Hi,
I will be commencing a Full Time MBA this fall and am considering my options: Booth, Kellogg, Columbia, London Business School, and a couple of other slightly lower ranked schools. I am a finance candidate, but not from a traditional banking/PE/HF background. I will be returning to finance afterwards, although I am not sure exactly in what capacity, and I am open to the off chance that something else (outside finance) appeals to me as I go through B School. I will be an international candidate at any of these schools (I'm keeping this whole thing vague for the sake of anonymity).
I am basically choosing between Booth and London Business School. Which would you pick? I know the usual response to such questions is: "well, where do you want to work?". But let's contemplate a scenario wherein I have to work in, say, Asia for the first few years out of B School; this obviates the usual "top US School for US jobs and LBS/INSEAD for European jobs" answer. This hypothetical also fairly accurately captures my dilemma - I truly don't give a shit about where I work. I want the better of the two schools, period - the one more respected globally, the one where I learn and add to my resume/skillset more, and the one that best sets me up for the long-run. And I want to study amidst the smarter, more accomplished student body of the two.
I would appreciate your thoughts. I am particularly interested in hearing from people who have gone through an MBA, are currently in a program, or are deep in the application process. General thoughts about the two schools' relative reputations from people in finance would also be most welcome.
Thanks a lot,
MBA2017
This is called a first world problem.
I've worked alongside people from both schools, and saw no major differences in terms of performance, though Boothies overall have a bit more polish to them-but that's my subjective interpretation. I'd personally go Booth only because I find Chicago easier on the budget than London and because I think it has a stronger reputation in finance circles, but YOU will be the cause of any opportunities you get (or don't) coming from either school.
But since you only care about the "better" or the two, then go Booth. Rankings support it having a stronger reputation. And IMHO, the caliber of student body is probably superior at Booth. The MBA isn't a big deal in Europe so lots of students may not have the sterling work experience or credentials that are almost a fait accompli at any M7 program. I'd realistically only go LBS if working in London was a priority.
But I don't want to appear as if I'm in any way disparaging LBS. I spent some time there last fall and it's truly an amazing school with the most international student body I've ever seen.
Any reason you're discounting Kellogg? 88% of people who recruited for IB last year got an offer. It's a very fun school too.
Opsdude: Thanks for your reply. I don't know why you have "2" next to that pile of shit icon. I actually am quite tempted by Kellogg. Not for the reason/statistic that you mentioned, but because I enjoyed my visit to Kellogg, I like the school (way more than Columbia, for instance), it is not in South Side Chicago like Booth, and probably over a long enough horizon it is actually just ahead of Booth in rankings (Booth has ranked higher in recent years). The reason I am "discounting" Kellogg is that, as a finance candidate with the option to go to Booth or Kellogg. for me to take Kellogg would be, well, unique...
On your Booth vs. Kellogg decision (I'll ignore LBS) they really will both fill your goals. I'm headed to Booth and found it a better fit (I ended up completing and then dropping my Kellogg app). I come from an industry of relationship management and wanted to obtain an MBA that would help me take a more analytical approach to problem solving; Booth better fit that bill. Plus I enjoyed Booth's events more than any other school, the people were just really down to earth and fun to be around. If you heart lies in the other direction I'd give it some serious thought. Are you going to admit weekend? That really sealed the deal at Booth for me.
If you have a specific shop in mind at graduation maybe peek ahead and see if Kellogg is represented there on LinkedIn. Otherwise I wouldn't worry too much about the difference. At 2 years and $150k price tag fit is more important than second guessing negligible differences in graduation opportunities.
Booth
Booth is known for its finance departments In finance, It is very easily to say that Booth, Wharton, MIT Sloan & CBS are on the same level LBS is in London, which is its key advantage. however, Chicago isnt small either.
I'm a Booth student, so I am biased. The best I can offer you is the following:
Many Booth students just returned from their study abroad at LBS two weeks ago. When they compare LBS classes to their classes at Booth, the differences are extreme. Booth classes are more quantitative, cover more material, and are generally more intense. Similarly, the caliber of student at Booth is noticeably stronger than at LBS (anecdotal). One student jammed all his LBS coursework into the first six weeks and then took the remaining six weeks off to travel before returning to Chicago.
On the flip side, and this is VERY anecdotal so take it for what it is, I've spoken a lot with LBS students studying abroad at Booth. When one of the LBS guys arrived at Booth, he signed up to take five classes (standard is 3-4) and join a bunch of clubs. A normal quarter for us is 3-4 classes. Needless to say, by the end of the quarter he had dropped the 5th class (4 was the minimum for LBS students abroad at Booth) and didn't participate in any club activities. He was a bit overwhelmed by the academics.
I don't think this is an LBS thing. My friends who studied in Spain and Hong Kong all reported the same exact thing.
Great response, I found it helpful as I am entering Booth and considering a semester at LBS. Thanks!
CompBanker: Thanks for your reply. I've lurked here for many years, albeit very intermittently, and have appreciated your posts whenever I have come across them. I already have no doubt that the rigor of instruction at Booth is essentially unmatched - even among top US schools - and that the general hustle involved in a top US MBA vastly exceeds that required by its European counterparts. Still, among things that form brand perception and imprint in places like Asia, "rigor of the curriculum" and "challenge of the experience" are not really top among the list. That said, yes, for me, what I get to learn and how I get to add to my skillset is absolutely vital.
Thanks again for your reply. Are you a second year? May I PM you at some point?
Also, as BreakingOutofPWM mentioned, Admit Weekend (aka First Day) is an incredibly valuable means of assessing schools. For example: I go to the South Side of Chicago twice a week for class, but 90% of my experiences are in the city because that's where we all live. You can't really appreciate this dynamic unless you visit.
1) It's not possible to leave LBS while enrolled in an MBA course, unless there are extenuating circumstances such as a funeral. I can't remember the exact wording in the regulations but it was along the lines of if you aren't physically present and adding value in class you'll be given a few chances and eventually expelled if there's no improvement.
2) Caliber of students is likely stronger at LBS. LBS publishes the profiles of all its students publicly, while Booth does not.
To answer your questions:
First Day will give you a much better picture of the students. Getting a formal campus tour and sitting in on a class is great, but it surely isn't the same as meeting the other admits who will be your classmates. Some very high percentage of First Day attendees end up matriculating, so you can safely assume that this will be an accurate representation. Much of your experience at Booth will be driven by your classmates, so this is very important.
If you're recruiting for traditional jobs, such as IB / Consulting / Corporates, you will undoubtedly need to go to the Harper Center more than twice a week during your Fall quarter. Most recruiting events take place there. Outside recruiting season you only really need to go there for class. Many Booth (business school) speaker events take place at Gleacher downtown and broader University of Chicago speakers take place in Hyde Park.
Something like 10% of the students live in Hyde Park. The remaining 90% live downtown or in the suburbs, although usually people from Chicago are the ones who live out in the burbs. Some 70% or so live in the Loop. This means that all your group meetings and social activities will take place in the cities, either at people's apartments or at restaurants/bars in the area.
You can take classes at Gleacher or NBC Towers from the first quarter. I've had at least one class at Gleacher/NBC every quarter. The course selection isn't as broad as it is at Harper though. Really depends on how you want to build your schedule.
I've discussed getting to the South Side in other posts, but the summary version is: You need to take the train. It will take you maybe 30-40 minutes door to door. Commuting is not fun, particularly in the winter. The annoyance is offset by the fact that you don't need to do it that often and pretty much everyone is on the train with you so safety isn't an issue and you can be productive during the commute (reading or socializing).
CompBanker: Thanks for your reply. So speaking of my classmates, how do you find the Booth student body? To put it bluntly, are there enough smart people to challenge you?
I'd say that in the PRC and HK, LBS is more well known than Booth IME
I am LBS student and this is a toss-up decision, IMHO. I secured offer in HK IB, beating several candidates from Booth, Wharton and columbia. I think LBS has slight edge over Booth/columbia in Asia. (Kellogg is a way below name in the region) Your decision between two schools does not affect your chance in Asia job market as much as you think - both schools are highly regarded. This is simple decision - do you want to spend your two years in London or Chicago? My answer was London. (In LBS, most of students are now enjoying paris, prague, rome, and barcelona)
Sorry to capture this topic - is speaking Mandarin a requirement for HK IBD?
Almost. Mandarin is getting more important nowadays. (BTW, I am NOT mandarin speaker) You should be MUCH better than Chinese students to receive the offer.
I'm sorry, but Booth and Columbia trump LBS in Asia finance. Just because you beat out people from those schools does not indicate otherwise.
Don't want to raise another CBS vs xyz debate but I do think CBS's presence in Asia is stronger than any other US bschool except H/W. Check last year's HK IBD placements and you will see more CBS students than other schools.
If you really hate CBS, I'd say LBS has more prestige factor than Booth. In Asia, school brand is everything and Booth is really not very well-known outside a small MBA circles.
Booth recently moved its Asian executive MBA campus to Hong Kong. I get the impression that it intends to focus pretty heavily on the region. If the comment regarding CBS is correct based off of that one data point, I wouldn't discount the effect of a strong physical presence (as a CBS student I'm sure you see the same through being in NYC - I'm sure you see a lot more CBS recognition locally than Booth). I've linked the facilities page with photos, looks like a pretty cool campus.
http://facilities.uchicago.edu/construction/international_projects/univ…
Regardless, the comment is fairly out of context - unless I missed something the OP threw out a hypothetical about working in Asia but doesn't care where they end up.
Yes, I agree Booth is trying to increase presence in Asia. Let's see how it goes. Btw, something may seems ridiculous to most Americans: Asian do care about ivy league, especially those who never studied in US. And people's perception about your school matters a lot there.
I think I missed the "hypothetical" part. Seems like my comment adds no value. I thought OP wants to work in Asia for a couple of years but don't care where to work after that.
This is a no-brainer. Booth all the way. Better finance placements, more prestigious, stronger caliber of students, and Chicago is an awesome city on a student budget. To get more specific, take a look at all the long-only mutual funds, hedge funds, and banks that recruit aggressively at Booth. If I'm not mistaken, PIMCO hires more from Booth than any other b-school. AQR and Dimensional Fund hire at Booth but almost nowhere else. I think Booth is even sending someone to Bridgewater as an investment associate. Then of course you have Citadel in Booth's backyard.
Booth's faculty is second to none. They are on the cutting edge of research, and the breadth and depth of Booth's finance courses is unparalleled. Booth is probably the only MBA program where the finance electives are as rigorous as Phd classes. This is why Booth is second to none when it comes to getting you ready for a rigorous job in finance.
Dude, do you jerk off on these names?
Wharton>>>Columbia>>Booth. Prestige baby. All the way.
I worked in Asia for 10 years (in finance) and both Chicago and LBS have similarly strong reputations. Either will probably get you where you want to go in the long run.
I think you will find that LBS has a more globally minded student body. I love reading CompBanker 's posts and his thread here: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/reflections-on-year-1-at-booth and his thoughtful replies here. But Chicago is a US-school with a minority of international students (even if it is a significant minority) and a majority of US recruiters. LBS is going to be more global.
Weather is pretty terrible in both places.
Betsy we don't all have the same weather preferences. Some of us thrive on 0 degree winters with wind chill. Keeps us in the library and give us an excuse to work up that beer gut.
LOL +1
You mentioned "I want the better of the two schools, period - the one more respected globally, the one where I learn and add to my resume/skillset more, and the one that best sets me up for the long-run."
As other people have pointed out - you are really the biggest variable in the long run. Now the short-term is going to be the factor that saturates most highly into the long-term outcome....and what determines the short-term is the recruiting opportunities you have on campus. Your first job post-MBA is going to propel your career.
Booth, Kellogg, Columbia, London Business School - Booth has a strong finance program and Columbia does as well. LBS will put you in a position to recruit for the European equivalent of the roles you would recruit for at Booth/Columbia. That said, you mentioned that you were open to some alternative, non finance roles as well. One thing about the Americans is they aren't as uptight as the Europeans about people crossing over from one industry to another. That's my opinion anyway after having done my undergrad in Europe and having worked there pre-MBA. So taking everything into account you might be best served attending a US business school and working in the states for your first two years post-MBA. After that you'll have the MBA + experience behind you to make your next career/geographic move.
Voluptatem et exercitationem est sapiente quia. Debitis perspiciatis ipsam natus accusantium quis tenetur. Soluta enim deserunt accusamus unde enim voluptatem at. Est quasi enim mollitia.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Cumque consequuntur aut at eligendi iste. Nostrum libero vel molestiae voluptate.