DB > MS a mad decision?
Internship offers from DB and MS. S&T roles, identical (in London). I'm gonna take DB.
Is this crazy?
I know MS are the bigger name, but it's a different world. As I see it:
DB are more innovative, gonna be important
I to some extent want to do FI, and MS are dead there. However, I would like to keep myself open desk-wise so won't only choose based on that.
DB aren't about to have the shit regulated out of them to the extent US banks are, and will be able to deal with it better (being all innovative and stuff) if they do.
DB kept better people/gained better people.
I can learn more faster at DB.
DB paid a higher portion of profits last year as bonus (let's not forget the things that matter here).
Any advice here? This is not an easy decision, and I realize I'm a bit crazy, but everyone I've met at DB has been a serious legend determined to get shit done, MS seems just a bit relaxed...
So some of this is definitely predicated on where you live. If you're from the London, and you want to stay in London for your whole career, that might not be too terrible of a move. If you're from the US and you want to work in the US, then MS might be better. Though since this is only for SA, it's not too big of a deal. As long as you learn and have great stories to tell, you'll be fine either way.
For a summer i'd consider MS! GS and JPM more easily compare themselves to MS rather than DB!
Only for the credentials i'd go with MS
I can in no way be arsed to do applications again next year. If I go in for the summer, I intend to stick it out there as an analyst. Movement can come later on.
I think it really matters on if you like the culture at DB. At least in the US, the people at DB are really laid back and nice (not to say they don't work the hell out of their interns like everyone else). After an info session at my college, DB invited everyone out to a restaurant for drinks, paid for it (even for the underage like my friend).
On the other hand MS seemed kinda rigid and not as personable. That said, for S&T I am not sure of whether or not it would be better to take DB- since it had a good reputation in Europe. If this was for M&A the responses would be ludicrous.
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If you can do FX in London, def. go for DB.
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I would definitely go for DB over MS for S&T. That being said, I have heard MS have a very high intern to grad conversion rate, MS in fact have hardly recruited front office FT beyond the intern pool (This is with ref to London btw). DB on the other hand, has something like 40-50% conversion rate (Source: Friends). People say desks and the bank are important, but I have been in your shoes and at the intern level the only thing that is of supreme importance is whether you can convert to FT. DB and MS are at par, if you get a FT offer at either you can leverage that to get FT fast track interviews elsewhere.
Which interviewers did you like more?
I got offers from two different banks and the interviewers at the "better" bank didn't seem that interested in what they were doing. The ones at the "lesser" bank sounded pretty passionate about their work. I chose the one with the interviewers who seemed to be really interested in what they were doing (one of whom is now my boss), and that decision worked out extremely well.
Maybe your questions would be better focused on a UK based forum like Nicube or something.
DB Global Markets if you are in fixed income/FX/EM.
Rtank: A DB recruiter said they convert 80% and up, similar to MS, and obviously some of that 20% who don't go on themselves chose not to. But can the recruiter be lying for DB's benefit? MS are supposed to be one of the highest conversion rates.
Ruby Rhod: Possibly a good point, but people seem to know more here. The only UK forum I know of is Wikijobs, and 95% of them are Ops applications and a lot of them seem like idiots.
Thanks people. Decision still unmade, got to sign today. I'm gonna talk to someone at DB later, see if she can definitely convince me either way.
The thing is every bank says that to attract interns, Citi claimed to have a 70-80% rate and at the end of the summer only about 50% got offers. Everyone I know, who interned at MS got an offer, not so for DB/Citi/JPM.
Also, for more UK info check out Nicube, thestudentroom ans Wikijob.. btw all of them suck, you are better off here at WSO where people who actually work in the field will give you advice as opposed to uni students.
P.S- I was in a similar situation last year and between Citi and UBS (since both were doing poorly at the time) how I chose Citi was: Heads Canary Wharf, Tails City. Perhaps you could do the same as both your choices are equally great!
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