How hard will it be to find an internship/job without internship experience?
I'm currently finishing my last semester at a target (think Berkeley, Duke, Northwestern) and I have no relevant internships under my belt. I was supposed to graduate in May, but had a lot of terrible luck/was stupid and now I feel like my future is in the toilet. Do you think I'm screwed or is there hope?
Get well soon.
Keep networking, this is key. Reach out to as many people as you can and see what it will produce. Probably on-campus recruiting will be your best bet since it provides a face-to-face instead of mass CV/resume submission.
Good decision to turn down the sketchy roommate.
Keep your head up, don't assume you will be rejected by all. Think positive and make it happen!
Thanks HuntNKill! It's been difficult to go to networking events because of my foot injury. I also stick out like a sore thumb so I totally understand why recruiters would ding me. Why would you choose an injured person over an equally/more qualified candidate who's not?
I feel stung by my first rejection. I know these jobs are hard to get because they're highly coveted. It feels like other people are just smarter than me..
Just keep grinding away with networking and refining your story. Try and find a way to make your summer experience, even though it may not have been directly related, tie to leadership/finance/other skills applicable in the field you want to get into. I thought I was screwed because I had a no-name internship my senior year but ended up getting multiple interviews with boutique consulting firms and F500 finance program and ended up with an offer in F500 corp fin.
1) I admit this might be easier for a male worker, but: I have lived below my means and standards many, many times in my life. In fact, my current place is a shoe box as well. During my first jobs I lived in motels and bed&breakfasts all the time until I found a better place. Never thought I'd have that many sketchy neighbors after graduating and working in finance. 2) Get well soon!
I have never had an internship in my entire life and that was because I was too busy and got caught up with too many part-time jobs, dating, going out. I simply needed the money for hobbies. It didn't hurt my job applications (was placed within 4 months after graduation) but I felt like I had to submit more and with more effort than others. Obviously, I didn't have any internship contacts to reach out to for a job.
Your CFA is a plus!
IB after MBA at target school with no IB expereince (Originally Posted: 05/12/2014)
Hey guys, I have finance experience and I've worked at one BB but never in a capacity as a banker working with models doing DCF or LBO's. I don't have any deal experience.
After looking around at some postings online for IB associates, almost all of the job descriptions have a requirement for 2-3 years as an IB analyst.
So how does an MBA help someone break into IB if they want experience to begin with that you couldn't get because you never went to a target school.
I'm guessing that during OCR BB's will hire MBA's as associates without IB experience but these positions are not advertised online.
To be fair, not going to a target school doesn't preclude someone from getting a job in IB.
However, to answer your question, you're right - banks hire post-MBA associates without IB experience, and your finance experience (even if largely unrelated) will help you with your story for 'why IB'
if you do go to a target MBA, you will have specific resume drops for your school. The job postings you are seeing are for lateral hires, not for MBA associates.
If anything, having IBD analyst experience hurts you if you're recruiting for IBD associate positions from a target MBA. The assumption is that any analyst that wanted to continue in banking should have been good enough to be promoted straight through or lateral to another bank.
The vast majority of post-MBA IBD associates had no pre-MBA experience - I've seen people from fields as diverse as lobbyists to biglaw paralegals. Having BB experience will help you craft your story as to why you want a front office position.
What about people who want to stay in IB but also want an MBA for other reasons? Does it hurt you to the point where you wouldn't get some interviews?
Why someone would consider IB post-MBA is beyond me....
Some people are genuinely interested in IB and have zero interest in things like PE....shock horror...
I'll speculate that you didn't partake in a BB analyst class. Also, to assume people are "genuinely interested" in IB when they cemented a career that is completely perpendicular to advisory is wishful thinking.. IMO
To add to that, I know of a number of people who didn't do IB pre-MBA who do it post-MBA and genuinely enjoy it and turn it into a long-term career. Again, to think everybody thinks just like you do is pretty retarded.....
You're right - to think everybody thinks just like I do would be a wildly optimistic assumption..
Chances on Landing a full time position in IB or Trading (No internship, non-target, Alright GPA ) (Originally Posted: 06/06/2017)
Greetings fellows, I have always wanted to break into IB or possibly trading since freshman year I am looking for ways to break in and also hear from you guys whether or not I have realistic chances to break in. A little background about myself, I just graduated from a non-target school Virginia Tech with a degree in Applied and computational Math with a concentration in Finance. I managed to graduate cum laude but I have no relevant internship on file. I have applied for internships at multiple banks and trading firms since sophomore year but I have been miserably rejected every single time. I am about to start a Masters in applied math and statistics at Notre Dame(Semi-target) and join the investment club down there/network but I am still skeptical about my chances. My network is pretty weak at the moment my cousin is Quant at Wells Fargo(Charlotte) and a friend of mine works for an accounting firm on Wall Street. Thanks in advance
Non Target -- so what is that? Walmart or something? If you want a real chance at making it to Wall Street you'll have to make the move to Minneapolis.
more curious of your school choice than will be able to say if you can make it on wall street. want to become a quant as well. did you apply anywhere else besides notre dame? consider minnesotta? You can probably place pretty well from Notre Dame in Chicago if you work on your modeling techniques and showcase you can apply what youve learned
Difficulty Landing F/T Job - Strategies for Grad w/no Internship. (Originally Posted: 01/19/2013)
Average B School (Top 50) May 2012 B.S Finance 3.9 GPA, 4.0 Finance GPA No internship
Have you tried cold calling firms?
What did you do in college?
It's only January. Start cold-calling every smaller firm that is remotely related to what you're interested in doing. Get the list of companies you want to start contacting this weekend and start hitting them on Tuesday. I say the smaller firms because they may need to hire people as needed, instead of on a recruiting calendar. Sending resumes online isn't working, so you need to try to personally connect with people. I suggest contacting a bunch of firms, not just the ones that have job postings...you might be able to get something there anyway.
My interest is in M&A. I have been primarily targeting the larger consulting/advisory firms rather than aiming for M&A through IBD. I'm going to start contacting botiques this week and see if that gets me any responses. I wanted to swing big out of college, but realistically I'm probably a better culture fit at a smaller operation.
Involved myself in the community and held a job that added no marketable finance skills to my resume.
Is an internship necessary for getting a FT offer in ER? (Originally Posted: 11/28/2016)
I'm currently applying to MFin programs at top-10 schools (U.S.) and consider working in ER or AM after the program. My background: 1.5 years in Management Consulting (KPMG, McKinsey), GMAT 750, BS in Economics (with hardcore math).
My question is: How important is it to have an internship before the full-time job in ER? Is it the same way as in IB that only interns get FT offers?
Definitely not. Plenty of people from the industry go into ER; O&G consultants at MBB, tech specialists etc.
Thank you
One thing's for sure: it's a lot easier to get an entry-level job in equity research through an internship. I was recently hired for full-time at a top sell-side shop without interning beforehand, but it wasn't easy. Throughout the whole recruiting process, I only managed to get one ER interview-- it just so happened that I got the job at that one firm. My impression is that they were just hiring to fill spots that they weren't able to fill with interns from the prior summer.
So my recommendation is to intern at an ER shop first. Industry people move into ER for sure (e.g. Sanford Bernstein hires 100% of its analysts from industry or McKinsey), but that's more common for senior roles than for entry-level associates roles.
The comments from 'Fantasic' below are on target.
It will be much more difficult to land a FT ER role if you haven't at least interned in the industry. Keep in mind the pool of ER jobs is shrinking, so most firms can easily hire out of their intern pool for their FT needs. Additionally, they can hire laterals from other firms or even some of your classmates who may have ER experience. The most reputable firms won't need to reach for some unknown quantity. Of course nothing is impossible, but you would be well advised to recruit for ER internships.
got it. thanks
Is it possible to hire into Goldman/similar BB's Tech with no prior internship exp at that bank? (Originally Posted: 10/05/2011)
im currently a 1st year analyst at a large hedge fund working 15-18 hour days. the bonus is great but i want to transfer out to a tech position at Goldman Sachs or similar group where my total comp (along with work hours) will essentially be halved. why? so i can have time to work on the tech start up that a few friends and i have started, but i dont want to halt all income to do it.
my internships in college have nothing to do with investment banking. i was a software engineering intern at microsoft one of the years, which is unrelated to finance. my current job, i work as a quantitative analyst, not so much related to goldman's tech position. i have never interned at goldman nor do i know many friends there.
i know goldman and others hire FT tech analysts/developers right out of their summer intern group. would it be possible at all for an experienced-hire like me to get in? i have a BS in comp sci
For sure you could definitely be considered as an "experienced hire" depending on how many years of technology experience they want for the particular position. I would say pinpoint a position that looks like something you would want/be qualified for, and then tailor your resume and cover letter in such a way that appeals to what they are looking for. Also, if you can try to make a contact at GS or whatever other BB you find an open opportunity, I think that could be helpful! Good luck!
Where your hours will be halved? What is this GS where your hours will be halved? I am confused.
Tech as in the Tech IBD coverage group? Or Tech as in mid/backoffice support?
You can get jobs at both without summer internship experience (probably less so in today's hiring climate) but your hours will be awful unless it's the latter
ya i was referring to the latter -- mid/BO support. how easy would it be to get in if ive already graduated from a target for a year? do they hire any experienced hires or is everyone straight out of college?
How can I better my chance of getting full-time if i cannot get a IB SA this summer? (Originally Posted: 04/02/2007)
I have been looking at this board for a while and I really would like to seek some advices from anyone of you on my situation. Thanks in advance.
I am now a junior studying in an undergrad business school at one of non-ivy target schools (say michigan). I have a high academic credential and had a wealth management internship in a BB last summer. However, this year of i-banking summer analyst search has been really tough to me. I already had quite a lot of interviews with BB and boutique banks throughout this semester. But none of them works out! I admitted that at the beginning I underestimated the competitveness of getting a summer internship in ibank. But now i fully realize it. Also, the fact that I am an international student almost always results in an automatic reject from boutiques.
Anyone has any advice what I should do this summer so that I can still better my chance for the full-time recruitment this fall?? I would very much appreciate that.
which country are you from if I may ask?
which country are you from if I may ask?
are there opportunities in your home country?
If you had a lot of interviews and did not get anything, you need to take a look at what went wrong.
I honestly do not mean to come off as rude, but one thing you can do is improve your command of English.
Hey , I am also an international student with an ok GPA, but really good major GPA, I go to a non target and I am interviewing with trading and investment banks. A friend of mine got a job in san francisco with a small investment bank, he is international also. If you have decent grades, good experience, you should be able to interview. A lot of small boutiques are hiring.
something obviously went wrong in your interviews (and from looking at your post, it was probably your weak communication skills in English). Work on what you think held you back from getting an offer for this summer.
thanks for the comments.
I definitely have to improve my writing skills. But in most of my final round interviews, I always could not perform so well whenever I talked with the MDs. Sometimes I just failed to convince them how bad I wanted to be in ibanking.
Anyway what do you guys think I should do for this summer?
P.S. small boutiques are still hiring? I called up a lot of them. most of them said the recruiting process ended...
Try Duff & Phelps, email your resume to the MD in the city you wanna go to. Do your research and you'll find something. I am currently interviewing with 3 boutiques.
Good luck
why don't you try opportunities back home, leverage your english there rather than trying to compete in an environment that may be too fluent for u.
by the way you write, i can tell your asian. you should leverage your command of chinese.japanese.thai whatever you speak and get a great job over there.
don't be greedy and stay for the depreciating dollar, although i know that's probably your intention.
Some suggestions:
Can you look at oppotunities outside the US? If you are a member of EEU/EEA, you may want to look at links such as efinancialnews.com and the career or employment sections. There are numerous job listings for summer employment (temps) based out of London hq offices, as well as other locations. Granted this will most likely not be FO and not have a formal training program, but will be finance related.
If you have any language-cultural skills in the emerging markets area, use them to sell yourself--even if you intern for little or no pay.
I knew of an analyst here that went to a program his junior summer at Dartmouth-Tucks. I don't know much about it, but it helped him secure an IB position FT without previous internship. He is also an international who studied in the states.
Is there any opportunity to work on campus perhaps in research or any finance related work for the summer??
This advice is basically worth what you pay for it. Good luck to you.
Thought I might add the oil-gas-energy sector out of Houston area is very hot now. If you have fluent language skills related to any oil producing nation, you may want to focus your intern hunting in that part of the country.
What are the chances of getting FT offers from banks that you have already interviewed with? I interviewed with a good amount and was final rounded with a few but did not get any offers. Will they reconsider you for FT or just look over your resume for the next guy?
summer analyst offer obtained without any experience!!! (Originally Posted: 02/19/2010)
Hi! Ive never worked before in my life, except as a junior administrative staff in a very small structure for a month.
I managed to get into summer internships at Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan in Investment Mgt, mainly because I have great academic results and was both brillant / lucky at interviewing.
Ive no experience whatsoever; do you think Im really doomed? or can I still get an offer? What should I do to compensate such a lack of experience?? thanks
I am confused. You state "I managed to get into summer internships at Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan in Investment Mgt" but then ask the question "or can I still get an offer?"
I think he means FT offer. If you are quick on the uptake and work hard, you will have no problems getting a return offer.
hey that's awesome! Congrats for the offers.
You might have to be very professional in case you have never worked before. GS or JPM is not like doing an important work at college. It's much more than that. Make sure you are keen on the job and work as hard as ever
Applying for FT after no summer offer (Originally Posted: 09/19/2010)
If someone summers at a bank and doesn't get an offer for full-time are they ineligible to reapply for a FT position at the same firm? Is it possible to not get an offer, apply, have different groups read the resume and interview and get an offer
Very unlikely. Moving across groups usual happens through networking or during the last two weeks of the internship where some of the interns are invited by other desks for interviews.
Even an intern in ops who was trying to network with a salestrader was told that he should apply for FT Sales but that he needed to get an offer from his division.
Previous experience for SA (Originally Posted: 07/30/2017)
Hi everyone, it's shluhenshtrasse here.
I've been reading WSO for quite a while now and would like to thank all the contributors for the invaluable effort they put in with their work – WSO community helped me to figure out what I actually want to do and how do I 'get there'.
I am a second year undergrad student at a London target uni. Now I've started preparing for application process for SA 2018. One of the things that I am concerned the most is the lack of finance-related experience. Last summer I interned at the biggest commercial bank in my home country, it was a proper paid 10 week internship. Also, during this academic year I was fortunate enough to secure a part-time position of researcher in British Parliament. Looking at some resumes of fellow applicants, I've noticed that some of them did like 3-4 internships, chaired school finance society, uni society, had a return over 10000%, traded with their own money and did some other bs.
So my question is – how actually important is your previous work experience and does it really matter for SA?
A lot of people overstate their internship experience so do not worry about that, you'll be fine. I once saw this guy on LinkedIn with 20 2-month internships and he did trivial jobs like being a receptionist and whatnot and wrote on his resume "front office representative" or whatever the fancy term is for receptionist lol. A lot of people also work as coordinators at some kind of event (literally directing people where to go) but they write on their resumes as if they organized the damn thing. But on the other hand, I met people with just one internship or none at all that got SA spots. So don't worry about it, best of luck to you
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