I put this here because it doesn't fit into any other forum, plus it's a very loosely defined subject.
I'm just curious if anyone knows, or is, what we college students call "Ballers" on wall street at a young age. I know about, and have seen, the 60 year olds driving enzos, but are there any people in their 20's to early 30's who've made ridiculous amounts? I've read of traders retiring by 26, but what about PE, HF, IB guys?
It's not about the money....
Then is it the stock options?
Depends on how you define "baller" and "ridiculous amounts". Everyone will define these differently.
Generally, traders and hedgies have the potential to make ALOT more young than IB and PE. However, these two careers require a combination of innate ability, learned skill, and luck. In other words...real talent. It's all P n' L there.
Well my definition is having enough $ to not worry about $ anymore. That's why I love wall street so much, even when you have enough $ to last you forever, you go after more. I love that cutthroat business sense.
But I just like hearing about success in wall street. The mainstream likes hearing about britney spending millions and being a whore...
I like hearing about HF managers making 1.1 B
Not outside of professional sports or winning the lottery - both of which would be much cooler than anything Wall Street has to offer.
I personally would define "baller" as making a few (3+ mill.) a year before 30. Is this possible as a trader? Yes. Likely? No.
Now...is the same possible as a banker? My first instinct is to say no...but I can't be sure it's never happened. Likely? Heeeellllll no.
For most on Wall Street, whatever they have will never be enough. People will pursue the next dollar just as voraciously as they did the first. There is always a bigger house / better car / someone else with more than you.
While I don't know any "ballers" in your sense, I think compared to many of my friends I am a baller because they work 9-5 jobs and make less than half what I do. Of course, it is all relative. Ask anyone on Wall Street and an IB-Analyst is anything BUT a baller.
I agree with above. A baller to me would be anyone taking home a million or a million and a half net of taxes before 30.
I think that is definitely three standard deviations out.
I'll be happy to clear $500k when im 30, I'm a simpler person lol.
Then again it depends on where and how you live.
Oh and, smuguy has it right. If you want to see ballers, all you have to do is turn on a european soccer match. There are 18 year olds that are far more talented (and wealthy) than many of us will ever be.
-balllers are the tech innovators in their 20s to low 30s (micro, sun, apple, google, and of course all the lessers)
-ballers are the 'straight into the pros' 19-20s NBA superstars
-ballers are the HF managers that took a huge risk to open up their own shop very early on and were smart and knowledgeable enough to actually win
There are very few young ballers on wall street. Wall Street (meaning the big established sell and buy side shops) is where smart young people go when they dont yet have the ideas/innovation/risk appetitite to hack it by themselves.
Some of those people rise up the chain and become ballers in their 40s-50s. Others break away and become ballers earlier by, e.g., founding Amazon (Jeff Bezos)
"Well my definition is having enough $ to not worry about $ anymore. That's why I love wall street so much, even when you have enough $ to last you forever, you go after more. I love that cutthroat business sense. "
Little bit sick, no?
"Little bit sick, no?:
Well to get into Ibanking and actually be excited about it (me being that way)is sick in itself. Some say you have to have the "passion" and I can see through the bullshtters. The people who say they "love finance" are bullshtters. I dont love finance, I love business, capitalistic business where my earning potential is defined by me.
So yes, a little sick indeed...
^then according to you what is "business" or "capitalistic business" exactly?
very successful traders can clear $1mm/yr before the age of 30, bankers cannot
live the dream.
What's wrong with you?
Im a success had it all. tall chicks, short chicks, brunette, blonde, leggy, assey, japanese, swedish, threesome and all.
i love how people try to portray the street as some glamorous life lol . Like Armani suits, girls on your jock, and a lambo parked in your million dollar mansion. Thats a dream life not wall street lol. You will never hear the success stories your looking to hear from an investment banker or trader. Lotto Winner? of Course ...Entrepreneur? maybe.... Banker/ Trader by age 30? No way. If you want to live that lifestyle you should have had the same passion for sports or acting... that you think you do finance.
think I do? and I said business, not finance...
Met a partner at a top hedge fund (not sure what level of partner though) that was 29. He makes several mill a year so on an income basis he's a baller. However, he's also apparently the least materialistic person you'll ever meet. Story is that he doesn't own a house or a condo, no car, rides the subway everyday, no sweet watch, etc. Apparently dude is into finance and that's it.
As ixjunitxi said, I don't think there's a lot of people that are "ballers" in business and finance in a materialistic way. Yeah there is a lot of guys who make a lot of money, but they are smart, so they're not going to flaunt it like some stupid iced out rapper that has 80% of his net worth in cars and jewelry. Most people I know in business that have a lot of success don't live like athletes, actors, and musicians, instead they tend to have one or two things they care about having nice (house, car, watch, boat, etc.) but never all of them. In fact, I was very surprised by how low key a lot of the hedge fund guys I interned for were, they cared about making good returns with limited risk, they didn't care about what kind of clothes they wore or who had the sweetest car.
Well Anybody know any Goldman Sachs Partners
Let's face it, the true ballers on Wall Street are usually doing something illegal.
ive met dudes at DB, Bear and other places who were making 7 figures before the age of 30. now despite what EVERYONE tries to convince me of, after taxes, making 700k a year or around 60k a month is MORE than enough to BALL THE FUCK OUT. even with uberconservative estimates of 50% saving, that is 30k every 4 weeks. a NONSENSE apartment at 15k a month and a nonsense car at 3k a month is only 18k. that leaves fucking 12k to SPEND every 4 weeks? if that isnt balling out idk what is man. not to mention that it apparently, from what i learned in my last post, isnt particularly difficult to make 7 figures on wall street at a young age, esp. if you work at your craft and continually improve. im hoping to pull $1.5+/year by the age of 28.
you are completely delusional if you think you will post-tax net 1.5+ at that age by jumping onto the ibd ladder.
Well that's an oddly specific target you've got there for $1.5 million by age 28. In any case, with 2 years w/e in MC or IB you could shoot for a top PE shop. Summer '08 hires will most certainly be making more, but below are summer '06 starting comp packages at KKR and TPG, which do not quite hit the seven figure mark, but at least put you in the high six figures by age ~24:
KKR
First Year cash comp is $350,000, phantom equity is $100,000 (note: phantom equity vests immediately) Second Year cash comp is $435,000, phantom equity is $200,000 Total: 2-Year Package cash comp is $785,000, phantom equity is $300,000
TPG
First Year cash comp is $295,000, phantom equity is $100,000 (note: cash comp includes $25K signing, phantom equity vests immediately) Second Year cash comp is $350,000, phantom equity is $150,000 Total: 2-Year Package cash comp is $645,000, phantom equity is $250,000
Please note that you will not have time to spend any of this money, however. Instead, you'll more likely be working on deals with a very low probability of closing at 2am on a Sunday morning.
-a majority of the world's top online NL cash game players are under 21 and many of them will clear a $1M easy in a single year, even "post-Frist"
-a friend of mine was an infamous online player who quit and now trades his own capital (low 7 figures) to build his track record and still an undergrad -entrepreneurs: friend of mine is working for a
Closer121, you have some pretty high hopes. It is going to take a whole lot of skill AND luck to be pulling in $1.5 mil by age 28. I'd say most people would be lucky with $500k by age 28.
im looking to be an institutional salesmen so i dont think that 1.5 is that lofty of a goal AT ALL. According to eveyone on this board, making 7 figures as a salesmen is "quite common" so to do slightly better than that doesnt seem that ridiculous. but regardless, im still going for broke no matter how nonsense that goal is. no point in aiming low because that's all you'll get. if i aim for a london flat and fall short and only get a greenwich estate, not too shabby in my opinion.
While I don't think $1.5mil is an unrealistic goal, it was more the "by the age of 28" that I thought was a bit aggressive. I do agree that having high goals is very important though. I just think you should have a number of less demanding benchmarks along the way to ensure you aren't met with failure along the way. Convince yourself that a London flat is what you need and deserve and soon you'll find the Greenwich estate no longer appeals to you.
closer121
You missed an important part - when you make this money on wall street, you make it in a BONUS...so it's not monthly income. And yes it's still a lot but with 50% tax it's less than you think. Most likely you are going to need to save for quite a few years to put a downpayment on your place. And since you won't have the monthly income (or annual salary) to support such an expensive place, you'll be required to put a lot down in cash.
and very few people make that kind of income by the age of 28.
If you're making 700 a year, you're really getting in a bonus of about 200-300k tax. This is barely enough for a downpayment on a coop.
I agree....you're more likely to be making aorund 500k a year at that age.
i hear ya guys, thanks agian for that input compbanker, you're right about the interim goals.
1.5? Man... I need to go start a HF... I'm too impatient.
Maybe you need to work a day. Just one day.
I won a poker event at 22 and it sounded like a ton of money... but after taxes and expenses... was not that much...dont believe the hype
I think the attraction of Wall Street is that it is one of the least risky ways to make a lot of money. People with successful startups or hedge funds will probably make more money, but the risk of failure in these ventures is very high. If you aren't extremely successful on wall street, you can still make millions throughout your career.
Work one day? Of course... I was joking half-heartedly... yeah I'm impatient, but I know damn well that without some divine miracle I'll need to put in my 2-3 years of analyst hell....
It's not just that. I've never used the word baller but when you said it I got a really funny image in my head. I really don't feel that any of my directors or vps are ballers.
It is about money, for me anyway. But I don't think there's that much to it for directors on $1-1.5m at 30 or so.
You are doing very well if you can do that gross. But still not that great. You can barely buy an alright house in a decent suburb. You do have other expenses after all. Definitely wouldn't classify that as a baller.
This is why people finance their homes...
yea, it's been a while since i've heard of someone paying for a suburban home in bonus cash.
im not going into IBD junglelove. im going into S&T.
Well aren't you Captain Obvious of the day smuguy..? I'm saying even senior bankers aren't that much different. They still have to take out mortgages, in fact you'd probably take out a bigger mortgage and take just as long to pay it off.
Wait, why would I take out a bigger mortgage?
Sorry - I think your witty comment soared over my head.
I meant they. I was talking about the senior bankers.
John Arnold of Centaurus Energy LP... youngest billionaire on forbes 400.. top of the trader monthly top 100 list...net worth of 1.5 billion at 33 (actual estimates might be more than that)... That's a BALLER..
Dude that guy was a major Enron trader, you have no idea how unscrupulous he could be. Now, this guy could be perfectly legit (I frankly don't know), but a billion dollars now is nothing compared to an eternity in hell.
Bonuses are taxed at 50% ??
Not in Texas.
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