Restructuring Lawyer to Restructuring Banker
At a top law school heading to a top restructuring shop (think Paul Weiss, Davis Polk, Weil, Kirkland). I plan to spend four years in the creditor/debtor restructuring practice at one of these firms before trying to make the transition to a restructuring boutique (Moelis, Houlihan, Lazard, Evercore). I have a quant background but admittedly, no modeling experience, and think after 4 years in law will have a tough time selling myself as anything more than a lawyer, albeit one who should know the bankruptcy code pretty well. I have an opportunity to enter business school tuition-free through a minority scholarship at that 4-year point at hopefully one of Tuck, Yale, Stern. I'd be about 29-30 entering the program, 32 when I enter a bank as an associate. I'm trying to figure out if I'd be fast-tracked to VP if I do a good job with specialized knowledge? I know many will say just learn the modeling on your own and skip the mba but I did the lsat while working and that was tough plus I bet after 4 years in any of these restructuring shops I'd probably appreciate a 2-year vacation haha. If this is all super preemptive and misguided please let me know, just think I'd really enjoy the practice of law but the prospects of partner do not sound feasible these days, and I don't think I'd enjoy in-house counsel.
Idk exactly the level you'd come in at, I think VP doesn't sound out of range, but in the time I've been working on RX deals I've seen similar backgrounds on both sides
do you think even with the scholarship the opportunity cost of the MBA is too much? especially seeing as they recruit to the associate level?
Not sure, Stern def makes bankers like crazy but maybe I'd try going for an associate role as soon so you can and if you don't get offers then use the MBA as fallback?
You would start as a stub associate out of business school. I know people who went pre-MBA IB ->M7 bschool -> top Rx and they were not fast-tracked. If you lateral directly to IB after working in law for a couple years, then I could see you starting as maybe an A2
While your law background is helpful, it's less relevant for Rx IB than actual finance experience. A lot of the top Rx shops have associates/VP who were IB analysts or even worked on the buyside and came back to IB. The analysts are also very sharp and have very strong backgrounds. I wouldn't bet on coming into any of these top Rx groups and outperforming your colleagues to such an extent that you're fast-tracked
Yeah makes sense. I guess I was thinking that at the 4-5 year mark moving from a law firm to the RX shop would have me come in as a VP, but that seems very unlikely. I don't mind coming in as a stub as I do think I will need some time to catch up on the technicals, just wanted to get a feel if I would be shooting my progression in the foot by coming in from an MBA instead of a direct lateral. Would you say entering the industry as a 32 year old associate would be difficult? I think I can see myself as a career banker (no PE/HF wet dreams) but understand I may just as easily fizzle out. At this point would the MBA have made a lot of sense if I'd like to exit to say corp dev/ strat/ or rx consulting?
I'm not sure that I've seen lawyers come in at the VP level, but you will definitely get some looks for associate roles after a couple of years at a top Rx law firm. I think you might be able to come in as a second yr associate, but not 100% sure.
As for entering IB at 32, I don't think it's a big deal at all, especially at firms that rely heavily on MBA recruiting to fill their associate ranks (i.e. most EBs with Rx groups). I'm at an M7 now and plenty of people are 30+ and will be starting as associates in IB / MBB. With that said, you definitely need to know what you're getting yourself into and make sure it's the right move at that point, especially from a personal perspective.
If I were in your shoes, I would get a couple of years of law experience under your belt and look to lateral as an associate, probably sooner than later - I think it's key to start looking to lateral after 1.5-2 years verses 3/4 years.
If that doesn't work, then I think a top mba makes sense, especially with a scholarship. I wouldn't worry too much about graduating at 31/32
If you want to be a restructuring baker, go be a restructuring banker. After a year or two doing rx law you should be able to lateral to an associate 1 or 2 position. Limited value to being a lawyer for long vs. the same time spent being in banking, if rx banking is your end goal. Anyone can learn the modeling and finance side of things and if you’re capable enough to get a role at one of those law firms you’re more than capable enough of doing the prep needed to make a smooth transition to associate after a year or two.
Okay, I guess I was under the impression that understanding the bankruptcy code would be a value add to the shop. So moving over is generally feasible if I learn the technicals and network properly? Thought it would be a pretty big hurdle with no prior finance exp.
It might be useful and can’t hurt, but let me put it this way: if an rx group had to hire you in two years, they’d rather you spend the next two years until then doing rx banking vs. being an rx lawyer. So I would make the jump as soon as feasible. The modeling and finance is easy to pick up. College kids and MBAs can learn enough to get jobs by reading and practicing, so you just need to do the same plus maybe be able to demonstrate on a higher level your understanding of how rx processes work, what the role of bankers is, etc.
Find associates and VPs on LinkedIn who started in law and talk to them. I’d imagine they’ll tell you the same
Would you even really want to come as a VP with no IB experience at all? Expectations for you would be pretty high, and your practical IB experience would be nil -- might be setting yourself up for a fall if associates (and even analysts) are running circles around you, knowledge/experience-wise.
Great point. at first, I was assuming being fast-tracked after the MBA where I'd come in as a stub, but even then I'd have a lot to learn so probably wouldn't be beneficial. Seems to me from what I've gathered here is to gain experience in law and try to make the jump earlier rather than later. If that doesn't work I can always go the MBA route. I guess I'm left wondering if restructuring law is worth it outside of a good way to tell the story of why rx banking? It is one of the most demanding legal practices and unlike banking, our bonuses are pretty lockstep irrespective of our hours/value.
2017 law school grad now in special sits and was K-JD.
100% do not try to be a lawyer for four years -> MBA just for RX banking. I am almost always against a JD /MBA and I would recommend doing that over your current plan.
I would ping the 20 or so lawyers at top RX banks at the associate / VP level and get advice from them on how to break in. It's good networking. Advice is likely either recruit after your MBA program or after 1-2 years of biglaw as an associate for both.
I considered a JD/MBA but wouldn't be able to get the scholarship for it now, also felt it defeated the purpose of the optionality a mba provides since I knew I wanted to go into law first. Are you suggesting I get 1-2 years of experience and try to network/study my way in and if that doesn't work, at that point entering the MBA would be worth it?
If you know you want to do RX IBD now, you shouldn’t intend to practice law first and treat law as a back-up. Recruiting is doable straight from law school.
I don’t really see a path where working as a lawyer -> MBA makes sense for you to do RX IBD.
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