55 Comments
 
  1. Going to be just dependent on how many interns accept returns. 
  2. Yes, but also dependent on how the market looks in a year. I would say that the question on whether to lateral or not should depend on your goals. If your goal is to stay in banking, I would consider a lateral, but would not if goal is to leave for PE as if you are good it's very possible to get a UMM/MF exit from UBS.
 

I think M&A is just a different level of bad. Every single day the bathrooms near M&A have multiple people crying. There are multiple analysts, including first-years, who quit with nothing lined up, The only people who stay are internationals because they are made to because of their visa status. It is the hell on Earth and everyone who has left, whether that is for a job or not, says their quality of life has improved. 

 

Hey, as someone who is not in the industry yet/starting recruiting next year, can you please explain why people are crying? I get the 80-100+ hour work weeks, and I can’t pretend to even understanding how stressful and tiring that might be, as well as how much it pushes you physically and mentally. 
I did do one month (yes I am aware one month is NOTHING compared to years as an analyst, including the vast vast difference in stress from studying for my target college exams vs FT in IB) of sleeping 4 hours a night every night at one point when I was beyond cooked at university, to get back on top with my degree and recruiting prospects on the line (if I hadn’t pulled it off it would have been curtains - no IB for me), and found that once you get used to it, it can be a new normal you can tolerate. Not indefinitely of course - but earning >100k comp and knowing that there’s an end in sight (as OP said you can lateral or genuinely make it to LMM/MM PE etc), doesn’t the struggle get somewhat justified and manageable? Again, clearly not as people are crying and it’s super tough, so can someone from the inside explain why the reality is not the same as in theory? 
 

Btw - this is not mean to antagonise or belittle or in any way talk down on these people, and I’m fully aware that my experienced are nothing near the stress and mental/physical fatigue felt by an analyst, and clearly if you can break into IB and stomach recruiting/keeping up an excellent GPA etc then crying is a sign things are very tough. I’m just genuinely not filled in and would like anyone to explain it to me. 

 

It’s not “just long hours you get used to.” It’s systematic abuse by evil and toxic people.

In my experience: verbal abuse was constant and personal. MDs, EDs, Ds will scream and curse at you in front of the whole team or over teams while you’re already running on fumes. 100+ hour weeks stacked for weeks on end. Sleep is 3–4 hours if you’re lucky. Sometimes, you’re told to lie about your hours so the bank can pretend everything’s fine.

One month of 4-hour nights in undergrad is nothing like two years of sustained sleep deprivation, humiliation, threats, and physical decline with zero control. The place is inhumane.

The cumulative damage after two years is what really fucks you. It creeps up until something permanent settles in. Working at UBS directly caused a chronic health issue I still deal with.

Would not recommend UBS IB and would recommend you do extreme diligence on any IB group at any bank.

 

The people are the real issue. The hours would be fine if we were doing deals and the people were better. The people are all miserable and want to pass that misery onto others. Verbal abuse, humiliation, lack of any decency or kindness really adds up over the 2 years.

 

Protected Saturdays is what the MDs say to protect themselves and make themselves feel better. They really don’t care about you like at all, and often blame juniors for their own lack of success

 

“Hi guys, my name is Victor Swezey and I'm a reporter at Bloomberg News. I cover workplace issues like layoffs, working conditions, labor unions, etc. Lately, I've been interested in UBS, so naturally I've been spending a lot of time on here. I just put out this scoop on the bank's RTO policies: "UBS Americas Brings Junior Bankers Back to Office 5 Days a Week"

I'd love to hear more about what's going at UBS, and I'm happy to talk on background/anonymously. If you want to chat, feel free to reach out at vswezey at blooomberg dot net or on Signal at victor2001.82”

-Vswezey

 

Yes. Re-recruiting could have left me with no IB job. UBS still pays street or close to it if you are top-bucket and there are still good exits if you are top bucket. My answer likely would be different if I were in M&A or another of the hellish groups.

 

Group dependent. Generally there is a high connection of bad culture and ratio of H1B's as all the American's end up leaving the bad groups. Within H1B's, they all work each other to an even worse extent. The worst teams to work in are those where everyone is an H1B.

 

Group and people dependent. Mentorship is really something that ends up happening informally when you work with the same few people commonly on deals. There are still good people on the platform, hard part is both finding them and managing to keep working with them. Quality of life as a junior at UBS varies drastically based on who your seniors are.

 

If you could tell MV or IB leadership one thing, what would it be?

 

A boss don’t get judged by the stories he tells. He gets judged by the territory he controls. When the map keeps shrinkin’, sooner or later the crew starts wonderin’ if somebody else should be wearin’ the suit

 

Very happy. I have enjoyed some of the people I have worked with and have learned a lot. With that being said, the bank is clearly declining as a platform, and team culture / WLB is somehow getting worse as deals dry up. A lot of the strong seniors seem to be leaving and the new hires are not exactly rain makers. If you are a top-bucket analyst, UBS remains a fine place to be for the short-run both in pay and exits. I am not sure that is still true for anyone except the top ~10-20% of analysts with those in the middle or bottom being underpaid and struggling to exit.

 

Don't lateral into most UBS groups. M&A, FIG, M&T, run. No exits, toxic culture, nonexistent WLB. LevFin works if you want private credit. Industrials has decent PE exits. CR has solid culture and WLB with decent exits. Tech, ECM, and Sponsors have okay culture and WLB but with real downsides: Tech is clearly declining and their exits will likely be weak, Sponsors had recent layoffs, ECM has zero exits despite being solid. Avoid everything else.

 

It's a 2-year analyst program. A2A promotion is basically automatic if you're mediocre or better, the bar is very low. There are some truly terrible A2A's who can't even do basic financial models. The only people who remain at UBS as A2A's are those who couldn't lateral to a bank or find a buyside role. Theoretically a 3rd year analyst exists only because the group doesn't want to promote you but also can't be bothered to fire you. Either this person above doesn't work at UBS or they're just making shit up.

 

Anonymous Monkey:

It's a 2-year analyst program. A2A promotion is basically automatic if you're mediocre or better, the bar is very low. There are some truly terrible A2A's who can't even do basic financial models. The only people who remain at UBS as A2A's are those who couldn't lateral to a bank or find a buyside role. Theoretically a 3rd year analyst exists only because the group doesn't want to promote you but also can't be bothered to fire you. Either this person above doesn't work at UBS or they're just making shit up.


Thank you sir. Good to know

 

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