Non-IBW Kelley????
Hi,
So, I'll be going to Indiana Kelley next fall and I'm interested in getting banking internships and opportunities in the future. I'm 100% going to try to get into the Investment Banking Workshop, but I've heard it's an extremely challenging process.
I understand there are less opportunities for non-IBW students, but by how much???
Also, would it be possible to break into the ib/pe industry from IU (non-IBW) assuming I maintain a high Gpa (3.6+)?
I don't go to Kelley or have any friends who have gone there. However, from reading this board and the responses to some of the Kelley fanatics, I believe Kelley is practically a non-target if you aren't in the IBW. I believe you can still get into MM banking and such, but any BB/EB is probably off limits for non-IBW students (as those spots/interviews are all IBW people). I would focus 100% on trying to get into the right frats and other shit that helps get you a spot on the IBW roster.
I go to Indiana so there might be bias but I'll try to give an objective review. Kelley is a semi-target, not on the same level as the top undergrad business schools but still a good place where BB, EB, MM banks recruit from for IBD. The IBW is a very large organization; up until a week ago before graduation, it had ~230 active students (sophomores through seniors) because it takes 70-80 kids per year. Most public schools are lucky if they send 10 kids a year to respectable banks for IBD. I believe for 50% of the IBW to place at BBs and EBs and another 25% at top MMs is strong for a school that isn't considered prestigious. It's still very competitive to get into though because a lot of smart students are interested and Investment Banking is highly sought after field across the country.
Being in the IBW is large advantage because alumni and interviewers know that it means you're a top student who knows your stuff. This is why a good number of banks have large preferences for IBW kids. They have good reason for doing so, the average IBW kid has a 3.9 GPA and is way more prepared for IB interviews than the average non-IBW kid. It would be easy to tell the difference 5 minutes into an interview. Because of this, you're on the outside looking in if a lot of other kids in your class are in the IBW and you're not. However, you're not completely out of luck, some positives are that you don't have to be in the IBW to take the IB prep classes, attend on-campus firm presentations, and you'll still get some 1st round IB interviews as long as you have a high GPA. It's up to you to network well and impress during your interviews to prove you're a top student. It's very tough but there's a small group of kids every year who do it without the IBW. Recently, there has been a few small moves by Kelley to make IB more accessible to non-IBW kids but it is still gives a big advantage if you get in, especially at the BBs and EBs.
P.S. Aim for as close to a 4.0 as possible. It's not too hard to get a high GPA if you put in the work and try to take classes with as many easy professors as you can. Also, about frats having influence, it's a quick lesson to anyone entering in this industry: who you know matters as much as what you know. So if you don't know anyone, start making friends.
I'm also looking to attend and could you tell me what moves were made to make IB more accessible to non-ibw kids?
Thanks!
Also, can you apply to the IBW and the CMBW at the same time just in case you don't get into one of them?
do 50% of IBW kids really get into BBs and EBs? that’s actually pretty impressive so that’s like 40 IU kids a year in top jobs. Feel like that’s even better than Stern.
Linkedin shows that a good amount of non-workshop kids got into smaller boutiques and mm banks. It's hard to tell how good non-ibw placement is since Kelley has like 2,000 kids.
I'd like to hear someone who is more familiar with IU Kelley speak about this, as one of my nephews is looking to attend in 2 years
I had a very unorthodox path to BB through Kelley without the workshop, and generally speaking the BBs are reserved for IBW members, although I am sure there are exceptions to every rule. Feel free to PM if you have questions!
Friend of mine's going to PWP without being in the workshop. Very smart kid though
Is that like an outlier at Kelley? Or are there other non-ibw kids going to firms just as prestigious?
I couldn't find much on linkedin
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PWP (or similar) without the IBW is highly unlikely, but possible without the IBW.
That's mad impressive. Do they have connections on the street or are they just a workaholic?
n/a
If you aren't in IBW I'd try to make connections at banks using things like LinkedIn and just start cold emailing. I'd also target a 3.7 minimum. A lot of people have been saying Kelley non IBW is like a non-target so I'd utilize the fact that Kelley still has a small yet present level of alumni on the street and just try to break in through networking. It's tough but it works.
join the Capital Markets Group. I know several kids who got DCM/Lev Fin roles at MMs out of that group.
Lots of kids have gotten M&A at top MM (Jef/Blair/etc) and a few at EB/BB from that group as well I believe. A lot smaller than the IBW though, still very new.
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Mind if I PM you? Going to Kelley and looking to get into the IBW
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Happy to speak w/ Capital Markets Group, and discuss various options to build student's education in the Lev Fin Capital Markets space (and do it efficiently - doesn't have to be semester-long). Happy to host a Lev Fin Teach-in w/ exercises (I taught kids at my HS the entire role in depth in 2.5 hours last year). They were burnt out but said it was the most they've ever learned in their entire life. Also - what's key is how students can learn more on their own time, what materials students can create (Projects / Pitches / Deal Summaries etc) to add to their resume and discuss in interviews, what other colleges w / quasi Capital Markets / Lev Fin Programs are doing - and their key weakneses (all are relatively new) https://www.leveragedlioncapital.com/. what subscriptions you could get an A) initial trial + paid - LCD, Lev Fin Insights, Loanconnector, CapIQ, B) Free right now - S&P, Moody's - create login - access to rating action reports , and C) Free - No subscriptions (and how you don't need LCD necessarily, and how you can source the info publicly for free on sec.gov / EDGAR.
In terms of hosting a 1) Lev Fin Teach In / or a longer 2) Lev Fin Day:
Open to hosting a teach-in, w/ students - performing exercises that = what job responsibilities throughout the life cycle of a deal. Hit me up if you're interested, would be cool to get involved.
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Just classify yourself as diversity bro… if a white guy can pretend to be black, you can at LEAST pretend to be Hispanic
I also go to Indiana and landed a top IB SA internship for 2023 without being in the workshop. Not gonna lie, it is harder to land IB without a workshop, but f210 helps prepare you for the interviews. Also, most alumni are receptive to kids who aren't in the workshop. So don't lose hope if you don't get into a workshop.
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