Unpopular opinion, but analyst to associate promote bankers are the worst to work for
- Usually bitter about failing their PE/HF interviews and having to stick in banking. Take it out on analysts by being Dicks, hardos about everything, and "gatekeeping" the profession
- Weirdly more willing to treat analysts like garbage (I went through it..so will you).
- They understand finance enough(relative to mbas) that they can chit all over your work(but not enough to recruit into PE, causing wierd conflict in their own mind).
4.worse hairlines than MBAs (from longer banking lifespan). It's not particularly inspiring to get handed reams of comments from a Norwood 4 hairline senior associate (aged 28) at 10pm
Working with MBAs, they are more likely to defer to my knowledge, less likely to micromanage me, and generally less bitter and toxic.
Thoughts?
Might have just gotten lucky with A2As (or unlucky with MBA associates), but I’ve had the opposite experience. A2As are more likely to take up some of my workload when they have the time since they know what’s going on. Meanwhile, the MBA associates I’ve worked for who don’t have as much finance experience seem to try to be making up for it by micromanaging more
why are you assuming that every analyst -> associate failed in PE/HF recruiting? There's some people that want to stay in IB
it seems like a lot of the points you make stem from confirmation bias
This. OP most certainly had his UVA/1310 SAT blow his MM PE offer.
Anecdotal but I only know of 1 A2A promote in my year at prior bank who stayed because they wanted to be a career banker. The rest failed recruiting and didn't want to take a corp dev pay cut. Maybe bank dependent, but the A2A associates were also far worse to work for than MBAs at the bank I was at as well.
ok dawg? first of all how would you know they failed in recruiting? second, your limited sample size isn't representative of everyone.
I hate when people make sweeping generalizations on groups of people on extremely flawed anecdotal data without realizing biases.
It's like assuming anyone that doesn't go to a non-Harvard ivy got rejected from Harvard. That's quite a foolish assumption to make. They might've not applied, they couldve ED'd to another ivy, etc.
can confirm. heard PE is pretty much the same thing so why move
yeah, on top of that the median career banker, over the long term, will make more money than HF/PE people lol
Agree at the senior level..The worst MDs I have worked for are the young MDs who started as analysts themselves. They tend to be 1 dimensional in the way they work (as they have never seen how work can be done in other corporate settings), overly focused on minor details that doesn’t matter at the MD level nor to the client (since that’s how they have been evaluated their whole life), create a ton of slides for every pitch (cause that’s the only way they have been trained), over-estimate their own abilities (image making MD before 34 and thinking they are above everyone else), are grinders themselves and would expect you to grind as a junior banker too to earn the badge, and are generally poor managers as they are never taught to properly lead a team besides seeing how their senior bankers manage deal teams. over time however they tend to nurture well into a senior MD role with more soft skills as they pick up these skills through interactions with C-suites
This is very true. Thanks for the writeup
This is the worst kind of MD, the kind that could never get their head out of the weeds. Thank fk I only ever got one of these my whole career.
truth. my current director is like that and it's annoying how he always has something to say, though now he's getting more chill about it i guess because he is trying to be a MD and has gotten feedback from others that at the MD level, you don't scrutinize numbers anymore and focus on value adding.
I think what you're experiencing is the fact that MBA Associates have more experience and training in how to manage ANLs.
AtoAs often are very strong technically but due to a combination of lack of managerial training and the fact that they themselves were often quick to learn, they can struggle to train others.
I wouldn't generalize in that way. Will say it's the people who don't know how to get their head out of the weeds and "move up" the chain to their roles who are the problem.
Unsurprisingly, I think it just depends on the person. I’ve worked with analysts to VPs who were incredible. They knew and understood the junior grind, but also understood the reality of client services. The result is they typically knew when they could push back on a client or MD and when they had to ask their team to put down their heads and work. They were very good at delegating which included making sure that everyone knew what they were doing which limited wheelspinning and iterations. I think these guys just genuinely enjoy banking more than your average guy, and it’s just a choice to stay in.
On the other hand, I’ve worked with analyst to associates who were awful. They were burnt out themselves and pushed all work down on the analyst. Any asinine request became “analyst work.”
ultimately, it just depends from person to person. Some people are good at their jobs and others aren’t.
I'm analyst to MD so I'm obviously biased but I don't think there's any correlation.
You have A2As who are completely burnt out and clipping a check until they figure out what they want to do. Some are chill and others will push all their work down to analysts because "if I had to go through it so do you"
You have some that "get it." They were analysts so they empathize with your daily struggles. They're technically proficient and make great teachers. They know the personalities and likes / dislikes of the senior people as well as internal politics so working with them is efficient
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