IB Associate Responsibilities
Hello,
I'm looking at getting an MBA to switch into IB. I'm guessing this might vary depending on the bank, but how much of the modeling of the deals does the associate do? I know there's plenty of boring, soul-crushing work like creating PowerPoints that has to get done (mostly checking analyst's slides), but ideally if I'd be building models at least some of the time, then I'd be intellectually stimulated enough to not totally hate the job.
Can any associates or analysts speak to how the work breaks down?
Thanks!
Depends on the group. In coverage, in the first year as an associate, I have done 5-6 full models so far (LBO + DCF) and small quant analyses here and there. If you are in M&A or Lev Fin groups that's a whole other story.
This is also an important consideration.
If you love building models and hate powerpoint, M&A will spend a lot more time proportionally (at all levels) focused on the model. Will just say be careful what you wish for. The idea of building a model is much more exciting than the actual execution, particularly when you're building out your 8th tranche of debt in your paydown schedule.
Thank you for your input here. In your experience what do people say are some of the most frustrating, boring, or inane parts of building models (besides debt paydown schedules like you mentioned)?
Usually the associate will do it for their first 6 months on the job, if their analyst on the project sucks, or if it needs to get done quickly.
TBH, models can be pretty tedious and it's one of the least interesting aspects of the job at the Associate level. Associate job is exponentially more intellectually stimulating vs. the analyst job. VP job is in turn, much more intellectually stimulating than either the analyst or associate job.
Once you're a few years in, your group will get pissed if you're still making formatting changes in powerpoint because your time is more effectively spent doing something more value add.
More interesting aspects of the job is coordinating the overall workflow and various workstreams across the project, learning about the industry / business you're working with, positioning the business, coming up with the overall structure / assumptions / scenarios for model (and ideally having the analyst build it out), explaining the model to the client, finding solutions to whatever problem the client or project has, etc.,
Yes, you'll also have to spend time checking slides and it sucks, especially if the analysts on the project don't give a shit, but you learn to be quick and catch 95% of the issues quickly, which leaves time for the much more interesting aspects of the job. Varies immensely from project to project, but would say on average, 30% of time is spent giving guidance / coordinating (either to analysts, product partners, lawyers, whatever), 30% of time is spent speaking on calls (with clients or internal), 20% filling in where needed when analyst is moving too slowly (usually during calls where you're not speaking), 10% checking analyst work, 10% admin (receipts, internal processes, regulatory stuff, eating lunch / going to the bathroom).
I appreciate your detailed response here. Could you elaborate on any strategies you have for quickly and consistently catching errors? I'm guessing a lot of it could be person specific. Over time you'd probably learn patterns in the errors you and your analyst tend to make?
I would hesitate to call either an associate or VP job exponentially more interesting than an analyst one, save for the fact that the analyst job is very much not so. If you're an A2A or A2VP then you've seen a lot of this stuff already and are unlikely to get a ton of joy from it anymore. I know there are exceptions, and you do get to engage with the theory a bit more as an associate and up, but most time will be consumed checking work or delegating. Sometimes you can get in the weeds on stuff an analyst is unsure of though, which could be interesting. Obviously varies significantly across product, shop, etc. One other point too is you've likely modeled a very similar scenario 5 to 10 times pretty quickly, so the luster wears off of X company acquiring another with X% leverage. I think seeing new scenarios regularly would be interesting, which I guess some coverage groups give exposure to, although heavy modeling will probably be done by product partners in these cases if it is more complicated stuff.
That being said, I've been in situations where a solid associate has been running through the whole investment thesis in depth with us on the debt side and answering tons of questions, going through specifics in the model with the help of an analyst, so this could also be interesting. I think it would take a while to get to that point and you'd have to be very solid. This guy was in Lev Fin.
That being said, above makes some very good points and it can be interesting. To some especially.
Make your analysts life miserable since all associates (excel a handful..) do is just forward emails asking "Can you handle?" without any guidance or empathy, only to take credit and send back to the chain as if you did all the work.. unless its wrong that is
Can you handle? I think we need to handle this Asap. - No, no we don't I am sorry you can't manage a process in a reasonable fashion.
Yeah I've definitely picked up on the annoyance in this forum when associates don't contribute at all. Not really my style, though I'm sure once I get some experience under the belt I'd eventually just be forced to delegate more. I'm not coming from an IB background, so for me it makes sense to at least start with a "working together" and learning from the analyst angle vs just "do this" angle.
I think you just have bad associates. It seems like a lot of you guys do. The associates in my group pretty much universally look to help our analysts in any way that we can. Sometimes I think analysts get a little bent out of shape when we don’t jump into a deck to make edits but the thing is…we have already done that as analysts and we need you to learn from your mistakes. If I’m asking you to make an edit on materials that you were running and you think “why doesn’t he just do it?” it’s because it is your job and the more reps the less mistakes. In banking everything runs down hill, that’s just how it works.
That being said, some associates are shitheads/lazy but the same can be said about some analysts.
I have run into the opposite problem, where an associate actively makes edits to materials without including me and then somehow expects me to constantly be reviewing his changes without him saying he is making edits.
You should have nothing to worry about if you are going to be a post-MBA associate. Just follow these simple tried and true steps:
Do you need a hug? I hear the cold weather up in NYC can get to you sometimes. My chest hair would feel nice and warm up against your face :)
Good first cut, some comments:
Thx
This seems like a joke to anyone who hasn't had one of these associates, but this is literally spot on - had two of these during my analyst stint.
Gold. Fortune 4000 lol. Another example of why I wouldn't call it all that interesting. Some lean in more than others, but this sequence is a large part of the job.
In my firm I have almost always done modelling and it’s similar for other analysts. Usually associates will quickly check formatting and the key numbers but not build the model. To the point where they will sometimes say “only Analyst knows the model” lol
If we need to split tasks though it could happen that the Asso touches the model to make some changes.
Note this is assuming we receive projections. If we don’t have projections and need to build a bottoms up model structure from nothing, the Asso and VP is usually quite involved as well.
I do agree that modelling sounds fun but it’s not the funniest part of the job. Especially when the client’s finance team is bad and you stay in the office until 3am to figure out why numbers don’t tie
MBA associate? Just delegate everything to analysts and scroll ESPN
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