Should I just end it all?

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Another SA here who didn’t get a return. I get what’s been said, not the end of the world, could be much worse, still opportunities, use it as motivation to keep going etc etc. Sure, but at this point I have nothing. Have to use the money I made to pay for school. Don’t really have any support, I’m just exhausted at this point after grinding so hard to be thrown back out to recruit during a recession. Don’t see the point to live like this.

Feel like complete shit as I hustled really hard just to get the role and the most that came out of it is really just slightly less loans I have to take on for the coming year (a lot of loans in the first place too). If anything I feel like it’s worse than getting a summer offer in the first place as now any other FT spot is going to first thing ask me if I got converted and I’ll look like shit.

Anyway not even sure why I’m typing this all of it out. Maybe a last cry for help or second thoughts before I end it all. Who knows, I’m sure that one guy whose been shitting on these interns all day will be here to push me to make the move.

Comments (49)

 
Most Helpful
Aug 7, 2020 - 9:34pm

Do not take your life over this man. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. I can't imagine what you're going through, but I have had people close to me take their own lives. PM me if you want to talk, or reach out to any of your friends and I'm sure they'll make time to talk with you. You are more valuable than some stupid logo-aligning job.

Array
 
  • Prospect in Other
Aug 7, 2020 - 9:41pm

I don’t know you, but I can guarantee that I know your life is worth far more than a career. If you need to talk, reach out to someone. If you’re the age of a SA, your story isn’t even written. Not even the prologue. Please talk to someone if you need to.

 
  • Investment Analyst in PE - Other
Aug 7, 2020 - 9:44pm

You did an IB internship, you’re very obviously qualified to do a whole load of roles. Clear your head and if you decide it’s too hard to do IB again then re-adjust your path.

You can absolutely kill it given what you’ve already shown you can do.

Array
 
  • Prospect in Other
Aug 7, 2020 - 9:52pm

It's not worth it. It's not worth it. It's not worth it. I'll say it a million times if I have to for you to understand. Take a step back and look at the bigger picture. You're very, very young and you have a long life ahead of you. This is a temporary setback, a small block in the road for you. You'll come back stronger and you'll accomplish so much and be so successful. Don't let this setback ruin everything. It's not worth it.

People love you, they care for you. I've never met you, and I likely never will, but even I was drawn to your situation to type out this response. I'm sure that you have people in your life that would be devastated if you hurt yourself.

No matter how you feel, call 1-800-273-8255 ASAP.

 
Aug 7, 2020 - 10:22pm

Posting this under my actual username so that you can through my post history and verify if you wish.

I didn't convert my summer internship and came back with a great IB offer and then PE then off to Harvard / Stanford / Wharton business schools, and now the skies the limit.

This is temporary, and you've already done so much. You're already in the 1% of college students who had an IB internship, which puts you ahead of 99%.

You can do this, and there's a lot of good times ahead. PM me if helpful, no questions asked.

Array
 
  • Prospect in IB-M&A
Aug 11, 2020 - 8:59am

Dang man, congrats for turning it all around after a hard start.

OP this guy has a great point and shows a great example. Yeah we’re going through a recession - but what do you think happened to people in 2008-2010? Many survived, many people found other high finance jobs, etc.

Look into hedge funds/PE/VC/etc. and you’ll find something if you grind. Keep shooting for IB too. If you push through then you WILL find something. Worst case scenario = work in a REPE firm for 2 years —> top bschool —> back into IB.

Know what killing yourself will do though? It’ll decrease your chances of working in IB to 0%. Personally I have had many suicidal thoughts in my past after a rocky childhood. I ALWAYS reason with myself and realize that ending it all would not solve the problem, but would instead stop me from solving it. There are people who WILL miss you, people who love you; they are people who need you. Don’t take your life over something this small - it feels like it’s your whole life right now, but 10 years down the line you will be extremely grateful for the lessons you learned during one of the darkest periods of your life as you turn it around and end up on top.

 
  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Aug 11, 2020 - 9:08am

Gj pushing through and good on you for helping OP. Though, I dont know about this:

Prospect in IB-M&A:

Worst case scenario = work in a REPE firm for 2 years --> too bschool --> back into IB.

Yes, it's good to be open to other career options and there are multiple paths to get to one's goals, but the expectation that the "worst case scenario" is doing REPE and getting into a top b-school is just unrealistic. REPE is also a competitive (and attractive) industry, and a top b-school is also not guaranteed. This isn't to say that OP doesnt have a good shot but if you set yourself up thinking that is the worst possible scenario, it might just lead to disappointment (like in this case).

Array
 
  • Prospect in IB - Gen
Aug 7, 2020 - 10:48pm

I'm not writing this for sympathy, because I don't want any. Only to help encourage you

Towards the end of my senior year, my parents noticed something was going wrong with me. When they asked me to help get screws for them, or other chores I was failing to do it accurately. Took me to the doctor and they found out I had a degenerative eye condition. The doctors were hoping it would not get worse, but it did and my very first week of college I was booked to have an eye operation done. Here I was looking forward to start my days at college, and now all my classes had to be dropped and shifted to online. My advisor encouraged me to even take a gap semester (but being stubborn I refused but did lighten my schedule). I assumed that the operation would only require a short recovery and I would be quickly back to normal. Well I was wrong, on both counts. For 2 months I had to be in near darkness and was constantly wearing sunglasses. Yes, as my friends were having fun in college I was at home unable to even turn the light on or go outside. And the pain... My eyes felt like they were on fire at nights. It completely destroyed my sleep schedule. I would try to sleep but just couldn't ..Oh and the vision. My vision stopped degrading in one eye, but the other eye had to have another operation some months later (but that's another story). About this time my chronic skin problems started to flare very badly. Rashes that would crack and bleed developed. Other areas were incredibly dry, and could not be fixed even with moisturizers. I had had it before in isolated areas, but this was more widespread. It was so bad I could not even take a shower because I was in great pain. I had to bathe using a bucket method. It took about a year before I could start using a shower again. While the condition has improved over time, it tends to flare up at nights, which leads to difficulty sleeping. It's not uncommon for me to have broken sleep due to this. It also tends to flare up in the heat/sweat. Due to this I'm unable to go outside much, even though I used to enjoy the outdoors. Even when I am with people (in say an AC building), I am very self conscious for obvious reasons.

Needless to say my social life over these past few years is at almost a halt. I've met a couple friends mostly through online study groups, and that's about it. Don't even talk to me about girls - complete 0. I was actually starting to get back on campus more regularly but then this COVID thing happened, so here I am again in isolation.

Professional life? Well I almost had a local internship lined up but then COVID happened and that blew up. Been networking for next year and hopefully can land something. Definitely very stressed. My parents have given a lot financially for my health related expenses in the past few years and I want to pay it back to them. I can't even begin to say how bad it feels to be so dependent at the moment.

My perspective on everything I just wrote:
Well it sucks. I'm not going to try to spin it any other way. But I know for my vision I can see well enough to type this without a problem (granted I am an inch or two away from my large screen). I know there are some degenerative eye conditions where there is no "operation". It's a downward trend to blindness and that's the end of it. My skin condition while very bad technically isn;t the most extreme version of that condition and as I said things have improved some (although not great). My parents have been fairly supportive during these times.

I am NOT trying to say that I think the above every second and I'm not depressed. Believe me, I'm depressed a ton. But trying to see the few positives in life and having a hope that the future will be better is what will get you through and has helped me as well. I wouldn't consider myself anywhere hardcore, but some religious music can be pretty comforting. Can recommend you some songs if you want. Has helped me to push through.

TLDR PLEASE DO NOT KILL YOURSELF, OTHERS ARE GOING THROUGH DIFFICULTIES TOO. WE'RE ALL IN THIS JOURNEY OF LIFE TOGETHER :)

Array
 
  • Prospect in IB - Gen
Aug 11, 2020 - 1:58pm

Some starters:
"You're gonna be OK" by Bethel Music
"Worn" & "I have this hope" by Tenth Avenue North (two different songs)
"Oceans" by Hillsong

Array
 
  • Prospect in ER
Aug 7, 2020 - 11:58pm

Inspiring comment above. And to OP, please realize that this depression and despondency WILL PASS.

Don’t let one or two bozos who decided to hire some other intern instead of you define you. There are literally tens of millions of people who are disappointed at a professional outcome, or who “failed” in their first job or internship and who then went on to lead incredibly successful and happy lives… And you can absolutely be one of them.

Take a few days to decompress, figure out what you think you want to do, whether it’s in the same field or a different one, and pursue it with vigor and passion… Just having a drive will keep you busy, focused and will fill you with hope.

As long as you continue to keep working hard and preparing, the fact that you did not get asked back to this job will NOT prevent you from getting another great job.

 
  • Intern in IB - Ind
Aug 8, 2020 - 12:03am

PLEASE DO NOT KILL YOURSELF OVER A STUPID FUCKING JOB

There are many solutions, please do not take your life over some stupid fucking bank. You are a valuable person with an immense amount of ability, just to get a job on Wall Street or in banking is proof you are more able and intelligent than 90% of the population, it would be a waste of a soul and talent to do this, plus think of your family that loves you. Please let me know if you need someone to talk to, I can message you or we can call through a blocked phone number, I do NOT care how we speak but please do not take your life, it is NOT worth it. I am praying for you.

Array
 
Aug 8, 2020 - 12:56am

As far as money, you're more than qualified for many roles that will pay enough for you to live (e.g. FP&A)

Array
 
  • Analyst 2 in HF - EquityHedge
Aug 8, 2020 - 7:46am

I come from a poor family and was extremely levered coming out of school. I didn’t convert my summer internship at a bank either (nepotism - role was given to build a client relationship), at a small middle market shop... okay okay I’m coming from a non target, I have no offer from a small shop, and I’m in serious college debt. At that moment, I realized two things - 1) I had nothing left to lose and 2) this is my moment to show myself and others who I truly am. I ended up calling over 50 people I knew who helped me dig myself out of the hole I was in, and I ended up at a large global bank doing M&A. I literally cried when I got the offer because I knew I had not only done something very difficult, but I had actually executed a generational social mobility shift. If I can do it, literally anyone can. Now at a hedge fund and am happy to connect / help you directly

 
  • Associate 2 in IB - Ind
Aug 8, 2020 - 10:29am

I didn’t convert my junior year summer in the financial crisis and ended up out of banking for several years. I took the circuitous path back via MBA years later and ended up at a top BB / EB where I’ve been for three years.

Honestly the job kinda sucks and everyone knows it but it pays handsomely. If you are still committed to the path you can find your way back eventually. I would recruit for consulting roles in your shoes and / or consider one of those tech boot camps that are touted so highly.

Array
 
Aug 8, 2020 - 10:38am

Brother - I get your feeling. Things usually never go as planned and the beauty of this whole process is figuring out how to overcome the challenges.
First: you need to get yourself into a better place mentally. Take a break. Don’t open WSO, go and do some fun things so you feel again the enjoyment of life.
Second: don’t worry too much when or if they ask if you converted to FT. It’s all about crafting a story. Believe me, there’s +100 legitimate reasons why internships don’t convert to FT. You’ll come up with a good reason.
Third: this is just a small bump in the road. You just will have to adjust and go from there. There’s plenty of paths that can lead you back into the role you want. Again it is all about figuring out what’s the best path for you.

I know things can look dark right now, but trust me, things do and will get better.

"Drill, Baby, Drill" - Sarah Palin
 
Aug 8, 2020 - 6:25pm

I often feel this way as well. Many people try to logic you out of your desire to kill yourslef, not realizing that the problem is that you're just feeling so much pain and pressure that you just want the suffering to end.And then life kicks you again you just want to step off the mortal coil and stop waking up to the shit. Been there. Many of us have. So you need to get help to address the pain directly. You need a friend /family support group. You need people around you that know you're going thru some stuff right now and need their help. Look for somethings that anchor you. Exercise, church, etc. You need to CREATE a life worth living.

For what it's worth, most of us on this board didn't (and still don't) have a smooth and easy path. Your situation is better than most! Hell, you got a SA job. Well done. Many people on this board did not even get that far. You need to take it into your heart and mind that you ARE qualified enough to get that internship and that someone will eventually hire you for a job. Use the discontentment to fuel your further studies and keep you focused on grinding, and you may get another IBD role.

And if you don't get a FT IBD role... so what? IBD isn't blowjobs and rainbows. It's a mean, difficult, taxing job. There's plenty of other jobs out there - you just need to go find them. I was rejected from all consulting jobs I applied for despite making final rounds and superdays at multiple top-tier firms. My life worked out ok in the end anyway. My younger brother wanted to be a strategy consultant too. When he got rejected he became an entrepreneur and pitched a local business that he could grow a new vertical for them, and they gave him a commission-based job to do that. He was successful at it, made bank, and then took the expereicne and parlayed it into tech entrepreneurship. He just sold his tech company for ungodly sums and is taking a year off to travel the world. Don't get hung up on IBD as some sort of one-itis be-all end-all career because it's just a fucking job anyway. If you grind, maybe you get in. If not, come up with a plan B and a plan C. You can do it. Many others have, so why not clearly-qualified you?

 
Aug 8, 2020 - 6:37pm

Perhaps listening to David Goggins' life story, Can't Hurt Me, may help. Some say he's a braggard and a hardo, but I think he is present and open about his own suffering, and there's lessons to be had in seeing what he did to overcome his pain.

He had an awful childhood, full of family violence, abuse, racism, etc. He had nothing and no-one. He heard of some MIL guy, and connected with him, and got in his head a vision of what a real badass looks like. Then he went home to try to mold himself into one. And he failed (at least in his mind). He dropped out of SEAL training, served a couple of years in a role that wasn't for him, and then basically quit the MIL and became a 290lb exterminator in civilian life. His life was shit. He thought of himself as a loser.

So he got present with the need to suffer, and that suffering was going to be his reality for a long, long, long time. And he 'embraced the suck' and the pain. He dropped 100 lbs in 3 months and qualified to go to selection again. He had many setbacks there that would have made 99% of people quit but he didn't. He built a mental shield that could withstand and even trhive in suffering. And he made it through, became a SEAL and served. Later in life, he became an endurance athlete, running ultramarathons as if they are nothing.

Someone coming from a position of such deep pain surely would have ample opportunity to mentally collapse and take their life. But instead he took that deep, profound pain, and used it to shape himself.

I've been suicidal most of my life. So I identify with you. DM me any time. But know that this is just your mind fucking with you. It wants to collapse and give up. You need to instead master it. You need to make it your bitch. You need to tell your mind to go pound sand because you're going to get thru and do your thing, full stop. Your thoughts are illusions, don't listen to them.

 
  • Intern in IB-M&A
Aug 8, 2020 - 7:16pm

I know somebody said this above, but I love this part of WSO. As toxic as some of these threads can be, this is an amazing community

Array
 
Aug 8, 2020 - 8:33pm

Another previous SA here who didn’t get a return offer - it was a blessing in disguise. It is very difficult to see in the moment but you need to trust the process and understand that everything happens for a reason.

Please pm me if you want to talk. However I thought my life was over and had extremely similar feelings - uselessness etc

 
Aug 8, 2020 - 9:13pm

You experienced an SA program where most others fail to even get a spot. You can leverage this for other offers. Should everyone applying to SA failing to get a spot end it all? No. You didn’t, and you got an SA position. Move forward. If everyone seeking SA positions did that, WSO would be a graveyard.

 
Aug 8, 2020 - 10:58pm

PM me if you just want someone to chat with who wont judge you whatsoever. I'll even send you some funny jokes :)

Lots of inspirational stuff on here that covers everything I could think of, so just wanted to put out there that even though I never met you, I got your back. Please reach out if you need to and I beg of you not to do anything permanent.

I know the feeling of being absolutely broken by something. It wasn't the job hunt, but it was a loss that was so surprising and significant that I literally could not imagine that it was really happening. Everything seems so much darker, like the world has gone pitch black. Not really like the color, but more like the empty space between stars. Everything gets so much harder, even the simplest stuff like making a sandwich can seem like a herculean task. I feel like this is the type of feeling that results more from a life sucker punch rather than a slow burn. But believe me, you can come out of it.

Please don't pin your happiness and self-image to your job. You are so much more than that. I know a lot of people love to talk about prestige and stuff, but at the end of the day, it is your relationships that matter more. The relationships with friend, family, etc. That is what makes us something, and being something is quite amazing in my opinion (so much better than nothing). These relationships and experiences with other people in life are what shape you into you. There is no mold set for you on day one. You are a person, and that is so much greater than a fucking linkedin title. People on their deathbed rarely ever wish that they put in more hours at work when they reflect on life--instead, most people wish they had more time with their loved ones. This is the stuff that matters at the end of the day. It is simply not worth to give all of that up over a job.

Also shout-out to the good parts of WSO. Been on here for a few years and seeing kindness like this is my favorite thing on this site. I fucking love when people rally like this.

Dayman?
 
Aug 8, 2020 - 11:31pm

Your job/work is not your life. It doesn’t not determine your value.Don’t end your life over this man. One of my best friends commuted suicide in high school; suicide doesn’t end suffering, it only pushes your suffering onto other people ( friends, family etc) be sad for a couple of days and use that as motivation. Best of luck

 
Aug 9, 2020 - 2:37am

God gives his toughest battles to his strongest soldiers

Many interns were not able to convert due to low projected deal flow in the projected future. Be open to using your skillset to applying to a broader range of corporate roles. If you can get the IB internship, you are even more attractive of a candidate coming out of it, and re-recruiting for future roles

Stay strong, and know that life and career success is definitely not linear. For many of us, the beginnings were slow, and the career growth was parabolic later on

 
Aug 9, 2020 - 10:29am

Dude your chances are not over...grab a corp finance job, any job and retry for IB via MBA. Or go Masters in Finance and reapply for analyst FT positions. You got options.
Don't let this get to you and use it as a painful reminder to do better all around next round.
Go exercise, read, sleep but by all means your life isn't over man. Head up.

 
Aug 9, 2020 - 10:52am

Bro, Please do not harm yourself. This is in the end is likely going to be the best thing that happens to you as you will come back stronger and sometimes serendipitously go down a path that actually better fits you and your long term success. The latter happened to me. You are a very young guy, the amount of perspective you will gain in the next 10 years will amaze you - so stick around for it.

A lot of banks are not converting folks or are giving offers and then rescinding them (Scotia)! So you could have very well gotten the offer and still lost the job.

The voice inside your head is an asshole, we all have this asshole inside our head pushing self doubt and “compare monkey” mindset. Please download and read the book “10% Happier” about the Good Morning America news anchor who had a meltdown on live TV after the asshole voice in his head took over.

Also, I would visit the UCLA mindfulness center and practice some very simple breathing and mindfulness techniques : https://www.uclahealth.org/marc/

Best of luck to you

 
Aug 9, 2020 - 11:03am

I'm sorry if I'm not being empathetic here but I'm just surprised at the thought that a human being would consider killing himself only because he didn't get into the most exclusive and highest paying career in the modern world. You people seriously lack perspective. Okay dude, you may have to work a slightly less prestigious job. I know, outrageous.

 
Aug 9, 2020 - 11:22pm

Don't pressure yourself too much. Success isn't overnight. Sometimes we want things our way asap but that's not how life goes. When one door closes, another opens. So evaluate your work performance and see what needs to be improved. Please always look at the optimistic side of life, I swear there are far greater things waiting for you, just keep going. Also, true happiness isn't measured in sucess or career alone. So don't be too hard on youself and enjoy the process of life.

 
Aug 10, 2020 - 2:03pm

Please do not do anything drastic to harm yourself over a job that will be in high demand for your talent for decades to come. To give you perspective of someone that is in the industry, analysts and associates are leaving in droves post-bonus, job or no job, due to how unbearable the work can be at times. There will always be a demand for people that want this life (thankless amounts of >100hr work weeks that make you question your existence).

If you havn't already seen from your internship, Investment Banking is not the be all end all and is just one of many steps towards enriching your business acumen for the long term, but you MUST make sure there is a long term for you.

It is really easy to get wrapped up in the moment and feel like certain shortcomings are the end of the world, but you should make a point to take time away (physically and mentally) from the grind to see things from a third person point of view.

I was from a non-target, didn't get a SA offer, felt the same way as you did, recalled telling myself that "I will make this the best thing that has ever happened in my early career", worked harder/smarter and followed up into a FT offer.

These are tough times and I acknowledge that no one knows fully what you are going through, But I would suggest doing as much as you can to develop a perspective outside of the toxic/one-dimensional view of Finance, stay close to family and friends, and sprinkle in activities that make you happy.

God bless. You will get through this.

Don't break yourself on the way to making yourself
 
Aug 10, 2020 - 3:33pm

Dude, you have no idea how many times I look back and wish I never did IB in the first place. I have lost friendships, missed out on life experiences and had incredibly toxic romantic relationships because of the demands of high finance.

I don’t mean to sound cheesy, but it all happens for a reason. This could be the biggest blessing of your life, it might lead you to the craziest, most fun career. If you end it all, you’d be choosing to turn a normal life experience into failure and letting it define you. I don’t know you, but you’re bigger than a dumb FT analyst offer. I promise you that.

 
Aug 11, 2020 - 1:33am

There are plenty of jobs out there, you don't need to do investment banking. You will easily pay off your loans with most corporate jobs. You can find a cushy corporate job paying 80k out of college and with a smart saving strategy, you will be able to repay off your loans.

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