Everyone keeps considering BofA to be mid tier but do you all know BofA surpassed MS in IB revenue last year, and is very close to surpassing them again this year? As far as I can observe, BofA is pretty much now a top BB along with MS, but a bit of a notch below GS/JP.
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Sure, revenue can be used as a factor. However, keep in mind that BofA also has a huge balance sheet, and debt deals also normally count towards ”IB revenue”. Who is the top bank depends on what segment you look at, and I can gurantee you that MS comes out very strong vs. BofA in e.g. M&A and ECM advisory.
Nevertheless, both banks are well regarded in IB, and ranking BBs among themselves is, according to myself, quite pointless. All banks have their respective strengths and weaknesses.
Just my $0.02
Except everyone tells me I'd better off be homeless than work at UBS next summer :(
They’re correct
Revenue is a piss poor metric for league tables. Balance sheet banks get inflated because it includes all the unimpressive debt deals that they land simply because they have the balance sheet to do it. Do you see Evercore/PJT/CVP at the top of the league tables by revenue? No. Are they better investment banks than BofA? Sure are. Not to say that MS is an advisory boutique, but they (like GS) lack a balance sheet and therefore rely on M&A and equity.
MS will walk into any bakeoff where BofA is trying their ass off and win it almost every time. If it's an ultra-levered sponsor deal that *needs* inordinate amount of financing, BofA will win it. Not because of their advisory expertise, but simply because they can staple financing.
Any non-biased halfwit in the industry knows that MS is another echelon from BofA.
Lol but BofA is above all the EBs you mentioned in M&A and equity league tables, so your point doesn't really stand. I'll say that I was surprised to see they had higher/comparative IB revenues. That wasn't the case a few years back. No matter the reason why, if that keeps going for a couple more years, I think it signifies that the bank is moving up significantly in the IB world. Just don't be surprised when BofA is silently winning those mandates and things change if the trajectory continues (esp since BofA had been boosting up their IB division of late).
It actually supports the argument that league tables aren’t always the end all be all. For example, Jefferies is above Centerview, Moelis, Laz in US M&A by deal value (just googled, this is from merger marker H1 2021 report). Does this make Jefferies better than them? Obviously not
OP is right about revenue league tables but if you look at M&A league tables and ECMleague tables MS is significantly above BoA. If you look at DCM league tables, the 3 balance sheet banks are the top by a lot (i.e. lending). I don't think anybody is denying the legitimacy of BoA but the revenue figures are kind of useless. I don't think MS thinks about BoA at all
You're clearly insecure about your BofA offer, which is fine. But don't start going on WSO and try to compare MS with BofA.
MS beats out BofA in M&A and ECM consistently (as others have pointed out) and the fact that BofA's balance sheet is literally the size of JPM yet still has revenues below MS shows which bank is really "better".
At the end of the day, BofA is a great institution to be in and you should be happy that you'll be working there. Be grateful for your offer and stop making comparisons like this, because it just makes you look silly...
^^^^ BofA is a fantastic bank even if it’s “not better than MS”
very strong groups (lev fin, REGAL, sponsors, etc.), global name brand, recession-proof balance sheet, great office location, etc.
Yeah, I'm not entirely sure what the MS penis envy is about, lol.
BAML is a solid, respectable bank to work at, that'll give you good exposure across cap markets and M&A, and will give you good PE exit opportunities (or the differences in PE exit opps will be immaterial and largely be dictated by the candidate less so than whether or not he/she came from BAML or MS)
In what world should anyone be insecure about a BofA offer
Yeah right, OP is insecure about working at one of the highest paying BBs with unarguably one of the best cultures in every metric, one of the highest retention rates in IB, and the sickest NYC building. I would be insecure too if I was in OP's shoes.
You are in OP’s shoes you fucking moron
But muh prestigious 'GS discount'...
Arguing over BB rankings >>> spending time with family on Xmas Eve
Realize I'm a part of the industry but this is just sad guys...
.
Take MS
.
Not really the topic of this specific thread, but just out of curiosity, how would BofA compare with other "mid-tier" BBs? Think it's slightly better if not similar to Citi, and a little better than Barclays/CS? Or would someone easily choose BofA over other BBs, given he/she doesn't have an offer from GS/MS/JPM?
The latter imo. I’d much rather be at a strong American bank with a balance sheet than a European bank (sorry Barclays, CS) and BofA is overall stronger than Citi in most categories
imo GS/MS>JPM>>Citi/BAML>>Barcap/CS>>>>>DB/UBS
I think BofA is a touch better than Citi. CS is also certainly below Barclays now.
accurate
This is absured, can we stop measuring dicks.
Let's just appease OP and cheer and hoorah for his BofA having a decent year. Over 20% of their IB revenue is from lending (for GS/MS it's an insignificant amount) and should be net from the tables, and in no way is this an indicator of BofA encroaching on MS's market position. Regardless, BofA is a great shop and there is no reason to feel insecure about working there, or the need to make some unsubstantiated case that it's top BB level.
People overcomplicate very simple things. BofA is an amazing place to land a job. Unfortunately, our industry is shaped by "assumed" prestige and "assumed" exit Ops. Given that, one should take MS every day of the week. It's that simple… just as one should take Harvard over Princeton. It's all quite simple. Cheers.
Total investment banking revenues include fees earned from syndicated lending, which MS doesn't really participate in. Removing that puts MS comfortably ahead
But why would you remove that?
I agree its kind of like saying FB is better than Amazon because their advertising business is better. You really can't single out one line of business or exclude. The reality is checkings / savings accounts, retail, lending, are not deemed prestigious when comparing rankings so they exclude them.
How about penis size, how does the size of your dick compare to those of MS or other EB's?
Who cares they all pay the same at VP level and below.
GS/MS discount is real
100% untrue - definitely not after this year's raise
Bank of America has not gotten anywhere close to surpassing Morgan Stanley as far as I have been informed and is actually losing overall IB market share. That being said, if you are an analyst and not the head of an Industry Group, I wouldn't worry too much about how one massive financial conglomerate stacks up against another. The junior experience will be fairly similar across the board (although GS and MS have to do far less pitching to win M&A mandates).
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