Friends after College?
After college, the hours analysts work sucks and most college friends just go in their different paths. So how do you manage to make friends? Are your friends basically the other I bankers ?
After college, the hours analysts work sucks and most college friends just go in their different paths. So how do you manage to make friends? Are your friends basically the other I bankers ?
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Career Resources
friends from college that move to the same city as you, co-workers, industry friends you meet working on deals or at events (this is pretty cool because you can expense some shit haha), random girls at bars, neighbors, people that work at the shops in your neighborhood, locals at the neighborhood watering hole. There are a ton of ways. it's like that Kay jewelers commercial, you have to keep an open heart.
This may seem stupid but can I still go to a bar without drinking
This may seem stupid but can I still go to a bar without drinking. I don't drink.
Ya, get a glass of water/tonic/cranberry/whatever else. No one is forcing the liquor down your throat. It's only a big deal if you make it a big deal.
You can - but you likely won't make many friends doing that. I'm all for staying healthy and not drinking if that's your thing, but those "just tonic" guys tend to dampen the mood at the bar.
You're right. It's not the drinking that makes you friends. It is the vulnerablility that you allow these people to see as a byproduct of alcohol which will make you closer friends.
This is a genuinely difficult concept to master. In your first year you have 0 time on the weekdays, other than early mornings, and limited time on the weekends whereas friends in less demanding careers will be drinking 3 to 4 nights a week, getting brunches and lunches, day drinking in Central Park and doing other things 20+ year olds do who work 9-7 or better.
It is difficult to keep in touch with friends and takes an active effort
SB for interesting topic
Drinking topic aside you are going to go through many changes in life post undergrad and friends are just one of those. Unless you were a frat guy you will have a circle of friends that everyone will stay in touch best they can and thanks to social media that is easy.
Eventually moves will impact this. This could be you moving or one of your best friends moves considerable distance away. Then later down the line you get married. Life changes again. As you go through life you will obviously continue to develop new friendships, some will take more life than others but its a product of cycling through stages of life.
You and your wife buy a house in the burbs and next thing you know you are on the board of your HOA and the routine BBQ host for the neighborhood. Then you start spending time with your neighbors instead of heading to the city and then you will find those relationships start to become tighter than what you once had with your college friends, except you are now 15+ years down the road at this stage.
If you're lucky you have some co-analysts you get along with, treat them like family and you'll end up having life long friendships. Talked to several MDs in my group, and besides their college friends, most of their long term friendships were made during their analyst days. After all, there's few people outside of IB who'll be fully aware of what you're going through, so I guess hanging out with IB guys additionally reduces the effort you have to bring in to maintain friendships; not saying to dump old friends, but just saying that embracing the fact that you're surrounded by several cool people isn't the worst way yo how long term
Its Totally up to you.... You wanna drink or not?
Nobody can forcing to you to get drink some liquor and yes you can go bar and make friends and chilled out with them......and have some soft drinks.
Friends from college - try to meet some of their friends and expand your group Friends from work - works great if you're an analyst at most places Join an IM sports team or some sort of hobby group I've also made friends with a lot of my GF's friends/their BF's, as we went to different schools
It's not easy, and one of my biggest regrets from college is getting comfortable with my college friend group (not realizing that everyone moves to different places afterward) and not making a real effort to meet more people when it was super easy to do so.
One other thing - this isn't really possible when you're in IB but I took care of my family's dog for a few days, and it was super easy to make friends with other dog owners in my neighborhood/building.
Meeting people post-college in a new town (Originally Posted: 08/29/2016)
As the title says, moved to a new town, starting FT soon. Obviously not in college anymore so trying to figure out generally what's the best way to meet new people.
Is MeetUp popular/good? Meeting people through shared activities? Coworkers? Let's hear your thoughts WSO.
I've found that joining a sports league is a pretty good way to branch out.
For me, social life actually got a lot better after college and here is how I did it.
1 - If possible, get a social second job.
I started out working as a waiter at a restaurant and that was a great way to make some friends at times. Eventually I moved on to being a bartender on the weekends, started out getting day shifts (night shifts are very competitive) and it was a great way for me to meet a lot of people. Now if you're working the typical IB lifestyle of 80+ hrs a week, this not possible at all.
2- Join groups relevant to what you like.
Republican? Join a group for that. Democrat? Join a group for that. Whatever interests you, whether it be puppies at that, join a group for it.
3 - As another guy said, club sports.
It works and it brings out the competitiveness in you. I've made good friends with the same guys I played intramural soccer with, after a year we were almost like brothers.
4 - Become a regular at certain spots.
Whether it is the most packed bar in town or whatever place it may be, become a regular and be that guy who tips the bartenders well too. You can eventually make friends with other regulars who will call you out to parties and events that may be going on.
5 - Apartments with pools and a younger demographic.
I found this works well in big cities for some of my friends. Many of them moved into social apartments full of 20 somethings that had a swimming pool in them, it made it possible to make new friends and be social with people as opposed to living out in the suburbs.
In college, social life is somewhat handed to you but I found that I had other problems in college. After a couple of months, people became very cliquish and broke off into their own tight knit cliques. Some guys on here had the college experience and enjoyed the social life in college but I found myself being very lonely in college. A mixture of a tough major I hated (Biology), family issues, and the fact that my college attracted large amounts of upper middle class suburban kids that were generally snotty, pretentious, and judgmental made it difficult for me to have a good social life going.
Now I have different friends I can always go out with, dating life has gotten dramatically better (I get with hotter girls now), I can get into better parties without having to be in a given fraternity to do so, and I find that the people I run into are a lot more accepting.
To all of you college guys out there who feel lonely, believe me, with some work it can definitely get better after college.
The first step seems a little extreme. Become a waiter just to possibly make a new friend? I'd rather develop a drug problem and start talking to imaginary friends.
Pffft, fucking GD nerd...
Totally joking, good on you. +1 banana point.
Try networking events. Usually you can find lots of people similar in interests and background.
Search for "town name" young professionals, emerging leaders, etc
These networking group things are everywhere and are usually a good investment with little upfront cost
I can highly recommend Internations, especially if you want to meet people from all over the world. I have only used in Europe and I got to meet a lot of great people through their events. The average age tends to be a little bit higher, but Internations also hosts monthly young professional events.
If you have co-workers you like, you can see if you can join their ECs; if one guy is on a sports team with 10 randoms, you might get along with some of the randoms and make new friends that way.
Have you tried making a Craigslist posting?
strictly platonic
Get out of your shell and try new activities. I just went on a scuba diving liveaboard, without any friends/family, for the first time ever and it was a blast. If you're outgoing, you'll survive.
Look for alumni groups in the area or setup a WSO meetup. Real easy to do and great way to start convos due to similar interests. Before ya know it, you'll be pukin on the sidewalk with a smile on your face
Networking is important.
To maintain a healthy social life post-college, here's what I did:
If you live outside the happening area, go into the happening area. I lived 30 miles out of the happening area but I would commute in and crash on a lone friend's couch from college. You'll be excited while you're down there because you had to get dressed up and drive all the way down + you don't live there so you've still got the luster of visiting. To pay your friend back, buy dinner or a thirty rack and chip in for Ubers. With the guilt of overstaying your welcome on your buddies couch looming, there's added incentive to find someone to go home with. Make it a game and have a little fun with it.
Join a gym. I make great efforts to tune out the world when I'm at the gym (blasting Young Thug at full volume), but if you're a regular for long enough, you're going to start recognizing people. Recognizing people leads to a chin point, a chin point leads to what's up, a what's up leads to an introduction and before you know it, you've got gym buddies. Ask the guy / girl if he's down to hit 1000M in the pool, squad up for basketball or even handball if that's your jam. All of that is real casual. I've also ran into gym buddies at the bars and a few drinks + introductions to their friends are always in order.
Take women on dates. If I knew absolutely nobody in my locale, this would be number one for me. Drop the stigma and download Bumble or Hinge. Swipe until you get a match and go on multiple dates per girl. Eventually, you'll meet up with her and her friends, who probably have guys who are hanging with them, who are probably a lot like you by association. If you're dating a chick who loves Dungeons and Dragons, I'll wager she hangs with guys and girls who are at least into Magic the Gathering or complex board games.
My fourth and final would be to volunteer your time for a cause that you care about. Once again, there's going to be a lot of like-minded people not only volunteering, but also working full-time at the organization. This is yet another low-pressure situation for finding friends because you're not there to find friends, you're there to save the fucking world. Friends, females and a sick B School profile simply fall into place ;)
Meetup can be great, though you need to find the right group. Work and religious groups can be great too.
tinder
Have you tried walking outside?
Good Lines to Meet People (Originally Posted: 03/31/2015)
I don't have a problem approaching people I don't know but want to meet. I am lost for words and I don't know how to initiate the conversation. What are good lines to say to people and also to keep the conversation going?
David DeAngelo said that the best opening line when meeting girls is, "Hi, my name is [your name]."
My friend taught me the conversation process--FROG. When having an early conversation with someone (usually a girl on a first date or at a party) ask her about her friends, relationships, occupation, goals.
This.
If that doesn't work, try the WATERRR process. Whiskey, absinthe, tequila...followed by "ERRR, drunk enough to have sex with me?"
For someone who was socially useless in high school, you really have to get that "what's the worst that could happen?" The amount of times ive cocked up conversations because I thought about it for too long.
Changed "friends" to "family", as my buddy just informed me.
If you have a pretty face, no need to talk. If you're ugly, you better have money. If you don't, be prepared for an isolated life.
Your loss for words is likely coming from anxiety. You are freezing up or censoring yourself.
what dat mouf do?
nice shoes, wanna fuck? ...or na
If it was anyone else I'd call bullshit but after hanging out with him a couple of times it now seems plausible.
Who are you trying to meet and why? Are you talking about non-sexual socially, in a career networking sense, or are you trying to pick up someone of the opposite sex, or same sex if that's your bag, and if the last option, are you male/female & hetero/homo?
In honor of St. Patrick's day:
"Do you have any Irish in you?"
"No."
"Want some?"
and if im not Irish :-( ? Am I doomed?
you'd be surprised how many people out there, even people who often seem outgoing, have a lot of nervousness when it comes to approaching random people they don't know.
"Hi, do you know any good lines to meet people?"
I think I heard this at some point during a later point in the night at the last WSO meet up
"Hello, could you kindly show me your O face?"
General template:
1: Introduce yourself
2: Ask a situational question about them(even a simple "So what brings you here?")
3: ?????????????????
4: PROFIT
Ask questions about them, make it about them. The less you talk the better, most people love talking about themselves.
This couldn't possibly be true in a given situation. You just can't expect a total stranger that you met 10 seconds ago to "love talking about themselves." People won't talk about themselves unless they trust you, so it is YOUR job to talk first and only then they will reciprocate (obviously, only if you are not a douchebag).
Offer a warm handshake, say hello and then your name, and then volunteer some info about yourself: "Hi, my name's Varg, I'm from Bergen."
Or if you're at a networking event where there are a lot of young professionals, you can volunteer where you go to school or work as a conversation opener. Hopefully the other person responds in kind. Another good question for networking events that I like to ask is "So how was work today?" That gets them to open up a little more and allows you to follow up with, "Is that how a day typically goes for you?" etc.
Since you tagged it alumni networking, you have a natural opener as you already have something in common. That's a layup. In general, I would practice by saying hello to people as you walk by them, encounter them in an elevator, etc. Sometimes they won't be very agreeable and other times they will be. I would also realize that many, many people have anxieties about talking to strangers that they simply don't show.
It's interesting, I think that having soft skills is becoming something that stands out to people where before it was pretty commonplace to just talk to people face to face. Especially with my generation and the reliance on cellphones/technology it is even more important to be able to simply interact with other people. Technical skills, in my opinion, are much easier to learn/teach than human interaction. So much relies on your own confidence levels, EQ and other qualities which are more ingrained and intrinsic than learned. If you can become comfortable with simply walking up to people and talking to them, you will absolutely set yourself apart from the majority of people. Practice, as they say, makes perfect.
In the words of Joey Tribbiani, "Hey, how you doin" jk go up to them while your drunk, pet their hair and with a relaxing smile say "mmmm softttttt"
Coming Soon: The WSO Basic Social Interaction Prep Package (videos included!)
For most the people on this site, that would do more for them than the technical guides....
I think Addinator and DC Depository have very good points. One of the best ways to keep a conversation going is to look for queues/topics/similarities. One piece of advice that I've learned from Dale Carnegie's How to Meet Friends and Influence People is that you can be more interesting by being interested in other people. Don't ask people questions for the sake of keeping the conversation going, because that's going to be forced and will alienate people. Ask questions because you want to learn more about them.
This doesn't answer your question directly, but hopefully it gives insight on how to formulate lines, versus using canned lines to keep a conversation going.
Just don't stop asking questions. Then ask questions based on their answers to the previous questions.
Also, pointing out obvious things is an easy ice breaker. "That painting is really cool" "This song sucks...what? you like it?" "Yes! They have this beer I really like that no bar ever has, have you tried it?" "Big gulps eh?, well see ya later"
I have one that works effectively well only If the elevator is taking more than a minute to reach your floor.
You could say "looks like a busy day for the lifts..."
Address the one thing you have in common with person to kick off any conversation. If you're at a networking event for instance, ask that person "hey how's the night been going for you? a lot of people huh". Then you can go into "so what do you do" or "are you from the area" - from there find more about what you have in common with that person and look to make a genuine connection. This isn't about what can you do for me vs. what can i do for you - you have to go in with a mindset of making a connection.
I use the D.E.N.N.I.S. system
friends after MBA school (Originally Posted: 02/15/2012)
Alot of people talk about how they formed the greatest friendships during their 2 years at MBA school. I was curious to know people's experiences a few years after b-school, when people start dispursing away from big cities towards places closer to family or spouse's family.
Will your MBA friends who last through the years end up or just being the people who are geographically close to where you live? Or does geography not really play a part, and people have annual trips. Or do large percentage of people end up relocating long-term near big metro areas where they can recieve the high paying jobs they went to MBA school to obtain.
Is this a rediculous factor to consider if the network/friendship/bonding aspect of the MBA experience ranks high on your list.
Well i might need another few months to confirm but i assume it will be like college. You stay fairly close with several guys but others become more of the occasional text, facebook post, etc and then others kind of fall away all together.
It varies. Obviously location is a huge factor. I have some closer friends from b-school that I still talk to regularly, and some that I don't.
I don't know how you'd use this to compare different schools. You're going to get to know your classmates regardless of where you go. It's really a question of how hard you try to keep in touch after.
It depends on the school, among other things. I've met many people at HBS who rarely keep in contact with anyone and I've meet people at smaller schools like Tuck where people remain friends well into the future. So, part of it is the person, part the school, part geography.
I'm more than 10 years out.
It's similar to college. Folks tend to keep in more regular contact in the first few years, but eventually grow apart. Part of it is geography, but a lot of it is simply just LIFE.
It's real easy to project your 20-something mentality and values towards the longer-term as if YOU will be static and unchanged.
Most people grow apart simply because life changes them. When you get married, you have kids, other stuff happens, you change careers, you move to a different part of the country or even another part of the world (or simply just moving from a city/urban lifestyle to a suburban one can make a HUGE difference). You will get caught up in your own everyday life dealing with jobs, commutes, family, that you're not going to be trying to reconnect with your b-school friends every weekend. Most of the time, it'll be every few weeks, maybe once every month and a half you get together for dinner, etc.
The fact that you're even worried (even a little) about this suggests that you're assuming you're going to care this much about all this when you're in your late 30s and 40s when you've got other more meaningful shit to worry about then.
You will have a great time in b-school, meet some great friends, hang out regularly for a few years afterwards pretty frequently, and over time that will taper off. And you will still be happy because you've probably got other things in your life going on by then.
Stop worrying about this stuff. You will make new friends outside of b-school. Your life isn't over after b-school. You will be just fine, and happy.
There's a clustering thing that goes on. Applicants or those who are 1-2 years away from applying to b-school, b-school students themselves, and recent b-school alums (less than 5 years out) may feel emotionally that b-school is the bees knees, but over time it becomes more and more a distant memory.
Making new "friends" as an analyst/associate. (Originally Posted: 09/27/2006)
I'm curious to know, how do bulge bracket analysts and associates make time for recreational activities such as going out, meeting friends, etc?
I work at a BB...
Monday through Thursday: fucked.
85% of my Friday and Saturday nights I am able to make it out. I leave office around 11 and party hard until 2-4.
It's not as bad as people make it out to be. If you have the desire to go out and get laid (and hopefully you do) you can certainly make it happen.
I mean if you have half a game you should be able to meet people by going out a couple of nights per week.
Are there a lot of attractive women in NYC? Are NYC chicks typically personable? Are you at an advantage given your occupation?
Dallas is amazing. 90% are blonde and nearly half are bombshells. And the best part is the lack of competition. In contrast to NYC (where I speculate being able to say you are an i-banker doesn't count for much) they completely eat it up here. But this is Dallas...investment bankers are few and far between. So the cliche works wonders, LOL. Instant "player" status.
tons of attractive women in NY, if you go to the right places, but being a banker in NYC is nothing special (dime a dozen).
i agree, friday and saturday nights are rough for meeting new people, but its all i can do. if i get out at a reasonable hour on the weekdays, you can bet i'm out at a bar getting shitfaced.
seems like you have a nice deal setup in dallas. kudos.
The amount of attractive NYC females is just as high as the number of arrogant male bankers
The women in New York are probably better looking than anywhere else in the country. But what you get from Dallas is a chick without NYC Trade Fem's stuck up attitude.
BSD123, you obviously have never encountered a truly
[quote=NYC Trade Fem]BSD123, you obviously have never encountered a truly
An analyst/associate in NYC may be just another struggling working professional trying to budget for his monthly rent.
But a 22-25 year old kid with a six figure salary in Dallas is few and far in between...and is a total rockstar. Especially if he is in banking...in which case he is on the cusp of wealth creation before age 30.
It aids tremendously that junior i-bankers in dallas earn just as much as their colleagues in NYC. Yet our cost of living is significantly lower. I live in the most hip/cosmo area of dallas in one of the most luxurious residences...where 1 bedroom rents go for approx $1,200-1,400 per month tops. Leaves enough left over for any kid to purchase or lease a lexus, bmw, or mercedes...and still have enough left over to treat chicks to wonderful restaurants and clubs.
In Dallas...an analyst/associate is on top of the world and totally in the game. He's also loving life...because he doesn't have to deal with women with attitude.
barf
thats good stuff. however in Dallas i would feel so out of the loop. And i do agree, the chicks in dallas are far better than nyc. they have better attitudes and are generally hotter. Here is the key: nyc chicks try to be hot. dallas chicks are hot.
Now that's where the hot girls are...
you mean UT
but I've heard it's a great time. The reality is that Texas women, in general, are extremely attractive. In Dallas, in particular, they are very healthy, very fit, and VERY pampered... generally just very pleasant to the eye. Plus, 75% of them are blondes...which you have to love.
I have a special place in my heart for Texas women.
Texas women are great. I really love their attitudes too and they're extremely friendly. I've run into a few out here in LA and they everything you just explained.
cusp of wealth creation...lol
i should transfer to Texas
Thank you for exhibit B. You aren't stuck up, you just "deserve the best". Right?
What do you consider as right spots for these women ?
Need a bit of clarification as to what u are asking.
It's a fact that NY has one of the highest ratios (if not the highest) of single chicks to guys in the whole country, so you're okay if you're a guy here. And I've been to TX, and though the girls are definitely more approachable and less jaded, they're also much fatter and are very plain jane. I guess if you like blondes then that's all well and good, but NY girls are much more exotic, stylish and generally more interesting, IMO.
BSD123, no I don
Agreed. Women (and men) deserve exactly what they earn. Not what other people earn.
Thank you Mis Ind
Have to? I don't think you have to. Why are you guys giving women stuff you feel they don't deserve? Because they won't talk to you otherwise? To hell with them, then.
And if you choose to try to buy a woman, don't bitch that she's too expensive. That's a situation you put yourself in when you make that choice.
dont put the pussy on a pedestal
sure you have to, if you don't she'll go to the next sucker who will.
its expected from the guy to pick up the tab, pay for the going outtings, and give her those gifts once in a while to keep her entertained...otherwise she'll get bored
women have been programmed to think that since birth, that this is what a successful relationship is based on, if he doesn't shower you with gifts he doesn't care.
A friend of mine who worked in Dallas told me the women there are just as superficial and stuck up. They'll approach you and among the first questions they will ask: where you live, what kind of car you drive, what you do, etc.
Also, why is everyone so bitter about having to buy a dinner or two?...
I have little doubt that the women in Dallas are just as superficial as in NYC. The difference is that the bar is SIGNIFICANTLY lower here.
A 25 year old with a six figure salary, german sports sedan, and nice pad is a hero.
i think thats unversal for all women, doesn't matter if they are in cali or new york or oklahoma they'll care about what car you drive and how much money you make.
its not absolute that the guy pay for the meal. what it is, is a social norm. i have no problem paying for meals and other various outings. Nor do i have a problem with flowers and other niceities at random times; i think girls like that. But by no means would i ever date a girl that said for example, "i deserve to be treated like a princess." That is over the top.
i think paying is a sign of respect. i would never dream of saying, "do you want to split it?" I would feel like the biggest douche.
ok stop with the whole flowers and niceties for a while, and watch how fast you end up in a dog house.
its like when you friend is pussy whipped, and you tell him he is, but he always says No I'm not
same with gold diggers, you may think she likes you for you, but she is actually in love with your wallet.
Tell girls you drive a honda civic, live in Brooklyn and watch how much your "game' suffers.
Because girls that have the "stuff" don't want to date poor guys. It's that simple. Why waste my time with you when I can date a guy that's better off? Who wants to have their wedding in some sweatshop in Queens? Who wants to raise a family on 40k? It all goes back to the discussion between ms ind and I a few weeks back. The girl wants comfort and protection. just b/c she wants a guy with resources doesnt mean shes a gold digger.
Now clearly if the dude is 5'5" 300lbs, but has a large bank account and the girl is hot, she is a digger. but if the couple is good looking and he has some dough, its a regular relationship -no gold digging, just girlism.
so let me get this straight, if she wants to date someone drivinga BMW, living in Manahtten, with a 100K a year paycheck...she is not a gold digger, she is just sensible?
Come on man, that is THE definition for a gold digger. She is dating someone based on their personal wealth instead of their personal qualities as a man.
Do this experiment next time you go out...tell 5 chicks you drive a SL500, and tell 5 other ones that you drive a 1998 Civic. Then count how many minutes will the conversation last.
This is exactly why I am against marriage, the man has nothing to gain by marrying, while the woman gains everything.
not girlism, just a bigger KA CHING for the woman, because not only does she get access to the bank account, she also doesn't have to give it up to a fat blob.
yeah cost of living is a lot less...i.e. for 500K you'll get a shack at a good town in NJ... in texas you'll get a 3 story mansion for the same amount
Dude, there are exceptions. I'm the breadwinner for my fiance, for instance, and he's not huge or buff or Abercrombie-and-Fitch-looking either. You guys are getting all cosi fan tutte up in here, and I think it's an effect of the grasping, petty, shallow kind of women you hang around with.
You guys do seem pretty jaded. Aspiringmonkey, you're not even out of college and I already feel bad for you. I don't think I had any experience with golddiggers in college.
Ms Ind, am i not correct in saying that a girl is not a gold digger if she wants a guy with money? if a girl is a golf digger, than i am a hot digger. people are looking out for their self interest. When you first meet somebody all you have is the superficial -you dont know what kind of person they are. Now, it is entirely different if a guy and girl have been dating for months and something occurs where he cant draw the same paycheck. if the girl dumps him b/c his 200k turns into 40k, then she is GDing.
But when I first moved to Dallas from Boston I spent four months borrowing a friend's eight year old Toyota Tercel coupe.
The reaction was fucking hilarious. First and foremost, I never had a problem getting dates. In fact, during those first four months in Dallas I went on at least a dozen first dates and a lot of second dates with mostly very attractive girls. And I found 50% of the time the chicks totally wanted to run as soon as they laid eyes on that piece of shit car, LOL. The other half took it in stride (although obviously I did have to explain the situation...why an investment banker who was supposedly successful drove a shit car, etc).
Anyway, that was my little social experiment, LOL. It was my "weed out" experiment...allowed me to sift through the green eyed hoes pretty quickly.
Of course, today I'm picking ladies up in a brand new expensive luxury sports car...so it's more difficult to "weed" them out. But then again...who cares, LOL. I honestly don't give a shit. My motto is that you can only expect so much from a woman until she proves that she is worthy of more than just casual emotions. And you NEVER, EVER put a woman on a pedestal. You never give them the power.
These are all lessons I've learned the hard way...but these days I've found it's pretty easy to keep even the most superficial and most beautiful green eyed girls around. 8)
If you weren't buying the girl dinner, would you be going to that nice restaurant by yourself? Its not like you're not having a great time/good meal yourself...
And going to a nice restaurant with just one other guy friend is just kind of wierd for me.
thats my biggest weakness. i always put them on a pedestal.
For years I put women on a pedestal. Every woman I met and dated...I chose to see only the best in them. I find that most guys who do that are inherently genuine and nice guys...good quality guys.
The problem is that putting women on a pedestal tends to be a liability...it sets yourself up to get fucked over. For some odd fucking reason 99% of women won't respect a nice guy who tries to treat them too well. So you have to hold back. Less is more.
Especially when it comes to cosmo green-eyed high maintenance girls. You have to keep the power...force them to cling to you by convincing them that you are a fucking winner.
From a girl's perpective:
Overly nice + timid + showers me with too much attention = a guy who is needy = looser.
To my fellow male chimps out there...always remember a cardinal rule of the Jungle...
Two animals cannot chase eachother. Invariably one chases...and the other instinctively runs. "Instinctively" being the operative word.
You gotta get THEM to chase YOU. You have to give them a reason to chase. You do that by convincing them you are a winner.
I'm all about paying. I think it's a nice jesture. Like I wrote earlier, I only expect so much from a chick when we first begin dating. It's a reciprical propositon...I'll take care of you if you take care of me. 8)
Now if she turns out to be a quality girl and something is there long term...that's a pleasant surprise and I'll all about exploring a healthy long-term relationship.
But 9 out of 10 girls...all you can expect is a fun time for a brief period of time and then you have to tell them Hasta Lazagna...don't get any on ya!
"Two animals cannot chase eachother. Invariably one chases...and the other instinctively runs. "Instinctively" being the operative word.
You gotta get THEM to chase YOU. You have to give them a reason to chase. You do that by convincing them you are a winner."
I agree that when one person chases another person, regardless what the chased orginally felt for you, the person tends to pull away, but I think this is particularly true with girls chasing guys, not the other way around.
I don't think it's a good idea for a guy to wait around to be chased by a woman, the reason being that it most likely won't happen. Call me conservative but I would withdraw as soon as I feel that the guy isn't that into me, I wouldn't even think of chasing a guy and I think that's a majority of girls. We are still trained to think that guys should do the chasing.
Ok I just reread your post and I think I might have misapplied what you meant by chasing, so I get your point, but since I already typed all that.....
i am a serious fuck up when it comes to girls. i loathe the chasing game. call me all mushy or whatever, but i cant believe a girl would dump a guy b/c he was all nice and into her.
it's not bc you are being "nice" per say that you get dumped. Monopolist has it right. the reason he does so well with women is not because he is an investment banker -- it's more his attitude. To aspiringmonkey, if you were to give Monopolist a challenge and make him drive a '98 civic he'd still get a lot of girls bc he can laugh it off.
i had the same pessimitic attitude in college that aspiringmonkey did. reality is most girls do like the comfort that money brings (as do men - why you working 100hrs a wk), but only some. you make the decision to pay for dinner / drinks (whic is a good idea), but you don't have to shower her with gifts -- in fact it is one of the worst things you can do in the early stages of a relationship w a girl (gfriend or otherwise) most women are not "golddiggers", and many are willing to look past how much $ you make if you are confident, have a great attitude and have your shit together (in other ways).
As stupid as the "game" seems, I hate calling it a game. If you have your shit together, are happy with yourself and your own life, women will sense this and you will do much better. call it a game if you must, but the bottom line is if you are embarrassed about your '98 civic and show it then you look weak. there are plenty of extremely poor musicians or artists that get very attractive girls because they are comfortable and have the right attitude. monopolist has it right -- he knows that some of the girls are after his money, but he's just having fun right now. he keeps it light, he keeps it fun by putting himslef in good situations (bars in dallas), staying a challenge and watching the girls flock. easier said than done. especially the confidence / attitude part. comes with time (and a lot of rejections) and maturity.
"If you have your shit together, are happy with yourself and your own life, women will sense this and you will do much better."
That phrase pretty much sums it up. Women can sense any insecurity and they'll use it as an excuse to a) use you if they can and/or b) flat out reject you.
Attitude is everything. You have to exude that you are a confident and secure person. I have this buddy...average looking guy...but he gets so much ass...and I always refer to him as a 'pillar of security.' The fucker never allows himself to be timid. Girls sense how secure he is with himself and they flock to him.
Exuding the right attitude is easier said than done. I certainly have my insecurities...used to always play the role of the "nice" guy and I was crapped on by women for years before I figured out how the fucking game works.
The problem with being "nice" is that, 90% of the time, women perceive it as being "needy." So you can be a nice guy (hell I think I'm still a really nice and generous guy) but you have to learn to remove the "needy" element.
To Sum it Up:
Being a nice guy is often interpreted as being needed...which is further interpreted as being insecure...so they throw u in the loser category.
Being a nice guy while also exuding tremendous confidence and security...coupled with your obvious career success...equals a winner.
Yep. I think there are two equally crucial requirements for a top-quality boyfriend. Be strong. Be nice. That's pretty much it.
I think because of my size I come off as jerkish. I still lift today and i used to bodybuild duing college, so girls say they are "intimidated," hence they dont approach me. Now that, coupled with my "loser category" disposition provides for a pretty shitty game.
And if i drop the nice guy attitude and pick up the game attitude, they'll be afraid.
need to learn how to have a nice "friendly" / "disarming" yet confident smile.
Dan the man, I've never known a chick to be intimidated by someone who lifts weights. I know a lot of hard core lifters because I lift myself six days a week (although at 6' 165lbs...I don't have a chance in hell of ever looking like any of them).
Point is...none of them seem to have trouble getting laid. Just be nice and kind. If anything...you should not have trouble evading the "needyness" vibe given your build.
Life doesn't revolve around sex.
o, yes it does. its a biological need.
We are in our twenties for god's sake. Everything that we do revolves around the quest for sexual fulfillment.
It's all about sexual fulfillment. In fact, 50% of the guys in this business are here and driven to succeed due to the fact that they CAN'T get ass at the present moment and couldn't get ass in the past. Maybe they were a bit nerdy in High School and couldn't get a girl...maybe they were a bit shy in college and never had a one night stand. So here they are today...driven by the sexual inequity they have endured throughout their young lives. "Just wait until I'm a big dig investment banker with a penthouse on the park." "Just wait until I'm driving my Ferrari down broadway, or sailing my yacht in the harbor, or rolling in $4K suits and wearing a Rolex." LOL
They figure career achievement will bring them the respect they deserve from women, and as a result, sexual gratification...later in life.
Hell, I'll admit that's part of the reason I'm driven today. And in retrospect...I thank god for a bit of sexual repression...it fostered a desire to achieve...to prove myself. And now I'm on a career fast track AND I'm getting ass left and right. 8)
But for those of you who are still enduring...still waiting for the day the heavens will open and shower you with all the ass you deserve....just make sure you aren't setting yourself up to drop dead of a heart attack at 35. If that occurs...it will have all been for nothing.
And that would be...a fucking tragedy.
I have been following this post for a while...I am an Analyst at a BB in Dallas. I am amazed. You are arrogant, greedy, and out for nothing but personal gratification. Your posts thus far have been nothing but premium fodder for a Wall Street Journal article.
I'm a bit offended by your comment. I don't consider myself to be arrogant or greedy in the least.
I posted this topic just for fun...because I thought it would be interesting and entertaining for us to chat about how we, as young banking professionals, balance the tremendous responsibilities of our jobs with our social/private lives.
As far as my follow up comments...they have been nothing but constructive criticism to guys on here who are having trouble. And it's not as if I'm bashing women. I have a tremendous amount of respect for them and how they "play" the dating game...it allows them to sift through idiots/losers fairly efficiently.
Further, I believe several women have even added their perspectives here and none seemed to take offense.
Wow guys you are sad. You don't need to be ibanker to get laid. Moreover, how different is a prostitute from some girl that you have a one-night-stand with? I doubt it is her first time. Sex is a biological need, but I think most people have gone beyond that point into the "lust" phase. Lust and sex will only destroy you in the end.
First off, this is a wondeful thread -hats off to the creator. Secondly, we are not sad. Lust is beautiful. Lust and sex are the only things that keep my going.
Hugh Heffner
robert is some whack job that comes on this forum every couple days and rips people for taking part in their lives. save ur judgements for people you know.
Well sex isnt for everyone I suppose.
Since I am a man, if Jesus is the only man in my life ( I certainly dont need to be told how to run my life....by anybody living!) does that make me a homosexual, which is said to be bad in the bible (I dont know where, somewhere in the middle)
maybe I am drawing the wrong conclusion, perhaps the "You will all perish in place!" avenging wallflower attitude could be from...
Envy (If I cant get any, nobody else should) Sense of Balance (I am married and dont cheat, look at these horny bastards, I cant believe that women sleep with them knowing that it is a temporary thing (after all women dont have sexual thoughts)) Sense of propriety Sex is not done in public, so it should not be done at all as it can be avoided unlike say, deficating Sense of Loftiness "What would _______ do?" Sense of Impotent Control (You are having fun? You shouldn't)
Or is there another conclusion that I missed entirely? I can't really say that this would cover them all
As for the original question, friends through shared hobbies, given the context I would not reccomend coworkers
One night stand, dress up go to any meat market do your thing, remember to bring condoms
Future wife, go more the friend route, after all a marrage is just a date that worked out, long enough to be legally together.
Although if you have no game, as there are no courses that you can take in it that I know of... well there is always books, observing those who do have game, practice.
I vote good thread. We all need to be reminded of the points brought up by mono a few ago. I've been slipping recently. You know when you start looking back to your college days longingly that you are fucked. Shit.
By the way, I'm a woman and not offended in the least. I think the best way to get rid of lust is to get laid. That's... kinda what it's there for, right? I mean, correct me if I'm wrong.
(Now somebody going to jump in and tell me that lust is there to test me and build my character, or something.)
no. because the lust grows into infatuation. you keep thinking about the sex. it never stops. the best way to cure lust is natural. lust leaves naturally.
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