Has anyone here been unemployed for 3+ months?
I'm literally going crazy sitting at home -- got let go a few months ago.
I have had at least 6-7 in person interviews (with decent companies) -- and at least double that in phone screens but have gotten no return offers. Has anyone been here before? Am I terrible at interviewing or something?
It probably doesn't help either I have a few 1 year tenure at places in a row. IT sales if that helps.
It's getting to the point where I'm considering saying fuck it and learning to code or something. What the hell am I doing wrong...
Took me 4 months out of undergrad to get a job. Not a job I wanted but it paid, got to the point where I took what I can get. I know friends who had longer layoffs. Sometimes timing isn't right. I've been there before.. countless interviews and nothing. Just keep your head up, while at home all day try to work on other projects. take the SIE, sign up for CFA. Something proactive that an employer might like. Keep your head up, something will bite eventually.
Are you still working that same job? If not how was the transition out of it?
So the job was a contract role so once my contract ran out I had to leave. While working there I made sure to gain some skills that an employer I would want I work for would like.. VBA, Modeling and I took the SIE. I’m actually interviewing for various roles in asset management, trading.. so things are looking up. Not there yet but I know I will be soon. Just keep working, don’t let anything stop you
what has been your work history?
Generally 12-18 months at tech companies for 2-3 jobs. It got my salary up to a high point really quick.
what were the actual jobs....what were you doing?
account executive...selling software
have you applied to jobs at salesforce.com?
I have though never get call backs. Applying online cold may as be like applying to Goldman's website cold.
i've found that as you move to jobs that are higher up the experience spectrum, with specific requirements, there are fewer applicants for each job listing.
Goldman has 10,000 people applying for entry level analyst roles...but very few applying for experienced HFT software engineer roles.
I applied to Goldman's website cold, no response. 1/3 of their online application was LGBT/diversity questionnaire bullshit. 6 months later an MD reached out to me directly via email after I had already taken another position. Just keep plugging away at these online.
I applied to Goldman's website cold, no response. 1/3 of their online application was LGBT/diversity questionnaire bullshit. 6 months later an MD reached out to me directly via email after I had already taken another position. I guess that Just keep plugging away at these online.
I would seriously consider applying as bi/pansexual or whatever weird shit these big corporate companies have such an HR boner for these days. They cannot prove your sexuality.
It's all fun and games until your boss sets it up to have you two getting a nice romantic dinner in an exotic location at a nice hotel on a "business trip".
OP - hang in there. I'm trying to make a change (after a voluntary sabbatical) and it is not easy at all. That said, try to keep busy. In addition to applying for jobs, it may be worth considering exploring interests/hobbies. If you are in a city, that could mean free museum days/activities, volunteering and community service or joining a sports team, or just a lot of reading. You may pick up or notice skills you never knew you had and you'll be growing personally. Things like volunteering mean you meet a lot of people and you never know where that next lead will come from. When people ask what you do, tell them the truth. "I got laid off and its been tough but I'm doing x and y etc." You'll be surprised how often someone random will say "oh I know x, send me your resume" or "I have a friend that..."
More individually pursuits that you never had time to do may be another idea. Wanted to learn to swim? Watch some youtube videos and go to the public pool and start in the shallow end/kiddie pool (no joke). Go for a run and work out. You'll be surprised how positive you feel afterwards and that will come off in interviews and meetings. Going into an interview and saying "I got laid off and have been on the beach for 6 months but in that time my running mile is down by a minute and I've volunteered and done x, y, z" shows you have initiative and are getting after it.
Any other questions, PM me.
Good Luck
Classic World of Warcraft is releasing on August 28th, perfect time to be unemployed.
On a more serious note, you say you were in sales. Use your sales skills, build a list of leads either manually or buy one, you can typically get a solid list of 1,000 company decision makers for $0.2/lead. Put them in a CRM - I'd suggest Pipedrive, its super cheap and easy to customize and integrate with your email, and put in the work.
Intro email Follow-up next week Call the third week
Depending on your budget you can also do a letter drop to the companies addressed to the decision maker for $1-2/lead and put in some witty writing about how you sourced the lead and reached out and why this makes you good at sales.
Do this 5hours every day in the morning like its a job and take the rest of the day off to workout, play videos, read a book, study for CFA, start a drop shipping business, learn to code or whatever.
That's what I would do.
Yeeeup it's all a numbers game GREAT advice. Just keep typie type type until someone type back. Unless your resume or approach sucks, then you're wasting your time. I'd just copy format standard for your field and remember personalization of intro notes goes a long way.
Classic WOW, WC3 Reforged, Apex, Rooftop bar SZN - Lotta great reasons to be excited about your significant freedom that you have today! You're not worth less because it takes forever for companies to hire people. Everyone has or will be there. Put in systematic work to an application process for 2 hours a day then go do something that lights you on fire inside.
This is good advice. Hell, I'd quit my job and do this right now.
Can also hire a virtual assistant from a place like UpWork to mine leads and data for $3/h.
+1 for hiring a VA. I have a couple in the Philippines that do great work. Worth every penny. Save so much time. I have them look up people's contact info for me at hunter.io
I thought about doing this -- and would be a good idea if I wasn't getting plenty of interviews. I'm getting through HR just fine -- just not getting the job. Sent out 20ish resumes ("black hole" online postings and got 3 phone screens yesterday.
I'm learning how to code. I came from engineering background so I might get a job at Facebook at this point before I get one in sales.
If anyone needs a jr dev to help work on algo trading things let me know, that's really my dream job. I can start tomorrow in FiDi and won't bitch about long hours or a low starting salary.
keen to learn more about how to use Pipedrive to sort job applications. That is, what are the headers, the way to track. I've not used Pipedrive this way. If you prefer, I can DM.
Pipedrive is fairly intuitive, you can get a free demo to play around with it and I think a subscription is like $10/month. You basically have a funnel and a profile for each lead that can include whatever you want. In the case of recruiting I would put the company name and division as the lead and the people to contact tied to the lead. I would build the following pipe.
Leads --> First Contact Sent --> Follow-Up Sent --> Cold Called || Traction / Declined
Set it up to upload the list into the Leads with all relevant info for each lead. Once setup and email is synced with pipedrive just send first email and move to the First Contact pipe, the week after follow up on everything in the First Contact pipe and the week after cold call all of those. Anything that gets traction move to traction and anything that gets declined put into declined.
This is basically my instagram DM strategy, ugh I mean, lead gen strategy.
I wrote a long post on this here: https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/unemployed-and-living-in-parents…
we got into a healthy banter here but this is exactly how I'd go about finding a job.
the short answer is yes, I was laid off during the financial crisis (the week after Thanksgiving btw) and spent 5 months looking for work and failing, it fucking sucks but there is light at the end of the tunnel.
also my last comment here: https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/i-really-need-some-major-life-ad…
Thanks for posting those links.
My own 2 cents: hustle. It keeps the money flowing and there is nothing worse than sitting at home doing nothing.
Starting your own thing is not that hard, look at the skills you have. My wife stopped working after kid number one - we started a small property management business. Agents are so shit that it was very easy to pick up friends and families at first. We don't have many clients but it's kind of nice for her to earn her own cash. Some guys are trying to get something off the ground and need help, go do it without a salary for a bit while at the same time pro-actively looking for jobs. Go work for habitat for humanity or other charitable organisation. Key is get out of the house.
In Finance it's not a question of if you will be let go, but of when you will be let go. It's a highly elastic job market. The economy might crash, your bank might have had a bad year, your group might have had a bad year, you might have had a bad year. So many variables that are completely out of your control. The great thing is that it's never a black mark (unless you are a complete ass hole and keep being fired for being a dick, but then your best bet is to just work in a job with no interaction with humans)
He's in Tech Sales.
Him and I have joked a bit about Digital Marketing.
There is light at the end of the tunnel... Not sure what the source of the light is right now.
I have been there, happy to coach you along. Feel free to DM me. You will be fine, NEVER GIVE UP.
One thing that has not been as fully mentioned here, is the fantastic opportunity for self-education that this sabbatical offers.
You can study financial modeling, value investing, get your GMAT / GRE done, etc.
That takes months anyway.
You can use the time to make yourself the most badass finance professional you can be.
That will improve your chances of getting a job.
This is great advice but thats the paradox of looking for a job, super tough to make those things are priority when you're grinding on the networking circuit.
Looking for a job is a full time job.
Hi differentialequations12, Everybody goes through this phase at some point in their life. Make sure you are utilizing the gap for developing yourself with some free online courses out there. Definitely, you will get into work or maybe start an own if stars are on your side!
Yes, I have been in this situation before and made the mistake of not taking advantage of it. I was constantly stressed about landing my next role and not bringing in money. The most important thing is too look at it as an opportunity. You have the unique opportunity to put a pause on your career and refocus if you want, get in really good shape, and fucking sleep. At the same time you will want to talk to as many people as possible and network heavily. In my experience, this is not too time consuming, so you will still have a good amount of free time. Use this free time to button up all those things in your life that are hard to get to when working full time. You want to make sure that you continue to progress even though you are not working full time. When you land a role you might even find that you were better off for have a 3+ month break.
Yup. Been there. It really sucks. Hang in there, OP and try to come up with a story to defend the gap.
So sorry for the long message. This hits so close to home so I had to create an account to answer. I was employed in management consulting in the UK on a tier 2 visa and was let go despite being a high performer due to the boss getting along with the other associate over me (which i should have worked better at admittedly), there were some other things they did wrong but I dont want to blame so as to not seem bitter even though I am due to their actions.
It came with no notice and they screwed me over for some reason. They basically let me go without telling me and kept me "employed" until 1 week till my visa expired. Basically in the UK if you are let go you have one month to find a new job and they didn't let me know until one week until my visa was cancelled. My friends insisted it was a racial issue (I'm black) and I am currently planning to move back to the UK and sue because IDK why they chose to do that!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Fuck man
I moved back to america and it was impossible from October 2018 to May 2019 to get a job, interview or call back from over 100 applications and I admittedly listened to my friends and thought it was an ethnic name thing so I had the idea to move to africa without a job to find something to do with one of the multinationals. Long story short after an incredible jobless journey in africa for a month I got a job this June in one of the massive consultancies in a major african financial hub and I am planning to make a return to the USA or UK (UK preferably to take up my firing in court).
But those months unemployed were the most horrible, demeaning and hopeless moments of my life. I considered suicide, tried drug use for some reason and felt so ashamed because I couldnt even afford an MBA so I thought I would be stuck forever.
But I would say please do not lose hope and maybe plan an MBA if you can afford it. Also consider starting over again in another country since people there appreciate foreign experiences but chose a safe country.
FYI - you have 3 months from the date of your dismissal to sue for unfair dismissal. Keep that in mind or do some research. If your dismissal was racially motivated it might be a different issue, but look into this. A simple letting them know you intend on fucking them over might be enough, but take some advice
Yeah I am aware of the time constraints, however I would not pull the race card because it kinda feels like a dick move and could ruin future opportunities for minorities. I think the owners were a-holes and I genuinely hate them to the core of my soul but they were (probably) not racist. I think doing that would be similar to girls lying about r*pe when they dont get their way, doesnt sit well with me. With that being said I would love to sink them into the ground and make them pay bro.
Happened to me during the financial crisis....spent 6 months unemployed, sent 500 resumes, got about a dozen interviews, and felt very lucky to accept an entry level finance job at about $36K per year with no benefits.
Just keep adapting and improving your resume, cover letters, etc. If you're getting interviews, you're on the right track. You just need to tweek something a little bit. Hard for me to say what that is without knowing the details of your applications, interview style, etc. You'll just have to be very self-critical and pinpoint what part of the interview is making you lose points...
Woah 500 resumes. I guess this is why support groups work, reading about you over coming your struggles after we were in a similar place makes me feel a lot more hopeful. Almost like ive seen how my journey would end. Then again going back to america isnt top priority now since I am in one of the top consultancies in the world working in an exotic location. I feel like I have a bit more patience in moving
I was unemployed for several months. Luckily i had savings to live for
it's tough man, luckily there are hundreds of AE roles in NYC - apply to all of them.
I feel your pain though, I've also struggled really bad with getting offers myself. I've gotten dinged for BDR roles while having 1.5 years of success in the role already. Even without closing experience I made it to about 4 final rounds for AE roles. I've interviewed at Oracle twice and SFSC once too (InMailed Sales Manager for an interview) but didn't receive any offers.
It just seems to be a super competive field to be in, even with the abundance of opportunities.
Yeah but I guess its the life we chose unfortunately, thankfully consulting is a bit safer when it comes to job security
I'm starting to think SaaS sales has become more competitive over the years as people knew how much money was to be made.
It's a job seekers market in tech (sales) right now...you might be doing something wrong. Do some internal reflection and try to evaluate your strengths and weaknesses.
What market(s) are you looking for jobs in? Hit up https://bettsrecruiting.com/talent-sales-roles/
...having said that, stay positive and don't give up. A lot of us on this board have been in the same position (myself included).
You can always teach English somewhere in SE Asia or be an International School Teacher pulling in six figs working around the world and get the Summers off.
Mike Rowe says these are good career options:
You could also join the Military and make good money provided you are healthy enough to get through OCS.
Or...
Go to the dark side and do Affiliate Marketing or some Tai Lopez/Alex Becker/Grant Cardone/Tony Robbins/Tim Ferris/Frank Kern/Russ Ruffino type stuff. Take out the money, flaunt it, sell it, cash out, and Flex on IG to build creds. Pay Russell Brunson and Alex Becker or Tim Ferris some $$$ to do a Testimonial video... done.
Check this out:
If it has a Lambo in the video, it must be good. Six figure agency in no time? Easy.
On a serious note, but you already know this differentialequations12 , and this is more for the WSO community to ponder, Finance in general might be "dead."
Two years ago I took a flight from Dallas to DC sitting in Coach and next to me sat a GS SVP. We got chatting about what he does and how he likes the city. He said he enjoys it and it's expensive but the client work is fun (he was leaving a client meeting to go to another one before heading home to NYC).
Long story short, he told me two stories. One was about his Mentor/Boss who is an MD and the other one is about his friend who studied with him and is now a multi-millionaire.
1) GS MD Story - "Happy families are all alike; every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way." - Anna Karenina. His boss was in his mid-50s and the wive took him to the cleaners during the divorce which leaves him without his apartment and other assets. Being mid-50s and with years in IB and no real retirement, the MD is force to rent a small studio to grind until whenever he can stop doing it still tied to that Blackberry lifestyle.
2) Friend who studied Finance - Went to try a few jobs, hated it, and decided to live in the parent's basement. I think there is another fatalistic thread here about someone doing the same but the different here is this dude started an Insurance company and after 4-5 years, the dude is pulling in millions per year in revenue and doing fine. The GS SVP told me that he is happy that his friend did so well and that the investment paid off.
I just got back to USA after a 9 month stint in SE Asia. There are folks there selling knock-off Nike and Adidas shoes for $10k USD/day (yes per day with about a 60-75% margin) in Manila, Malaysian Chinese girl with fake boobs selling sex toys from her Facebook group, and other forms of 'hustle' that people do there as Makeup Artists and Massage Therapists. Not to say they can and so can you but there are options.
Check this out:
Not exactly legal. I know a guy who makes custom shoes who has access to factories (running Adidas, Nike, Puma, etc) but they only do FOB Factory and the buyer is left with the bag to take care of shipping, export, import, and customs. Manila merchandise is all manufactured in-house in Philippines as the tariffs on Chinese imports, even with a Free-Trade agreement, is not fun.
Browsing FB Marketplace for SE Asia in places in Jakarta, Manila, or Kuala Lumpur (Indo, Phil, Msia) gives you an idea of what people want. The poor folks want to look rich so the Gucci and LV does well for the ladies along with Skin Whitening products (because everyone wants to look pale and Chinese) and the fake Jerseys and Shoes does well for the gents. Either way, their Cash on Delivery (COD) setup Shopify front end can produce over $10k/month NET. Also, you don't pay taxes apparently on E Commerce in the Philippines. Good deal right? So what's the downside?
You can make First world profits in a Third World country provided you want to deal with Third world problems, logistics, and most of all the people not only the locals but the foreigners who are very predatory over there as well.
There are always some Gold deal out of Africa for $10k/kg below spot until you realize it's no where near LBMA level and the hops and toll you pay to get goods from point A to B even with some 'Gold Wholesaler' is going to net you next to zero with passive capital risk. Of course, there is always some Coal deal out of Indonesia but I've already written about that in another thread. You can also do the "Lord of War" and attend LIMA in Langkawi, Malaysia to try to broker some deals but again, you are dealing with Asians, and some ex-wife of a General of XYZ Country's Airforce just sold 10 jets from ABC company and collected some 8-figure commission on the deal... because she's the ex-wife of some General of some XYZ country. Rest of the people who want in on the action are Israeli's, who have an Industrial Complex in Philippines with a nice Tax-free Zone, Chinese, and Americans who aren't exactly welcomed at LIMA or SE Asia in General. Israeli gear doesn't sell well in Muslim countries and a lot of inventory carrying happens without any guarantee of payment by the Government and payment is always late if ever rendered at all.
Bottomline... yeah. Make some Tai Lopez videos and call it a day or get a hot SE Asia GF and have her sell sex toys (Fake shoes, Skin whitening, Slim Teas, some MLM that failed in the USA but isn't regulated in SE Asia, etc) on Social Media while you write her copy on Quora/Reddit to pump up her persona as she barely speaks a lick of English. She gets to monetize a commodity, you get to profit from the Joint-Venture, she gets English education for free, and you always have a hot SE Asia chick at the end of the day. Skip the Singaporean girls unless you want to shell out $50k USD to get a Hermes handbag for her B-Day or the like. They are expensive and if beauty is their only commodity, there are other better looking who don't demand those things. As far as innovation goes, I've seen 'startups' that monetizes 'other services' online with a Payment gateway... Digital pimpin at its finest. There's also a dude who shows his rather scandalous journeys around on SE Asia with video captions who get 5 figure views per video. He probably has a couple of rental properties and the videos are informative for whoever else can't travel like that but wants to and wants to vicariously experience different regions of the world.
What I've realized reading and writing some of these things is that... Your mind becomes an echo chamber. Social Media multiples this effect. If you think the world is unfair and there are so many inequities, guess what your Google or YouTube search history will look like? When your mind isn't right, as thebrofessor pointed out multiple times on various threads, it is next to impossible to see life from any other vantage point than your current plight. Yes, it can obviously get worse, but then again, what are these other humans doing and how are they still doing fine? So the world isn't all doom and gloom and someone obviously has it better and someone has it worse. From the Master: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9paVDx1y0A
Someone always has it worse and someone always has it better, always.
Go eat a steak and ponder this:
Kevin Spacey's show on Netflix was one of many positive factors that arguably saved the company and now after certain things came to light his career took another turn. It is what it is. Kate Spade, Robin Williams, Michael Schumacher, Anthony Bourdain, etc. Admired by many and obviously career-wise successful... But such is life.
Often people think "being a Hot Girl" can be a solution to life but for every one "Hot" Instagram girl that "makes it", others become no bodies, webcam whatevers, soft/hardcore blah blah, and etc. Power Law and luck applies to every industry and what they don't tell you about the Hot Girl situation is that they over rely on a depreciating commodity, their looks, and fail to acquire marketable skills so when they get replaced they also have normal people issues with drugs, alcohol, and suicide. My friend who's a Playboy photographer recounts the number of bodies he had to bury and the funerals he had to pay for for the models he has photographed over the years. Hot can be replaced with anything like intelligence, GPA, connections, whatever. There are those with all of the above and still relatively "stuck" in a situation of whatever.
OMG! Isnt' that Bella Hadid? Yes, I saw her in person in Kuala Lumpur at a TAG Heuer party. She's a female with two arms and two legs albeit a nice looking lady. Maybe I should write elsewhere about the funny wild stories of SE Asia...
The whole idea that the Grass is Greener creates a slew of mental fantasies constantly at each level in life so if you are miserable now and your Bank account is increased 7-9 figures USD you won't be a better human being over night but just a more bitter or miserable Rich person until you find that pleasures on that level is fleeting and has no meaning hence why some of these Rich folks end up offing themselves or can't freely travel without an Army of security guards. There will also be an overwhelming sense of the impostor syndrome like being given a Gold Medal without running the Race. Read about Lottery Winners and how many of their lives suck much worse after winning than before. There is no magic bullet, the Grass is never Greener, and if your mind isn't right once you get there it often will fall short of expectations and you will be back to square one thinking that your previous Paradise is Hell and that the next Trinket will fix whatever ailment you have in Health, Wealth, or whatever. It won't, ever. Buddhists and Stoics got some of this right so two things:
Career Idea: They pay $10k or so for "Boardroom Actors" in SE Asia for Caucasians to look the part. I've also met a fair share of LinkedIn Yahoos who have zero technical background but are 'recruited' by 'Blockchain' companies in SE Asia as a 'Consultant' for this or that. I've also ran into tons of VP of "Business Development" for borderline sketch projects in SE Asia looking to debt structure this or that. If one is thin on moral and ethical values, there are many a ways to monetize and make a 'career.' Go do a paddle boarding Business in Bali and promote it on Social Media or teach Muay Thai or Boxing somewhere with a twist for burnt out folks on Wall St seeking some spiritual Ascension/Transcendental Meditation shit for $2-3k and use ClickFunnels or whatever with some Alex Becker or Dan Lok type Evergreen Webinar. Find your Spiritual Center whilst getting Punched in the face and kicked on your shins that was Originally priced at $7777.77 but now for a limited time it's Udemy bargain bin price of $1975.97. Do it a couple of times a year, boom, Rich and you get to Network with folks who buy into this stuff. Heard that there are LinkedIn spiritual leaders that get "tipped" a donation of $10,000 from their loyal followers and folks making ASMR/Mukbang videos. Busy counting 1's and 0's and missing out on all this new age creativity... Such shame! I guess that's why God invented Liberal Arts majors.
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