IB/Finance in Denmark?
Hi All, looking to move to Denmark as a UK citizen, visited quite a few times and love it there honestly. I met my GF there and am looking to move there. How open are danes to hiring foreigners, I don’t speak any danish but am willing to learn. Have a background in accounting/AM & PE as well as a MFin. Don’t know if this matters but I’m also muslim (not strict though) and I know that the current danish government is very anti migration so does this hold me back whatsoever? Only asking as I’ve heard some pretty bad stories from people. Thanks in advance for any advice!
Based on previous WSO threads, here are some insights regarding working in Denmark, especially in the finance sector:
Language Requirements: While many firms in Denmark prefer candidates who speak Danish, there are instances where firms are open to hiring non-Danish speakers, especially for more senior roles. As mentioned in one of the threads, some firms are perfectly fine with employees only speaking English and even provide extensive relocation assistance.
Relocation Assistance: Firms in Denmark often provide comprehensive relocation support, which can include assistance with obtaining necessary documentation like CPR numbers, Yellow Cards, and NemID. This can significantly ease the transition for foreigners moving to Denmark.
Cultural and Social Considerations: While the current Danish government may have strict migration policies, the professional environment in finance and investment banking can be more inclusive. Your background in accounting, asset management, and private equity, along with an MFin from LBS, are strong qualifications that can make you a competitive candidate.
Personal Experiences: It's important to connect with professionals who have made similar moves. Networking with individuals who have relocated to Denmark for finance roles can provide valuable insights and help you navigate any potential challenges.
In summary, while there may be some hurdles due to language and migration policies, your strong professional background and willingness to learn Danish can work in your favor. Networking and leveraging relocation assistance from potential employers can also help smooth your transition.
Sources: Do interviews get easier as you get more senior?, What are the chances for an Asian international student for IBD?, Why are banks hiring less qualified candidates?, Immigrant challenges - breaking in to PE/VC, The future of Hong Kong high finance
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Quickly addressing your migration concerns, legal migration from Europe/Americas generally is no problem. Irrespective of religion, people may be irritated of outwardly religious behaviour - there's generally an attitude that religion should be practiced at home.
As the other commenter said, Denmark values culture etc., so it is important to make efforts to integrate into society. This means learning Danish.
That said, I don't think it makes much, if any, sense for you to move to Denmark. You don't speak Danish, Swedish, Norwegian, or Finnish so therefore are of 0 value add to any Nordic corporate. Furthermore, most finance jobs aren't even in Copenhagen, they're in Stockholm.
Even if you learn Danish, it will take you a long time to become somewhat fluent, and even then you can only achieve that through full immersion. But even after you will struggle significantly because you won't realistically be able to communicate at a business proficient level.
It is one thing moving to Denmark if you have some familial connection to it, but just moving because you've been there on vacation a few times and you liked it is not rational.
You need to be realistic. At this stage, or even at a much later stage, you will not be able to make it in finance there.
It would be easier to become senior in banking in London and cover Nordics, and then get parachuted into a local office.
Oh, and you're not even an EU citizen. Further complication with moving.
Better moving to Sweden instead.
Thank you for your response - just to clarify I also have a long term GF there who I’m planning on marrying soon hence another big reason for the move (ofcourse I do really like it there and have visited quite a few times now). It’s great to hear that religion isn’t a big factor I’m not outwardly religious either so not an issue. Regarding learning Danish my understanding was that you can get by with english (at least for the start) and once you’re there you need to take Danish classes, although I guess finding a company to sponsor my visa is the big issue. Ofcourse I’d quite like to integrate as I don’t want to be seen as an outsider & and I think their integration process is pretty solid but the difficult part is getting there in the first place.
I’d be happy moving to Sweden too and then moving from there to copenhagen later on.
Again thank you for your insight and advice much appreciated!
Moving to Denmark and learning Danish whilst there is no problem, but getting into IB without local language skills won't happen as all jobs require fluency in one of the languages I mentioned as, unsurprisingly, the offices out there cover Nordic corporates.
I moved to Denmark couple years ago from a BB in NYC, albeit at a much later stage in my career.
Getting hired as a junior Finance employee in Denmark as a non-Nordic foreigner is incredibly difficult. But if by some miracle you do manage to get hired and get visa/permit situation sorted, then the language won’t be an issue. Most Danes speak English well enough in Copenhagen (especially Frederiksberg), and you could easily live here for a decade without ever learning Danish. Definitely do learn Danish though. It will improve your experience exponentially. I recommend Studieskolen.
Even though Danes can speak English, in a group setting they will still revert back to Danish after a few minutes, because they are not as comfortable speaking it as you may think. In contrast, an upper-class Indian/Paki/Bengali can and will continue every conversation they have in English if they have even a single foreigner in the group. The same cannot be said of Danes. One-on-one, you will rarely use Danish, but you will always have to utilize your hard-won listening skills in a group setting. Just another reason why you should bring up your listening skills in Danish to near-native level ASAP.
The immigration logistics are quite good in Denmark, and much better than the US (where I moved from). After 4 years of working here, after completing language and other exams, you are able to apply for PR. After 9 years, you can apply for citizenship. Clear and straightforward path.
Having said that, don’t move to Denmark. I come from a very similar background as yourself, and your fears and trepidation about moving here is 100% warranted. If your girlfriend is having trouble staying legally in the UK, then move to Ireland together instead.
Your actual religion matters little and less. Do you “look” like a Muslim? Do you have a “Muslim-sounding” name? These are much more relevant questions.
Changing your name can take some of the heat off being Muslim. Believe it or not, having an Arabic name is not among the five pillars of Islam. You can still practice your religion in secrecy. Besides, a hundred years ago, Jews did the same thing to avoid prejudice. So there is precedence for this sort of thing.
Sure, it’s not politically correct advice, but I am making the assumption that improving your personal living situation is more important to you than virtue signaling. The US (or the UK) is a paragon of tolerance compared to a country like Denmark for Muslims.
Sounds like you have a lot in the “pro” column of why you think moving to Denmark is a great idea. Allow me to add to the “cons” column.
God forbid you find any problems with anything in Denmark.
Bring up the fact that Germany (on their southern border) and Sweden (on their northern border) both have Amazon, while Denmark does not, and they will shriek that they are just fine. All is well. “Why do you need to buy so much stuff, huh?”
It will feel like you are in a never-ending Key and Peel sketch where the Latino guy is offered a chair to sit in, but is “just fine, homes! I want to stand. What’s with chairs, anyway?”
Problems that the Danes themselves perceive, they will unironically claim that it is because they as a people are too humble, too kind, etc. Get ready to hear choice phrases like, “oh yes, it is because of our misunderstood kindness”. Again, this is not banter – Danes actually believe this shite. Speaking of banter, Danes have paper-thin skin. They dish it out, but can’t take it. Danes have this smug, self-superior attitude that can really grate on your nerves, and this will take some getting used to.
Denmark is by far the most nationalistic of the Nordic countries, and some of the fiery anti-immigrant speeches given by Danish politicians would make even American conservatives blush. I should add that an anti-immigration stance is the only thing the left- and right-wing parties can agree on. How nice.
As should be apparent by now, anti-immigrant sentiment is rife in Denmark, and “un-Danish” is an insult frequently used by Danes to put down foreigners.
“If it’s Danish, it’s right; and if it’s right, it’s Danish” may as well be the national slogan.
I have lived in America for over a decade, and have never been made to feel like a foreign interloper there. The immigration nightmare in the US is a legislative issue which has little to do with how you are treated in your day-to-day life.
Denmark is the opposite situation. The laws are becoming harsher and more anti-immigrant every year, but as of today, their work visas are still better than the H1B fiasco. However, the real problem is that even if you live in Denmark for 50 years, and speak fluent Dansk, you will always be made to feel like a foreigner.
Having said all this, you may be surprised to learn that I rather enjoy Denmark – particularly Danish girls. I have lived in over a dozen countries, and I’ve found the most success with Danish girls out of all nationalities. No idea why this is, but I won't question any good fortune.
I also love when it rains, and thus am fond of the Danish weather. As for the myriad other issues highlighted in this post, I have found that an 8-figure net worth insulates you from many ills.
If you Google stuff about moving to Denmark, there’s a cloying blog written by an American Karen that is utterly worthless. There’s another biased and outdated website run by a vehemently anti-Muslim American male. However, I would rather give an unvarnished take so that you can go in with both eyes open, and adjust your expectations accordingly.
Thank you so much for the lengthy response! Very useful on my end to hear about your experiences. Fortunately my name isn't muslim sounding (thank god for my parents) but I would say I "look" muslim or at the very least asian/middle eastern. Don't have a long beard or anything so it's not blatantly obvious though.
Honestly, the main reason she's not too willing to come here is she & her family prefer Denmark she also wants to work in the healthcare industry and denmark excels in that regard as a nation. At the same time l've also been keen to leave the UK for a while now and experience something different so it makes sense on the face of it at least.
I understood there was quite a bit of anti migrant sentiment there and Danes would be quite nationalistic. My gf is actually a 3rd generation immigrant herself and still sometimes feels like an outsider. How have you found working there as an immigrant yourself? Are people generally welcoming or do you feel iced out at times? I’ve worked with danes before mostly people who have moved to London and all of them have been very nice (although I’ll caveat by saying the reason they left Denmark was because they said everyone was literally the same there and they actually liked working with a diverse number of people).
Your girlfriend’s experience of feeling like an outsider despite being a 3rd generation immigrant is not an outlier. For that reason and those stated in my post above, I have no desire to stay in Denmark long-term.
However, my own experience in the workplace has been largely positive, and I am well-liked by my colleagues. In more personal settings, people are outwardly friendly enough, but close friendships are reserved for those who have known each other since they were 6 years old. Sure, there are exceptions, but it is folly to put your stock in them.
Since I don’t care about making genuine friends, and prefer casual soft-touch relationships, Denmark has been a great fit for me. Given that you simply want to leave the UK and experience something different, by all means give Denmark a try.
With all due respect, I think you’re overestimating the weight of your religious identity, when you are most likely going to judged off your physical looks/ethnicity straight off the bat. A Muslim from the Caucasus/Balkans with a “Muslim-sounding” name is 100% going to fare better in Denmark than an irreligious South Asian/Middle Eastern person, simply because he’s considered culturally European and physically blends in with them. You seem overly insecure about your association to Islam when really and truly you should be more concerned that you’re initially going to be treated with whatever perceptions they have of South Asian people, even when bending over backwards to come across as non-religious and Westernised as possible - they are well aware you were raised with different cultural values altogether. Your beard length doesn’t make you look any less of your ethnicity and your ambiguous name isn’t going to paint a different picture either. Being thankful that your parents gave you a non-Muslim sounding name is so weird, when they gave you your genetics (the actual problem). Danes are naturally going to be much more open to a white Muslim than a Pakistani apostate, idk why we’re beating around the bush here... That white Muslim can pass as a Dane, whereas you cannot. That's the whole point.
It's highly disingenuous to assume your religion will be the barrier and not your cultural background, I have a feeling people are conflating the two in this thread. I’d consider approaching a major life decision with more scope and rationality. Denmark is nothing like France, Germany, Netherlands, etc. The UK bubble bursts very, very quickly and no amount of watering down your religious background is going to help you because this is not what you are going to be largely judged upon.
Going off their government statistics, it doesn't seem that tolerance in the face of disproportionate criminality is a virtue worth indulging any further.
In many ways I can see why they feel the way they feel. In fact I’d likely agree with a lot of their points because stuff like this just reinforces the stereotype they have, which negatively affects hard working, honest immigrants and makes it harder for those people to come over. I’ve seen it firsthand as my dad is quite open and forward thinking he raised us quite differently compared to others in my community which I am very thankful for. He’s always disliked a lot of the backwards mindset that people have, and as a result taught us what’s right and wrong - I’m still in touch with my culture but equally I understand where some of it is BS.
But one thing I’ll say is those stats don’t really tell the whole story. A lot of these people usually come from not so great socio economic backgrounds, which increases the likelihood of them commiting a crime. Also as mentioned previously, danes are typically quite nationalistic, even if you’ve fully integrated they won’t consider you one of their own which only exacerbates the issue because many of these people will feel like outsiders which again only makes people more likely to commit crime.
Funnily enough, first gen immigrants also don’t even commit as much crime as you’d think it’s usually second generation immigrants who already have nationality so the issue isn’t with them itself but rather feeling like outsiders that causes them to group together and rebel. Just my 2 cents on the matter.
lol what kind of Kuwaiti goes to Denmark and commits crime, this seems really weird of a statistic?
Is it still so backwards in Denmark? In Sweden, integrated immigrant parents would give Swedish names to their children, but not a widespread practice anymore. Plenty of foreign background (immigrant parents) children (particularly Chinese and *Iranian*) who work in finance in Stockholm. Indians too.
Once again Sweden excels and Denmark shows itself to be a dump.
Now that I think about it, this is actually a really good point that extends beyond the Danes to Europeans in general. I am of Sub-Saharan African heritage, and a few years ago, when I was interning in London, there were quite a few other interns who spoke my language. Whenever we went out for social events, none of us would speak our African language (I'm being purposefully ambiguous here) in the presence of those who could not understand, because it's viewed as disrespectful in our culture. This is something you only do when you don't want the other person to hear what you're saying. On the other hand, the French, Italian and German interns would speak almost exclusively their respective native languages in front of everyone in social settings. It was honestly very awkward. I remember one time, there were just two French guys sitting at a table with UK, Asian, and African students, and they were the only ones speaking in their native language to each other.
Studied at a danish high school after moving from an english-speaking country - everything everybody on this forum is saying about the difficulty of assimilation is incredibly accurate. To be honest, felt like I was the only one with this experience. But maybe that's just the way this place makes you feel. Nonetheless, I like to think of myself as a quite outgoing person, but Denmark made me feel ostracised socially and culturally. Maybe because it was high school; maybe because I was the vast minority in terms of background; I'm not really sure. But yeah, it's a rough place to integrate, and you better get used to feeling like an outsider and being a forever 'international'
Let me say though, if you're TRULY committed to selling yourself to the Danish culture, (I certainly wasn't) you can make it work. But if this isn't your attitude, you got to accept the aforementioned possibility. In short, Denmark's amazing... for the Danes.
Interesting you say this, a lot of Danes I know have the same problem but the opposite way around in the UK. They’re always confused on why people are so talkative and loud here.
I’d say I’m generally somewhat reserved with people who aren’t close friends (and these are mostly friends I made in high school tbh) so that actually works for me.
What makes Denmark so difficult to integrate into in your opinion?
the only time I experienced racism in my life was while I was studying in denmark. despite having features that could pass for a native dane—extremely fair skin, blue eyes, and blonde hair—I faced daily comments about my greek/italian/spanish heritage. people would often joke about how the education system in my country is a joke and say that we only party, do drugs, and get drunk. ironically, the opposite is true. very classist too imo.
It will be tough, but 100% possible. A good number of people in MBB, UM Asset Management / PE shops are foreign. They will not care if you are Muslim. May require a bit of networking etc
They are probably Danish of foreign origin i.e., their parents are immigrants.
By foreign do you mean people outside the EU too though? Freedom of movement makes it pretty easy for people inside the EU to come work there, on the other hand as I’m based in the UK I’ll need someone to sponsor my visa. Based on my background AM probably makes sense for me or an infra PE firm.
Denmark is a super homogeneous insular place. I ordinarily wouldn’t recommend it for foreigners.
That said, I note you do renewables. that’s the one place Denmark is fairly globally oriented. There will be jobs at CIP, Orsted, the pension funds and even one or two of the banks / Advisory shops that do renewables globally and will have roles and probably even welcome internationals.
Thank you for your advice! I noted this too, and I find they are much more open to people from different backgrounds there, browsing on linkedin I’ve seen people go from financial controller roles directly to PE which surprises me as that wouldn’t be possible here.
You’re correct i currently work in the infra PE space although my role isn’t completely transaction oriented. I cover quite a few sectors renewables being one of them, but also transport, utilities, social infrastructure and now tech infrastructure like data centres, cell towers etc. I’m a research analyst so I essentially provide the business with a top down view of the market and assess which sectors are most attractive, the orignation guys will then underwrite any acquisitions. I do come in on the transactions but more so to give them comfort around assumptions, valuation & some due dilligence on any risks associated with the acquisition based on our view.
You should look at CIP. AIP/PKA, Pension Danmark and even Danske Bank. There’s one decent boutique bank that does renewables too but I can’t recall the name. Alll are small but prima facie would hire your profile.
I can’t emphasize enough what an insular place Denmark is. People don’t realize what an exceptional, global, cosmopolitan city London is until they leave.
> Says he's Muslim
> Has a GF
> What?
Literally said I’m not practising mate, I’m not that strict and FYI we don’t sleep together or are ever even fully alone together (i.e. we’re only together in public).
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