Cant do it anymore

I'm a second year Associate at EB. A2A so have done this shit for 5 years now. Have probably averaged over 100 / week throughout 2021 and its gotten especially bad recently. Going to bed now between 4-6am 6 days a week

Trying to hang on for the bonus due in March but my mental and physical health have deteriorated completely along with my performance and I still have 6 months left to go

I have a family who loves and supports me which is probably the only reason I haven't killed myself by now. They all sat me down last night and begged me to quit

Dont know how to quit. There's a deal I'm working on that will derail completely if I quit - they'll beg me to stay on until its done. At that point I might as well just stay on to get the bonus

WSO Elite Modeling Package

  • 6 courses to mastery: Excel, Financial Statement, LBO, M&A, Valuation and DCF
  • Elite instructors from top BB investment banks and private equity megafunds
  • Includes Company DB + Video Library Access (1 year)

Comments (91)

  • Analyst 1 in S&T - Equities
Sep 8, 2021 - 12:12pm

Can you ask for a light staffing week at some point in the future and just be honest with your staffer about this? This way you have more time to think and not make a hurried decision at a low point. I think it would be in their best interest considering the alternative is you quitting. If your staffer can't cut you some slack after 5 year A2A then there may be an issue with the firm in general. 

Learn More

300+ video lessons across 6 modeling courses taught by elite practitioners at the top investment banks and private equity funds -- Excel Modeling -- Financial Statement Modeling -- M&A Modeling -- LBO Modeling -- DCF and Valuation Modeling -- ALL INCLUDED + 2 Huge Bonuses.

Learn more
Sep 9, 2021 - 5:09pm

Agreed.

For some perspective, Floyd 'Money' Mayweather says "My health is my wealth" and no one loves money more than that guy, but he still recognizes nothing is more important than your own health.

Has been my biggest takeaway from 2021 tbh.

Just tell them you need to work less hours or else you will quit and actually do it if they don't oblige. You have plenty of money saved up (I would hope), so you don't need to worry about paying the bills. Isn't that why we all got into the industry in the first place? So when we r in scenarios like this, we have the financial freedom to walk away and do whatever TF we want? USE IT.

Don't succumb to the golden handcuffs.

Most Helpful
Sep 8, 2021 - 1:54pm

Take a step back and think about what you've said in the OP - you're contemplating suicide but afraid to let go because a deal you're working on will get de-railed without you? Don't care if I get MS for this because it sounds like you need a reality check, stat.

1) Juniors are a resource and you're easily replaceable - sure there will be a bit of turbulence for the firm / deal team during the transition, but until you have revenue tied to your name you are dispensable. Execution is a commodity and the show goes on with or without you - full stop. Groups / deals don't fall apart when the global head leaves, so what makes you think this holds true for a second year associate?

2)  Firms will fire you without an afterthought if the economics justify it. It might sound cynical, but corporations are an economic engine and the only entity it reports to are its shareholders. The majority of the "relationships" that you have in the workplace are professional relationships at best (with the occasional outlier or two that you can genuinely call your friends) - this is particularly true for anyone above you in seniority. Would your director / MD visit you in the hospital if you fell sick from work?

All to say is loyalty to a artificial entity (your firm) is completely asinine and would encourage you to think twice before trading your well-being for a cause when it won't be reciprocated. I get the reluctance to leave money on the table regarding your bonus, but that's what "golden handcuffs" are. You'll always be leaving money on the table when you leave a job, whether its in the form of accrued bonuses, LTIP, etc.

If you're truly working the hours your working and your mental health has deteriorated to the point that you need an intervention, no amount of money is worth that. To be clear, this isn't coming from a jaded banker - I love my job and the BB I work for. At the same time, I try to keep a level head and realize that my job doesn't dictate how I live my life. Failure to speak up is completely on you - if you don't know how to draw the line in the sand, then you're not managing your professional life as well as you think.

  • Associate 1 in IB - Cov
Sep 8, 2021 - 1:57pm

Jesus over 100 hours as an associate? Is this normal across other banks right now?

  • Analyst 1 in IB - Cov
Sep 9, 2021 - 4:31am

can confirm - APAC BB and assocs are working just as hard/long if not as much as analysts 

in fact some directors still sending emails at 1-2am 

  • VP in IB - Gen
Sep 8, 2021 - 2:03pm

March is nowhere even close.  Just quit - lateral to a BB coverage group or even a capital markets group.  They'll pay out your year-end prorated bonus (based on their buckets, not your EBs, so it'll be lower of course) but at least you will have a normalish life.

  • Associate 1 in IB - Cov
Sep 8, 2021 - 2:23pm

What are associate hours like at your bank right now? I'm at a BB and ours are pretty brutal. 

  • VP in IB - Gen
Sep 8, 2021 - 2:38pm

Probably like 80-85, but the difference between 85 and 100 is massive.  The curve isn't linear because at some point, it goes from not having free time every weeknight to getting less than 5 hours sleep.  Those incremental 10 hours are where it gets bad.

  • Analyst 1 in S&T - Equities
Sep 8, 2021 - 3:30pm

I'm an associate in BB coverage, think the 80-85 seems about right...bad weeks are 90+ but it hasn't been week in week out like it was when capital markets went crazy last year.

Sep 11, 2021 - 3:21am

you could quit today, and the only thing it would truly cost you is your opportunity cost of the spring bonus. Think about how much money you'd pay for a break and then quit. You can always go back to banking or find another way but if you hit rock bottom (and I mean rock bottom) you won't be thinking straight let alone able to handle the pressure of quitting so just know you can quit before then and it will be ok. 
 

you could also go the route of talking to the staffers. Might as well try to avoid the non ideal outcomes even if they say no.
 

On the other hand, I totally agree with this comment. I'm a headhunter and banks are still giving people full year bonuses (or a mix of prorated bonus plus sign on etc) to cover what people will be leaving behind. If you make a move, even to another crazy bank, you'll get a month off in between signing the offer and starting and you'll still get the money. Capital Markers / Capital Advisory teams are also a good idea.
 

Lastly, the large middle markets are paying out just as aggressively as the EBs/BBs but are recruiting even faster in my opinion. 

  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Sep 8, 2021 - 3:24pm

This sounds insane. I would say just quit. Hate to say it but March is still a long way to go and it's not worth further damaging your mental health

Sep 8, 2021 - 3:26pm

starfishM

Dont know how to quit. There's a deal I'm working on that will derail completely if I quit - they'll beg me to stay on until its done. At that point I might as well just stay on to get the bonus

No, just fucking no dude. Smack yourself out of this line of thinking.

You know what they'll do if you quit? They'll staff someone else and have a replacement at your desk by the end of the week. Look at how many posts on here talk about a hot lateral market. We are all replaceable. Every single one of us from MDs down.

You know what's not so easily replaced? Your health and mental well being. No amount of money is going to fix that. You going to be broke and/or homeless if you miss that March bonus? No. Reread what you wrote, think about how much more of yourself you'd lose hanging on for that dough. It's not worth it, the money will come. 

Sep 8, 2021 - 3:30pm

Sounds horrible. Obviously try to do everything to let your staffer not work you like a dog before you call it quits. Good luck man! Little 20 min naps during downtime could help, make sure you are drinking enough water, taking your vitamins, and getting some sort of blood flow. Standing desks are also good. Wish you strength during this. 

Sep 8, 2021 - 4:11pm

There's no great answer for you, but a couple ideas:

- You know when your bonus will be paid, but do you know when comp is determined? That's really the date you need to get to, and it's probably january/february. You don't want to quit before the check actually hits your account, mind you, but post-comp committee you just need to do enough work to not get fired

- Short of actually quitting and meaning it, I wouldn't breathe a word of your plans or circumstances to anyone at your firm or even one degree of separation from it. If you think you're unhappy now, imagine getting fired in December or shafted on your bonus because word is out that you're out the door

Sep 8, 2021 - 4:15pm

Talk to your staffer.  If they don't care then start telling your VPs that you're too tied up to work on stuff on certain deals.  If that doesn't work then talk to your group head and tell him you can't be staffed on deals that require you to literally be in two places at once, and need to discuss your staffing situation.  If that doesn't work, then tell him you're not able to work in that capacity and don't think it's fair to have your performance suffer because you're not able to be two places at once.  If that doesn't work then quit.

Sep 8, 2021 - 4:50pm

Can't tell if you're a psychopath or lying about your experience. You're the first person I've ever heard of who hasn't learned that shit can wait / you can push back by the time you hit associate. I've literally never experienced anything that was consistently required to be done at 4-6am or even after 1-2am. You have to have some backbone whether that be pushing back or quitting. 

  • VP in IB - Cov
Sep 8, 2021 - 5:49pm

- if you've been the group for 5 years, no one wants to lose you and no one will blame you if things aren't perfect. Work with the team to get out of the hole you are in right now 

- deliverables will never be perfect. No deal will be perfect 

- it's client services. We put a good effort but we can't solve their problems

- as someone already said - things can wait. You don't need to solve it right away. You don't need to own what might be someone's work or problem 

- banking in particular is a long game. Trying to do everything or getting nervous burns people out. It's about optimal outcome with best effort that makes you look good. Try that 

- unlike what someone said, your team probably cares about and won't fire you or even pay you less if you raise the issue. Client doesn't control your outcome anyway

- it's been a horrific stretch since April / May of 2020 once covid quietness went away. We all hope it subsides soon

  • Associate 2 in IB - Cov
Sep 9, 2021 - 2:33pm

Agree with this. I've been in banking for a while and have seen people take a couple weeks to months off to avoid mental breakdowns. Seniors don't want to lose loyal mid-level guys. Talk to a VP, Director, or MD you're close with and level set. Assuming you've done good work for a couple years - ask for some time off (could be a week, 3 weeks, 5 weeks). Decompress and come back when you feel more yourself… I'd still quit post bonus in this situation.

If you have this conversation and they don't sympathize with your need to take some time off - quit. Health is 100x more important. Best of luck man.

  • Associate 1 in IB - Restr
Sep 8, 2021 - 6:51pm

Just bounce.  You'll be able to jump ship to the buyside w/in a few weeks and still make more than enough to live on / save, w/ way the fuck fewer hours.  I had bonus due in mid January and just bounced.  

I'm an A1 at an MM, so not making as much as you, but going from $260k to $190k all-in comp is a no-brainer if the $190 also allows you to have a life, look after your health, and begin un-fucking the relationships that are important to you.  Also, it'll more than come out in the wash if you can position yourself for carry in the near-term at your new job. 

Sep 8, 2021 - 10:14pm

Echoing what pretty much everyone above has said, get out ASAP. I actually had a very similar situation in PE down to having my friends and family sit me down telling me to quit but I refused and it made me more and more miserable and desperate because I didn't know when to say enough is enough. Nothing is worth sacrificing your mental health and happiness. You need to be in tune enough with yourself to realize when you've had enough and make the tough decision of stepping back and doing something else. There's no hero's in this story except for you. If you were to leave it'd be only but a minor inconvenience to your firm until they filled your spot with one of the many eager candidates in line. 

Take the power you have of realizing you're miserable and use it to focus your energy on finding something which better fits your lifestyle expectations / interests.

  • 3
  • Associate 1 in IB-M&A
Sep 8, 2021 - 10:36pm

If bonus gets announced in December/January and is paid out March, could you quit when it is announced?

I think in this environment, while juniors are replaceable, we hold a lot of power in terms of setting boundaries. I would actually talk to the senior banker on your team if you have a good relationship with them and tell them you need a break. What's the worst they can do?

  • Analyst 1 in IB - Gen
Sep 9, 2021 - 1:11am

Take a week off and totally unplug. Leave your phone behind or give it to your parents. You've been there for 5 years, if they fire you, they fire you. Start logging off earlier, it can wait.
 

You don't owe the firm anything. If a deal get derailed just because of you, that's the firms fault because they should plan better. This is just a job. You need to take a huge step back and realize your life is worth a hell of a lot more than logos on a PowerPoint and numbers in a spreadsheet.

I challenge you to aim for mid-bucket. If you get top bucket I'll be disappointed because the damage to your mental health is not worth the money. You should consider lateraling down street if you can. Fwiw my shitty bank pays street base but  low bonuses BUT our saturdays are protected and everyone always takes at least a 1 week vacation and we have lower hours. For me personally the trade off in pay is worth it because the per hour pay is about the same.

  • Analyst 1 in IB - Gen
Sep 9, 2021 - 1:03pm

Big foreign based bank. In the BMO, BNP, HSBC, Nomura, SocGen, type tier. It's not prestigious, I won't be exiting to KKR (no interest in PE so idc) BUT I didn't do any work on Saturday or Labor Day and besides the people who started in July, everyone took at least one day off between 8/1-9/9 with some associates taking the week off. Therefore the trade off is fine for me.

Sep 9, 2021 - 2:04am

Man… you just wrote that if you didn't have a supportive family you would have killed yourself by now because of your job. Leave now. Fuck the bonus. Obviously don't know your financial situation but you've been at an EB for 5 years so one more bonus shouldn't be make or break for you. Your company doesn't care about you, just get out and get some help.

  • Prospect in IB - Gen
Sep 9, 2021 - 12:03pm

I have never heard of associate constantly pulling 100 hour every week. If that's the case, you guys need to hire more heads and bring it up to your Staffer. I seriously doubt any MD or group head is working 70 hours a week to bring in business. I have pulled 80-90 hours week occasionally. But my average week is still 65-70 hours range, despite working at what people call a sweat shop on the forum. I think a lot of problem with analyst on my team is either working too slow or doesn't know how to not ask for more work.

Sep 9, 2021 - 12:15pm

This is clearly an issue from the staffer/higher ups. I understand when turning live deals everyone hours can be crazy, but 100 hrs as an ASO consistently just is not right. Mental and physical health should always be a priority. I think people forget that these are jobs NOT your life. Also you've put in 5 years, you need to be able to say no and prioritize your well-being.

Sep 9, 2021 - 12:52pm

1. Turn your Linkedin to Open to Work (Private)

2. Take offers from recruiters and compare them. Ask them essentially everything about the job.(I recommend Corp Dev in Tech industry, they work 3-5 hours a day). 3-5 hours a day, yes you read it right. I have a friend who is Software Engineer at Google, He works remotely and sometimes he works at my place. It's real, they work 3-5 hours a day right now. People in Corp Dev even work fewer hours than that. If you have 5 years experience without an MBA, your comp will be approximately 160k to 180k base, 10% - 20% annual bonus, 100k - 200k RSUs vesting for 4 years. So it's not that much less.

3. Write your 2 week notice, fuck the bonus. It's not worth your mental health.

4. Enjoy the by-product of Big Tech Monopoly.

Sep 9, 2021 - 12:52pm

Only point I'd make is - you owe the firm nothing, you don't owe them loyalty.  Maybe you owe some loyalty to people, but not the firm, and if that's the case they'll understand.  Firm will be fine, it's happened many times before.  Bonus money is hard to give up, but over the course of a 30-50 year career, one (highly taxable) bonus isn't going to make or break your wealth.

  • 1
  • Analyst 2 in Consulting
Sep 9, 2021 - 2:22pm

Have to echo what everyone else is saying just to reinforce it. It's not worth it. Try to explain your situation to leadership and make them understand it is literally destroying your physical health. If they don't understand and change your situation then quit. When you look back on it 20 years from now you'll be glad you did. 

  • Analyst 1 in IB - Cov
Sep 9, 2021 - 2:34pm

Jesus Christ, man. Reread your own post. Listen to yourself. You've been fucking brainwashed. Let me help you, brother.

>I have a family who loves and supports me which is probably the only reason I haven't killed myself by now. They all sat me down last night and begged me to quit

Listen to them and fucking quit. Read what you just said. You are thinking about KILLING YOURSELF over an OFFICE JOB.

If you heard some data entry clerk say that they were thinking about killing themselves over their job you would be like "dude what the hell, just quit".

Despite how "sexy" you've been brainwashed into thinking banking is, it's literally just a fucking office job that isn't worth KILLING YOURSELF over.

>Dont know how to quit.

Open up outlook. Click New Email. Type in your staffer's name in the first line. Type "I Quit" in the subject line. Type "I am terminating my employment at bank effective immediately" into the body of the email. That's all you have to fucking do.

>There's a deal I'm working on that will derail completely if I quit - they'll beg me to stay on until its done.

Dude, are you even listening to yourself? Who gives a FUCK if the deal falls apart? Did these people give a fuck about you when they worked you 20 hours a day to the point of suicide? Come on, man. That's the brainwashing talking. 

Think about this: You are thinking of KILLING YOURSELF but you won't leave because you're scared that your boss's deal might fall apart? Jesus Christ, when did people get so enslaved by their jobs.

>At that point I might as well just stay on to get the bonus

Cool, I guess that bonus will come in handy for your family to buy you a nice casket after you've blown your brains all over the CIM that your MD needs by tomorrow but won't read until next week for a pitch that has zero chance of happening. But hey, I'm sure your bank will at least wait until your body is cold to put up the job posting on LinkedIn.

I'm not trying to be a dick. I'm yelling at not just you but MYSELF because I was in the exact same boat except I was a first year who was 3 months away from the bonus. Suicidal thoughts, family telling you to quit, endless late nights, and perpetual misery. My family almost took me to a psych ward after a few nervous breakdowns.

I quit and found another job in 3 months. With <1 year of professional work experience and less than 5 closed deals on my resume. 

You're a second year associate. You have been a professional for over 5 years and have accumulated an insane amount of transaction, technical, and leadership experiences. You're a dream for other companies to hire.

Just fucking quit and take control of your life again.

  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Sep 9, 2021 - 2:57pm

as another first year analyst, what type of job did you switch to? Wondering what type of job I can land with <1 year of IB.

  • Associate 3 in IB-M&A
Sep 9, 2021 - 2:46pm

Lots of good advice here. Will add on a few things

- Just quit. Tomorrow. Take a month or two off of work of any kind, go sit on a beach and recover, and then figure out what's next. You'll be very employable even if you take 6, 8, 12 months off. Mental health comes first, and after 5 years you probably have a nice buffer.

- If you absolutely need the money in March - given your tenure, your bank will probably let you take a long (2-3+ months) paid sabbatical, even short-term disability for mental health you'd get a nice break, but a lot of places may offer this up informally at 70% salary or something. Even if unpaid, I'd take a break so you can have a month fully off and then use the rest of the time to figure out how to GTFO in March. 

- F*** the deal, they will figure it out, should not even be a consideration for you besides handing off models and such

Your life is not worth prestige or money

Sep 9, 2021 - 3:28pm

Here's my two cents:

Do whatever it takes to stick it out and stay on for the bonus, then get the fuck out of there.

You seriously contemplating suicide, that's not okay. This is a job, you are what? Probably 26-27 years old? That's not even half your life my friend.

The money is great … sure. But is it worth your own life? Fuck no.

Seriously, please quit this job, and speak to whomever you managers are that this is not okay, and be open and TELL them how you're feeling.

If there's no sympathy given there, then they can go fuck themselves. Pretentious assholes. None of it even matters anyways.

Please please please look after yourself! You mean so much to your friends and family!

  • Business School in IB - Cov
Sep 9, 2021 - 9:15pm

FUCK EM

Jk but not really

Its easy for me to say it cuz i'm not in your shoes with your pressure but i'd quit

Look at it on a scale of risk/reward

It's pretty low risk to quit- their deal might fall thru but who cares it happens

It's pretty high risk to affect your physical health working on a deal that in the grand scheme of things will probbaly mean jack shit to u

I'd be lying if I said the reward was low by staying because you're getting the bonus you've grinded for

But I think the reward to your physical health is just as great

All power to you bro. Love and respect. Hope everything works out my guy

  • Business School in IB - Cov
Sep 9, 2021 - 9:15pm

FUCK EM

Jk but not really

Its easy for me to say it cuz i'm not in your shoes with your pressure but i'd quit

Look at it on a scale of risk/reward

It's pretty low risk to quit- their deal might fall thru but who cares it happens

It's pretty high risk to affect your physical health working on a deal that in the grand scheme of things will probbaly mean jack shit to u

I'd be lying if I said the reward was low by staying because you're getting the bonus you've grinded for

But I think the reward to your physical health is just as great

All power to you bro. Love and respect. Hope everything works out my guy

  • VP in IB - Gen
Sep 9, 2021 - 10:46pm

For what it's worth, I can fully empathize with this and am near my breaking point as well. I'm an A2A2VP working 90 hour weeks consistently... unbelievable deal activity without enough support at the associate / analyst level across multiple deals. We are in an unprecedent M&A market as you know, and this is not sustainable whatsoever.

I can't fully appreciate your situation but I share much of the same sentiment. For what it's worth, I think this year will be a tremendous bonus year where making it to March will give you a lot of extra freedom with a couple years of living expenses hit at once. If you are truly done with the job (which I am sure you are), decide that you are getting your bonus and then transitioning to something else... but first take a few months off to travel, get your mental / physical health right. Having that extra bonus will provide alot more comfort.

Something I'm struggling with weekly / daily and use the above to give me hope.

Good luck and hang in... we will power through this! :)

  • Analyst 1 in IB - Cov
Sep 9, 2021 - 11:00pm

dude, no offense but your corporate vp bullshit talk is part of the problem

this guy is about to kill himself and you're telling him to hold on for SIX MONTHS aka HALF OF A YEAR aka 2022 just for money

this is kind of why i hate senior bankers. all you fucks do is think about the dollars

the dollars and all of that """financial freedom""" won't be worth shit if he kills himself next week. if he's serious about being suicidal this guy needs to quit NOW

  • VP in IB - Gen
Sep 9, 2021 - 11:52pm

I was just giving my two cents and what I would do in that situation... hence the caveats around not being able to fully grasp their situation. Don't think I understand all of the anger in your tone, but that's whatever. We are all people here... that come to try and both receive and provide advice. All advice will be different based on perspectives, experience and personal viewpoints. What I typed was basically saying to hang in but make the decision to be done with banking now but to finish strong. Often times, reframing perspective can help alleviate quite a bit of stress and negative thoughts. 

For what it's worth, I'm not a senior banker (VPs are not senior bankers)... I've been grinding in this world for a decade and am also tired of this horrible lifestyle. Also, you may not totally grasp how to utilize "no offense" but that's ok. We are all stressed in this industry, but unsolicited name calling to someone is pretty toxic, when they are just trying to provide an honest, constructive perspective for reframing mindset to help someone through something challenging.

Controversial
  • Analyst 1 in IB - Cov
Sep 10, 2021 - 9:53am

you don't understand the anger in my tone because you don't realize that you're the enemy and your """advice""" is dogshit

you can't even make a post without sounding like you're constructing a snarky email that'll go out to an associate who left a comma on the footnote of page 72, you blinded fuck

also, the reason your advice is dogshit is because "it is what you would do in that situation" which is what led you to being a VP who speaks like a corporate drone on an internet forum

  • Prospect in IB - Gen
Sep 10, 2021 - 12:00am

You'd be surprised what an MD would do not to have a deal fall through or lose a good associate.

Grow some fucking balls. Let them know.

They might give you this Saturday off.

  • Consultant in Consulting
Sep 10, 2021 - 1:09am

mate, plz take care of your health it's your life. If you can make it to bonus szn that's your choice. But your body and mind are #1 priority. #1.

Sep 10, 2021 - 8:10am

This is sad. Sorry your going through this.

You've done investment banking for 5 years now and should have great exit ops, but it doesn't even sound like your there yet in terms of thinking.

It sounds like your priority be in the interim is to see a mental health therapist. Stay safe.   

Sep 10, 2021 - 10:20am

Health comes first. At the very least you should let your firm know you're at the edge and need a break. Most banks are desperate for talent and will go out of their way so that top performers stay on. 

Second thing I will say is the deal will not derail if you quit (and even if it does, who cares?). Reminds me of a quote attributed to Charles de Gaulle: "The graveyards are full of indispensable men"

The bank will move on with or without you.

Sep 10, 2021 - 12:43pm

Don't quit until you ask for help and your request is denied by multiple people. Ask for help. Even tell HR your predicament before resigning. They don't want to get sued. Figure out a way to get some good sleep in (after a very light workout or yoga). Hydrate and take vitamins and eat healthy proteins and fats (eggs/olive oils). A single day off won't hurt. Go nap anytime you know nobody is looking for you. Don't die.

Sep 10, 2021 - 1:02pm

Thanks for posting and for the honesty. I think a lot of people on this forum have felt immense pressure at their jobs and can relate to your level of stress. I can provide a couple of anecdotes:

  • had a friend in a similar situation a couple of years ago. he was an incredible analyst (3rd year) and would have easily been kept on as Associate. Consistently staffed on the most deals and the most complex projects. Finally had it one day and quit. He was 6 month away from bonus (same as you). They did not offer to pay it to him early. They just told him he'd be looking at an XYZ bonus in 6 months. It was a lot of $$$, but he quit. The lesson? He basically admitted he couldn't do it anymore and was burned out. The bank's reaction was to try and lure him with his potential bonus. Leads me to my next point...
  • ...yes, I understand that you're probably leading this project. But guess what? It could get derailed at any moment for any reason. If it's a sell-side, perhaps the owner decides they don't want to sell at the 11th hour. If it's a buy-side, perhaps negotiations fall apart as the seller is asking too much? There is so much out of your control here. You shouldn't feel one ounce of guilt. 

You need to put yourself first. You (and your family) are the most important things in your life. Jobs and money come and go. Don't think twice, it's all right. 

Sep 10, 2021 - 1:13pm

If you seriously needed to ask yourself in regards to your mental health and contemplating suicide while sitting down with family and close friends, it's time to go my friend. At the end of the day, it's just a job that they can easily fire you for with no reason they have to disclose. Take care of yourself and I hope you can get back on track. 

Contra omnes dissident
  • 1
Sep 10, 2021 - 3:27pm

I was feeling pretty burned out a few months ago and unhappy with my BB's comp discount just to have their brand on my resume, so decided to move laterally to an EB, negotiated a one year bump, and figured the two months of gardening leave would provide for a great mental and physical reset. If you did something like this, you could maybe walk away with more money if you negotiated a one year bump, a faster path to VP (which is big for mental health) and also have the benefit of two months off to travel the world or do whatever you're passionate about outside of work.

Sep 10, 2021 - 3:28pm

I don't normally post on here, but I started as an analyst and have been a banker for 10+ years, currently a Director. I've gone through a lot of ups and downs, though never quite as bad as what you described. Here is my advice:

1) Speak to your group head. Tell him or her that you are struggling with your health and need to take a week off starting next week. Don't ask, just tell. Regardless of what he says, do not show up for work or log in next week. During your week off don't check work emails.

2) When you return, set yourself specific work hours (eg. 9am - 11pm) and do not do any work or check email outside those hours. Do your best to get what you can done in that time and be as efficient as possible. If anything slips it is not your problem, it is the fault of your team who inadequately staffed the project.

3) I have seen some people who cannot do #2, usually because they are perfectionists and cannot handle doing anything at below 100% accuracy / not being the #1 performer in the group. If you fall into that bucket you do need to leave. No-one is ever going to tell you to do less work in your banking career and you will always feel like it isn't as good as it could be. You are responsible for setting your own limits.

I think you owe it to yourself to see if you can find a way to work sustainably in the group long term, but if you can't it is definitely not worth being as unhappy as it sounds like you are.

Sep 10, 2021 - 5:28pm

Thanks all for the support and advice (even the tough love advice). Much appreciated all around. 

I spoke to my staffer, MD and VP. All were supportive and offered a bit of time off (week, etc). However I think I'll need a month at least to recharge which is harder to swing. 

I've decided to try and stick it out a few more weeks to try and get a new position lined up before quitting. Will update this post with however it shakes out. 

  • Analyst 1 in IB - Gen
Sep 11, 2021 - 2:00am

Please take a week off! I know you need more time but I hope you're taking a week off sometime this month. Don't push it off.

Sep 11, 2021 - 8:49am

Be a bit practical here. How do you intend to find a new job when you're already working 100 hours a week? Just quit the entire thing and move on.

Array

  • Associate 2 in IB - Cov
Sep 11, 2021 - 9:11am

Glad to hear. Take it one step at a time. Start with 2 weeks off / unplugged and see how you feel. As others have mentioned, when you return set clear expectations on working hours (nothing past 10pm). If things don't improve - quit.
 

It's okay to not have something lined up. you may need a month to ground yourself before setting up interviews and that's OK. 

  • Analyst 2 in IB - Cov
Sep 10, 2021 - 7:55pm

Hope it works out. I was in a similar situation and quit with a pretty significant accrued bonus. Best decision I have ever made. I can't even begin to explain how much happier I am. Basically a different person. I had absolutely no issue finding a job and landed my dream gig. You couldn't pay me any amount of money to go back to IBD. It really takes a few months to decompress and get your life back in check. Then you'll be able to go into your interviews in the right state of mind and knowing what you want to do. 

Sep 10, 2021 - 8:44pm

Some of the biggest lies put out by corporations is that you're important at a company and that you should be loyal to a company. 

Here's some news that is probably striking to you. You're nothing but a COG in the machine and are easily replaceable. I have interacted with several upper-level employees (VP+) who were at a firm for 5+ years (some even 15+ years) walked off and moved on to another opportunity. Those guys were replaced within a few weeks at those big corporations. Yes, a few WEEKS. Their legacy was gone in a few WEEKS. You will be replaced very easily. And to that extent, if you're not who cares? I remember one user on here mentioning how his friends were laid off during the GFC by their keycards being inactivated. No personal message, nothing. All that hard work, gone in an instant. Your corporation if they have to will do this to YOU. You'll be laid off in a few seconds without hesitation while here you are undergoing mental turmoil to be loyal to a business. Cut the mentality out now. The firm does not care and will not care about you. This is a corporation. Your family cares for you, not the corporation

Additionally, the idea of "if I can only hold on to the bonus" is a DANGEROUS slippery slope. You'll start shifting the goal posts to "if only I can get the VP promotion." "If only I hit a net worth of $2M". "If only..." and you'll be stuck in this until you under go a mental breakdown and end up in the hospital or kill yourself and be DEAD.

As for jobs? There are plenty of openings for someone with 5 years experience in IBD. Even if there were only few, you're very close to the top of any applicant pool at this point.

Don't be like the weak man who gets seduced by an attractive girl he knows is cheating on him and struggles to end the relationship. With any wound or difficulty the best thing to do is rip the band-aid off IMMEDIATELY.

Walk away from the job immediately and don't look back. Take a week off and then start applying for new jobs. 

Array

  • 5
Sep 11, 2021 - 3:53am

Nothing is more important than your life. Your family will be devastated if something happens to you. This decision to quit is not only about you, it's about all the people who loves and supports you as well. They can give zero shit about that bonus or any potential risk to your career in this case. Any worthwhile future employers will also give zero shit about you quitting in this case.

What you need is a clean breakup. I understand it's not easy to quit. But just like if you were trying to get out of a toxic relationship, what you'd need to do is inform the person you're breaking up with them and completely block their number and any means of communication to prevent them from getting a hold of you. 

Send in that resignation letter immediately. Block all contacts (email and phone) you need and pack your bags to stay at someone's place (ideally out of town). When you're at the breaking point, you need to take drastic measures to make sure you save yourself. Remember you don't owe anyone anything, certainly not a fucking deal! Good luck!     

Sep 11, 2021 - 1:42pm

Man Drumpfy had a 9/11 post about the man in the red bandana and how he wanted to quit too. Sometimes it is alright to found out you don't like finance. It is not shameful to do so. Take some time off and travel and take care of yourself. I send my regards to you! :) Feel free to pm if you want to talk or catch up after your vacay.

Sep 12, 2021 - 7:54am

What does A2A stand for?

Employment is a two-way street, especially these days. You need to be upfront and transparent with them that your current hours are not sustainable, and you're due for a promotion and/or pay raise, which would come with reduced hours. Either that or try and cut the hours yourself. Start saying no, I can't. Then use those hours to find a new job in PE and get the hell out of there. 

  • VP in IB - Gen
Sep 12, 2021 - 8:24pm

Aut sunt ipsum et rerum non quia ipsam nihil. Magnam aut et qui inventore nihil a pariatur. Sit dolores laborum error sed.

Accusamus repudiandae consequatur libero sapiente. Enim ut voluptas dolorem qui. Ea veritatis ut neque iure omnis.

Ut soluta ut quis tenetur. A voluptas accusamus ut eaque illo repellendus.

Expedita voluptatem quos veniam similique enim sint aut consequatur. A autem eaque aut ipsum quo. Voluptas odio aut molestiae eaque nisi qui. Voluptatibus ea aliquid non ratione. Minus quos illum sit et deserunt.

Sep 12, 2021 - 11:57am

Aliquid corrupti reprehenderit est autem doloremque id. Sapiente eos distinctio voluptas sunt labore nesciunt consequuntur. Quia eveniet explicabo voluptatem omnis voluptatem. Alias doloremque omnis iste voluptas molestiae. Dolore illo accusantium ex.

Dolores perferendis harum facere illo non laborum culpa doloremque. Libero placeat necessitatibus et odit beatae quos. Rerum tempore impedit quam quis officia molestiae. Est delectus ad inventore sint autem enim animi. Culpa ullam ipsa beatae rerum sit.

Quo rem voluptatem fugiat possimus quis consequatur. Fuga est omnis voluptate. Quia perspiciatis consequatur qui. Odio iste voluptatem eum odio delectus animi magnam. Repellat harum labore accusamus soluta quod deleniti est adipisci. Odit et soluta fugiat nostrum. Totam sed eum ea nihil.

Maiores maxime et non sed. Maiores unde neque qui omnis sint sed. Id laboriosam rem libero a. Corporis dolor necessitatibus eius.

Sep 14, 2021 - 6:17pm

Cupiditate tenetur vel magni laudantium atque. Voluptatibus perspiciatis veritatis autem et quasi distinctio. Asperiores ratione eum et expedita.

Non ex non in tempore at. Atque maxime enim impedit recusandae est repellendus. Aut aut quia repellat facere autem. Beatae aut non iusto veritatis mollitia culpa nulla. Sint consectetur dolores aut consectetur necessitatibus aliquid sed. Laboriosam et consectetur aut voluptate illum dolorum qui.

Eaque ipsum laborum et aut mollitia. Porro consectetur aut quam qui deserunt. Perspiciatis sit enim adipisci est quis natus. Qui commodi ratione consectetur tempora ut ut omnis. Cum eligendi est qui quis aut non.

Start Discussion

Total Avg Compensation

September 2021 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (10) $853
  • Vice President (39) $363
  • Associates (220) $232
  • 2nd Year Analyst (135) $154
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (30) $147
  • Intern/Summer Associate (103) $143
  • 1st Year Analyst (489) $135
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (378) $82