Thoughts on CPPIB vs DB in London
Hi monkeys, I'm lucky to secure a full time position with DB IBD in this very situation. But I recently got another offer from CPPIB credit investments team, which is a 1-year offcycle internship (graduate analyst as they call it). I was told that there's a great shot for me to convert after a year. I talked to a few DB guys. It feels like people are really nice there but the deal flow is not good. While I'd definitely take CPPIB if it was 3 months ago, now I'm so uncertain whether I should take the risk of being jobless one year later or just go with the typical IB-to-buyside route and take the ft offer. Both positions are based in London. I'd very much appreciate any insights or advice.
I think DB is way way more recognized brand so even taking into account current problems with DB I would take DB.
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Yeah DB is the exact definition of secure job.....
Do you know which team you’ll be in at CPPIB within credit? And whoch team at DB?
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Go for CPPIB then. From that team you’ll be able to move easily to any other role in RE either on the credit or equity side of things which would be the logical exits from DB.
Or you could join DB, move to Levfin after 1-2 years and then take it from there. It will be a longer and more difficult move imo though.
Real asset credit is a great team, go for it.
Presumably DB is M&A? If LevFin they'll still quite up there
Re CPPIB do you also know what the FT offer rates are following offcycles? I have a very small sample set of SAs there but it appears that a substantial amount do get offers. Also Credit is very wide - so will be good to know whether this is an opportunistic moment for the team that you're in.
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If your DB offer is M&A I would definitly lean towards CPPIB - not that their European franchise is totally underwater, but that they still have a few issues to get through, and the current pandemic does not help things for them
As other commenters have said - CPPIB is one of the desired exit opps (especially given if you're in a team like REGL at DB). Not sure about comp in direct investment teams (been told they try to compete for talent so read what you will), but in terms of firepower, growth (been expanding substantially), comptency and culture they are a really good place to get buyside exposure
Man, people in IB would take CPPIB as an exit opp, if you are at all interested in credit investing I would take that.
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I would absolutely take CPPIB if I was you. Having experience as an a-a (and having worked at a BB), I can tell you CPPIB is a great opportunity. Don't predicate your decision on job security, I would argue DB isn't great in this regard either. From personal experience helping recruit as a junior at a BB, the coverage group gets a call from HR a few weeks before the summer internship ends with the # of spots they are allowed to offer... For example, with an internship class of 10, DB HR can potentially call and only offer up 6 positions, where it is not a mutually beneficial scenario (i.e. even if you are good, they might not have an offer for you). I don't have confirmation here, but sounds to me like CPPIB is willing to give you an offer if it is mutually beneficial... that means, work hard and get a FT job... with great hours.... with a very respectable buyside shop...
This.
However, OP, you realize the macro situation right? This is no joke. DB has been an organizational mess for years with layoffs and departures left and right across the firm. It is not well positioned as a company and hasn’t been so for years. That’s bad for you stability as an employee and morale in general as well as comp (not that it matters that much as a junior).
That is not to say that there are t stars at DB or good teams or that you would not get great experience there.
CPP has permanent capital and sees some of the best deal flow in the world. And it has permanent capital so probably no layoffs anytime soon. With these deals you deal with the world’s top buyside shops and others. You are the client and do the investing. And direct. If they like you you get a job and can move on from there.
Lots of good arguments here but especially given the macro and the uncertainty it would not be a contest for me. Finance as an industry is not expanding and really hasn’t been for years. So just keep that in mind... However we have different priorities and mindsets so perhaps you would make a different decision. And that’s cool.
Previously worked at a Private Funds Group in a bank (currently in an European MF) and have worked with many high profile funds. What I can tell you from experience is that CPPIB is the place to be. Many of the funds we were trying to raise capital for go straight to the Canadian pension funds first (unlimited dry powder) so you really get to experience and underwrite numerous amounts of deals.
From dealing with the guys at CPPIB, I can tell you that they have some of the brightest and sharpest people working there (any of the Canadian pension funds really...for example, Quadreal's executive team is from TPG, Lehman, Head of Nomura) so you really get to work with great people and learn.
Now, I am talking from experience interacting with the London office, so things may be different in other offices...
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You are comparing full time vs internship so I would say that this needs to be taken into account. Also - while CPPIB is good, credit is not for everyone; if ultimately your goal is to work in credit then fine but otherwise you will just pigeonhole yourself
You are comparing two fundamentally different jobs so ultimately this should be the deciding factor.
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