Sr Asso / VP Unemployment Check-in
Hey team. Figured I'd run a check-in on anyone else who's in a similar position - recruiting for a sr asso / VP title role after 3 years in PE / GE and 3 years in banking. Last firm decided not to promote (tough market / fit / whatever else you wanna attribute) and haven't been able to convert from the various interview processes I've landed. Gone pretty far with a few firms but they either decide to take someone else or freeze the process.
Getting to be pretty tough mentally and wanted to see / talk to others who are in a similar position. Also starting to wonder whether it's time to start recruiting into corp dev / strategy / banking roles and try again for an investing seat in a year or two once market recovers. Thoughts?
Hey man - I'm coming up to a pretty similar position actually. On my 3rd year in PE, did 3 years at MBB beforehand. My tenure basically ends this summer as I was told in the fall that promotion is "unlikely" for me. Have been recruiting but most processes are moving super slow. Think that worst case, I'm going to pursue a startup with my friend - try to raise some cash / operate it. Will apply to b school as well. If the startup fails (good chance), I can say I explored operations for a year before going to b school.
Dude... Are you for real? So you are 6 years into your career and still making decisions based on what "narrative" makes sense to some MBA adcom or PE recruiter on your resume? And wasting a full year of your life pretending to do startup? This is beyond sad...
Not sure what prompted this aggressive answer. Not sure how deep you are in your career - but you’re bullshitting me to say you don’t make career moves based on what will benefit you in the future, regardless of your tenure
Guess his HF is blowing up. God bless…
Tough break dude. What kind of firm are you at now?
At an UMM flagship buyout fund. Historically had a reputation of promoting from within, but given the tough market attrition has been low, so our 3rd year associate class is pretty bloated.
I could’ve hustled harder to make VP honestly - done more internal networking and built a sponsorship spine, but didn’t realize the process of lateraling would be this insane. People had previously landed some pretty good gigs.
PM me, I went down similar path. Got 3y offer in MF PE but left to start a company (got backed by YC and raised subsequent round).
Punchline is that it’s really hard unless you have a technical background or you have funding runway (at least >$1mm)
From a non-technical background but have a really unique vertical SaaS idea, any idea in your experience as to how to connect with potential technical cofounders? What's truly the best way?
are they not promoting you to sr asso (from asso), or not to vp (from sr asso)? are you trying for asso, sr asso, or vp roles at other shops?
How long have you been out of work?
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following
Not be annoying / rude but genuinely as a data point wondering what type of firm you were at before in terms of MF/UMM/MM/LMM
they already said MBB (i.e.consulting)
I’m in one of the Asia financial hubs. I took a stupid career move at the height of the market in 2022 and got f*cked for that.
All the recruiters I’ve spoken told me that most funds (MFs, MMs) in my region are not even hiring, or hiring only at associate / analysts. Even then, these can come with requirements for specific language capabilities.
I don’t care. I don’t have a mortgage or any other liabilities. I have savings that will last me years. I don’t think I’ve applied for jobs except one I found particularly interesting, but recruiters are still reaching out for LMM ish roles.
What do you mean by stupid career move / why?
It’s quite specific so I don’t want to say more than the below cuz I don’t want to giveaway my identity.
At my 2nd to last shop, I got stellar performance reviews and worked my ass off for more than a year, MD straight up told me that everyone liked me and that I was unproblematic.
However, they had significantly lowballed / cut me when I joined because they knew I was fleeing a really bad situation. MD and Principal admitted as much to me, said they would “consider” but refused to promise / confirm to true me up to my level, despite more than one VP vouching for me. Note that they were unable to hire another candidate for a similar position for over a year, because both were insistent on “getting another bargain like [[me]]” - their words, not mine.
So I recruited out. Had other, way better offers (financially + stability + brand name) than the one I eventually took. All offers for the same level of seniority. Old shop’s MD immediately promised to true me up + more when I handed in my resignation.
The firm whose offer I took looked really good from a growth angle. They’d grown really, really fast and I did my checks where I could but there was nothing bad. MD promised fast progression, cited multiple examples of early joiners who benefited from amazingly fast progression etc, incl. someone who apparently joined as a SnASO and netted ~15m after a portco dividend refi (not his team / office tho).
Nearly 2 years later, I’ve seen multiple new datapoints shitting on the firm, industry wise and on WSO too. My team’s SnAso / Aso pool has been decimated by multiple departures (incl. replacement hires who noped out after only a few months), the remaining good colleagues want to leave so badly (but are stuck because of visa / other issues), the MD got so nasty on some people who left that I had to help ex colleagues get legal advice.
I don’t regret leaving, obviously, but I sure as hell regret joining - that seems to be the consensus amongst ex colleagues who are left or remained
Similar spot, 2 years IB and 3 PE now. Firm's fund raise didn't go as well as planned so no promotion spots for our class.
Been in a number of processes over the last 5 months with similar results to you despite having strong deal experience. Definitely getting a bit discouraging.
Guess we’re both in the same boat. What kind of firm were you at / when did you wrap up the gig?
Also what kind of searches have you been interviewing for?
MM firm with my time being up this June. Have been recruiting for MM/LMM mostly Sr. Associate roles. Have a few processes in the later stages now so hoping one converts otherwise have no clue what I'll do once my times up.
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Checking in; worst hiring market in our field since potentially ‘08 and it has not been easy.
Caveat is that a lot of people get this & a lot of people are experiencing the same thing.
Yup, unfortunately a by product of the worst fundraising environment since '08. Some would say right now is potentially worse than '08
Do you think mm / umm firms will be receptive to candidates for sr asso / vp titles that were pushed out? If not, how do you recommend phrasing the narrative for searching for a new gig?
Was let go in Dec 2022 from a MM PE fund ($1-2B fund size) after 3.5 years there. I've been aiming for a similar sized MM PE fund / slightly larger.
2023 I got three interviews with two progressing to final round. One went to a candidate who had an inside track (he was one of the MDs analyst back in their banking days). The other just never hired anyone.
This year has been very tough. Even when I have a referral from someone, I'm either not getting a first round or not getting past the first round interview. I've had two PE interviews so far this year without progressing past the first round.
I've been keeping myself afloat as a "field PE operative" consultant for a private investment fund with one of their portcos. The money has been good (in-line with prior pay though who knows how long it'll last); the work life balance better. The nature of the work is a lot less interesting.
Still trying to pound the pavement but seriously thinking on trying other things now
Hi, would you mind sharing how many years of experience you had before becoming a “PE Field operative” as well as what you do?
I guarantee you that I’m in a completely different market (not US / EU) so won’t be competing with you, but am thinking of doing this to pass time if I get bored / for similar reasons.
Thanks!
I've had ~10 YOE before starting the consulting thing, which tbh landed on my lap cause I worked at a unique sector-focused PE firm. If I were to estimate the TAM of other investment funds that would look for someone like me, I'd probably arrive at a figure less than $1-2M.
Right now I'm helping them out with a restructuring (both on the operating & financial side)
**Clarification** I only have that 3.5 years of experience in PE
Sadly your experience has been pretty typical for people with a similar background. While recruiting picked up in March, it is still far short of what it was two years ago and firms are still reluctant to extend offers even though they are out there interviewing people. I’m optimistic that the second half of 2024 will be better but I’m hypothesizing that until we start seeing interest rate cuts, hiring is going to be very sporadic.
For the benefit of the community, the competition is very fierce out there for Snr Asc / VP / Principal roles right now. I’m working with people who have gone to HBS / GSB / Wharton for their MBAs, worked at very reputable MM funds, had top undergraduate institutions and grades, and in some cases good closed deals. Even when they rock case studies and fly through interviews, firms find an excuse not to extend an offer at the finish line.
I don’t recommend people give up (it only takes one offer), but expectations should be set accordingly!
Do you think mm / umm firms will be receptive to candidates for sr asso / vp titles that were pushed out? If not, how do you recommend phrasing the narrative for searching for a new gig?
Could I PM to hear more about how you work with / support current MBA students? Going to be matriculating to business school within the next few weeks with goals of returning to PE post my program.
Would be interesting to hear about typical game plan, hours, your level of engagement, etc. Let me know if that's typically covered in a first consultation / whether the first one is similarly paid at the hourly rate included on your website.
Welcome feedback over the forum as well in case it's helpful for others, though imagine you might want to leave some of that to 1:1 dialogues so let me know either way
Keep going - it's an extremely tough market so you may have to reduce your preferences (strategy, location, etc.) but it's better to be in an investing role now and then jump in 1-3 years once the market improves.
How's the market looking for associate laterals lately? Know it's been tough for higher levels.
Haven't seen much for associate laterals as well lately too.
Think associate level recruiting is still semi active. Maybe not as much as it was a year or two ago, but think still a decent number of searches.
are you seeing those opportunties in tech or generally? I don't see much honestly for tech PE (with even less so in tier 1 locations)
Same boat. Spent 2 years in MM PE (analyst) then 4 years in MF PE to get counseled out in December due to market / lack of space. Was notified the prior summer and went through a slow grind of recruitment. Final rounds on several big name funds but no dice. Broaden my horizons to look at smaller funds and landed one last month after a ~9 month search that I am fairly excited about.
Advice is to stay positive (desperation / anxiety comes off poorly in interviews), cast a wide net, and know what your priorities are on your next role and what you are willing to compromise (eg title, location, comp, culture, and strategy in terms of sector/size). In this market, if you can hit 3/5 of those attributes in your favor, consider that a win.
Also most processes I went through took on average 3 months, some shorter some longer. So prepare for that in your timelines as it’s much different practically and mentally than associate recruitment.
Appreciate the insight. Is the spot you landed a sr asso or vp title? Were you independently networking for any of the searches or all through the headhunters?
also curious how you phrased the narrative for looking for a new gig?
I landed a VP role. This one (alongside 90% of my ~15-20 interview processes) were through the headhunters though I did go the mile on one or two larger firms through networking. At first I was solely looking for VP roles, but once I departed from my firm most firms will try to push you towards Senior Associate.
When I was still employed with my prior fund, I would suggest various reasons why I’d want to leave depending on the fund I was speaking to (eg distaste for my sector or strategy, seeking new geography, wanting something less bureaucratic) though ironically this made it most difficult for funds that were most similar to my prior where my experience was most translatable.
After I left, I kept a candid answer that there was not space due to market / org structure, though I would say maybe 50% of inbound opportunities would rule me out as a result, so I would think of a better answer that sounds reasonable (even if it’s disingenuous) as most firms would have suspicions anyways that you are being pushed out.
What was your strategy in networking directly with PE firms? Did you cold outreach or do so through mutual connections? I would imagine that's probably better if mutual connections rather than through HH
Cold outreach in my opinion is a waste of time for laterals. Warm intros / strong connections do go far though.
I had networked with loose connections for those roles (1-2 touch points previously). It’s really a crapshoot of finding perfect timing when it comes to networking for roles, but do get in touch with former colleagues for drinks/coffee to catch up and see if they have any advice (could lead to uncovering those potential well-times opportunities)
Have been recruiting for 5 months and not a single offer. Spiraling in a very very dark place
Are you an associate 1 / looking to lateral as an associate?
Associate 2
Damn - was not offered VP, but offered an operating role at a port co. Think I will take that for a year or so, then re-recruit.
Jesus this market is such shit.
How many YoE / what kinda firm are you at now?
Probably the best move tbh. Market has been absolutely brutal honestly.
6 years of experience all-in. Mckinsey for 3 years; PE for 3 years. At an UMM fund that's at the inflection point of becoming a MF, classic control buyouts
In a few processes but they've been dragging. Have also been booted from 1 other process for somewhat asinine reasons (my case study didn't have the comps they were looking for).
Would absolutely recommend you take them up on this offer; no one is safe in this market, and no one has advantage (except maybe the “elite” of the “elite”). After 1-1.5 years, I wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy.
have you thought about going to b-school?
Same happened to me - strat+ops/chief of staff was where I landed. For what it's worth, the role is very fun and personalities have been far more pleasant to deal with (I loathed the people I worked for before - now I am actually happy to grab a drink or dinner with any of my peers). Not sure about odds of getting back in or if I'd even want to (probably not great though I feel I would be 10x better at my old job now) - what I'll say is that a) the biggest shift mentally has been that I had viewed myself as an investor for a long time and that has been a tough adjustment for me (especially as I still interact with my old fund - not that fun to have a career setback staring you in the face at every board meeting you attend) b) cadence of operating has been far far faster, which is really nice, less of a slog c) long-term comp is a real concern - basically I'd need to be a COO or CEO or work for myself (or elite salesperson, but that'd basically be a total career reset) - there's a path to making money, it's just not completely clear in the same way as it is in PE or banking/consulting. I'd also add that the work I'm doing feels far more intellectually satisfying, but will pause there.
Thanks man - that's awesome. I have a few follow-up questions if you don't mind:
Any chance you mind PMing? Working on that same transition currently, interested if I'm pitching the opportunity the right way or any best practices their
Seems there is a fair amount of interest in people doing PE consulting work while they look for a job or try to wait out the bad market. I have something that might help:
A friend of mine reached out a few days ago and he is looking for a junior or mid-level PE professional who can provide support with deals and portfolio company work (generally associate level work — analysis, modeling, etc.). The fund is a European family office but the portfolio company and support work is for the US. The idea would be to do a minimum of three months of work with the potential to extend beyond that. Remote is fine but proximity to NYC / Boston is preferred. I imagine this would be a really good option for someone with LMM / MM PE experience who is currently looking for an associate lateral, senior associate / VP role, or a business school student. For anyone interested, shoot me an email (email can be found at my website; I’m avoiding posting directly to minimize email scraping spam): www.RossettiAdvisors.com
Been recruiting for about a year, it’s definitely been a tough slog. Have gotten much more traction for roles in my sector (I was a generalist for a couple of years before moving to a sector-focused-fund). Most of my opportunities have from networking, HH channel has been fairly dry. Been tough striking a balance between settling for something and waiting for the right long term fit. Even in a good market I know mid-level roles can sometimes have very drawn out processes, guess that’s a reminder to be patient…
how senior are you / what kind of experience are you coming in with? are you still at the fund or have left already?
when you say networking, do you mean within your own connections or cold outreach?
This has been my experience for similar period (year +) - HHs have basically been nonexistent, it's actually insane. Will go months without a ping fairly often.
Anyone else still looking?
Yes still in market. 2 yr program ends in July and very stressed that the market is so dry. I have mentally accepted that I may be unemployed for a period of time after my associate stint given I won’t be going to business school. Anyone else in a similar position?
Hey, I was in your position about a year ago just around when the market when to shit and it crushed my mentality and self confidence.
My two cents - when I hit bottom after being unemployed for 6 months (searching for ~18 mo) I leaned hard into other areas of my life to take my mind off things - I liked sports, got really into following the EPL and joined a rec league; seriously worked on my relationship with my gf (no issues but expedited how serious things were...now soon to be fiance). It really fking sucks when your 2 prospects ghost you and you're staring a nothing in the pipeline with noting on the horizon. Just keep reminding yourself it is a numbers game (and it is) at this point and (as dumb and corny as this sounds) remind yourself to be grateful for the experience you've had so far.
I broadened my scope outside of traditional PE with the mindset that I'll find something temporary to weather the market and recruit again. My criteria was 1) narrative needs to make sense -- i wasn't desperate for just anything and wanted new/relevant experience; 2) M&A or transactions related role; 3) geography - for personal reasons, i was stuck looking in a non-PE/finance hub; 4) base level comp expectations (anticipating a paycut to PE obviously). Eventually I landed something pretty compelling in a niche sector role up. Keeps me busy and pays the bills but super boring compared to PE. Just dipping my toes back into the market now...sounds like it is still pretty soft but at least I feel I am searching from a position of strength.
Thanks for sharing. I've been looking for a year and just burned through the last two in my pipeline. How long were you unemployed when you got your role? I'm trying to get a better sense of how long is too long. Really appreciate it
Late reply here. I was unemployed for ~7 months before I found my current role. Hope you're in a better mental place.
awful job market in general, worse for finance / tech, and even worse for PE. Shops overhired post covid, now fundraising is slowing, rates higher, slower deal activity.
job market still as dry as Sahara
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I’m thinking about taking a private credit role since I’m not getting any deal reps at my fund (UMM PE) - would that take me out of PE forever?
I'm a 3rd year assoc at an UMM fund where we have to spend ~10% of our time on private credit deals. I would just say these are not nearly equivalent to PE deal reps. You don't do the work of developing a real thesis (sponsor does it for you), you don't develop a really discerning investor mindset (do all deals possible as you want to maintain "relationships"), and you typically only go to committee once or twice for 15 min increments where you get asked some softball questions.
I think it's been good training when you're brand new as the modeling is basic, there's a very structured format, and there a minimal stakeholders - plus you get the opportunity to step up a bit more and get a speaking role. That said, if a sr. Assoc in private credit was looking to lateral into my fund - I would probably not consider him. You;re honestly better off bullshitting how much live deal exposure you've gotten honestly
Extrapolating your fund’s experience with private credit (which is clearly not the focus) to all private credit is just a lazy train of thought
Can confirm. My fund had a “creative” opportunistic strategy across the cap table - I was super naive and thought it would be great experience. Fund strategy ended up being private credit bc the team lead wasn’t comfortable w any other risks.
Two deals I thought were terrible and politely asked pointed questions about. For both the response was, “[Xyz Tier 1/2 PE Firm] wouldn’t be doing this if it were a bad deal.”
One of those deals we unfortunately invested in and will barely get half our money back…. 🫠 (after just a year)
Now in the same boat searching and would rather be unemployed than stuck and seen as a credit person
Any more success stories here? I took a break from PE to do something else (with honestly a bit of naivety around how difficult it would be to get back in) and have been struggling to find traction. Feels night and day from 2019-2021 where there were just inbounds 24/7. Hopefully interest rate cuts in 2024 change the dynamic but it's not been fun.
What was the something else you ended up doing?
Could someone please share whether it’s da le to recruit once you’re no longer employed? In junior VP and recently changed jobs but completely burnt out and wonder if one of these days I just say fuck it and quit - will people give me interviews?
What are you trying to switch to and from?
Not in corp PE (in infra/RE), but I'll give my perspective as someone currently hiring an associate. Would be a very very tough sell internally to hire someone that's unemployed, considering the amount of uber-qualified, currently employed talent also looking out there. First question my seniors will ask me is "why him/her when we're getting applications from current UMM/MF associates?" Would imagine that is the case in 99% of instances for corp PE / VP-level as well. I'm speaking for an UMM/MF in NYC. Things may be different at a LMM shop in a tier 3 city.
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Disagree with this this - Senior members in particular know how horrible the job market is right now, and especially for mid-level & above. MF / UMM platforms, sure, you may get resistance, but there will be shops with logical people who aren't just prestige whores. What you have to keep an eye on is if the screen is being conducted by a junior to begin with - then you might have issues.
Having said that, it still makes the search much, much, much harder. Realistically I'd say it's a 70/30 split in favor of preferring current employment. But its not the end of the world, and can especially be navigated by direct networking.
Keep cranking fellas.
Anecdotal: my friend's unemployed and he's getting interviews at some really solid tech buyout funds - not the best, but deffo solid. I think there's just so much of this crappy macro going on that funds and recruiters understand.
through HHs or just cold outreach / networking? if through HHs, what was the narrative he told them? and size-wise what kind of firms are you referring to that he's getting interviews with?
Is it a similar job market for PE Ops roles?
Also am curious how the unemployed folks here in PE are spending their time while job searching. Seems like in targeted job searches, there is only so much you can do in a week.
think there's still more seats in ops roles that i've come across - also likely less competition for those spots if i'd have to guess.
I’m currently working with more than a dozen VP-level PE professionals, the vast majority of which were laid off at some point in the last six months, and they have no problem securing interviews. As was mentioned above, in the current market and with the proper positioning, you’re going to get looks. People aren’t throwing out the HBS guy who worked at Goldman/Blackstone (made up profile) just because he hasn’t been employed the last three months. The bigger problem is that there just aren’t that many firms hiring right now and they are getting bombarded with qualified applicants, both employed and unemployed.
what about associate level
Is this European based or us based? I thought at one point you were based in Europe so not sure whether your reference point is over there or us folks reach out to you as well.
Glad they’re securing interviews but are these firms actually hiring in the end? Lots of processes my friends and I have seen they don’t end up pulling the trigger
That's an outlier example though - the HBS + Goldman + BX guy isn't the average candidate who's unemployed at the moment. That one example might not have trouble getting interviews but the vast majority of others who don't have that background I would expect would have to justify their story and hope for the best that the HH or interviewer understands AND sympathizes with it enough to give them a "second chance"
What are MBA's coming from PE experiencing?
From what I've noticed and from people in my graduating class, it's pretty horrible and that's for people with respectable backgrounds. Personally, I've been looking to make the switch into family office / co-invest / SWF from direct PE for the lifestyle, but there's literally nothing out there. I even turned down a direct PE offer at a sweaty shop b/c I don't wanna be suicidal in a year, but as time goes on I'm starting to have some doubts about that decision.
Curious on hiring views for VP / Sr. Assoc from MBA grads - how many months is too long to be unemployed (even having come from a good firm)?
are you an a3 now? how big is your class and did anyone get the promote at all? have any of them found roles yet either?
After how long of unemployment will interviewers start asking what have you been doing? What responses has everyone given?
Bump - I'm coming up on 3 months, I'm basically assuming summer will be pretty dead so I'll be at 5-6 months+ by the fall. Curious how best to position this.
Any update for those who are unemployed/actively searching?
Buddy of mine is ex-BB / KKR at VP level & still can't find shit; this market is brutal
Brutal indeed - your buddy is currently unemployed? Just asking as I have a similar background and unemployed.
Is he HSW MBA?
Aren't VPs more long tenured at that point? What would be the circumstances to force someone out at the VP level since it seems like at that point the funnel has already substantially narrowed
Bump, looking to lateral at Sr associate level in London. What's the vibe?
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Large cap buyout (more aggressive control/value) who switched to a large hybrid buyout/growth platform a couple months ago - was in a couple other processes, and got this offer without a HH (reached out to a head of the fund/vertical directly on a whim). At the VP level in NYC. Would recommend a similar outreach effort and good luck on the hunt! Keep your head up, things are slow this summer but not reflection of your ability. There's a few VP level moves I've seen in the last 2 months in NYC large cap.
were you unemployed at that point of the switch or employed at the large cap buyout still? been absolutely crushing out there for me, both HHs and non HHs wise, no leads at all, summer is going to be even worst. and don't know how much i can hold on any longer. might just become an uber driver
Just widen search and come back to PE once market opens up.
How long have you been unemployed?
Same here. No leads whatsoever. 4 years of IB and 2 years in growth. Been unemployed for 6 months now.
I was employed
What sector?
Pretty popular/vanilla sector - ie tech/healthcare/consumer
Any advice on cold outreach for mid-level roles? Sounds like it worked out well for you but I'd imagine the approach is different than the "spam email every school alumni" approach we all took as college students
I currently work at X fund, worked on Y marquee deal (if you've done one), wanted to check in and learn more about your experience...
Or, wanted to check in as I am looking to transition to a fund that does more [insert vertical here]
Depending on your resume and fund size, you can cold outreach. I generally emailed partners and principals who went to my undergrad or business school, but at many funds I just cold emailed. Got responses from most people.
If you're currently unemployed, you'll prob want a slightly different email
This was really helpful to read. And congrats on the role!
Would you be able to share what the interview process was like / what questions you've received? I know there are a few threads on this on WSO, though detail on interviews at the senior associate / midlevel stage has been sparse, so figure you'd be a really helpful data point.
I understand these interviews are typically more high-level than standard associate recruiting and try to gauge fit / investment aptitude / ability to run third parties / etc., but would really appreciate any specificity on how you think we should prepare. As in, what are common questions you received, how well did you know your deals, what seemed to resonate vs. not, what were questions that you were underprepared for
If too much to type, I'd love to reach out to you directly for a call at your convenience!
It's pretty vanilla - all the usual VP level questions. Why do you want to leave, what areas do you cover and any investment themes you like, what role did you play in the closed deals you've done - diligence, FDD, CDD, financing, etc
Similar spot. 7 years into my career and have been unemployed for a few months now (practice dissolved, not fired). Getting a look every now and again for disparate stuff bc I'm applying to almost everything, but tbh haven't made any real progress. Also have been applying to srassoc or even assoc roles despite having been a VP for 2 years. Strong references and personal emails on my behalf haven't gotten me a single interview.
Have a friend who is ex top MF has been looking for almost a year now and hasn't seemed to have made any real progress. Have another top MF friend who was given a timeline to go find something new. We (unfortunately) are not alone.
Starting to feel a lot like I need to study for the GMAT, as much as I've always said I don't wanna get an MBA.
My UMM firm has pushed out 3 VPs over past 12-15 months and will def hire another once market picks up. Just keep building relationships and hopefully you saved enough $ to keep afloat. Careers are up and down (I’m at the lowest point in my life so far)
Any sense for why they pushed out so many VPs in such a short period of time? Performance issues, politics, other?
Directed to the response above me - are you still at the shop? What level are you at?
mind if we chat? i'm the op, would be helpful to hear about how you're navigating this sh*tstorm. surprising to hear about your friends as well.
Yea DM's open
Piece of advice to anyone reading this, if you are unemployed but manage to get an offer on the table, accept that shit asap. Perhaps you can shop it around and put fire under the asses of other pending interviews, but tbh this isn’t 2020. Even if it’s a shitty role, accept and continue to recruit elsewhere and make it make sense perhaps if u wanna take that risk. For reference, was laid off after restructuring and been unemployed now 8+ months despite hella interviews, final in-person rounds, strong references and support of various professional organizations and HHs. A good chunk of my own network is unfortunately also going through the same thing after recent layoffs. Since then I’ve myself doing side gigs and random fun ways to get cash on the side but overall morale def ain’t the highest lol, may have to start an OF if we’re being honest. Either way, gotta stay consistently grinding and patient for the right opportunity that God will provide, praying we all make it through this boys n girls. 🙏
Will subscribe if ur hot3
Johnny’s hot cake 🍑🥵
Kinda relieved to see that I am not alone - I am more junior (2nd year analyst) from a top BB group and been in the market for nearly 6 months but no offer. Nearly 100 applications across PE, PC prob ~10 interviews with 3 final rounds but still no chance. Fingers crossed for everyone here!!
Brutal. FWIW in a better market I was in a very well regarded BB principal investing group and it took me much longer with far more apps and double digit final round interviews to finally land something. It's a numbers game and eventually the shot will drop.
are you only looking at mf/umm/mm or did you look at lmm as well, did you limit geography/sector/strategy or have you been casting a wide net? did you solely rely on HH or did you try doing some networking on your own?
Has anyone here aimed for a pivot to a public investing role and did you get traction? Whether it’s HF, AM, ER or even a mutual fund. Jw
yes but haven't had much traction.
I'm in a publics seat trying to move back in the private markets. Just be really careful about this and understand what you are signing up for. The type of person who succeeds in a HF setting is very different than that of a PE setting, especially since the # of deep diligence / low turnover seats have drastically decreased post-2022 that are most comparable to PE work. If you don't LOVE the public markets already, I would recommend on average not moving into that space. It can pigeonhole you very quickly if you stay a few years and there is a real lack of a transferable skillset.
Just received an offer at a small SM. Very limited opps in the market and highly selective / competitive processes competing against passionate ppl
Just finished 2 year at UMM fund and now unemployed. What are some things I should do to fill time
therapy, gym, learn to cook, and spend time outside.
what kinda gigs are you looking for next? and what was the reason they gave you for not keeping you around?
Headcount. They had 1 spot for 6 of us. Still want to do PE and pretty set on it
Not that the market has improved (very few new opportunities seem to have surfaced in the last 1-2 months), but… had six different offers go out these past two weeks (VP + Principal roles) across LBOs, Infra PE, and a couple of HFs. Previously it was mostly associate / senior associate type offers. I don’t think the market is anywhere near recovered, but it IS possible to land a role in this market. Competition is brutal and I continue to hear more stories about funds who are downsizing their mid-level investment teams due to missing fundraising targets. I encourage people to stick with it.
Also — have plenty of people securing interviews despite being terminated. Clients have told me that when they tell HHs that they’ve been laid off, the HHs don’t even blink an eye anymore.
Anyone having success?
Very few opportunities - the mid level is super saturated at a lot of firms right now and firms are being very slow and very picky with candidates.
Wondering if people have gotten perspective on how to navigate this period. Obviously it's been insanely difficult to find anything in this market and hopefully it improves, but how long is too long of a gap in your resume? Is it better to stay unemployed / in a sub-par investing seat or find something else and wait for the market to improve (strat finance, corp dev, etc.)? Is anyone else considering any alternate career paths?
Feel free to DM for anyone else thinking through the same questions - would love to compare notes.
IMO, and only for people interested in non-LMM PE (i.e. reasonably large check sizes)
1) If you're ok with your seat, stay
2) If you're not happy with your seat, but you're doing real deal work (PE/Growth), and doing real deal work or Portco management, stay
3a) if it's really unbearable and/or you're in a zombie fund, make looking for a new job your job, because you'll have an edge over unemployed peers
3) If you're unemployed, take the first "real deal work" PE/growth job you can that's of sufficient scale. I think when the market expands you'll see more mobility, especially if you have blue-chip pedigree prior to your latest move. If you take a funky role (LMM, FoF, etc.) then it may be harder to move again
Roles in NYC are a real premium right now, so may need to be open to other geographies. If you are, that will give you a real leg up.
Having just navigated 1.5 years unemployment in this market after leaving a seat I thought was unbearable... this guy gets it. Hardest period of my life so far, 10/10 do not recommend.
Lots of stealth group layoffs going on, at well-regarded funds...
Such as?
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