Staying Ambitious for the Top

I mean for what it’s worth I haven’t been motivated for years, so I kinda get it. Personally, for me it subsided when I got into college since I was lucky enough to get into a good school and prove wrong everyone I wanted to prove wrong. Nowadays, I operate based on the “just gotta do it” mindset. Honestly, It helps me in every aspect of my life. Classes fucking blow dick? Whatever, gotta get the GPA to compete. Tired and can’t go to the gym? Gotta go anyways and at least get some sets in, don’t want to be fat ugly and have chicks think ur unfuckable. Basically the David Goggins shit but not as crazy (hope to get there one day but that dudes an animal). It does kinda suck the life out of you admittedly, but this outlook has brought me a lot more success in college than I had before adopting it. Long and winded answer but hope it helps man.

Not in the exact same position as you but happy to share my thinking about motivation. I have always been the most motivated by goals I can't reach. I did my undergrad at a non-target and had no idea IB even existed until my second year. I had a goal of working at an American BB in London and it was extremely motivating, because I never thought I could reach it. I then got an internship at a tier-2 bank, an internship in VC and an internship at an UMM PE firm. All of a sudden, my goal became quite likely and my motivation dropped. I've never been doing this for the money, as there are plenty of other jobs where you can make more than enough money to live a really good life without sacrificing everything else in your life. Obviously, the work in IB isn't that fun either so that is not a driving factor. I just knew that I had been working extremely hard to even get the opportunity and not to seize that opportunity when I have it would be to fail myself big time. I also knew that even though I might not be motivated right now, there is a risk that I change my mind down the line and it would be very difficult to reverse that decision. I'm also driven by insecurity. Being part of one of the most prestigious investment banks in the world does boost my confidence and sometimes also impress others.

For me I come from a poorish background in a poor white area miles away from any major finance centre. I had no idea about corporate careers growing up and ended up at a decent semi-target but I know I could've got into a target if I tried/had the guidance. I've had no mentors and had to figure everything out for myself and parents actively tried to discourage me. It seems like all the time I read/see some privately educated minority/woman be a part of some diversity program/get easy access to interviews etc. That shit drives me harder than anything. As a passionate believer of meritocracy and very against diversity programs it really fuels my fire. For example, literally everyone on the finance society at my university is either privately educated or an international student. I am one of the only public school kids there yet I am at the back of the queue for everything.

This really helps me get into the mindset of that the "world is against me" and that I need to prove everyone wrong. Nothing is more motivating than that imo. Part of it is to get to the top to make change in the world as well.

Also try to remember that a lot of early career finance is a numbers game which involves a lot of luck. This should average out over a 40 year career. Not to mention if you actually have the passion to get to the top, you won't burnout whereas you're friends who are focussed on money will.

Discipline over motivation always. Motivation is great, but you're not always going to feel like you want to do something. Motivation is temporary. You have to do the right things whether you feel like it or not. However, even discipline gets tested. We all have a limited amount of willpower to push through. The real way to overcome this is you have to change your mindset entirely. You have to become addicted to the grind and enjoy the grind, as crazy as that sounds. Once you become in love with the grind, it no longer feels like a burden to do what you need to do. Or at least you won't constantly feel like making yourself do something even if you don't want to

I come from a non-target and I'm an international. I've applied to around 500 internships and permanent positions and managed to get only 2 BO internships at some BB among those. Sometimes, I may feel the same thing as you, that all my effort is in vain. But I dream of getting into IB. And the thing that always makes me push forward is the idea that if I decide to stop, it's all over, there is no IB. But as long as I keep trying and failing there is always the small chance of hearing something back. So I guess hope is what helps me keep pushing.

I have a similar perspective to that of Rocky and the consulting intern above. 

I'm still not comfortable sharing too much even while anonymous, but when I graduated high school I really did have nothing. My depression was the worst it has ever been, I had dissapointed my parents, and I did not feel that I had any future. The only job that I could get was physically demanding and horribly compensated. I realized that I literally could not live like that, and that I needed to either change my trajectory or take my own life. 

There's obviously been a lot of change since then. I worked my way up into a pretty good school, I fought tooth and nail for opportunities and took some big risks, and I've managed to break into IB and can enjoy the compensation and opportunities it offers.

Grinding takes a lot out of you, and failure is constant and painful. Seeking external validation and money won't give you the drive you need, it has to be internal. Your vision for what you want to do with your life, what sort of person you want to be. Are you happy with where you are? What can get you to the place where you think you will be happy? 

I had the desire to change my life, and I think that desire has only strengthened with success. I have proven to myself that I do have this capability, and it makes even the unlikely outcomes of 'the top' feel achievable. I don't know if I will get there or even if I will want to get there as my goals change with age, but it's a good point of reference. 

You need to look at the timelines of successful people who are 20 or even 30+ years out of college.  What were the most important moments in their success, what were the qualities that caused them to do well and so forth.  Study a few of them.

You'll quickly see that landing the right opportunity out of school is a very minor factor.  Almost completely irrelevant.  Sure, a few of would say they learned a lot in their first role (who doesn't?) and many will give credit to a key mentor they had along the way.  But rarely (never?) is that valuable mentor someone they met in a BB IB role lol.

Nor will you hear any of them say that their success was the result of getting on the right path early and following the steps.  Let me know if you can find that billionaire who's like "the key for me was landing at a top bank out of school, because that got me into megafund PE and then HBS, followed by a few more logical steps that got me on the Forbes list".  You'll hear all kinds of interesting pathways, but never that one.

The good and bad news is the same: if you want to be great, you're going to have to do things differently than others.  For the guy who just graduated from Princeton and is at GS TMT, that might be bad news.  His path isn't as neatly laid out as he might've hoped.  For you and many others, its good news.  You're early in the first inning.

I really liked the people I was working with when I started doing well.

Every level unlocked a new tier of people that I could soak up knowledge from.

The money is almost irrelevant. It's what you can create with it and who you get to work with that makes it enjoyable, IMO.

grew up poor / family still poor. lived in the hood tired of the circumstances and financial problems that i faced. was told i would be a failure by my family those things have motivated to land at a BB at a solid group. Those motivations will eventually fade but i know that I wont ever want to be poor again 

I am literally talking with my dad right now about this. I am in your same position and feel you a lot. We are not alone, we just need to keep pushing l think.

At the end if you are in the hell right now, why stopping there??

Definitely struggle with this too. Might not be the best approach but for me it helps to have senior mentors who are excited about their jobs. The people you surround yourself with are really important, both friends and colleagues. 

Honestly, until I turn 30 I've just told myself I need to make sure to work as hard as I physically can to help myself get as far to the top as possible. I'm wanting to have kids at 30 and that's great motivation to be able to be experienced and close enough to the top that I can have a better work-life balance and pay to start easing off the gas and start a family. That's why I stay as ambitious as possible while I'm young to try and land in that desk-head or PM position where I can manage my workload on my own ad have enough of a direct contribution to the firm to be able to start taking a percentage cut of P/L.

Insecurity.

I've admitted that i wanted to be the most successful person out of my HS. I hated my time at school, taking daily verbal abuse and routine bullying. I measure myself against my personal nemesis (which most of them are from my HS). Until i outrank, outearn, and outlive those bastards i would do pretty much anything to achieve that.

Not recommended way of staying motivated, but this is what i've worked with for the past half-decade or so.

In my observations, the underlying motives at core come from one of the following:

1. Extreme fear of poverty. Usually for people who are born into low social class and have suffered poverty, contempt, and disrespect. Their worst nightmare is going back to being poor, and only fat paychecks can give them a good-night-sleep

2. Lack of self-worth other than money and prestige. Usually for people who see money and prestige as the main basis of self-worth.

3. Believer of pyramid hierarchy and elitism. These kind of people so deeply believe in an old-school established pyramid-shaped hierarchy, and therefore will always prioritize superiors’ bullshit tasks over anything ( including their mental health, work life balance, or even self-esteem ). In their world-view, this world is all about making the top few “elites” happy, so they’ll work their ass off just to make their boss and clients happy. These kind of people are very likely to excel in schools and in jobs, but they’re also likely to become hardos and ass-kickers that everyone hates. When they grow into seniors in the future, they will enforce top-down culture to those who are beneath them and make everyone’s life miserable.

4. People who always follow a mainstream path because they feel unsecured about exploring a new unique path. Majority of people are in this category. They are so risk-averse that despite all the pain and suffering that ibanking has brought them, they still choose to go along the path because it is a well-trodden path and they feel extremely unsecured about going astray from it.

So the trick is: become one of these people. Maybe having multiple of the above motives. I know a person who made it to top PE from a non-target and absolutely killed it at his job, and he’s got 2,3,4 simultaneously. 
 

It's hard because as you've seen, there are always obstacles and setbacks. Tips that keep me going, pardon the obvious and stream of consciousness.

- It's a marathon, not a sprint. You keep running at the wall head on, you're going to burn out ASAP. I try to keep perspective knowing that my career is going to be multi-decade long

- Failures are lessons on how to take new paths. Same analogy as above, you keep blindly running at the wall, you're going to break something. Rethink approaches, reset strategy and reengage with a new perspective

- Accepting that getting to the top includes a lot of factors and variables that I cannot control. Luck, being in the right place at the right time, hitching to the right star. My approach is to always put my best foot forward, focus on the factors I can control and hope for the best outcome. My stress levels have come down significantly.

- Reevaluating myself and resetting to more realistic expectations. Two points in my career where I got a reality check as to what my capabilities really are and a really really rude awakening as to what I can realistically achieve. I'm never going to be global head of xyz at GS/MS, or a partner at a megafund and you know what, that's ok. I'm no longer stressing or burning energy towards unattainable goals

- I don't have all the answers. Removing the pressure to be the "smartest person in the room" is super liberating. I can focus on what I'm good at and delivering results in the ways I know best

- The absolute most important - don't let ambition consume you. Focus on the day to day, be consistent in delivering results, and be well balanced. Spend time with family, see your friends, have hobbies, take care of your physical/mental wellbeing, take holidays, make memories. That mental state percolates into my attitude to work and makes all the difference.

Grew up kinda poor, watched parents get well out of it, saw myself fail throughout middle-high school / early college, saw that I was wasting my life, did the hardest 180 history has ever seen, and haven't seem to have lost that fire since sophomore year of college. To me, winning and crushing it was not an option and I just did everything to achieve the best possible outcome for so long. But realized how unhealthy that was when I was putting all that mental effort in for a job I absolutely hated. Realized I had to meld the two ideas together of taking my type A personality and combining it with a job/career where I felt supported and encouraged to push it to the max and now feel like I have no limit and no need for one either.

I guess I found even more strength and power in being in a supportive environment which pushed me to be an even harder fighter which was something I underrated in my past roles (IB M&A and MF PE). I work in my current firm's C-Suite now and found that as eccentric as some of the C-Suite folk can be, they are often the best to work with for reasons which will take me some time to explain but happy to get into it.

“To crush your enemies. See them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.” – Conan

To play your game, on your field, with your rules, and still beat you at it. That's motivation.

Also grew up poor. Section 8 housing, student loans up and down, tons of ramen and keystone light was the default. You get the idea. So never gonna face scarcity again, hence the above quotes.

Now I live in a penthouse apartment in one of the most affluent neighborhoods of my city. Beautiful boxer I just adopted (was not a cheap adoption). You can search my history about all the fancy cars I've had and still do. Look at my username, because that's going on too. Pay for my parents mortgage. Etc, etc. But I'm also almost literally twice your age. So I've been through it but proof that motivation is there. Just have to find the right kind.

What matters to you in life. Economics: goods and services, whichever one it is. Goods: nice toys that give you pleasure. Services: like donating or community service that you can provide to.

And of course, look up Jocko Willinck's podcasts and book of Extreme Ownership. 

At dawn, when you have trouble getting out of bed, tell yourself: "I have to go to work - as a human being. What do I have to complain of, if I'm going to do what I was born for - the things I was brought into the world to do? Or is this what I was created for? To huddle under the blankets and stay warm?"So you were born to feel "nice"? Instead of doing things and experiencing them? Don't you see the plants, the birds, the ants and spiders and bees going about their individual tasks, putting the world in order, as best they can? And you're not willing to do your job as a human being? Why aren't you running to do what your nature demands?You don't love yourself enough. Or you'd love your nature too, and what it demands of you.

Marcus Aurelius

I really like the aphorism from Naval Ravikant, "escape competition through authenticity". If you're doing what you like and enjoy you wouldn't stay motivated.