You see all these posts about people's internships where they are just doing bitch work, etc . .
If you have had interns, what qualities made them the best intern? What qualities did you see in them that made you give them more work? What experiences did they have that allowed you to give them more advanced tasks?
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Work was really dictated by need. I would say be likeable. Everyone always says do good work and you will get more. This is half true. If you do bad work and I can check it and make you do it again it is still easier than me doing it. Everyone looks better when they check and not in the weeds. I had one intern that I thought was a nice guy so I spent a slow afternoon walking through some of our M&A templates and answered questions. Spend your free time in the templates and learning them. No-one is going to give you a ton of responsibility right off the bat but when the moment comes and you get some modeling request you will be ready.
Best intern we had was a good guy who took shit and gave it back
we worked him pretty hard and he did a good job... we also gave him a ton of chit daily.. once we learned who he could mouth off back to.. he did.. it was funny cause it showed he had a pair.. was not going to let people walk all over him... it was a huge plus.. however this was an energy trading firm.. you need to have pretty thick skin on the desk I was on at the time... not cause it was a hard core desk but the manager was young and most of the staff was young
I say show initiative and you will get better work. Take a project given to you and propose ways to expand it or suggest doing other similar projects. This will create work for yourself and show the boss that you may be able to come up with unique solutions.
Best internships? (Originally Posted: 07/03/2011)
What are the best possible internships for a student like me (non-target, rising sophomore) to position themselves for an SA stint in IBD? Excluding boutique/MM IB internships? Which types look particularly better on a resume and which ones are worthless? I'm sorry if this question has been beaten to death but anyone who has valuable info is really appreciated. Thanks
If not a boutique/MM IB internship then probably something like a Boutique/MM PE internship, maybe even a HF or VC. There are also PWM internships (but everybody does that); I would argue that BB back office internships sophomore yr are solid (but most people on this board would beg to differ)
I'd argue that a BO at a BB your sophomore year would be better than banking at a no-name boutique, though I have no idea which one is looked at more favorably by recruiters. The work experience may not be directly relevant, but you still have plenty of time to pick that up.
You will, however, still have formal training, gain plenty of contracts within the bank, work in a more group based environment and have a chance to prove yourself in a competitive environment. Just about anyone can get an unpaid internship at a small boutique, just by cold calling. Getting a BO position as a sophomore is more difficult. IMO, obtaining one as a sophomore will if nothing else show that you are a competitive candidate with the initiative to obtain an internship typically reserved for juniors.
Also, if you decide next year that banking is not for you and trading may be more towards your liking, having that BO internship will put your in a much more favorable light than a no-name boutique. Having a firm understanding of how back-office works and being able to see things from their point of view will help you immensely as a trader.
As I've said before, take anything I say with a grain of salt. I have no idea which one will help you out more, but I personally feel that as a sophomore, if you have the choice between a BO role (in say finance or risk) and a FO role at a no-name boutique, you should seriously consider taking the BO position. Note: If you are a junior or a sophomore with an offer at a place people have heard of, don't even consider the BO position.
You could try something in startup/tech they are easier to get as a younger student
Same question i asked an associate at gs a while back. In order of attractiveness: After mm/boutique ibd, pe/vc, investment management, corporate finance (as in finance for like a fortune 500 company)
I did a PWM internship at a bulge bracket after my sophomore year at a non-target...it's nothing extremely prestigious, more standard, but you can use that summer to network, ask around, and get contacts to their IB division.
Although as they mentioned above, a small/MM boutique internship in IB is probably better since you'd actually have IB experience going into junior SA recruiting.
well said reddog
Summer school to boost your GPA and a part time internship in BB PWM or at a boutique IB
Pretty sure if you can get a PE internship at a megafund, that's better than any gig at a boutique/MM IB. Same goes for top hedge funds.
My question is: where does fund of funds fall?
Thanks for the info guys. Anyone else?
Anything corporate finance-related is good. Then it's all about how you sell it to your recruiter and what you've done over your internship. You have to show that what you've learned will be useful in your future (it works for any job application basically). Afaik, it's better to be in a company where you truly learned a lot of things than in a good boutique where you spent your time proofreading presentations and making coffee, without even learning how to master Excel.
he stayed out of the way.
Who treats interns best (Originally Posted: 01/10/2007)
I'm deciding between offers for an internship this summer in IB, so I wanted to know who would be the best to intern with (think the top 5 BB's and a couple others), in terms of intern perks (I heard Goldman gives Blackberrys), high rate of full-time offers, intern responsibility, and overall summer experience.
Goldman does give blackberrys, but they also work you the hardest (by a long long way..)
Intern responsibility? Try any of the top-5, who tend to have highly structured programmes that attract the cream of the crop.
General perks: between Citigroup and Lehman Brothers (in terms of flying to NY for an 'intern' networking day etc..)
The second-tier firms also have good internship programmes, but you probably won't enjoy it as much as the people there are only there because they've been rejected by the top tier...be prepared for that.
treats interns the best. Street-wide, they are regarded as having a highly structured program with lots of perks for all their summers.
"in terms of intern perks (I heard Goldman gives Blackberrys"
Is this really a perk? I'd hate to have one.
I think most BBs give blackberrys to summer analysts. Certainly, Citigroup does.
The best part about being a summer was not getting a blackberry. The summer associates got them and they were constantly coming into the office. Very few people (analysts and associates) will call and ask you do things that are not important, so I'd pick a place that doesn't give blackberrys.
Not having a blackberry is not necessarily a blessing; if analysts and associates need you, they will not hesitate to call your cellphone.
Also, there were times where I needed a simple confirmation email, but I couldn't go home until I got that email. It sucks to have to wait in the office for a simple email--wish I had a blackberry then. Sitting in the office looking like you are doing nothing is asking to get side-staffed on projects.
Another case: associate emailed me work on Saturday..I wasn't in the office to check the email, but came in on Sunday and had two full days of work to do by Monday.
I don't know that I would have been called into the office any more had I had a blackberry; but I can tell you I spent more time in the office because I didn't have one.
grass is always greener...
i don't know anyone who wants one but doesn't have one. grass is fine on my side of the fence
Everybody gives out blackberries, as far as I know. If I have the misfortune of getting a summer, he/she had better be reachable. Trust me, you won't like it if I'm emailing you when you're not in the office.
You're better off figuring out where you're going to get a better experience for the summer. Ball games and steak dinners are nice, but if I were you I'd rather get steamrollered by a heavy workload, real learning, and real responsibility. The best thing that can happen to you is to get treated like a real analyst, not a tourist.
Dingleberries are great for interns. It's not like you are going to have much of a life anyway so you might as well be connected. Like the Wiz said, at least you don't have to be married to your desktop.
but ML-Houston was pretty sweet. I think it might have just been the guys that work there. They liked to have a good time pretty often.
are ballers. Almost every one I've met, from different firms, knows how to have a good time.
will work you to death as well. Other than GS, I don't know of any summers who worked longer hours last year than the ones at ML. In a related story, the acceptance rate on their full-time offers is always pretty low compared to the rest of the BBs.
I think it may just be with whole cost of living difference and the like. I worked in Chicago right out of college then transfered to houston and got a sweet increase in pay. I live pretty nice in Houston but still make less then my buds in NY. Your money goes far here.
I second WizardofOz. There were numerous times I just needed to forward emails, receive some messages, turn some comments that I could have done all at home had I been given a blackberry- instead you are forced to trek into the office and run the risk of someone dumping something on you.
However, in retrospect, this was a good thing, since all the assoc and analysts that were in the office noticed that I was there every sat and sunday just like them. So in terms of facetime and doing extra work when asked of you, for a summer analyst trying to get a job, not having a bb is good. In terms of a big hastle, not having one is a pain in the ass.
I'm not ready to reveal where I worked this summer, since I am going back, but I just want to let you know we did not receive bb. There were a number of firms this past summer that didn't hand them out. I think this will def change for next summer, especially at my firm since there were a great deal of complaints by assoc and such that the summer analysts didn't get bbs.
I also question the validity of Royal Oak's statement about goldman working you the most. I feel that there are a great number of banks that work you 100-110 hrs a week if you are a great summer analyst. It really depends on the individual's commitment and attitude in this regard. I am sure there were some at goldman working 80 hr weeks and some working 110 hr weeks. I'd put money on the fact that the ones working 110 hr weeks got a hell of a lot more offers than those working 80 hr.
Not having a BB is very helpful in getting that FT offer.
Lehman has a really nice program for interns as does DB. Friends hated JPMorgan, but maybe it was because of the groups they were in? GS was a killer (late nights and weekends) and although the firm provides great networking socials and things of that nature, you have to have the time to actually go...
i also think that it's really group specific. at my summer firm, the experience was all over the place. my group was money - i meshed with the people, live deals, and interesting pitching - but my roommates group was miserable - by the end of the summer all of the 2nd year analysts had left.
with respect to the BB post, you've always got to come in and check email on the weekend, but as pointed out its good for facetime. just live near the office and its nbd.
Absolute best intern programs are probably with consultancies. Although they are much harder to get my friends that interned as consultants left work at 7:30 to get drunk and make fun of their clients. Plus if you work for McKinsey or Bain as a junior you can pretty much write your own ticket to any consulting firm or BB after that.
I've heard really good things about Citigroup's internship program. I had several friends who interned there, and all signed their offers immediately. I've heard similar things about JPM and, to a slightly lesser extent, GS.
I agree with the post about consulting firms offering the best internships. If you are good, you will get to touch real client deliverables and get some great experience.
Am sure many will disagree but I think it is easier to take your consulting internship and leverage it into a FT offer from a bank than the inverse. That said, I understand that the best way to get a FT offer from a BB is to knock the cover off the ball while interning. The consulting internship is just a great avenue if you are considering both options.
Full disclosure -- I am in consulting.
Had many friends intern at GS, MS, and Citi and didn't hear great things regarding treatment. JPMorgan makes a huge commitment to its interns and invests a lot in them. Offer rate is also very high.
do you get to keep the blackberries?
no
man i got raped as a summer --- the experience was worth it and made me a lot more marketable on the street for full time. experience is so important, 'perks' are pretty standard.
It's only 10 weeks - grind it out; if you don't like it then switch to something else.
I am going to be interning this summer at a BB for Municipal Finance and I was hoping some one can elaborate a little more on an IBD program. Is Monday-Sunday pretty much guaranteed? What is your typical day like? Do you do anything other than work with your group? How often is the 10 week program extended? How is the mentor program useful? Any information that can be provided would be greatly appreciated.
Muni's... have fun with that.
The only perk summers should worry about is the summer --> FT offer ratio. I don't care if GS or MS gives blackberries, if their acceptance ratio is 30%, then I'll take a 2nd Tier any day.
From what i know DB is the only one that pays its interns overtime..which is a huge perk!
By the way, I'm not sure where the rumor of GS and MS having 30% offer rates started, but it definitely hasn't been true over the past few years.
I think you should consider which firm you would truly want to be with after graduation and make a move based on that... my thing is this, if you do not go get drunk every night and go to the firm of choice in my case it will be GS, as they are very difficult to get into and they hate being rejected so if you tell them no now, be ready to not get an intrview senior year; that being said if u do not get drunk over the summer then you would have saved more than you would have spent and could put that money to other use....
are you crazy? whats the point of making all that money if you can't give it right back to your bar of choice?
Likability, Value Added and Critical Thinker.
Quick notes on those 3 things.
1 & 2 are the most important. People always struggle with 2. If you're getting coffee, lunches, etc to keep people focusing on making money, then good. If you overhear someone talking about x, y, z and your team member says "I'll get back to you on that", offer to research x, y, z. Simply put, provide value by doing something that allows others to focus on making money.
Don't be the intern that throws around buzz words and thinks he/she is above "bitch" work. You're an intern, you are a bitch.
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