repeat. You may get lucky and find a more positive place but don’t know if it will veer too far into the family / nuturing arena. Need to decide if this is for for you or not. Sorry.
Real estate is not like PE or banking or something where you need a big fund and/or existing infrastructure to be competitive. There’s tons of tiny teams and no name shops where guys are making bank and living incredible lifestyles.
What I’m saying is it’s a big world in terms of options compared to some other fields, so don’t feel like you have to suck it up and deal with a team you don’t like. There’s room to move around, but some combination of deal experience, connections, and luck is the price of entry - that may be the goal of the first job.
So your issue is that the team is understaffed? I mean, the rest of this litany of complaints barely rises to the level of "annoying" let alone toxic. Your job isn't supposed to be a place for you to find lifelong friends. Every workplace has office politics. Who cares if there are "fake smiles".
And yes, when people decide they're going to quit, it upsets senior staff who now have to scramble to backfill those responsibilities and functions.
A lot of this seems to boil down to your inexperience within the workplace in general, rather than this specific firm. The grass is not always greener
Welcome to having a job.
The first major lesson I learned about this industry was the entire sector is filled with big egos, manchildren, and office politics. Not to say it's not in other sectors but this type of personality gravitates towards deal-focused industries.
Your culture does not sound bad, albeit not great, but in fact it actually sounds better than the average considering the great WLB (how can you work 40-45 hours a week but then complain about understaffing?).
There are plenty of companies out there that will be far more cutthroat while working you 60+ hours a week constantly, where every person is directly insufferable to one another's face without even the guise of politeness.
Yeah, OP has this unrealistic expectation of the workplace where everyone gets along and pulls in the same direction, where every second of work done is fulfilling and meaningful and rewarding, and where human nature evaporates into a cloud of good feeling and constructive honesty. All for his benefit, of course.
People suck, and so do workplaces. Dealing with office politics isn't toxic, it's part of every job description, from a lowly fry cook to a Fortune 500 CEO
100%.
OP - another point, I'm willing to bet given the work hours your company is also open to the idea of paternity leave (bold assumption but more to be illustrative of the industry as a whole here). Most companies in CRE still frown upon this concept, whether openly or behind closed doors.
If it's got a toxic work culture where you are dreading Mondays, it's not a dream job, no matter how many other boxes it ticks.
Jesus christ, this Gen Z generation.
You have great hours, great pay, a great company, great autonomy, but your mad becuse the MD is talking behind your back and you're not making friends? This isn't sleep away camp, its a job. Stick with it or go to tech.
This x100. Sigh. Y'all remember when the boomers were complaining about us 10 years ago....safe to say they take it all back now lmao.
I think you put on your big boy pants and man the fuck up. No offense you seem socially awkward and you are letting surface level shit get to you. Its work and its giving you a way better lifestyle than the majority of this country has. I also think you are getting the first taste of real life which is that there is a hierarchy and as a recent grad you are at the bottom. Be grateful you have what you have, just play the game. The way you write about it you are giving the vibe that you feel like you are above it all and guess what...you aren't. Getting upset you have to "watch your step" is soo asinine.
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