Have seen a lot of stories of people getting top bucket on this forum but not so much on the other end.
For those who did not get top: what happened and where are you now? How did you move forward after getting a low bonus?
Personally had a lot of positive reviews so was quite shocked, but interested in hearing from others who experienced the same.
| +355 | Evercore Intern Seizure | 54 | 7h |
| +67 | JPM M&A is Gone??? Purely Coverage Banking??? | 31 | 6h |
| +58 | Is DCM actually underrated ? | 24 | 17h |
| +50 | How do I understand vs. just memorizing? | 5 | 16h |
| +48 | Losing my personality in Banking | 9 | 17h |
| +47 | Are all Tech / TMT groups sweaty? | 38 | 13h |
| +42 | Associate & Above IB exits | 16 | 3d |
| +32 | Incoming IB Analyst: Best Ways to Prepare? | 10 | 9h |
| +27 | Which groups are ideal for laterals? | 12 | 11h |
| +24 | The good and bad with Wells Fargo | 1 | 17h |
Career Resources
Get instant access to lessons taught by experienced private equity pros and bulge bracket investment bankers including financial statement modeling, DCF, M&A, LBO, Comps and Excel Modeling.
Fellow BB here. I, however, could see it coming as I was putting in little effort (working ~50 hour weeks in my 2nd year) and wanted to leave at the end of two years. I compared the incremental after-tax pay with the substantially less hours I worked to my fellow top bucket colleagues who got worked like dogs, and it came out to ~$15 an hour for that "overtime". To me, my time out with friends, family and Hinge dates is worth more than that. I still have a handful of great references, so will leverage that to a niche buyside role or corp dev / strategic finance to optimize my pay with how much the job consumes my life. After all, ~90% of people end up leaving banking, and this role is great to take out of college to preserve your optionality within finance (despite the agony we surely endured at times). The job market isn't great at the moment, but have loved the time off so far. Best of luck, brother.
Nah hinge dates never worth it. Girls will respect you more if they see you ignoring them during dates, and getting the coveted top bucket status (they know your fingers flow smooth on that keyboard)
Damn all the bottom buckets are congregating here, and seem to be displeased at the fact that girls don't respect them (surely not as displeased as the girls they aren't able to please). I said it once, and I'll say it again, NYC girls like bankers because they make nice money, are always busy (especially not emotionally available), good with fingers (although if you're top bucket, you don't have time for that and go straight to business), act like bankers (cancel dates, don't text back for 2 days, don't apologize to anyone except your MD, are constantly talking about how bad the MBA associates are at Excel and PPT, etc.), and most important of all, prioritize themselves. If an NYC girl hears that you let go off the top bonus, or didn't prioritize your career to spend few more hours with her, she'll dump you the same day (yes, it sounds pathetic, but so are the NYC girls)
I struggle to see how I could get away with working only 60ish hours a week. How did you do it?
Would love to here more feel like this hasn’t been discussed enough
Bucket status is also not meritocratic in many cases I've seen. If they hear you've secured an exit op or plan to leave, your bonus is at risk of being docked, especially in this market environment. It's business, nothing personal. You have to look out for yourself in this industry, and loyalty is valued only to the point at which its convenient to discard of you
Totally agree makes complete sense
Mero what? LOOL
.
Hard for a lot of people to 1) accept you aren't as good as you think you are 2) not get defensive and improve 3) say you don't know and ask for help
"Everybody loves a comeback story... seabiscut, the mighty ducks, rocky... Kim kardashian?" - parks and rec - Michael scott
This. Negative feedback (when constructive) is an enormous gift. Use it. Ignore the noise.
Got bottom-mid bucket first year. Have a MM PE gig lined up post IB that i focused on obtaining heavily during my first year.
Working on improving capabilities in year 2.
Top bucket for first two analyst years and then mid bucket and then bottom bucket. My joy, learning, and youthfulness all got sucked out of the job - it also sucks when seeing your MDs work just as late or even later than you - seeing that it ultimately doesn't get better (though it surely does in most regards). I kind of just stopped caring and as someone else pointed out, I enjoyed more "free" time with friends, family, and my girlfriend (she was most appreciative).
Also lost my father somewhere in those declining bucket years that made me reflect on if this is all worth it to me (it wasn't), so currently trying to figure out where to next. Will keep you posted!
Just a reminder that these people aren't your family (they knew of my father's passing and the mental toll it took on me and didn't really care, even after I had worked / gotten to know / gotten close with them for four years) and will cut you / pay you less. It is a business at the end of the day, and we are all just mercenaries and hired guns going to the highest bidder.
Eat and drink as much of the snacks in the office as you can.
I’m so sorry to hear about your father and how they treated you after. Nobody should have to tolerate that. Its just a job at the end of the day
Sorry to hear about your father and definitely sucks to be in a work environment that does not care a single bit about your well-being. Did you end up leaving the firm? Would love to hear an update in a few months.
Sorry to hear about your father
Sorry to hear about your father. I’m sure he was a great man. Praying for you and him
Sorry to hear, you are wise beyond your years my friend.
this is why this business is a McJob, absolutely pathetic behavior from colleagues and the org at large. Your post made me want to punch a wall.
Thanks for sharing, really gives a well-grounded perspective into the role.
And take care too.
Condolences on your dad. Hope you start feeling better soon.
I’m very sorry to hear about your father. I lost mine completely out of the blue during winter break of my senior year of college. There’s been about a million times I’ve wanted to call him and tell him about work, but of course that’s not possible. He would be an amazing source of support for me, and I get intensely jealous whenever I hear about my fellow analysts complaining to their dad about work. Part of me wants to just tell the senior bankers I work with so that maybe they’ll feel some empathy towards me, but at the end of the day, I don’t think they really care. In my experience, banking isn’t an industry where caring about people and doing the right thing is valued much at all.
Abysmally bottom bucket here, still got the deals on my CV, still got the (shitty) brand, still got an okay-ish bonus, I cannot complain.
can you elaborate on being abysmally bottom bucket? did you not work at all?
I am just not really good at organizing and focusing myself, and I hate doing unnecessary work and will complain when forced to do so.
Went from bottom bucket to top the next year. Doubled down on the role and sacrificed pretty much everything to really focus on getting good at the job and succeeding on my deals. Took the feedback away, worked longer hours than any other analyst, and used deliberate practice to annihilate any doubt or weak points so that seniors had no reason to give me less than top. Built good relationships with everyone in the team and had a few good deals close too, which is mostly luck, but always helps.
Honestly it was a hollow victory. The bonus felt great and it was good to check the box, but didn’t get any deep seated satisfaction or fulfillment. After that I actually started working a little less, stressing way less, and worrying way less about work. Started taking better care of myself, exercising most days a week (5 minimum), eating healthy, spending more time with family and friends. For me personally, I’m glad I checked the box, but have decided the sacrifices required to guarantee top bucket were not worth it, and I don’t place importance to it any more. I still care and work hard, but I always, without exception, make time for myself and my personal well-being, health, and self-care.
Off-topic rant but I want to hammer home one thing to the prospects/younger guys on this thread specifically. You’re gonna chase that success and you’re gonna make some sacrifices, but please don’t sacrifice your health and appearance. It’s not worth it. There is no nobility in being a fat or scrawny, bloated, ugly, wrinkly, unkempt, alcoholic, pothead, etc etc top bucket 24 year old. You will seriously regret it.
Watch your diet and take your vitamins, be physically active no matter what, take care of your skin, hair, teeth (all 3 extremely important). Sleep your 7-8 hours whenever you can. Spend time putting into place the right health habits. Don’t excessively drink, eat sugar, or do drugs. Do activities that bring you joy and spend time with people you care about. Spend some time daily outdoors and in the sun (wear sunscreen daily too of course). These aren’t guidelines, these are absolutely necessities if you want to continuously improve as a man and age like a fine wine into your late 20s and even 30s and 40s.
You still have your youth, energy, collagen, strength, and now is the time to nurture it and take advantage of it because if you don’t you’re gonna start getting old way sooner than you think, especially with an IB lifestyle. Be proactive now and have the wisdom to prioritize yourself. Even if you cut out every single other thing during your analyst years to avoid “bottom bucket”, never cut out taking care of yourself.
Prison
From bottom bucket to bottom bitch
Was bottom bucket at a MM bank. Quit and left for a small crappy PE firm. Pivoted two more times to small firms and finally landed at one that 10x'd its AUM.
Now work in MF PE and have my old banking group doing bitch work for me
King 👑
how did you manage to recruit into MF PE? does MF PE check references?
(not saying that you are incompetent, but am curious as to how the recruitment process works)
I’m sure some back-channeling occurred, but to what extent it impacted the final hire / no-hire decision, I can’t say. On cycle is truly a disorganized clusterfuck, so firms are often making decisions with very limited datapoints. I think it certainly helped that I was from a very strong group and knew my deals / modeling cold. Reason I ended up in bottom bucket was because I would give very little effort to non-live processes with people I didn’t care for. For live deals with seniors I respected, I’d run through a brick wall for those guys and was able to learn alot in my 2 years. Tried to maximize learning opportunities without sacrificing my gym / personal time, and the extra $5k after taxes was never something that seemed worth it.
Bottom bucket first year, middle bucket second year, top bucket stub bonus (A2A). Ranking went up as I cared less and relaxed ironically enough
How did you turn it around?
Was bottom bucket at a small boutique bank and essentially told I was a negative value to my face, then lateraled to a larger BB / EB and got top bucket for those analyst years before getting promoted. Besides actively trying to improve my skills, I just noticed that culture for me was the main difference - one team effectively told me to sink or swim on my own and wouldn’t provide any mentorship (got yelled at once for asking to clarify instructions), whereas my other team was more receptive to mentoring / coaching. Goes to show that there is a lot of variability in the industry.
Also experiencing the same at my current MM firm. Very minimal support from the people above me. May have to start looking at lateral opportunities as well
Do you have any advice for lateraling to a better bank? Currently at a so-so MM and would love to be at a BB.
I just got bottom bucket at a bulge bracket bank. Got told I don't add value to the team despite individual reviews that would indicate middle/lower middle.
Seems to be more about politics and kissing up to the right people. The worse the culture, the more politics matter it seems.
Luckily I have worked less and while at first I felt bad, I don't envy my higher ranked peers who are working on bullshit pitch work that I'm not staffed on because they don't think I'm good, and because the market is slow.
It is very very very much political. At a prior firm I got all 5s and one 4 (would indicate top / bottom of top / top of mid) but somehow got told I was middle bucket... You have to "play the game" even when there isn't a FaceTime culture, there really is!
started at MM (bottom) moved to EB (top) and then to MF (special sits).
realised my skills / strengthes were under-appreciated at the MM (they just did sell sides). EB role was much more analytical.
Do you have any advice for lateraling to a better bank? Currently at a so-so MM and would love to be at a BB.
yeah just apply... make sure your modeling skills as amazing (not just okay) and ace that interview. (sounds easy but pretty hard).
Also go towards and industry you're very interested in and you should do well.
I work the door at a strip club between bouts of drug addiction and homelessness
I’m probably considered a bottom bucket by virtue of not being top bucket (the rest of my class left). I was bottom bucket because I simply didn’t work with the shot callers in my group and did deals with MDs who weren’t the people who mattered
Had great reviews, but none of that matters if you lack proximity to the heads of your group
Anyways, I’m going to corpdev now, making probably 80% of the money with half the work. I was never good with the schmoozing or politics but I’m good at the technicals (which they kept saying wasn’t “that important”) which a corporate role would appreciate much more
What makes you think schmoozing and politics matter less in corporate?
Because we don’t have clients to please. Sure we have internal schmoozing but there’s variability in outcome so it matters less
Was bottom bucket at a top BB three years ago for two years in a row now I’m running a fintech startup with my college friends and recently completed YC.
I’m personally waiting to the day my bank inevitably pitches for our business when we’re a unicorn. Spite is the best motivator!!!
what has your comp being like doing all that (not snarky I also want to get involved with an earlier stage startup)
Once we raised our first round my cofounder and I paid (and continue to pay) ourselves a $150k annual salary. It is not much in NYC but we both agreed to send more of that salary premium to engineer hires instead
Late to the party, but have a relevant story to share. I'm a shy beta Asian kid and when I started my analyst stint, I was a big pussy and just tried to grind my way to success in my group. Awkwardly didn't get along with a ton of people, and even though I was first in / first out everyday and grinded insane hours, I wouldn't get staffed on great projects and realized at some point I wasn't earning any clout/respect in the group. Convinced myself that I'd at least be mid-bucket, but in hindsight shouldn't have been surprised with the shit bonus.
It freaked me out though and I though my career was over; the week after I spent a ton of time networking with my friends in corp dev roles since I though that was my future. During my second year, got staffed with an Asian VP lateral who ended up "adopting" me. I honestly have no idea if she knew my reputation in the group or if I got lucky as fuck that she was a lateral, but she didn't give a shit about me being weird and thought I was just a great analyst. Basically revived my career and I got a top bucket bonus my second year after literally just working with her the entire year. She gave me confidence to recruit for buyside and was ultimately my reference to my current shop (which is super sick, but I'll leave it at that).
I'm now a senior associate (ignore title) and literally owe my entire career to her. Still lowkey hate the job and planning on applying to bschool, but I guess the moral of the story is this: if you're bottom bucket, you should seriously reflect on if you deserve it or not. Everyone knows this industry isn't always meritocratic, so if you feel like you're bottom-bucket ranking is due to factors that have nothing to do with your abilities, you have to put yourself in a position and with people that you can succeed in / with. But, if you're bottom bucket because you're lazy and hate your job (which is also fine), just leave.
Can I PM you
Top bucket at an EB my first year then got so burnt out and coasted my second year to bottom bucket
Quit with nothing lined up, took 1-2 months to reset, then recruited hard and got a job in corp strat at a large f500 4-5 months after quitting
Best decision I ever made was leaving the industry
This is prob the best move. I genuinely think the ib analyst route should be two years, then do something else with more free time to enjoy life.
Currently in my 3rd year as an analyst and getting tired of the constant pitching and long hours. After getting bumped to associate, likely going to coast and then look for corporate roles if the hiring market improves
Thats a good approach though would warn you that depending on good/bad M&A markets are, it might be hard to coast as an A2A. And speaking from personal experience, even if youre pulling 70 hours a week being bottom bucket, ur still gonna want that free time to yourself (bottom bucket behavior lol). I had to force myself to quit to recruit FT but thats just me
My friends always joke that I keep on failing upwards. I didn't get a return offer at a mid-tier BB (Citi, BofA, Barc) but somehow got an offer at a top-tier EB (LAZ, MoCo, EVR) for FT. I was bottom bucket my 2nd year (got a FU bonus of $25k lol) but landed a role at a top UMM PE fund. I was bottom bucket yet again so didn't get a Senior Associate promo, but thankfully it was during 2022 when the market was still hot so I managed to land a VP role at a $2-5bn MM PE fund (technically I recruited for a SrAso role but it was implied when I signed that I'd get the VP title by year-end/6 months after my start date).
Realistically speaking, I probably won't make it to Principal at my fund and that's the end of my PE career, but I feel like I have a solid enough resume now to parlay this into a top-tier Strategic Finance or Corporate Development role.
Expedita ratione accusantium quidem aliquid eligendi dolores animi. Quo quis nemo animi sapiente cum et aut quia. Recusandae soluta aut amet distinctio et dolorem. Nam ut ad qui aut sunt.
Laborum quos nihil sit labore aut debitis. Nihil blanditiis aperiam incidunt expedita ipsa voluptatum voluptatum. Autem neque officia qui numquam.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Consequatur eos beatae quibusdam dolore velit quae culpa. Temporibus cum maxime eos velit corporis necessitatibus optio illo. Deleniti aperiam reiciendis et vel sapiente ullam. Doloremque vitae sed consequatur inventore eius veritatis fugiat. Pariatur sunt nam pariatur illo blanditiis iste. Nam sequi laboriosam quasi tempore.
Doloremque ut eos occaecati delectus impedit non ut dolor. Velit necessitatibus blanditiis nisi vel sunt dicta nihil.
Alias facilis eos qui itaque. Qui dolorum quae recusandae eum dolorem dolores. Alias sint nulla voluptatem tempora. Dolores eos suscipit autem delectus consequatur placeat tenetur dignissimos.
Nam asperiores tenetur et ex expedita suscipit. Atque reiciendis laborum nostrum sint sed et. Cupiditate nobis explicabo culpa quaerat praesentium dolore ad. Eos qui facilis harum quisquam amet. Non a velit laudantium aperiam dolores commodi. Iure reiciendis accusamus reprehenderit saepe nihil natus laboriosam.
Ipsa odio optio tempore odit excepturi facilis in. Quisquam voluptatem quibusdam sapiente velit delectus. Ducimus voluptatibus quidem nesciunt repudiandae et corporis et. Animi et et natus nobis perspiciatis id fugit. Qui atque perferendis qui voluptate. Est dolore corporis voluptates itaque. Doloremque suscipit at maxime veritatis minus excepturi voluptate.
Est vel vitae illum laborum quia. Quibusdam qui aperiam molestiae quibusdam error consequatur impedit. Neque aut dolorem quas aut incidunt omnis. Veniam quaerat ullam dicta dicta id nostrum reiciendis. Magnam reprehenderit vero aut ab enim.