Top groups that don't model
I hate modeling. Tired of it.
Whats a great relationship group? Basically a financial sponsors group that doesn't model?
Don't care about exits.
Thoughts?
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JPM LevFin
Have heard this group places lights out. Are you sure they don’t model?
They don’t place well to PE at all (solid for credit) and no they don’t model. Have firsthand experience
WF HG DCM. Sub 65 hour weeks. 0 modeling. Downside (or upside for you) is that it’s in Charlotte.
Media and entertainment groups that don't model like at many BBs are fun.
Always heard that JPM and MS's M&C groups are considered one of the best in terms of exits and experience. Do they not model???
Any chance at getting into this group from MBA? If so, would Duke/UNC be the best bet?
As any intern or FT? The only MBA interns i saw recently were in coverage group, M&A, and lev fin. DCM didnt have any.
Interested in learning more about this group. Does WF have any other similar non modeling groups in other offices outside of NC??
corporate banking
Which team? I interned at Citi CB and we definitely do model. It's debt focussed ofcourse, so similar to private debt / levfin landscape.
Also because of this I got an amazing number of interviews from the above mentioned two teams while recruiting full time.
portfolio management
ECM isn't a relationship group but basically no modeling - GS/MS are top
Anecdotal but have a buddy in a C&R group at a mid BB that does literally zero modeling. He claims that it's similar at most BB's as well
Can you name which one?
Depends your definition of modeling. But most coverage group don’t do it unless u are in GS or Barclays. Top groups with very little modeling work: JPM LF, BofA/ Barclays Sponsors. Top here is defined by deal flow. Exits are good at sponsors because of the relationships with PE firms.
Evercore sponsors?
Really good too but I believe they don’t really have junior bankers. Maybe like 2-3 analysts + associates. Mostly senior relationship bankers.
BofA / Barclays sponsor don’t model??
They do but relative to other groups they prob do the least amount of modeling work.
Can confirm Barclays sponsors group does modeling occasionally
Can confirm that Barclays Sponsors models. Interned in a group that had an overlapping deal with Sponsors and they were pretty much running the model. It's only one anecdotal data point though.
...
Love the question. Best place to work that does the least amount of work. My kind of junior.
MM Tech IB modeling is a joke + none gives a shit.
source: sold companies to Tier1 PEGs with mickey mouse financials (1-year forecast only, was rolling mgmt budget provided by management). Tbh it's more realistic than some of the garbage projections out there.
This is hilariously accurate. Sounds amazing honestly. I had a buddy in MM Tech IB attempt to explain a DCF he did… very stimulating. Love the part where he chooses a PGR out of a hat to assign a company that is growing 100% YoY right now because you can’t model that shit to ‘maturity’ and good luck getting a tangible exit multiple on a small private company.
Bonus Point when he went exit multiple route and how he determined ‘size discounts’, etc.
Lol. Give him a break dude.
https://corpgov.law.harvard.edu/2022/04/20/the-dcf-valuation-methodolog…
Would presume banks that have M&A divisions that execute would get you less modeling in the coverage group. That combined with if the group does a lot of IPOs then you can probably stack your staffing on less-modeling deals. So maybe a tech/healthcare group that does a lot of IPOs?
Now that's what I'm talking about!
Any more insight on these groups?
yo momma's book club aha ayeeee
Any update for 2022? Any good groups to look into for those who want to be a career banker with less modeling work and good growth opportunity?
JPM sponsors? Spoke with someone in the group a few years ago (still there I think) who told me that their job was mostly relationship management.
Yeah, models are terrible in committed relationships.
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