What's something that you've learned that they don't teach you in uni?
I've been having lots of calls with some more senior-level bankers (thinking senior associate and up), and one question that I always ask to wrap up my calls that I think differentiates me a bit is, "What's something that you've learned that they don't teach in school?" This usually gets a pause and good think through from them, and I always get some different advice.
Now I will ask this to all of you senior chimps for the younger chimps because I think it would not only benefit us, but also give us a taste of life that some of us have yet to experience.
Ooh this is actually a great question.
Maybe one for me, who was (maybe still is) very self-conscious as a younger man, is that however much you think someone / people notice you, it's almost certainly MUCH less than you think. This has two (slightly contradictory) implications:
1) Relax. So you put on the wrong shoes and they're all scratched and look bad. Everyone is going to think you look like a clown, right? No. Nobody cares. Even if someone notices, they won't remember - life is far too short to remember the day the Analyst wore crap shoes.
2) Sharpen up. Say you sent a networking follow up message to the VP who said he'd absolutely refer you. Well, his MD came over as soon as the VP returned to the desk with some comments. Then he checked his phone and replied to a message from his girlfriend. Now he's thinking about dinner. For you, it may have been the most important thing you did that day. For him, he may have forgotton already. There's a fine balance between following up and being annoying, but I tend to recommend being aware of following up.
I wrote the above but then remembered something as important:
Markets aren't efficient. Seniors don't think of everything. Just because something might seem obvious to you does not mean it is obvious to everyone. I've been shocked by the amount of "mind shit" I've thrown at the proverbial wall that has stuck. This is from volunteering ideas in team discussions to cold calling companies on a whim which has led to a fee opportunity.
I like your point a lot. I think the first is something I do quite well. I like to think of myself as a perfectionist at times and everything has to be right, but I absolutely agree that even if people notice, they have better things to think about than your scuffed shoes. As to the second part, that is a skill that I have to leverage. I don't think I follow-up enough and that might affect my ability to obtain a referral or offer for that matter. Regardless, I really appreciate your advice and will do my best to keep those things in mind.
Fully agree with your last point. Better to ask a question and appear the fool for 5 minutes, than to remain a fool indefinitely. A variance of ideas doesn’t come about if no one speaks up to contribute or inquire.
Based on the most helpful WSO content, here are some insights that senior-level bankers might share about things they learned that aren't taught in school:
Networking is Crucial:
Behavioral Tips:
Continuous Learning:
Practical Experience:
Soft Skills and Character Development:
Real-World Application:
These insights provide a taste of the practical, real-world knowledge that can significantly impact your career but isn't typically covered in university courses.
Sources: Six things I have learned after joining a top business school - Part Two, Advice From an Advisor to Senior Wall Streeters, In Search of Wisdom, 1 year into MBA: Things I wish I knew, What I learned at Harvard Business School
Something they don’t teach you? The value of taking your time. Everyone’s so eager to jump to the next title or salary bump, but here’s the thing: moving too fast can actually work against you. Real respect (and trust for that matter) comes from mastering the role you’re in, even the boring stuff. When people see you truly know your stuff and aren’t just climbing for the sake of it, you start getting more freedom and bigger responsibilities naturally. Someone mentioned something along the lines of "you need to be on a solid ground to make the jump" and it kind of stuck with me.
I see what you mean and as much as I agree with you, I think the industry is pushing very on obtaining talent earlier and earlier and I think that it contributes to the, "I have to do everything fast" mindset. There's an infinite number of things you could be doing as a student to better your odds of getting in, but as soon as you get in you might still be stuck in that proactive speedy mindset. It'll be more difficult to switch out of that. Good point though!
it’s an ugly truth, but I am reminded of it occasionally…
To be truly be successful you need to take from people who don’t want to give up their spots / power.
what I mean by that is, to be the billionaire, the president, the CEO - the truly top spot, means you will most likely need to displace a person that doesn’t want to leave / doesn’t want to give you something important.
I see this a lot now between boomer and millennial dynamics.
this isn’t to say people should sociopathically take things from others, you must earn respect and earn the right to be in that position (by generally having respect from others for your integrity in at least some very important respects) - but the “earning” is just table stakes, to actually then “get” and keep the position requires the uglier “use of force” (which can and does change a person after the fact).
I just see it a lot in real life, as well in literature, movies, etc. (reminded of succession’s Logan - “you’re not a killer, you have to be a killer”; but obviously less toxic - but the grain of truth is you need to be willing to take unapologetically).
morally I’m in two minds about whether it’s worth the cost or not (“meek shall inherit the world” and all that).
Since when was Joe Goldberg in this movie? hhaha
Overall, I'd say the ability to think.
I always say, where school and the real world completely differ is, school is essentially about who can run the fastest, in the real world is all about running to the "correct" place. So, you may be a "slower" runner than other people, but your heading to the correct place it doesn't matter. I know people from high school that were really smart, had all the advanced classes, actually went Ivy League, and are probably doing at or worse than other people from the same grade who were deemed not that smart. It's like that picture where they say its school and they have every animal lined up to climb a tree, yes a monkey will climb better than a fish but you never test who can swim the best. So school has become more, he is what will be on the test, study it and come back. In the real world, they don't give you the answers to the test you have to figure them out, which is a completely different skill set, and why sometimes the people who did poorly in school end up exceling in the real world.
If I had to pick a second I'd say relevant skills.
I think a big thing you here from everyone is we get taught science but not how to understand taxes. Just more classes about relevant skills, accounting, the trades, how to budget, how to get a mortgage, investing, basic home repair. That would probably go a long way for some people.
Side note: I'd say the problem is more with the schools/system than the teaching. Like a lot of other things, instead of making step adjustments to make school more relevant, nothing has changed; so the only way to change is to completely overhaul everything, but that would probably never happen because you would put a lot of teachers out of work.
Eh, high school isn’t college. Unless you’re only a finance major, if you take a liberal arts degree (double or minor) you’ll learn how to think
True, but I think that's reversed. High school should be for the basics and college for the specifics, not the other way around. Also, you can't get away from it unless you change the system. All of school now, high school and college, is basically memorize and repeat. That can get you far in life but also there are other ways to do it.
For example, cheating/copying work in school is usually against the rules, however, copying work in the real world is a way to get ahead. Not saying everyone should copy or steal, but a lot of stuff people enjoy today is someone just taking someone else's ideas and approving upon it slightly. Think a lot of the stuff Steve Jobs did.
Don’t burn yourself out - time in the market is better than timing the market
Everything school was nearly useless
Some great responses to this thread already. I personally think that the worst thing about Uni finance applications is that a lot of people think that high finance (IB/PE/HF etc whatever WSO people edge too) is only obtainable based on what degree you studied. I went to a target and did the classic finance/econ course but i met very smart and articulate people who studied Mech Eng, Comp Sci, Maths, Medicine, Geography, History etc who thought because they didn't study Econ/Finance, that they had zero chance of getting in. After breaking in, I worked with qualified doctors, chemical engineers, classics & Latin graduates etc and defo benefitted from working with people from completely different backgrounds and saw how they solve a problem, get better at doing daily tasks like getting comps or powerpoint hacks you name it, just seeing their differing applications to getting better on the job was the biggest takeaway for me personally. It made me realise that if i were a recruiter or interviewer, I'd much rather interview an engineering or STEM student from a semi-target rather than an off-the-rack stereotypical econ target student any day of the week purely for the reason of wanting to hear their background and motivation for wanting to get into finance. Don't get me wrong, targets are targets for a reason and most people attending them will be very good at the job or at least in interviews, but you can probably always half-guess their motivations and aspirations for getting into finance. Lastly, i also think after working with people across all levels is that people skills and hobbies matter a great deal for working relationships - most teams don't want to hire a technical robot who's got zero social skills or isn't fun on Thursday drinks etc. Getting the balance right between being bloody good at the technical aspect of the job is important, but definitely being able to express your interests/hobbies be it sports or niche history or cooking interests etc defo helps once you break in. Just my two cents however.
I wish schools / business frats / clubs / etc. were more honest about how important internal politics are at a corporation. I had to learn that one the hard way.
Life has seasons is gold. Is like a good food, if you eat to fast you won't enjoy as much/long, end up with stomach ache by the time you get to dessert...
I think I'm someone who's often in a hurry to land a job and finish uni (because uni has also gotten a bit unpleasant and stressful), so I really appreciate this advice, especially the first one...
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