So, this is in follow-up to a recent post here. I'm lateralling into an EB coverage team, top notch team, has done the biggest deals even when the market is underperforming.
The role itself is an open ended role (An/Assc), the team has always mentioned that they will guage where to put me after the end of the interview process. I have done all rounds of interview, received a call from the HR almost confirming it was an offer.
The call went something like this: it was a HR person. We wanted to get some compliance/references checked before we make you the offer. No congratulations, no the team loved you nothing. Then, they dropped it was an Analyst 1 post at the most basic band of salaries. I do not have a chip on my shoulder about starting at this position and that position but from the interviews I had with the team members they somewhat hinted though never confirmed that it's more analyst 3/associate 0, though non-committal. I really do believe I can add value where a fresh undergraduate cannot because I have first hand industry experience and I have seen it translating in client calls + model builds.
Then, I asked him is there any room for negotiation for the title since I understood the team is yet to decide. Then, the HR person went I'm not sure I have to check with the team, we don't want you to start at some title then find out you're not performing.
There are a few points worth mentioning here: I hold an advanced degree (think MD/PHD), plus on my way to finish an MBA (INSEAD/LBS). As some of you might be aware, the MBA summer associate these days have been next to non-existent. I have managed not to take no for an answer and pushed my way into securing this. The only relevant experience I have is 2 no name advisory/boutique PE shop and an EB off cycle internship.
I'm gonna ask some very basic questions here.
- Is it a usual way of HR deploying a negotiation tactic? They also asked me for my compensation history of previous 3 years.
- Is it worth sending the VP (who interviewed me, and at the time when he asked which level do you have in mind, I kept it brief saying an email basically saying I'm flexible to the team needs) an email something along the lines of I am confident I can contribute at An3 level, but ultimately I'm flexible to the needs of the team".
- Is there a risk of me losing the offer by negotiating more?
- This is my first full time offer in the industry and hence any advice anyone would have is greatly appreciated.
Based on the most helpful WSO content, here’s how you can approach this situation:
HR Tactic or Standard Practice?
Should You Email the VP?
"I wanted to thank you again for the opportunity to interview with the team. I’m confident I can contribute at an Analyst 3 level given my advanced degree, industry experience, and the value I’ve demonstrated in client calls and model builds. That said, I remain flexible to the team’s needs and am excited about the opportunity to join."
This approach keeps the tone professional and collaborative while reinforcing your qualifications.
Risk of Losing the Offer?
"I understand the team is still deciding on the title, and I want to ensure I’m positioned to contribute effectively. Given my background, I believe starting at Analyst 3 would allow me to hit the ground running and add immediate value."
This shows you’re advocating for yourself without being confrontational.
Additional Tips:
Ultimately, negotiation is a delicate balance. Advocate for yourself, but remain professional and flexible to maintain goodwill with the team. Good luck!
Sources: https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forum/job-search/negotiating-offer-before-during-and-after-interview-follow-up?customgpt=1, https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forum/job-search/offer-rescinded-after-negotiating-salary?customgpt=1, Employment Dilemma, Offer on Table and Unsure if Consistent with Long Term Goals
Be more specific on the office/country. May vary or change depending of that.
London
This isn't negotiation, they're making a lowball offer because they don't really want you.
What do you suggest I do then? Just accept it and take it?
How many years of full-time work experience do you have? IB/PE/corp fin specifically
You have a PhD and are accepting an analyst 1 position? What?
A Phd does not equate to investment banking experience. Einstein is probably more intelligent than 99% of Associates, and would not get in higher than An1. No level of education equips you for knowing how to model, fast. It's also an employer's market currently, where people with 2+ years of IB experience are struggling to get higher than An1 offers. He's lucky to get an offer at all, frankly.
PhD is worthless in IB though. In US it's even more of a negative than a positive: it shows that you're leaning towards academia, not dead set on IB, plus you're not that young anymore and physically won't be able to grind 100 hour weeks like guys who are 20-25 (once you're closer to 30 and after, it's difficult to function under sleep deprivation, plus the mind is getting less sharp and it takes more time to do things).
yeah they are trying to rip you off buddy. The team is in it too probably.
No they're not? Nobody doing a Phd is working 14 hour days modelling or building pitchbooks. He's lucky he got an offer at all. It's delusional to think he would get in at a level requiring 3 years experience, especially in London.
If you don't have any FT work experience, I can see why they did this. They likely have a long line of candidates and can afford to low ball you because others will accept it.
Personally I'd take it, crush it and see about a 2 year path to ASO. A year or two of a lower title than you really deserve is not a big deal in the early / more junior phases. The experience you'll gain is a very decent tradeoff
I have like 5 years full time work experience, just not in finance. But I guess it doesn't matter here
Yeah not relevant if it's not in finance, and even the finance internships are going to be discounted since they're internships. If you want the more tenured ASO role to get credit for prior experience, you'd need to follow the MBA ASO path, but if they're not hiring any summers you're kind of in a tough spot with that.
Personally in this market + for top tier group I'd just take the AN job and run
I'd reach out to whoever you are closest with on the team and have an open discussion. Likely, it's not a negotiation. I would assume they like you and want you to be successfull and part of that is having you start at a junior enough role that you are set up for success.
It's odd to have HR have that conversation though and to not tell you details.
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I dont think you have any leverage here. Take the offer and crush it.
My 2 cents also as an Assoc in London
Take the offer - this isn’t the US. EB coverage teams are super lean and the MBA assoc model doesn’t work here. If you actually join as A3 I guarantee you will be severely beyond the rest of the class and more of a weight. At that level you’ll be expected to take ownership of so many things already but you have seen none of it
If you really want to do banking I’m telling you that you will have a very hard time finding a senior analyst or associate role with no previous experience at a top shop. Better to be A1 and grind a bit, you’re assoc in2 years. And you’ll be making 6 figures in your first year anyway so money not an issue
You see a ton of Europeans with masters in finance and 4x 3-6 month internships across reputable IB/PE shops start as AN1 (especially when they’re from continental Europe where competition is insane).
These guys have more relevant experience than you but don’t think twice about taking the junior analyst role. So no, it doesn’t sound like a tactic to me. The rationale simply is why would they pay you way more money to take a junior associate spot just to teach you how to be an analyst first (which has little to do with industry knowledge but a lot with cranking reps and process management)
This is classic EVR behaviour.
Old boss of mine got the same treatment when joining EVR LDN, however he secured Asso title as he had 3 years solid experience and was told there was no point him adopting the An role when he would have to transition to Asso role within a year.
To be quite frank, you can have a fancy MBA or other degree under your belt, but if you haven’t spent a significant duration of time in a role of responsibility getting in deal reps I.e. have only done internships, I can see why they’d give you an An position, I would in their shoes. The level of responsibility grows as you go from An 1 -> 3, it’s a very different ball game to internships and an MBA; banks are looking for someone who’s heavily experienced (actual deal reps) and comfortable with both the responsibility and attrition levels of the industry when promoting to associate.
You might disagree with me here, but saying you can add more value or An 3 level value after a couple of internships and a higher degree, even if the higher degree is in a relevant field, is a step down the wrong path… an advanced degree is not the job, you can argue it’s a subsequent indication of your intellect but really it doesn’t come close to translating to real experience which is what will get you your stripes/earn you your years as an employee.
Hope negotiations go well, perhaps ask if you can be reassessed after a year and focus on adopting increasing responsibility throughout the year, probably your best bet.
Congrats. Just take the offer in this market.
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