MMs: Drawdowns (Capital Cuts and Stop Outs) & Vol Allocations

A bunch of related questions that I've been asking myself. Assume all questions are for Fundamental Equity L/S pods, unless stated otherwise.

Re/ Drawdowns:

  • Q1: Do all major MMs (let's say Top-4 plus the next 5-6 by AUM) communicate drawdown limits to PMs?
  • Q2: Are drawdown limits generally communicated and managed as a percentage loss vs. peak GMV, or are there alternative models/metrics?
  • Q3: Which of the "Top-10" MMs are more likely to stop out teams before their official drawdown is reached, vs. which firms are more likely to allow teams to go beyond their limit (if any)? (Ignoring the fact that a PM who's good at selling himself will always get more leeway.)
  • Q4: Related: When people (e.g.) say that MLP has tighter risk management than others, are those people really talking about the drawdown-% numbers in the PM contract (which to my understanding can be relatively meaningless), or just about how strictly these limits are enforced? (In theory, a MM could fire a PM for any or for no reason.)
  • Q5: How does Citadel typically handle drawdowns? Do they systematically cut capital before a stop out, or will they let the PM handle GMV sizing until the bloody end? How relevant are the communicated drawdown limits at Citadel?
  • Q6: Out of curiosity: Are non-L/S pods treated differently with respect to drawdowns?

Re/ Vol Allocations:

  • Q7: Which of the MMs are known to give relatively low vs. high vol allocations (defined as % of GMV), vs. no explicit allocations at all?
  • Q8: Do all MMs use the standard definition of volatility (~"stddev of daily returns") when communicating vol limits to PMs, or are there other popular models used? (E.g., to avoid penalization of winning streaks without having to manually adjust the vol allowance.)

Thanks bros.

5 Comments
 
Most Helpful

This is all specific to (6), Macro:

  1. Yes. Very clearly
  2. $ PnL
  3. Anecdotally maybe Citadel. But if you do start doing overtly dumb stuff (re: trading) any of them will cut you before your official triggers are hit
  4. Not Macro question so I'm just guessing here: they might be talking about factor exposures, Risk taking a hard stance on enforcing those
  5. Going to generalize to the top 4 not just Citadel: usually halfway or so to your official drawdown limit you get your capital/VaR cut (usually halved). Exact fractions depend on negotiated limits if you are a senior enough PM to negotiate these things; most are handed down to PMs in the initial convos
  6. Answers 1-5 are for macro. Don't think L/S is materially different in terms of "ease of being cut" (high)
  7. Re: vol. In Macro everything is given as VaR not GMV, so you have a max VaR. VaR is just 99th ptile SD vol (more or less)
  8. VaR (vol) figure given to you by Risk. You hopefully have your own estimate of what your current daily vol is but they usually use something like JPM risk metrics model and have standardized figures which you Accept and trim accordingly if the word comes down from above 
 

for 3 - do u mean citadel are likely to fire before drawdown limits are reached or they are likely to be more flexible 

(probably the former but just wanted to make sure haha)

 

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