Is my profile good enough for a MSF program in the UK?
I've been following this site for awhile now, but this is my very first post!
I'm a prospective MSF student, and I've applied to several schools in the US, but I'm not feeling stellar about my chances of acceptance, so I'm trying to decide if I should also apply to some programs in the UK. I think that Oxbridge and LBS are way out of my league, so I'm currently considering LSE, Imperial, and Warwick. However, their sites have very little information on class profiles, so it's difficult to tell if I stand an actual chance of admittance. Here's my profile:
GMAT: 710 (Q45 72%, V41 92%, AWA 5)
Exp: 2 years as field examiner/regulator of smaller-sized community banks
UG: 3.63 GPA in Managerial Economics from a non-target, state university
I think what's really killing my chances is my abysmal score on the quant section of the GMAT. I'm even thinking about retaking the GMAT before the deadline for applications, but I'm not sure if I have enough time to study for the GMAT AND put out good applications.
So what does everyone think? Am I a good candidate for these schools? Would it be worthwhile to apply?
It's not abysmal, the quant section is just a lot easier for most people so your percentile is lower. If you check out Anthony's MSF site, there are lots of comments about how recruiting is quite hard for people who don't have prior experience and/or need to have their hand held through a campus recruiting system. You're a good candidate for the top US programs judging by their stats. The only harder to reach ones are Princeton and MIT.
You have a decent chance at LSE, definitely warwick, maybe imperial.
by the way check FT rankings for European business Schools,
Cass is better than imperial, LSE and Warwick... would definitely consider Cass and LSE in your place
LOL good stuff. By the way, I've got a ticket with your name on it to Gordon Brown's 2nd term inauguration address.
If you apply to the top 10 you should land at least 3 or so.
op be careful with smooth_nico, the guy is clearly insecure about going to cass and tries to make-up for it by constantly posting about what a great school it is.
LSE is better than cass. but even if you got into LSE, you will still struggle with recruiting. i don't know what area of finance you want to go in, but i recommend trying to network into a boutique/MM and gaining some direct work experience before doing your masters.
haha i can see why you would say that... but I'm simply promoting Cass, as the leading european business school that it is. I did not discredit other unis in doing so, and LSE is an excellent choice! But for all those considering an MSc Finance, Cass is ranked right up there, and I am happy to give additional insight- having spent 4 years there :)
Smooth_Nico, Cass? Really? Not to be a dick but didn't their placements... suck? I considered taking an MSc there 2 years ago but was turned off by their placement stats. Curriculum, etc, -wise though they are pretty good.
Anyway to the OP, you won't know unless you try right? Your stats are far from awful and I think you'd be competitive for Imperial and Warwick.
And +1 on Anthony's site, good stuff.
I think it's fair to say that LSE being more established, and having a great reputation scores major points for placements.
Cass is getting stronger every year (see rankings), and comparing today's Cass placements, to two years ago, you should see a difference...Cass definitely beats warwick for placements. In the UK if you are not in London, then you wont be exposed as much to the top firms recruitment programmes. Cass vs. imperial is debatable, but FT rankings matter.
As you said curriculum wise, Cass offers the best MSc programmes. They are an up and coming school though, and being realtively new means people discredit Cass- but my fellow classmates all interview at top firms, and you would be surprised how many get jobs vs. LSE, UCL, Oxbridge...
One thing is for sure: Cass is an excellent choice for Finance. In London, you will find that a lot of people at top banks studied there. If you are top of your class at Cass with relevant experience, you will have all the chances of securing that top spot.
I think I have given a fair opinion here- But please keep the feeback/criticism coming guys...
Anyone who says CASS > Imperial, LSE, Warwick does not know what they are talking about.
You are using grammatically wrong English.
Thank you everyone for your responses so far. I really appreciate all the input.
As a follow-up, does anyone have anything to say about how LSE, Warwick, and Imperial place in the US? My goal is to start a career in Asset Management.
Cass is not in the same league as any of the schools mentioned here. Smooth_Nico should sit down because he's talking bollocks. I wouldn't mind but he's doing someone who needs help a massive dis-service.
Wow. I have a masters, lived in 3 continents, employed, but apparently my educated insight is completely bullocks... i doubt that even if I am fond of Cass that you could say that the #3 in UK (after LBS and Oxford) is in a different league...
Luckely for you the FT does a pretty good job at rankings, take that Clarkey:
http://rankings.ft.com/businessschoolrankings/european-business-school-…
Yup... thought so Clarkey
I've never once seen a Cass dude at a BB superday in London. The problem with Cass is that it doesn't have a solid Undergraduate reputation attached to it. Warwick, LSE and Oxbridge do, so Banks and Consultancy firms are more likely to present at these schools where they can access thousands of top students rather than Cass where they'll probably meet about a couple hundred tops.
You must stop mis-represeting Cass on here. Are you on commission?
Plus, the rankings you linked to are full one programme, i.e. a Masters in Management. What about Finance and Economics?
Let me be objective here: LSE >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CASS
Have you thought about the MSc in Regulation (with a focus on finance) at LSE? Seems to fit your profile.
Plus, you get to take graduate-level finance courses as well.
Thanks for the suggestion. My only concern with that would be that it might lump me into the regulator category, and that's something that I want to avoid.
^^^Without even touching what has occurred above...just to give anybody who is thinking of getting an Msc in London and wants to be in the finance industry insight:
When we got resumes in for an advertised position, LSE, Oxford, Cambridge, LBS and top foreign schools (notably HEC) resumes were studied one by one, and the best of those were brought in for interview. All other resumes were tossed immediately without any consideration.
If there were no applicants from those schools or there was a severe problem with any of the candidates, then we moved on to Cass, Imperial, Warwick (and I'm probably forgetting a school or two). All schools below that were tossed without consideration. So Cass put people in that same class, and they would be judged on their interview. If two candidates were equal in everything else (including interview, other stuff on resume, etc.), then Warwick and Imperial were given consideration over Cass.
For the most part, it never came down to step 2, as the first grouping of LSE, LBS, Oxbridge and HEC was always able to fill whatever positions were needed. Obviously there are people from all schools represented in FO in the various institutions in London, and Cass will put you ahead of most other schools, but for the most part it is hard, without some luck, to break in without being from that top tier.
I don't make the rules, I'm just the messenger. It doesn't matter what rankings say or who says what or if somebody got a job here or there from whatever school, the idea is to put yourself in the best position to get a job. Hence, I think the mindset I've described here should be first and foremost in anybody's decision making.
Was this for a New Analyst, though? It seems odd that you'd receive an application from anyone from LBS as I'm not sure they have an MSc programme for pre-experience candidates?
Are you at a BB? Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs have conducted M&A workshops on campus at Warwick. I doubt they'd do this if they didn't consider Warwick in the first bracket you spoke of.
Not BB, but Warwick definitely not in that bracket even among BBs, just ask any of your friends at BB's, it's just a notch below. There really is not much wiggle room on that top tier, it is pretty much well established by now, in the minds of recruiters, as to what it is, and almost everybody in the industry will tell you that. The anecdote I've given applies to new analyst, intern, experienced (2nd year) analyst and experienced associate positions. You are right, it was quite rare to see LBS people apply for new 1st year positions. For the most part, for new analyst spots it was it was that top tier minus LBS (though if somebody from LBS happened to apply, they would certainly be considered.) Then for experienced recruits it was all of the schools in that tier with LBS included. We actually hired one from LBS as a 2nd year analyst, had a few years of experience in FO at another firm (though not in IB.)
Once in a while you would see an LBS resume for first year as there are plenty of well-qualified people who have been out of work long enough and want a job. Also, common if lateralling from another industry.
I'm sure this message may be true in a few boutiques... but I find it hard to believe (considering I interviewed EVERYWHERE) that Cass ppl get tossed out. Actually GS ran interview days just for Cass people in first rounds last year...They did the same for LSE...
LBS also has a pre experience MSc (MSc Management)... i met a few ppl at ACs doing this course
Smooth_Nico. What was your UG institution? Perhaps it was your UG that got you interviews.
Also, the BB interviews you had - when were they and were they for M&A?
UG in Investment & Financial Risk Management (1st) from Cass, MSc at Cass... 3 internships in IBD thru ACs leading to full time in M&A... Cass is up there guys...
There will always be somebody from those Universities (Cass, Warwick) somewhere. But to say that Cass is better than LSE is just plain dumb.
I have met one single person from Cass so far at a BB (did a Masters at Oxbridge afterwards). Warwick people are in there more often though nowhere compared to Oxbridge or LSE.
And in conjunction with those three there are way more people from continental Europe (HEC, SSE, Bocconi, St. Gallen, ESADE) at BBs than form Cass or Warwick.
And according the OPs profile I think you might have a good shot at the Acc & Fin Master at LSE. Also consider Imperial Finance Master and maybe the regulation MSc at LSE as well.
My threads for later.
my roommate had a facebook lying around from his internship last summer at a top BB. Out of a S&T class of 60ish: around 10 were Oxbridge, 10 were LSE, there were about 4 each from UCL, Imperial, Bocconi, HEC and Warwick and then a bunch of randoms. Not one from Cass...
@smooth_nico & rebelcross... is it really that easy? no offence to the OP, but since he's from a non-target UG and the work exp doesnt see too banking focused, wouldnt he have a hard time up against students from targets and those with exp at banks? im asking cause im interested in this as well but not sure if i have a competitive enough background.. thx
I think you should reread what I've said. I keep stressing how much better the top targets are for recruiting and I never said it would be easy, even from one of those big time schools.
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