Hedge Fund Lawyers

Note: I don't want to hear that I made a mistake going to law school lol. I'm comfortable with my decision and I have no interest in working in high finance in a technical capacity, but I do have an interest in working in high finance in a legal capacity.


Making this thread because I see a lot of lawyers working in Hedge Funds as Counsel and there seems to be a lack of information on how to break into these jobs.

Questions for Hedge Fund Lawyer (Specifically those that work for hedge funds or are doing secondment at a hedge fund)

  • Is there a pathway to work for a hedge fund without firm experience?
  • Have you seen a hedge fund take summer students for legal work?
  • What type of work do you actually do on a daily basis? Is it similar to the in-firm work?
  • Is the pay similar to in-house exit opportunities?
  • What made you go from firm work to in-house at a hedge fund?
  • For those that left, What made you leave the hedgefund? 
 

Hedge fund legal work is entirely compliance and fund formation.  Both utterly miserable for the reasons laid out in your PE post.  Although I have less experience with hedge fund legal work, it is probably less exciting and more mind-numbing, if such a sorry state of affairs is possible (only upside is predictable hours).  It is odd you are posting these questions on WSO, it is like asking a bunch of C/B-list actors how to get a job as a janitor on a movie set.  Sure, maybe they have some HR contact for a job referral, it is just not the right place.  They are above you and always will be with that scarlet JD.

 

Really not true, plenty of HF lawyers with restructuring backgrounds who read docs and take active roles within groups after moving to the investing side.

 

in terms of getting the job your best bet would be starting with restructuring at biglaw out of school 

 

There's a distinction between in-house counsel and transactional counsel at a lot of funds. In-house counsel is generally limited to compliance and fund formation work. I have never seen anyone hired directly out of law school for those kinds of roles, usually they hire people who have worked in a fund formation practice at a biglaw firm for several years. I think you should consider whether that is what you really want to do. Transactional roles are usually reserved for people who have experience in a particular area - finance, restructuring, M&A, etc. Those roles are fewer and further between, so it takes a lot of luck to find them. I have seen a handful of funds hiring lawyers directly out of law school for more esoteric transactional practices. But honestly I'd advise against it if that is the way you want to go - if you really want to be a lawyer, then work at a firm for a few years and then make the leap. 

 

Our compliance director is the most miserable SoB. One of our PMs used to bully him around the office. We would have felt bad for him if he wasn't the most power-hungry little tyrant to ever scream at a junior analyst for accidentally accepting a gift from a broker without his permission.

Do you want to be him?

Big4 Audit --> TMT L/S
 
Funniest

OP, this is likely the level of respect you will achieve if you keep insisting on attending law school for a non-litigation role. YMMV, some do fine in transactional work. Overwhelming odds it will not be you. 
 

 

Hedge funds are very varied organizations in terms of what responsibilities people have. I think the job usually isn't that interesting depending on the fund but the hours are probably lowkey and you're getting payed pretty well. My dad did some really minor legal work once for the GC of a hedge fund decades ago. That GC (and also at the time a Managing Partner and the CAO) directly negotiated the partial sale of the fund to JP Morgan for $1.4 billion in the mid 2000s. He also started and sold a legal consulting firm to Duff & Phelps. He did start out briefly at a big law firm in the derivatives group. I think that's probably one of the coolest careers you can have as a corporate attorney so it's not like being in-house at a hedge fund is necessarily a dead end. Depending on the fund, you can build a lot of responsibilities for all sorts of key stuff because the department divisions can be a lot less structured.

Edit: to add on to your questions, working at big law firm is usually miserable and it's super hard to become partner so that's why people go inhouse. In house hours are almost always way less and the pay decent (like 300k) whether you're at a corporate or a solid hedge fund. You can probably intern at a hedge fund as a 1L but you want to be a Summer Associate at a big law firm the next summers because you get paid really well and get credibility (that's probably the only way to get a legitimate inhouse counsel role at a fund right out of law school). Where you really want to intern as a 1L is the SEC if you want to go in house at a hedge fund in your career. SEC graduate program is a good path to becoming inhouse at a hedge fund too if you don't mind getting paid way way less than stomaching 2 years at a big law firm.

Array
 

I would be wary of career paths taken by those several decades older within the legal “profession.”  Back in the 80s, attorneys were relied upon for substantive, financials-based M&A advice.  Much of current best practices and precedent were not formed, forming creative outlets.  That is all gone now in any law related to financial services.  With each passing year, arranging that sale becomes less and less likely for an attorney if they even make it to GC (another unlikely outcome, highly competitive for attorneys).

You are correct people move in house for a better lifestyle, this is not always the case though. Plenty of F500s work attorneys to the bone, they are fired or laid off if the company is taken over, the work is rote (you will work on the same kind of contract 50-60 hours a week), and the pay is not close to 300k. The overwhelming majority of associates will leave big law making a good clip less than 300k, and many will take a 50% or greater pay cut to barely above 100k.  Room for advancement and promotion is limited. Your GC and your direct manager will likely have been partners at a large firm and either left for stock packages, actual autonomy and lifestyle (which you do not have), or they were forced out of big law (partnerships are de-equitizing).  Because of up or out, a low low six figure salary should be viewed as the norm by law applicants, not 190k. Paying 1L summer jobs evaporated after 2008 outside of diversity programs, this includes Yale and Harvard Law. Working for the SEC is less exciting than watching white paint dry, those who did it 1L in various offices geographically tended to regret it. 
 

tl:dr there is a lot of misinformation about legal careers and trajectories, it is worse than the most cynical WSO 19 year old college sophomore can imagine 

 

I know this is a year old thread at this point, but:

Plenty of F500s work attorneys to the bone, they are fired or laid off if the company is taken over, the work is rote (you will work on the same kind of contract 50-60 hours a week), and the pay is not close to 300k. The overwhelming majority of associates will leave big law making a good clip less than 300k, and many will take a 50% or greater pay cut to barely above 100k.

Is just flatly not accurate. Nearly everyone biglaw attorney I know who has left in-house (at least 10), whether into finance (investment firm, etc.) or just general corporate (tech/other industry) makes at least $200k in total comp. Some are making $300k+. I was personally good friends with a mid-level IP attorney (~10 years experience) at a F500 company who was making at least $400k in a non-NYC market.

None of these were former biglaw partners, all left in the 4-7 year range. Yes, hours can suck but that's America. Please point me to any job where you can make several hundred thousand dollars and not work hard. Bonuses are often guaranteed and not subject to meeting hours.

Do shitty in-house jobs exist? Obviously. To act like the "norm" for in-house after biglaw is sub-$200k hellhole for the rest of your life is a joke though.

To the original poster's questions though, no hedge fund that I know of is going to hire interns or fresh law grads. They can expense their legal bills to investors so they take ample advantage of that and outside counsel often and freely. It is only when you get to a certain size that it becomes more cost effective to just have a few in-house lawyers, and I haven't seen any hedge fund with significantly staffed legal departments (i.e., more than 4-5 lawyers) even if they are large. Hedge fund work is going to be compliance, fund formation, investor negotiations, and some contractual work with your service providers, ISDAs, etc. If you are looking to have a broader skill set, it is better to target in-house at a PE fund where you have a chance to be on actual underlying deal negotiation teams.

 

Thought I should comment as an ex-restructuring lawyer, now business side at a distressed fund. It does happen on the distressed / credit side given there is value add in knowing process / docs / deal dynamics.

In terms of working as an actual lawyer in a fund, there is an enormous difference between being transaction counsel and more strictly “in-house”. The former is basically a managerial version of your usual M&A / restructuring lawyer - the latter is very different and it’s really all fund formation and compliance.

 

How are you finding the switch from both an interest and lifestyle perspective? As someone who went from restructuring lawyer to rx ib I do find this side of advisory more interesting but obviously hasn't come with any material changes in lifestyle (if anything possibly worse now than before).

 

Echo the importance noted above of distinguishing between (1) compliance & fund formation versus (2) transactional counsel versus (3) the even-rarer business-side seat (disclosure - this is what I'm currently chasing as a former restructuring attorney). I've seen a decent amount of the second and third buckets in my own networking, and my law school roommate recently finished a ~5 year stint in a compliance/fund formation/etc role at a hedge fund. Caveat, gap in my knowledge is what the legal department at a truly massive manager like BlackRock looks like.

Big gating issue, these seats are rare. The friend referenced above was at a single-digit billions AUM fund where it was the GC, and then my friend replaced a low-level non-attorney compliance person with the carrot that 'you'll start out doing more compliance grunt-work but we'll transition you to more interesting truly legal fare over time / once the compliance program is beefed up' (a promise that was borne out, but tangent, hiring a true compliance-only person as a 3rd team member became a multi-year fight that my friend never won). So, a grand total of two people. Smaller / less documentation-intense funds may only have a GC or outsource completely to outside counsel at a firm. And, as the public company GC I interned with during law school used to put it, a GC is essentially a quarterback... you're doing some work/learning things on the fly yourself (such as big ticket one-offs, like a regulator audit, some big litigation, M&A as an example from the corporate in-house context), but you’re really spending a lot of time just issue-spotting things that need to be done and then coordinating with outside counsel to actually do them for you. That means you need to know your stuff cold (to comprehensively issue-spot), so if you're contemplating jumping from a firm to a fund earlier in your career, you can't move as GC, which leaves you dependent on finding places that have legit ‘second seats’ or larger departments. So, I think the big takeaway is that if you're trying to make the move early on, you should probably focus on filtering funds/managers by scale.

Now, how do you get there? My friend is the only person I know who didn't start in biglaw and then move to a fund (he did SEC compliance work for a consulting firm straight out of law school for ~ 2 years before getting a lucky look from a recruiter). Getting to these seats principally comes down to preexisting client relationships and/or luck. The prototypical route for a junior move seems to be, start with a minimum of 2-3 years in biglaw (the better your firm name, the sooner you'll get looks) and then either move to a client or have your firm name stand out on a resume screen.     

A big gap I can’t speak to is whether you can make that move in-house as a junior and then climb up the ladder at the same fund to make GC. My friend left the fund he was at to go to a law firm with a strong fund formation practice because he wanted to be able to learn how to navigate the full spectrum of fund types / clients and flesh out his experience in a way that could set him up to potentially move back to a fund in the future as a GC, which is something he felt he wouldn’t be able to accomplish at the fund despite a good working relationship / apprenticeship mentality with the GC just because his view was limited to the fund’s perspective (whereas at a firm of course you have multiple clients whose perspectives you can use to inform/build your own knowledge). My limited anecdotal experience is that GCs typically have a longer tenure at a law firm before moving to a fund, and that among funds with small legal departments, there are specific law firms that have great alumni networks (Schulte comes to mind, but I’m sure there are some other examples of firms with practices that cater strongly to funds in some capacity where this comment is applicable).

Finally, your question about whether the pay is similar to in-house corporate exit opportunities… my hunch is that the pay for an attorney on the legal side at a fund can't be any worse that in-house corporate roles if that’s what you’re using as a comparison, but depending on the culture of the fund / whether you're looked at purely as a cost center or more favorably, you might be exposed to more bonus upside optionality (the latter was my roommate's experience, but caveat, the fund he was at did superlatively well during certain periods when he was there).

 

Wanted to give an update on how my job prospects turned out as a first-year student. Networked with quite a few PE Lawyer and Hedge Fund Lawyers. There's an abundance of compliance jobs if you network. Law jobs.... not so much. I did get an offer at a quant fund though as a summer law student but ended up taking a mega fund offer.

 

I’m a recent law grad, patent attorney w a top LLM in IP/securities law with little experience during school.

I just took a pay cut to start an entry level Compliance Consulting position with a newish/small firm but has major/many clients and is known in the industry. Growth is supposedly very quick/possible, especially for law backgrounds obv. so I’m pumped for that.

I’m hoping it can lead to a CCO position with a fund, maybe a former client, etc. Maybe get poached by a law firm to get some of those skills down too and then in house CCO but I don’t see myself being a full on attorney unless it’s strictly Compliance related or minimal GC tasks, leadership type role, client/employee or COO type too. Regulation is only getting stricter and on a global scale so I’m hearing (and seeing) this is a field not going away any time soon.

 

Ut modi dolor autem perspiciatis aut odit minima. Qui magni qui repellendus est dicta ullam quia velit. Perspiciatis voluptatem veniam perspiciatis nostrum quam dolorem. Est perspiciatis assumenda excepturi quod nihil voluptatem itaque. Eos consequuntur non est.

Natus error et fugit eveniet perferendis. Voluptate minus omnis et amet. Et vel id reprehenderit qui est tempore dolor ut. Nesciunt aut aperiam asperiores repudiandae voluptatum eligendi.

Career Advancement Opportunities

April 2024 Hedge Fund

  • Point72 98.9%
  • D.E. Shaw 97.9%
  • Magnetar Capital 96.8%
  • Citadel Investment Group 95.8%
  • AQR Capital Management 94.7%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

April 2024 Hedge Fund

  • Magnetar Capital 98.9%
  • D.E. Shaw 97.8%
  • Blackstone Group 96.8%
  • Two Sigma Investments 95.7%
  • Citadel Investment Group 94.6%

Professional Growth Opportunities

April 2024 Hedge Fund

  • AQR Capital Management 99.0%
  • Point72 97.9%
  • D.E. Shaw 96.9%
  • Citadel Investment Group 95.8%
  • Magnetar Capital 94.8%

Total Avg Compensation

April 2024 Hedge Fund

  • Portfolio Manager (9) $1,648
  • Vice President (23) $474
  • Director/MD (12) $423
  • NA (6) $322
  • 3rd+ Year Associate (24) $287
  • Manager (4) $282
  • Engineer/Quant (71) $274
  • 2nd Year Associate (30) $251
  • 1st Year Associate (73) $190
  • Analysts (225) $179
  • Intern/Summer Associate (22) $131
  • Junior Trader (5) $102
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (249) $85
notes
16 IB Interviews Notes

“... there’s no excuse to not take advantage of the resources out there available to you. Best value for your $ are the...”

Leaderboard

1
redever's picture
redever
99.2
2
Secyh62's picture
Secyh62
99.0
3
Betsy Massar's picture
Betsy Massar
99.0
4
BankonBanking's picture
BankonBanking
99.0
5
CompBanker's picture
CompBanker
98.9
6
dosk17's picture
dosk17
98.9
7
kanon's picture
kanon
98.9
8
GameTheory's picture
GameTheory
98.9
9
bolo up's picture
bolo up
98.8
10
Linda Abraham's picture
Linda Abraham
98.8
success
From 10 rejections to 1 dream investment banking internship

“... I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer...”