Negotiating salary for FT return offer?
Given the current market, it is already very fortunate to get a return offer as a SA but would it be frowned upon to negotiate a signing bonus or your base pay?
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Please dont do that....
You should do it. Establish dominance by demanding higher signing bonus and base pay than your peers.
You have the leverage - now is the time to ask. Ask for the perks: membership to John Allan's, endless supply of Voss Water (sparkling, naturally), and (3) Brioni suits. Let them know that you are not replaceable and not a commodity and demand to be paid what you are worth.
Also, increase your seamless allowance to $30
Increase to $30? Do people get under that? Wtf do you eat, lunchables?
Yes
With the negotiating position you're in as a college student holding a full time offer, why wouldn't you negotiate your comp?
Might as well negotiate how far up your ass they shouldn't kick you while exiting the place
The key to negotiation is leverage and in this scenario you have very little(none). I don't suggest trying to negotiate anything, they have a wait list of people willing to take whatever they offer.
I agree with @vik2000 above. After 10 weeks of intern groveling and ass-kissing you must now set the tone for your 2 year analyst stint. You must shatter their current perception of you and replace it with that of the best deal-maker they have ever seen. Someone destined for a direct track to MD. It will be important that you control EVERYTHING in the negotiation process.
First, ask for the correct HR representative (this may take some digging on your part), as well as the most senior person who was involved with your recruiting (probably a VP) to meet you for a very important discussion. Do NOT disclose the purpose.
Set the time. Make sure to show up late.
Set the place. Somewhere outside of the office and even the building you work in. The coffee shop across the street will work fine, no psychological benefit to making them go across the city. Besides you want to keep some of your chips for the actual negotiation process.
Buy the coffee. If they say no buy them the most expensive drink the coffee shop offers, then add 4 shots of espresso.
Create a pitchbook using stolen materials from your SA stint. This will let them know that you have firm secrets. Make sure to hint that their competitor banks have not seen these materials but have expressed great interest and ascribed high value to your inside knowledge of the firm.
Make SURE to let them know that the 6-figure salary they offered your 21-year-old-ass will NOT cover the lifestyle you intend to lead while you are working for their firm. You are a high-value asset, and require funds to let your peers know that, through the purchase of asinine clothing and accessories (like a woman).
Opening point for negotiation: Assure them that you are so EFFICIENT AND EFFECTIVE that it will be like having 2 second year analysts. Convince them that your base should reflect at a MINIMUM those levels. Tell them you are willing to cut part of the $50,000 they will be paying you for your signing bonus as a trade off in base (this will also give you a high starting point for negotiating your starting bonus as well).
I can tell by your post you are a very smart individual and are uniquely driven, as well as being extremely special (your mother was right!). It is very unlikely that out of the other 98% of applicants (according to a recent WSO post) will NOT be able to fill your role. I mean come-on! 10 weeks of learning Cap-Iq is basically a PhD in Quantum Physics!
Please record your negotiation for the success of future WSO monkeys.
SA-12345dicks
I know ya'll are joking. But what about this scenario:
Top ranked intern gets a return offer from his bank but also an FT offer from a megafund (e.g. Silver Lake or KKR). Is he in a little bit of a position to ask for a signing bonus?
But what if he thinks there is a compelling reason to go back to his bank? But at the same time wants to be compensated a little for turning down an offer from KKR?
Goddamn it.
He (you) should accept the offer then 6 months later interview for Associate positions at KKR, rather than shit megafund analyst positions with no exit ops and (I'm guessing) lower pay.
Maybe you can negotiate for someone at the firm to wipe your ass and tell you that its special. Or is your Mom going to keep doing that after you graduate as well?
Dude, there's an extremely simple way to ask.. "Hey bank X, I'm grateful for the return offer and I'm very excited for the opportunity to be a part of your firm. Even though bank X is my first choice, firm Y has also extended me an offer for so and so. I really want to begin my career in bank X, however, is it possible to receive something more closely aligned to their comp/benefits/etc?"
Nothing might come out of it, but if your really want to try, go for it.
Yes. Do this after locking horns with your MD, to display your dominance to the entire firm.
You need to play hardball. If you are percieved as a true alpha will you will be able to negociate and bend them to your will. The quickest way is to go to the MDs office and drop a big turd on the desk. When he leaves his office in disgust, make sure to show the people who watched the scene that you mean business by asking the staffer to clean it. Make sure you eat beans to help with the task
Negotiate FT Offer w/ BB (Originally Posted: 08/17/2017)
Are FT offers from BB for IBD open to negotiation? I know this may seem childish but I want to make sure that I'm getting a fair package.
Thanks!
no
No
Negotiating FT offer, will a BB agree to this? (Originally Posted: 08/09/2008)
What happens if you do a SA stint in a regional office (not a major financial center by any means ie not Chicago, LA etc but another major city) and get an offer, but decide that you want to be in the BB's New York office with the same exact position and provide family pressure as your reasoning (they are very close to NYC).
There are many other reasons, of course, such as friends in NYC, being in NYC allows you to gain networking opportunities within the BB itself, at other BBs where friends may be working, hf/pe/vc firms, and the fun of being in New York City. (Obviously you don't mention these reasons)
Let's say the regional office is heavily understaffed. Some employees realize the office is in need of more people and mention to you they wouldn't mind having another body (you) in the office during the year to help out. Do you think mentioning that you would be willing to work during your entire senior year of college (mid-August all the way to mid-May and possibly even over winter break) part-time to help the regional office would make the BB accept your request to move FT to NY.
Given the dreaded market conditions and poor outlook for FT recruiting, the bank would save money by not having to interview candidates, not having to train the new employee from day one, and would get some help for another 9 months and you would have worked there for just about one year when the FT position starts.
Any thoughts......
Just be glad you have the opp to work in a regional office during the year and dont use it as negotiating lev. Take the good experience for your resume and you can discuss FT in NY with this bank after you've applied/interviewed to other banks for NY and after you've been actually started working in the regional office during your senior year.
Given the environment and depending on which city this is in, you're experience may prove more fruitful on all the issues you mentioned. Much better to be in an understaffed office in a downturn, in my opinion. Especially if that city just has a better economic climate that'll make the city less depressing that NY may prove to be. http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/bizfinance/finance/features/n_8453/
Great post and even better aticle MMmonkey. Let's change the scenario around a bit. Normally, I would expect to live in NYC off of my analyst salary therefore classifying me as broke. However, let's say my housing situation is all taken care of and very nicely at that. There is no $3K a month rent, no mortgage etc...
The city that I'm in has been hit extremely hard with the real estate downturn and while I have gone to school in this city for 3 years, I really can't see any point in staying for 2 more years. Considering when you are working you don't get 4 months off out of the year like you do in college makes NYC seem even better ad makes staying in the cty I'm in now that much harder.
Sure, I might have an offer with the best of the best, but at the end of the day, my family, friends, networking opportunities within this BB, at other BBs, and at hf/pe/vc firm are what matter to me most.
I'd rather take a position in NYC with a lower BB than the Tier 1 I'm with in this regional office. If they agree to my conditions everything will be all set, but it's not that cut and dry.
I guess I just have to wait it out and see in another week or two.
Like I said I think you're better off talking about "your conditions" until after you've started working into the school year (around interviews).
As MMmonkey said, with the current hiring climate it's difficult to negotiate much of anything simply because so many people are being laid off / have been laid off.
I think the more likely scenario is you start working there, stay for at least a year, and then discuss possibly moving to New York. I've had several friends who have worked at regional offices and then moved to NYC or other centers like London.
If you really want to work in NYC I would strongly suggest interviewing early at other firms (assuming you get an offer and therefore have a backup plan) and seeing if you can get in anywhere else.
FYI, I would not think of it in terms such as "lower BB" or "Tier 1" vs. "Tier 2" or anything. The reality is you'll have similar recruiting opportunities at most bulge brackets and people heavily exaggerate the difference it makes.
The NY Mag article almost sounds like a joke. Wall Street doomsday predictions in a down cycle? Check. Highly paid schmucks getting their comeuppance? Check. And the numbers - senior bankers getting paychecks close to analyst levels? A $5m deal? What?
Did you even notice the date of the NY Mag article? Well maybe you did; I can't tell from your post.
My conclusion is that I really want to be in NYC. Like you said dosk17, the difference between Bulge Brackets is very small to the point where your recruiting opportunities will not be any different unless you are comparing a top group on the street (GS TMT, MS M&A, UBS LA) to an ordinary or not so great group at another BB. I have learned that I will be receiving a FT offer with the regional office.
I've been far away from my family and friends for 3 years and I think it's high time I go home and get to enjoy the aspect of being close to everyone, along with the added networking benefits within the firm, at other major banks, and on the buyside as well. I don't see how being an analyst in this regional office will make me happy for the next 2 years, and not to mention I won't have any amazing opportunities given that I wont be at a UBS LA or CS LA.
Dosk, I'm going to go ahead and participate in fall recruiting with the goal of landing a FT offer with another BB in New York . After hopefully securing an offer in NYC, I will ask the BB I summered at if they can move me to New York for FT. If the answer is yes, then I'm all set. If they say no I'll gladly switch firms in order to be in NYC and receive the many benefits that come along with it.
that article may be one of the best contrarian indicators of the tech bubble bottom
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