Lifestyle post promotion to VP?
Hi there, am an SO to someone in banking. He's one year out to promotion to VP. He keeps telling me it will get "better". Not sure what it means and I would really like specific details. He still works to 9/10/11 longer most nights. Still working most weekends.
I asked him what it'll be like post promotion and he said getting home round 7:30 with maybe some work later at night/weekends he can do from home. I'm not sure what that means exactly--exact details on the level of consistency in my live would be helpful? He'll be home at 7:30, can spare an hour and then will have 3-4 more hours of work? Will it be like that most weekdays? Will he still be working from home half the day or more, most weekends? How often will it be volatile where he's working to 2-3 am in the office again again? Any other details you guys think may be helpful..
I'm trying to figure out long term what this means. I have been with him through this analyst/associate years but I am pretty wiped out. He insists he wants to stay in banking.
Thanks A.M
I'm in a similar spot to your SO so I can give you some guidance, albeit every shop is slightly different and I don't know the specifics of his role. Generally most days I leave the office around 7, home for dinner with the wife, watch some TV together and then from 9 or 10 onwards I'm in my study either checking work from the juniors or reading up on industry news or preparing for meetings the following day. The late work at home is not that intense. In saying that, if there's a live transaction I'm in deal mode and all bets are off - I could be the office with the whole team jamming until 3am every day of the week inc weekends. Unfortunately that's the nature of the industry, you just have to accept it. I'm lucky in that my wife doesn't have any issues with me not being home during those periods, she would prefer me to do my job well and be successful because it makes me happy. The best thing you can do for your SO is to be supportive during those busy times. If you make it hard for him by guilting him for not being home, I guarantee it will cause problems for your relationship, because the industry is already hard enough as it is and he will be ultimately forced to make a decision between his girl or his job. Maybe just give it some perspective and imagine how you feel if he was in the military and away for 2-6 months on end in a war zone. The fact he is home most days and on weekends is already a win. Plus ou've already made it through the hard yards, he's not lying when he says it gets better from here.
I guess I've been feeling that I don't get the companionship I need. He makes time to call me for sure but I'm not sure that's enough for a relationship. Showing you care through actions, helping out at home, and what about when we have kids? Will he be around enough for them? All those things matter too.
Does your wife not feel a lack of your presence? Does she feel you're around sufficiently? I am in medicine will have decent hours but don't want to single parent. I want to know he'll be around and I won't constantly feel lonely as I have the past several years. I feel that he isn't able to make time to do the little things to show that.
I'm going to be 100% real with you right now. Trust me when I tell you I understand what you're going through, but it's best to be blunt with you right now.
I hear you from the standpoint that it's hard to understand how demanding a job is unless you're in it. If he's an associate up for VP, I promise you that he right now has one of the most difficult jobs in the entire industry. He's trying to balance impressing Seniors while developing junior staff; it's a very difficult job. I'm sure he's also competing with other senior associates trying to reach VP.
To be 100% real, that man needs you right now. He's on track to be where people would literally kill for professionally. That's not to say your concerns aren't valid, but he sounds like someone who wants to generously provide for his family as we all do.
Judging by your user name, you're his girlfriend not his wife right? Assuming you're his girlfriend right now, I hate to tell you if this guy knows what's good for him your ass is going to get dumped if you don't improve your attitude. It's every man's worse nightmare to get nagged after work no matter what industry they're in. I'm sure you enjoy the money he's bringing in but guess what every benefit has its costs. If you're not willing to make any sacrifices yourself as part of the team then this won't work out. Stop being so needy. If you can't handle delayed gratification and short term sacrifices do him a favor and end the relationship. This is what you need to hear as opposed to what you want to hear.
I appreciate your response. I don't depend on his money. I am a doctor and will have better work hour:pay ratio. I love him for who he is and I miss him not being around. I have sacrificed a lot to be with him the last 7 years and dealt with his absence. I would rather he make less money and be around to spend time with.
I take your point and I am ok with delayed gratification. I just need to know his current work situation is temporary and will improve.
This is an asshole post. You’re making a lot of assumptions. She has every right to be asking these questions. Cut out this bullshit assuming that this guy is a noble saint who just wants to provide for his future family and that she’s a nag. He may care much more about a large paycheck than her.
Her concerns are extremely valid. Is she needy and a nag for asking reasonable questions and wanting to occasionally get to spend time with someone she cares about? I’ve never seen such a presumptuous post. I feel sorry for anyone who has to put up with your attitude. I hope you treat your current or future spouse better than is implied by your “advice.”
If the problem is indeed his actions when he's not working, then you need to tread carefully when you address it. Be honest about how you feel about him not being fully in the moment when you're together, helping you around the house, doing small things to show he cares, etc. Just don't make it about his work because that will drive a wedge.
From my own perspective I try to help out with house chores and do interesting things on weekends. However if I'm in deal-mode there's very little on my mind except work - I find it hard to have basic let alone meaningful conversations about anything except work. On weekends all I want to do is either catch up on sleep or rest watching mindless tv for the few hours I have to myself. Its a temporary phase and my partner leaves me alone during those horror weeks because she understands that this job requires such an intense focus at the expense of everything else in life. Then when the deal is over things revert back to normal and I make a point to do more than my fair share of the housework - because I am always aware of the attention deficit I created. Seems like your partner just needs a bit more awareness of how you feel and needs to make more of an effort to true up the balance, again just be sympathetic when you raise it.
I am not a VP and do not have first-hand insight into what a VP lifestyle is like. I can give you my opinion, but don't want to lead you astray, scare you, or give you false hope.
From reading thread, it seems like the issue is less about your SO's hours and more about the fact that he doesn't "show he cares through actions" when you are together. In my experience, that phrase has been an ex-girlfriend catch all for "I can't articulate what I want, but I want something different".
I would challenge you to be specific with what you are looking for from him when you are together instead of hoping he will start doing something different or assuming he should know what you want. Doing the opposite of both of these things (that is, using nebulous phrases and not being transparent with expectations) is a surefire way to end up in an unhappy relationship.
I would also recommend you not assume he doesn't sacrifice anything for you (#3 from the list posted on the 22nd above). If he is making time to talk to you for extended periods of time on a regular basis during the week, that is a massive sacrifice. As you probably understand, there is always something a junior in finance can be doing. To allocate one's time to something other than work is, in its purest form, a sacrifice. He is sacrificing sleep / career advancement / peace of mind in order to interact with you - you should take comfort in the fact that he values your relationship enough to do that. If I were an associate up for a VP promotion (as I am I would dedicate 100% of my time to ensuring I got the promotion - all else would be second to that.
EDIT - Just as an addendum here: You speak a lot about the things your SO is not doing to better your life, but I'm wondering what some of the things you do to add value to his life are. Obviously not trying to be inflammatory or aggressive whatsoever - I am just curious to hear as I think every relationship is a bit different and I would love to comp what you do against what I've experienced.
Thank you for your thoughts everyone. We broke up yesterday. The final conclusion was there is a difference in long term values and we will never make each other happy. I care a lot about family and he would never be around in that way. Me and family would always come second forever. He doesn't see himself being less intense about work ever. 5 years ago he told me he would re-prioritize in the future but he cannot commit to doing that now.
I feel like I just lost 7 years of my life and a love that I will never find again.
If you really think you lost a love you'll never find again, find a way to make it work. Otherwise, look at it as saving yourself from sticking out another 2-3 years only to go down this same path further down the road. Regardless, there's no need to be overtly dramatic on this site, you won't find the sympathy you're looking for
yeah you're right. Time to move on. I just felt the need to post for closure.
Sorry to hear that. As someone who just completed the VP years, life has gotten better, but there will always be lifestyle sacrifices. That being said, I’d walk away tomorrow if it meant losing my SO. Don’t second guess yourself over this decision; he made it clear what is currently his top priority.
It may suck now, but breaking up is the right call. Ultimately, you can’t change people. Next time find someone whose goals are compatible with yours.
On the bright side, at least you found out now rather than when you were married with kids.
A piece of advice--he may not have a choice but to leave banking at some point. Maybe he's great at his job, but being a great analyst/associate/VP doesn't necessarily translate to being a great director or managing director. At the VP level or below, you're not really responsible for selling anything. You don't bring in deals for the firm. At least, you don't get judged on bringing in deals. As a director or MD, you need to bring in deals. You need to produce meaningful revenues for the firm every year or you'll be kicked out.
It's probably not what you'd like to hear, but most of the kids on here are just that--they're kids. They only imagine that their bosses work less hard than they do. Sometimes that's true, but directors and MDs do different types of work. There is a lot more travelling. You have to see clients in person. I don't know if you mentioned your boyfriend's industry coverage (which sector he covers), but even if he covers tech and lives in San Francisco, he'll have to travel a fair amount. Or if he covers financial services in NY, he'll have to travel a fair amount. And I specifically selected those two sectors and those two cities because if he works in one of those roles in one of those locations, he'll travel A LOT less than if he covers almost any other sector or lives in any other city.
Investment bankers want to deal with C-suite executives which almost universally sit in corporate headquarters. When you're selling something, you go to the customer, so while his work hours may improve slightly as a VP, director and MD, he's not going to be home that often. It's almost 9pm in New York right now, and I guarantee I can call a number of Ds or MDs in the city to come meet me for a drink at this very moment.
In that sense, if he wants to be an investment banker at a major firm for the rest of his career, he's always going to be working in some form or another. Just because he's not sitting at the office looking at spreadsheets or PowerPoint presentations doesn't mean he'll be home. Fortunately, the two of you should be able to afford a nanny.
Once he makes VP, he can lateral at a more senior level to a corporate development or private equity role, but the hours there aren't much better. In short, he's not likely to have a 9-5 job any time in the near future even if he laterals to something related with slightly fewer hours.
theaccountingmajor here's your chance buddy ...
Wow, this thread took us on a ride. Rare for a thread to include real-time closure.
For what it’s worth, I know how it was to be on the other side as an analyst, not an associate/VP. I was in a long distance relationship — we were on different coasts. She was still in college while I was working 80-100 hr weeks. In the end, we broke up, but I learned a lot from it.
She was always telling me I didn’t spend enough time talking to her. I was frustrated because I didn’t have a lot of time to give, but what I did have, I gave freely. I took at least an hour every day to talk to her daily and texted her throughout the day. When I worked 16+ hrs a day, all I wanted to do is sleep or drink (myself to sleep). You also forget that there’s a lot of boring stuff that takes time outside of work (commuting, eating, laundry, etc.), so I felt like I was sacrificing a lot just for that. I also paid for her to fly out monthly while we were in a relationship, which added up to real economic cost. During those trips, I had to prioritize all the little things that had to happen (laundry, etc.) to make time for her. She never noticed those small things.
She was always telling me that if I cared about the relationship, I should leave... but it’s just not that easy to leave IB. The entire time we were together I was paying off student debt. Add to that, the monthly trips, the gifts I bought her, and money I sent to family turned into golden handcuffs. That’s beside the fact that I took literally years of my life to attain that position. Coming from a non-target to IB, it was especially hard for me to “just leave.” It takes time, effort, and luck to find a position in finance doing interesting things with similar pay and better hours. Did I try to leave? Yes, but juggling work, a relationship, and personal stuff made it difficult for me to interview. I have to practice a lot for interviews, so it was only after we broke up that I had enough time to do all that.
The biggest lesson I learned was for the relationship to work, we had to be at similar levels of busy. As a college student, she was just hanging out a lot vs. me working all the time. That imbalance definitely caused rifts, especially with the amount of relationship maintenance she required. Also, I think that I could have done a better job of being positive around her. The people/environment of banking and lack of sleep tended to make me an irritable, impatient, negative person. Often, because I wasn’t doing hobbies or had much of a social life, our conversations turned out to be unloading — not good for a long distance relationship, much less any relationship. She finally “understood” when she graduated and worked in consulting, though we were in different places in our life by then.