Best Bank/Desk Combo? From an IB perspective

Hi,

I was wondering what the best Bank/Desk combo is. For context, I'm more familiar with IB, so I know that in IB, it's groups like PJT RSSG and GS TMT. I promise I'm not trying to gauge prestige, but is there one desk at a bank that is widely considered the best of the best?

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Best desks are rates vol, macro credit, fx vol, equity index vol, distressed credit trading / desk analyst for trading buy side exits. XVA good as well but would put behind the above

A lot of people on this site say things like Citi is better than MS for fixed income. I agree from a market making perspective, but disagree for exits. For the above desks GS, MS, and JPM will have the best talent and produce the most PMs/buy side risk takers even if they’re market making arm technically makes less money than a lower tier bank. It’s like going to Yale vs UW for comp sci, even though UW ranks better for CS, you should go to Yale for the opportunity

 

Thanks for the reply.

I was also wondering if people rank S&T jobs across desks. I completely understand that different desks are interesting to different people, but is there a singular S&T bank + desk combination that has the most “aura” on Wall Street?

For instance, is DB Distressed Credit considered better than HSBC FX, or can you not really compare them in terms of “prestige”?

Again, sorry if this is a very basic question. I’m not really too familiar with S&T at all.

 

it's like comparing apples to bananas. Most aura? GS Rates Vol, might be so. But is that actually the seat that successful EQD traders in MS, eCredit Traders in Barclays,,,etc should/would like to jump ship? I don't think so. THey have completely different career track and their technical skills needs are completely different. (well EQD traders might have some overlap with Rates Vol though)

 

One thing also to add here is that products change. Yes rates is the hot product now but it used to be that for a decade rates stayed flat and rates trading was the most boring desk and traders come in at ten log two trades and leave at two. In a long career trying to optimize for a single product is just kind of pointless. Just find a desk you’re genuinely interested in and be the best at trading exactly that.

 

As someone who briefly dabbled in IB before I switched into S&T (eqd), prestigewhoring works differently in S&T.

There's a larger scope for how different desks operate even within the same product so it's quite difficult to directly compare prestige if you're doing different work entirely. For example, I like eqd, I didn't want to work at ms eqd because you are effectively a button pusher as a junior and don't meaningfully contribute at any point in your career (the desk has been around for a while so the work is pretty routine). Imo the work > the brand is more important for the longevity of your career (I'm still a prestigewhore make no mistake but I remember at uni when I was applying for IB internships I was obsessing over the differences btw gs and ms).

However, on the IB side, prestige is the main differentiator across banks since the work is largely similar so it becomes easier to have these conversations directly comparing desks. 

I might have a convo with someone also in eqd and we're both working on such different niche financially-engineered-on-crack products that our daily workflow looks completely different...

mo monke mo problems
 

Vol desks by far. Any and all vol desks will have great exits primarily because the desks take on loads of risk - biggest thing is you can only hedge so much

You can hedge your delta which changes often, vol is difficult to hedge, and as a dealer you’re usually short gamma (as clients buy options -> you’re short options / gamma). You’ll have theta as well.

Unless you work on a total garbage desk (commercial fx, corporate rate solutions, equity finance, etc) you can have PM type exits. And even with the others - can go work for eg a corp treasury (light job and pays decent and corporations are based in loads of MCOL cities).

Overall a great life man - most desks are better than people make it seem

 

Shortest answer is probs most things at GS (or if you wanted to include the prop shops JS/HRT/SIG). Longer answer below.

What’s the measuring stick for “best”? PnL? That’s going to be incredibly volatile across years and products and In reality your cut is higher making 20 bucks at hsbc than Goldman because they understand there’s seat value. Market share? You can print a lot of trades on a crossed market, you will not make money. Exits? #1 determinant there is going to be were you good at making money in excess of seat value. 


if you ask a index vol guy who the best index vol trader is on the street, he’ll give you an answer. That answer is probably going to change as people move around. if you ask him who the best high yield credit trader is on the street he’ll have no idea. My point is there really isn’t a revered desk at some bank that everyone would drop what they’re doing to join if they had the opportunity. 

 
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