Career advice breaking into ER post grad
I am currently an incoming senior at a target school majoring in economics doing an internship at a bulge bracket in their wealth management division. During this internship I’ve come to the realization that wealth management isn’t what I thought it would be and it isn’t exactly for me as I’m more into the analytical aspect of finance with direct exposure to financial markets. I do have previous experience in investment banking at a small unknown boutique S&T (my two main interests) post graduation?
Hey PWMtoER, the following topics might be helpful:
I hope those threads give you a bit more insight.
Try to meet as many people in ER and on the desk as you can. If you say you are an intern wanting to learn more you should have a great hit rate.
ER and S&T are related, but still different enough that they probably draw on different types of people (especially the T in S&T). So just be sure to figure out which of the bunch you actually want.
If you're at a target school, then just go on linkedin and find the names of people in ER or S&T who went to your school and reach out to them. Cold calling is a bitch, but it works if you put in enough effort as it's just a numbers game.
Alternatively, ask any professors that you're comfortable with on whether they know any alumni who went to finance that they could put you in touch with.
Lastly, I'm sure any target school has some kind of finance club. Go to their events, talk to the speakers, etc etc.
Note that these are all things for getting an interview, how you prep for the interview is a different story where you need to prep pitches and stuff.
What are the differences the people in the T in S&T and ER exactly?
If anyone else could answer this that would great as well
Sales =/= Trading =/= Equity Research
I've seen people from all three go to all the other three before, but Trading is probably the least similar of the bunch as it involves an entirely different skillset for the most part. ER -> Sales is the most common though.
People who go into sales tend to have a salesperson personality i guess? Research tends to be a bit more analytical, but you're still a salesguy at the end of the day (hence, sell-side), and trading it really comes down to what you're trading exactly.
Thanks for the reply, so far I have been reaching out to individuals on the equity research side through my firms employee network contact list but I haven't really gotten replies. What do you think would be a solid way to start improving my hit rates in terms of individuals wanting to set up calls with me. Would mentioning my value investing experience come off as pretentious in introductory emails? Messaging individuals who have went to my school and are in positions I'm interested in hasn't necessarily worked either for me thus far although I definitely need to increase the volume I'm sending these emails/messages out.
Also in terms of what I could do to prepare myself for an equity research position, what do you think my best resources would be? I also understand you're currently in the ER space, of the individuals on your team how many were able to break in without direct experience (summer analyst roles in ER or past analyst experience in ER)?
It's a bit surprising to me that your alumni aren't responding to your messages - usually good schools are good schools because they build some sense of camaraderie amongst the student population.
In any event, to improve your hit rate, don't go with stock language, try to tailor the messages and get referrals from within your existing network. For example, if you're in some club and a guy in the club knows somebody in finance, ask them to put you in touch. If you see that a potential target played the same sport as you, make reference to that in your initial message.
Also, be sure to keep your messages short and to the point. Something like " Hi so-and-so, By way of introduction, I'm John Doe from prestigious uni and I came across your profile /contact/whatever (or Jane Doe referred me) as I'm trying to learn more about ER. I have some personal experience in following the markets, but would like to learn more about the industry / career path / etc itself. To this end, I wanted to ask if you might have time for a coffee meetup or quick phone chat. Thank you very much for your time and consideration in advance".
Something like that.
I'd avoid being so specific on the value investing bit just because you might meet a hardass who really grills you on that (unless you're feeling really confident).
To prep for a coffee meeting, phone call, or interview, be sure to have your story straight (Why ER, Why Now, Why didn't you do it before) and for the interviews, at least 2 pitches, preferably 3 (2 long, 1 short). Be able to make your pitch in under 120 seconds and be ready for a hardass to try to grill you (i'd say 70% of the interviews will involve somebody being a hardass). Also you need to be able to write an earnings report within 60 minutes (you should be able to do it within 30 minutes just to leave yourself a huge buffer).
I'm no longer in research. Left the industry 2-3 years ago. I broke in without direct experience as did most of my team. Experience is most helpful in getting the interview, but once you're in that room, I'd say it's a surprisingly level playing field in impressing the analyst. If you come across as sharp, professional, etc. you might be at a smaller disadvantage than you'd think vs a kid with 1 year of experience under their belt. For sure if the analyst needs a plug-and-play, you're probably SOL, but in that case, you wouldn't even get the interview then.
Rabmled a bit, but lemme know if you have other questions.
How much lower are my chances if I try to breaking in by applying directly on company websites or emailing people directly with some ER reports and models? I know that networking is key, but after trying it for some time I realized that I have too much ego to ask for help, and I'm not that good at it either.
I'm not gonna say you don't have a chance with that approach, but it depends very heavily on your qualifications at that point since they can only judge you by your submitted materials. This is an extremely tough game given you're going to go head to head with licensed, proven individuals who are already in the industry.
In any event, if you're bad at the networking game you should seriously reconsider entering the field. The simple truth is your stock picks will be lousy (as is everybody else's) and your ultimate success will be predicated on convincing people to pay you despite the commoditized nature of your product. This is generally done through networking with your clients (buy side - all of whom don't care for you since they have 15 other senior analysts trying to do the same thing), company management (all of whom don't care for you since they have 30 senior analysts inviting them to NDRs), and other sell side folks (if you have a lousy reputation on the street, good luck when you inevitably get fired during a recession).
Lastly, while a big ego isn't a dealbreaker in this industry (~80% of the people I've worked with / met are egotistical assholes), if it prevents you from making awkward asks such as cold calling (successfully) or trying to get that NDR despite your sell rating, you're going to have a bad time.
Happy to answer any other questions you have.
Thanks man, good comments. To make it clear, I don't want to stay in ER in the long run - more of a stepping stone to get into AM/HF. As far as networking, I think I will be better at it when I have something to offer. At an entry level I just don't like the whole phone call->coffee chat -> Ask for interview trendline that everyone follows. I know that is how people break in and you gotta do what works, but at least with ER I thought I can stand out with a thought-provoking analysis of companies/industries and trying to stand out some other way, rather than following the crowd.
Is this something that could work? As far as qualifications, I am a graduating MSF student, waiting for CFA lvl 2, with a few non-IB finance internships.
I completely understand the feeling of "I'll totally have something to offer if only I break in". I won't say you're wrong, but in my experience, getting into the industry is the bare minimum to be considered and few people will give you the time of day even after you have that to offer. It's not a knock on any specific individual, more just that the competition for buyside is retardedly intense.
While the thought-provoking analysis bit is what we always told associates we want, the simple fact is that 90% of what you do is not thought provoking (i.e. earnings notes, maintenance, etc) and 50% of the thought provoking work you do will probably have to get toned down because it'll piss off some key client (the street is biased towards buy ratings so most of your thought provoking opportunities will be on the short side - which always pisses people off).
Secondly, no offense to you, but you do not have the background of somebody likely to produce thought provoking research. You seem like a kid who probably could do the job (it's not exactly hard), but you don't have anything in your background that suggests you have deep industry experience or sector expertise (in a specific vertical, not ER). The thing that'll typically let you publish thought provoking research is some type of differentiated knowledge that your competition (sell-side) and clients (buy-side) do not have easy access to. If it's just stuff in the 10-Ks, standard industry databases (anything from S&P or MSCI), or trade events, you are highly unlikely to be able to tell them something they don't know. Keep in mind, a fair share of people on the sell side and buy side have experience in the sector they cover (e.g. PhDs for biotech, former regulators for Financials, FP&A specialists in consumer, etc).
It's easy to say that you won't follow the crowd, but doing it is much harder. After all, if it was so easy to see where the crowd is 'obviously' wrong, then we wouldn't have so many underperforming asset managers.
Note: This isn't me saying that markets are efficient (they're clearly not) but beating it is also not as easy as buyside / sellside claims.
Of course I don't actually know anything about you and maybe you do have a differentiated view. If that is indeed the case, then yes, developing thought provoking analysis that you can package into 1-2 pages can indeed help you get a job in ER if you are able to get it in front of the right people (i.e. a senior analyst looking to hire or a DOR ).
Parting thoughts on this matter are that you seem to have a somewhat rosy view of the industry based on the things you've said. You should try to talk with more people who are in the industry to actually improve your understanding of the day-to-day aspects of the job. As you are now, you would likely come across as naive in an interview which is a huge red flag since ER puts you in front of real clients way faster than most other parts of finance (you might literally be talking to a PM within a month of getting licensed). Happy to answer other questions you might have.
Facilis similique maxime tenetur iure impedit. Odit nam vel eveniet ad neque quod velit ratione. Ut assumenda et vero adipisci totam ut eum. Modi fugit quo iure.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...