BP Trading?
Any insight on how BP trading and development program stacks up in terms of comp, lifestyle, exits, etc.?
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comp good not great, gotta wait until you start trading comp will still be relatively low but higher potential year-end bonus
lifestyle good
exits great
etc great place to learn this business
Got worked like a dog during TDP but imo people aren't as smart compared to peers in banking. Sure you get some super sharp guys but most leave to shops like Glencore and Trafigura very fast.
Huh?
meaning that the level of talent @ BP sharply drops off after a few years
100% disagree
Have you worked at bp before? Knowing a couple of sharp friends there =/= the overall level of raw talent. Raw talent at super majors like Shell and BP drops off after the young and hungry go their separate ways.
I agree with this, BP has lost a ton of people last 2-3 years to funds/other shops. The top brass at BP has grandfathered deals to get paid to not leave but no one is getting those deals it seems.
a couple? I know maybe 75 so a much larger sample size and have worked with BP traders daily for almost 20 years...
One of the most profitable oil trader in the world is at BP and not young.... how you can sit there and tell me a 15 year exp BP trader does not have the raw talent of someone young and hungry shows your lack of knowledge on the subject.. want to know why the older traders don't leave? they are making too much money to leave....a book lead at BP makes 5-10mm without taking massive risk.... why does vitol, glencore, traf hire young kids? easy, they are cheap talent who have been trained well... and if they dont work out, they fire.... so many ex BP/shell + ex trade house folks out there then anyone cares to talk about. I know a good 40-50 people who wish they didnt leave BP after a few years post TDP program
Okay you got me, didn't realize you worked at BP for so long. But my point still stands: yes the concentration of talent at the top of super majors such as BP is high but compared to places like Trafigura and Glencore it isn't as high. Yes, those firms do fire juniors but it's not like BP job security isn't that much better.
Work at bp - agree with Monty. Marcellus is correct that bp has lost some great people over the past 2-3 years, but most are on the analytics side of the business. Have also been able to attract talent too. Some younger traders are very intelligent and if they are not held back, will do very very well
Agree on the Glencore, traf, vitol hiring young grads comment. Also interesting enough I know a trader who works for Glencore who said his biggest regret was leaving BP.
Why would a trader want to leave BP in the first place then? Why the regret?
did they not get a trade seat after doing their BP TDP?
I dont believe so. Which is quite odd because he became a trader at the next company he moved to (before glencore)
Actually pretty common, the culture does not fit everyone and they used to overhire juniors to some extent. People always say I regret “leaving xyz” moment they hear their buddy landed a huge deal or had the right asset and things went their way. Would not read much into that, many people have also left BP and had great success elsewhere.
For the risk averse, sticking around at BP till they literally walk you out the door best option for sure. Just be prepared to be in more and more meetings as you move up, and not have that much control over your schedule. Versus someone at a merchant who basically can work 7-2 and vacays whenever. Or fund guys who get paid out asap, vs sitting around at BP waiting on their 4 year retention.
marcellus, would you mind expanding on BP culture a little? it is something I have read quite often on this forum and cannot really make sense of it. What is so unique about their culture? also for the other part of your comment, i guess survivorship bias comes into play here
Sure, hmm will give it a shot. First off, BP is an origination led firm so no trader is bigger than the firm. At times when an origination deal blows up it impacts the whole desk. Next, as Monty already alluded to the top brass at BP gets paid relative to merchants/funds so therefore unlike other majors there is much less fighting between desk heads, originators at the top (bonus pool is not finite at BP). Those things though are issues you deal with 15 years into your career so not that relevant to the junior employees.
More relevant to junior employees is the way the firm deals with regulatory risks, IT and in general promotions within. Due to major regulatory issues in the past they prefer traders to stay in their market and sort of expect to become the utmost expert in their market. There is no real centralization of fundamentals and fundamentals models (though this is planned to change) so you have a lot of legacy models that need to be updated/maintained and shared. Further junior people and TDP are typically not promoted early either cause there is too many people at the level above them still or the firm is strict in making them wait their time as others did in the past. You need to wait your time and not question those above you unlike a merchant/fund that could move way faster or at least welcomes that challenge.
So again BP's edge comes from origination, its physical knowledge and relationships. While they also pay some of the top traders in the industry very well and provide them with the most knowledge out there to be able to generate alpha quickly.
"7-2 and vacays whenever" at merchant shops? Is this including Glencore/Trafi/Vitol/Gunvor/etc? I'm at a major looking to move to merchant shop or a fund.
have heard that their TDP is hands down the best place to start out. great exits and phenomenal branding. ofc if you wanna stay at BP you likely have to eat shit for a few years before you make junior trader
Easily one of the best if not the best place to start your career as a trader.
Even better than s&t?
the question is do you want to do physical energy trading or a more generalized trading program?
More like do you like energy & commods? If yes, than bp gives you the option to move to banks,merchants,etc. if not than then other places prob better
100% agree
What’s comp in TDP?
$70k I believe- definitely could be wrong tho
why does it matter? You're getting the best seat to learn.
100% agree... doesnt matter at all because if you are half way decent you are in a great seat.. if you are good.... even better
Have heard shell & p66 programs being 80k ish so around there
shell is paying much higher this year...
They pay 40k
But best place to start oil trading. Better place by any mean than any banks which don't have the 1/100 exposure majors have in the business
40k? that's terrible comp wow.
Yes but you'll learn very quickly and it's worth it when you see the exit
This is false
£45k base for London yes, $80k in Houston
What are the ranges in compensation you can expect right after you finish TDP? Staying at BP? Going to a trafi/Glencore?
How much does a first year trader bring in at these places?
this is a good question and very hard to give a narrow range.... I would peg traders who stay in the 175-275 range and those who leave in the 100-400 range... I think the real question is year 3-6 post TDP which can be a huge range..... I don't believe anyone is making life changing numbers 1-2 years post TDP
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