3 years IB at a top BB/EB, then UMM PE where I got absolutely ground down. Call it a push-out if you want, but the reality was the portfolio was struggling, fundraising was stalling, and my entire associate class got cut with no Sr. Associate offers.
I landed in a PE-backed operating role in finance. Mid pay, decent equity, real lifestyle. And I feel like a loser. This isn’t the golden path, and my read is the road to $5-10M just got pushed out by a decade if I don’t get back into investing soon. The window is tight. Going back to IB just for the paycheck feels wrong, but PE is fundamentally a grind and the rare growth seats that are actually livable basically don’t exist right now.
Here’s where I’ve netted out on the obvious options, would love to be told I’m wrong on any of these:
∙ Family offices: everyone tells me they’re slow and high variance on outcome
∙ PE operating roles: same grind as investing, none of the clout
∙ Banking: step back, same hours
∙ Growth equity: no one’s fundraising, negative seats open
∙ VC: not my style. Too many calls, not enough analysis
∙ CFO track: feels like a cop-out. Bean counting, limited intellectual upside, slow path to real wealth
∙ CEO track: so non-linear I might as well put it all on red in Vegas
Anyone been here? What am I missing?
Comment to avoid bot
IB very underrated career path if you are wiling to swallow pride. Same or better pay than PE esp if your fund returns aren’t amazing and more stable than HF. Plus generally more enjoyable co workers than PE hardos
I think this is very fair. Groups vary but most people leave banking before having an army of analysts and associates under them. I wonder if once you have that leverage it becomes much more fun, and yes pay is solid and camaraderie is much stronger
It never ceases to amaze me how there are so many ways to make a buck and you are stuck thinking you can’t make real money unless in IB/PE/HFs.
Look around everyone that is wealthy owns some sort of asset. You’ve spent 5 years learning fundamental business analysis, write and investment thesis on a space you can’t stop thinking about and go start a business. You have the perfect resume to raise money.
Stop being a bitch and go take some risk.
Lol I don’t disagree. That said, I think you completely ignore that everyone is in a different part of the risk curve. I’m somewhat risk tolerant but not nearly as risk seeking enough to drop everything and try and start a company. 95% or more didn’t fail within 5 years, I’d maybe take that advice. Unfortunately not the reality. The question is less “where can I make the most money?”, and rather “where can I make the most money in a sustainable path?”
I disagree. Your assumption is that you need to go down the typical VC/searchfund path and raise substantial capital while focusing 100% of your time on that.
I spent the first 6 years of my career in IB/PE then transitioned to a remote role that allowed me to take several $XX,000 bets on stuff I wrote investment theses on until eventually one worked.
Look up Bill Gurley’s podcast with Chris Williamson on finding a career you love.
Much easier to win when you wake up thinking about something and go sleep thinking about something.
You have the best business training in the world. Use it.
"It never ceases to amaze me how there are so many ways to make a buck and you are stuck thinking you can’t make real money unless in IB/PE/HFs."
IB is still the most conservative way to make millions of dollars. It is still the job where, simply by existing, you make that type of money. Is it the only way you can make real money? No. Far from it.
But it is the easiest way to be in a position to make that type of money.
I would say Big Law is the most conservative way to get to $1m. You are paid on cravath scale. You get a bonus if you hit billables. Nothing more nothing less, as long as you work enough hours. You are stacking cash day 1.
Feel for you man. But it’s really not productive to force a cynical lens on every single opportunity. There is no “golden path” either so I’d discard that thinking.
I am rounding out my PE Associate program now so I understand where your head is at and most of my peers are in the same shared struggle of figuring out what the next best step is.
I won’t preach to you and everyone has their own priority ranking and weighting, but I would think through a) which path you think you can truly excel and outcompete the pack, and b) what environment/lifestyle/location/immediate comp you can stomach. The whole “I feel like I’m a loser” / “I feel like I just delayed the $5-10m mark by a decade” thought paths seem less helpful for guiding this decision.
One foot in front of the other. All fair points
What paths are you considering where you think you can outcompete peers?
This is an AI generated post
Where did you end up landing for WLB? Looks like you were looking for a similar role about a year ago. Were you successful in finding it?
I got shoved out of my MF and now doing strategic finance at a privately owned company.
Hours are still pretty bad (65-70 on average) but am clearing ~$365k. For context I was making $450k at my MF and was working 90-110 hours so I am very happy.
When you run it forward, what are you playing for long term? CFO?
Sounds like a great seat. Is that comp you quoted including equity? I’ve heard bugger private companies can pay that out in cash. Smaller ones tend more strongly on equity packages
Thanks sir! Long-term I think anyone in the seat would pursue CFO and thats the best path (aside from Head of Finance from this seat) but I will probably be too burnt out by the time I get there tbh.
Comp is all cash (Probably 60% in base, 40% in bonus is how that ~$365k is comprised). I was told I was too junior for equity. Definitely got super lucky in the offer though.
I don't think CFO of a PortCo has to be such a negative position like you make it out to be. There's a huge range in this. In my experience the larger the portco, the more likely you are to be towards CFO B
CFO-A: heavy accounting background, glorified controller / chief accounting officer offloading all other "normal" CFO responsibilities to late 20s/30s non-MD/Partner PE employees
CFO-B: strategic CFO with capital markets ad M&A experience, deep industry knowledge, key relationships, etc, matched with a solid controller/CAO to handle the nitty gritty bean counting with CFO oversight
Agree with this. I would guess more than half of the lower middle market PE "CFOs" are really glorified controllers. Sometimes this is out of necessity due to scale, but if you come from the PE side you can basically require a strong controller under you (or else you don't take the job).
Since you did IB before, you can return to IB from the corporate side - it is very possible. Whether you want to is another question.
It sounds harsh, but head hunters are completely full of shit, if they are telling you there are no roles, you need to cast your net wider and talk to more of them. What you said is not entirely wrong though regarding the number of roles.
It's frankly pretty common to get pushed out of a fund, you can't promote / share equity with everyone. I wouldn't completely discard the possibility of just getting another job at a different fund (maybe you haven't). I have friends who have a better quality of life at LMMs and decent pay also. Maybe you'd like one of the many types of hedge funds.
As corny as it sounds, it is a good opportunity to think about what really makes you happy - think about what industries are cool and good to be in, etc.
I left IB, went to corporate, and I do feel under stimulated and almost just went back to IB a month ago (turned down a BB offer). I struggle with the same sentiment you're describing - not sure what to do about it yet lol nearly 10 years into it.
Ignore title. I feel you man, I've spent 3 years in IB and 7 years in buyside (both GE and PE), and I'm so disillusioned that I want to go back to IB.
The clearest path to $10M NW is still IB (not PE). PE you can potentially get up to $100M but it is mostly luck dependent.
From this thread I really think that LMM could be a move, perhaps strategic CFO as CFO B as mentioned above for a larger cap PE-backed company, or even IB again and rise up the ranks at the VP level, in that order
Appreciate all of the thoughtful notes here. The only two other paths I'd consider are SWF / LP-level investing and the Operating Partner path at a MF. More conversations to be had but grateful for the support and this community!
LP always seemed like an awesome, cushy job. Mainly just because I would love to be able to push around PE Partners and ask them to jump through hoops (yes, this is both petty and hyperbolic, but you get the point). Would guess the travel is cushy and easy, and the pace of life is better while still being intellectually interesting enough.
"Where's my DPI, little guy?"
It is frequently these things. Being an LP is great.
I truly think many people would be better off if they swallowed their pride and go back to banking because many (including myself tbh) are just not destined to make it to partner and if you're going to be grinding might as well get paid as much cash as possible.
After 2-3 years at UMM PE you'll be able to join most BB/EB at the Aso3 level with probably VP promote within 1 year which is probably better cash comp then any other opportunity on a average outcome basis. Additionally after doing 2-3 years of PE you're probably much more aware than your peers of how sponsors / corporates think which can put you at an advantage. Lastly I found that at the VP level in IB (unlike PE) you can coast much easily which is great given you're paid $500k+ easily even if you're mid-bucket.
I've had 2 friends from different UMM/MF go back into banking and have been able to fasttrack their careers and are making Director this year while I'm finishing up my VP2 stint and probably need to play more musical chairs just to make it to the next level at a different fund (as my fund is doing.. ok) so just food for thought.
I agree - I remember leaving my IB stint and thinking "I'm actually getting paid really well, I'm well respected, and could be a young VP if I just keep this path going". I just went to PE because its the "right thing to do". But candidly, IB for all the BS you deal with had some really good times as well. I also think there are SO many more seats in IB than PE. I think the swallow your pride point is real... I just remember VPs working like dogs to get the promo. Nearly worse than being a PE associate lol
I also left banking for PE and I agree. There’s also some piece in knowing that a lot of the stuff you do in banking is quite inconsequential (eg all these randoms marketing decks). The brain damage is PE is higher which is good in a way but sometimes it’s just tough
The main thing that’s stopping me and probably will continue to stop me from going back is that I never want to go to sleep at 3am every day of the week. It’s just too bad for short and long term health. I think I have lost neurons and still havent recovered. Other than that it’s an incredible career for risk / reward / ability to move around banks / availability of seats / cash comp / actual job difficulty etc
something ive been grippling with lately is if the IB has SO many seats than PE is destined to stay true forever. PE seats are static or shrinking, number of PubCos are shrinking, play that forward long enough and IB seats will need to follow. right?
also in a true downturn, PE seats should be stickier
who knows what AI does to this
sounds like a great time for an MBA at H / S / W then a jump back into an investing role
Sounds like you need to figure out what it is you actually want.
PE secondaries, the future of PE
How’s lifestyle?
Holy ai slop
why not start your own business?
Use AI and launch a startup and own something for yourself. going forward that's probably the only real way to hit $10mm+ net worth
Are you doing this? Curious what the play is if that’s so easy nowadays.
Everyone is also thinking this, but there is a lot more to making a startup than just vibe coding with AI. I think the better path is to make a specific app/website/service and realize value from it.
Am I the only one that married well and rich? Why is that never an option for you people?
Although most people in high finance are ugly, fat or the loser virgins from high school who can’t speak to women, so maybe this cry baby post makes sense.
Yeah this is the way.
Lol, did you marry for money or she happened to have money? That sounds so superficial. Judge women for being gold diggers, but if you marry for money, you work for it.
Separately, having a high sense of agency, seeking guidance in other’s experience, and being thoughtful doesn’t resonate with “cry baby”
You must be a stud! Crushing life, no doubts ever, smoke show and loaded wife. Good for you man. Keep crushing it. Thanks for the illuminating advice!
- All of us Ugly, Loser, Virgins
I have seen this with others before, and I hear you. I have seen ex-PE associates / VPs end up with VP Finance / CFO / chief of staff roles at a portco. I personally think it is a terrible path. You get paid less than an IB VP. Work-life balance has always been a lie. When the portco exits, you will be the first person the next fund replaces to plug their guy in. You might be canned after two consecutive bad quarters. Risks is much worse than rewards, PASS.
Truth is, we have been grinding in this field for so long that we forget that most billionaires were not once a private equity associate. The serial founders we partner with might end up making more money than your PE partner, with a better lifestyle, autonomy, and time for their family. And common...carry is fake money if the fund can't exit their investments. You got into banking and PE, and that alone tells me you are more capable than lots of people. You have what it takes to have something for your own. So why not?
What are your thoughts on moving from PE to corp dev roles at PE-backed companies? Yes cash comp is a haircut but you get equity incentives in that particular company. So you have much better line of sight if that company is doing well / if your equity is worth something (which it could be worth in the $1-3m range typically if sponsor can exit at 2x+ return in ~5 years). Much better than carry in a fund that's harder and longer to realize
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