Came across this article today on high maintenance women. I can see the argument of the author that women need to "shrink themselves" so they don't seem high maintenance by people they are trying to attract. I know there have been countless threads on women in finance/alpha women but I don't think I have seen any healthy discussions on this topic.
My POV on high maintenance is that yes it can be a lot of "labor" (financial or dedicating time) and I prefer to have an equal/balanced relationship where she also dedicates the same in return, ofc I am not going to count every single detail.
If the woman needs a lot of expensive things (hence why she is seen as high maintenance) then she should either support herself or accept the fact that many men can't afford to or don't want to support their lifestyle (in both cases resulting in a smaller pool of potential mates). so either they support themselves and make it clear that they are not expecting their SO to support them or stop complaining about how their dating pool is small. This is only for financial needs assuming there isn't something serious / out of the woman's control that is preventing them from supporting themselves. Dedicating time is a different thought process, for me.
Would like to hear what my fellow monkeys think or your experience dating high maintenance women.
Honestly it’s one of those things you eventually learn to not fight. Spoken to numerous girls who are high maintenance and the conversation eventually fizzles out once they realise I’m not going to spend my hard earned money on them like that. It’s up to them to continue to play that field but I really wouldn’t be surprised if they never find a long-term partner because I find most guys can probably only put up with that for so long and that’s until they’ve had sex then they eventually replace her with the next “hot girl”. If you’re on this app then I’m guessing you’re fairly young, just keep playing the field, realistically I wouldn’t begin to worry about marriage until you’re like 31-32, but in your 20s even if all your friends are in a LTR, play things at your speed and you may even end up being in something longer term than them if they rushed into it.
Maybe this is just the old man in me but the older I get, it becomes more about behavior than anything else. I don't care whether my partner is high maintenance or not, I just don't want them to cause any headaches. I work hard enough as it is, I just want to come home to a pleasant partner who's going to be fun for the evening. She could be wearing nothing but Prada or she could be missing teeth, I don't care, just be pleasant to be around and don't cause problems. That's all any successful man really needs.
I was with you up until the missing teeth part.
I took some liberty with my hyperbole but I think the underlying point still stands :)
British girls punching the air rn
Some West Virginia vibes
to be honest, if that's the only thing that matters, why would you spend on Prada. there are a lot of girls with great personalities who are just not hot and thus low maintenance. would be a waste of resources to get a hot girl who maxes out your credit cards at Prada if you don't care if your girl is hot or not.
The car clubs/ownership groups I am part of have a very high amount of the girls you have described. They are often "seen as a trophy" along with their homes and cars and other things. I personally wouldn't want this, but if this works for them... not much for me to worry about.
For some people the relationship is about providing for each other in different ways.
if you can afford it and know what you are getting into then sure, some dudes enjoy the aspect of providing everything.
Though more often than not it leads to an overworked man, a demanding wife, and lifestyle creep that keeps him working to the grave. I avoid expensive women like the plague, I have found almost no correlation between how expensive their lifestyle is and their looks, intelligence, ambition, or personality - so it's easy to avoid altogether.
I think women labeled high maintenance are usually headaches. I do not think self sufficient women would be labeled this, it requires no maintenance because it takes care of its self in that example.
I do think you touched on something interesting though which is very high earning or high preforming women usually have a hard time dating. This seems to be because generally women do not date someone who makes less than them ( que people saying they know a women who makes more than partner) so that gives them a very limited pool if they make say 300k at 30. Because the guy who is 32 making 350k often seems less likely to settle down and is seen as very high value but as a general rule the high income does not make the women attractive by itself. She would have to already be very attractive based on other qualities to get that man as a general rule.
Definitely is a factor. I'd say women are getting more open to it, but definitely have higher expectations in salary for a man than a man does for a woman (a man making 300k+ often times will absolutely not care if his woman even has a job).
What I think hurts them more is that it inflates their own perceived dateability when it really doesnt to the same degree as a man. A guy that has his own penthouse apartment, a 250k+ salary, etc. will be a big deal for most women. A woman with the same traits doesnt move the needle near as much as a man. So she thinks she is entitled to someone as her 'equal' when in reality if she wants a better partner she should focus on looks and personality
I’m definitely one of those women you describe. I think “entitled” isn’t an underserved description with this mentality but the way I frame it is, I’ve worked too hard to be a meal ticket for some guy who chose a lower earning field. I gave up some golden years of my life to ensure I can retire on my own, live in a great place and travel everywhere… I would love to find someone who has these values as well.
Essentially, I want someone who can keep up and pull his weight. I would never ask this guy to cover me (it’s a two way street right? Queue self awareness applause) but unfortunately that means I have a dating pool that dwindles by the day. And I’m ok with that, I want to be with someone who has the same value system as me and I value being independent and having a good lifestyle.
I know a female friend who wants someone who earns more than her (note: not the same, more) and can kind of "lead" in the relationship. The only problem is... this severely limits her dating pool because she works in high finance and makes a lot of money... and I just don't really understand it, I mean, if you already make that much money what's the incremental money the guy have going to do? I think it's more an emotional thing? Like she respects the guy more if they make more than her? I have no idea...
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
Maybe she’s trying to build some serious wealth
100% don't want to date a high maintenance woman, emotionally or financially. When I was younger I thought 'maybe it's not so bad' but it's exhausting to 'emotionally' be there for a chick when she's having a new problem literally every week or two. Novelty wears off real quick
On lifestyle, I definitely don't want to be working my hours until I die. Happy to work 50hrs a week or so up until my 50s and then probably tamp down to a more flexible role. A woman who spends all my money is just not worth it. That said, overly stinginess isn't great either. Moderate is always best
Do you want a simple woman
How BAD you want her to look ?
Please share insta handle for confirmation purposes
I dunno man, usually like your takes but I'm gonna have to disagree slghtly on this one -- 99% of girls that look bad are low-quality from a personality / values standpoint. Otherwise agree with what you've said
bro
Not worth the brain damage. Crazy, expensive taste, always in some DrAmA, etc
Funny you said not worth the brain damage, I was speaking to a girl and we facetimed and met up maybe on 2-3 occasions. I could swear my IQ was eroding by the second as all she spoke about was her nails and lashes, honestly couldn’t give a shit. It’s made me hate girls that bother for these things now.
Would you consider her dumb or ignorant? What made you talk to her in the first place
Lol I had the same thing happen with a Chinese girl. She wouldn't stop talking about how much she likes to party, partying in Taipei and all the stuff she likes to buy. I can't wait to leave talking to these kind of people, although I can also see some guys being fascinated by such women, even if for a very short time.
High maintenance financially? Literally costly, but still manageable. Worst case, she makes me step up my own game and dress nicer, workout more, eat nicer stuff and fetch myself some nicer accoutrements, etc.
High maintenance emotionally? Hard pass. Never again will I put up with dating someone who texts me every hour throughout the day because she can't find something to do herself. I'm trying to work or take care of errands (so maybe you don't have to!), or god forbid spend time with friends/family. Not...babysit...you. Or date someone who wants me to be as emotional as a junior high girl going through her first big crush and breakup. Some things are worth deep emotion, but not EVERYTHING is. You get the point.
Texting you every hour of the day isn’t high emotional maintenance (aka clingy) but more so a girl with a queen mentality who thinks she is the top of the world and everything revolves around her hence interrupting you with your work.
Would help to understand your definition of 'high maintenance.' Would you say 'emotionally needy' or 'financially demanding'? In any case, relationships ought to be fun and enjoyable, otherwise what's the point? There's always someone out there who is fun and pleasant to be with, so why should anyone put up w/ someone who isn't?
Hot girls are most often than not high maintenance (in the financial sense). If I have the money to piss away, why not? I like my girl to look hot and nice and expensive when she is standing beside me, sitting on my lap, giving me a bj, laying on her back etc. Having a hot chick tagging along when Im out and about also makes me look good, puts me in a good mood when I look at her and other men naturally respect me more. Its the whole package. Trophy? you better be damn sure she is.
However, fuck emotional needy girls. I have enough shit to deal with on a daily basis. Besides, if I want something really annoying and time consuming, I will get a puppy, at least that little shit won't talk back.
Reminds me of "What Makes Sammy Run?"
High maintenance women, I have zero time or energy for them, so in my world they are not a problem.
I live in a wealthy part of California, and at my local mall (that has many ultra high-end designer/luxury stores), I see an inordinate amount of old dude + young gold digger girl couples (look like daddy and daughter but the girl usually has heels and a bad nosejob + lip fillers). Don't know why those guys are so desperate. I would think with all that money, either you just enjoy your life or get a hooker once in a while. I don't get the sugar baby thing. Walking them around the mall and buying them shit. What a waste of time and money
girls want to shop
Women apparently drive 70-80 percent of all consumer spending :p
Sounds like orange county.
Lmao is it that obvious?? Guess I accidentally doxed myself 🤦
Well it's not dissimilar to OF mkt -- why not just use free videos like everyone else? Because they crave that emotional connection
Sad to see how in the old days if was just the above, but now with OF it exploits lonely men everywhere at scale
.
There’s a lot more to high maintenance than just sinking money into the machine. Try time and dealing with whining etc….
Chromeo - Needy Girl
I'm a girl in repe so this whole thread was hilarious.. if I was a guy I would date the hottest + most intelligent girl I could find and go on lavish vacations and shopping. Life is too short, why even bother working if you don't enjoy yourself. I feel like genetics are important and if someone wants the full package, realistically there is some level of expectations that come with it. Or date down in looks. Or date a woke liberal or a Western European/ Scandinavian if you want to find a hot girl who pays for herself. I know this culture exists, but I've never met a girl who splits bills or rent, and the guys are all in their 20s.. Maybe not on WSO but I think most guys enjoy feeling like they can provide and dressing up their gf in cute outfits.
If you want to be extra careful and save all your income, avoid dating girls who look like semi instagram models. Also probably don't pick up girls at places like gospel, the blond, cipriani, surf lodge, st tropez, aspen, mykonos, st. barts, tulum, maybe even avoid dating at HBS/ GSB too just to play safe. If you use dating apps, very early on mention that you have a roommate and see if she continues responding, that's a common hard dealbreaker if the guy is post undergrad age. If you truly want someone who doesn't care about money, save yourself the time and find out early on
Found the high maintenance sloot
Yeah I'd bang the high maintenance girl too, but 0 chance I'd wife her up. Life's too short to be miserable, and IG model types -- while fun in bed -- would be soul crushing after about a year
Yea if they are just hot and have no intelligence or passions etc. I would hate that too.
it is kind of ridiculous the idea that most beautiful girls are shallow, dumb etc. when it hasn’t been my experience whatsoever. Most of my girlfriends look like models, have careers and went to top 10 schools.
Also feel like society has gone backwards with some aspects of the feminism movement.. at the end of the day even if a women has a full time job, she will realistically spend much more time, effort into taking care of the kids, cooking, organizing trips, working out, etc. Plus only a tiny fraction of CEOs, fund MDs, startup founders are women, so I find it really interesting / confusing when girls prefer to pay in the name of their made up idea of equality.
I believe in equal opportunity but men and women aren’t equal, there are 2 genders for a reason (not 10). I think the whole idea of the nuclear family is falling apart but that’s another topic
Our upbringings shape our views, I grew up in an extremely conservative, affluent suburb where the culture and views are a bit different. The first time in my life I heard of couples commonly splitting bills/expenses, I was 18 and on a layover in Copenhagen, I befriended a Scandinavian girl and heard its normal there.
I mean if a girl doesn’t at least buy you amazing birthday / holiday gifts, plans surprises and do other things to express interest then it’s a bad sign.. but yea I’m just shocked by some of the views I see on WSO. I have a couple guy friends who are crazy cheap, and that’s fine we can be friends / or professional colleagues. People should date others who align with their views and lifestyle ideals.
Are you "one of the guys"? I feel like you are, jw
I think high maintenance receives a super bad rep here. Sure, it is time consuming and expensive; however, each person has their own individual tastes and likes. I shouldn't have to be judged by guys for spending thousands on clothes or shoes if its my money and not theirs yet many do. It doesn't matter to me personally if the guy dislikes or doesn't spend money on expensive stuff but he shouldn't dictate my lifestyle or spending choices. Likewise, almost all guys I meet whether it be in-person or via apps will make some sort of comment about my profession hence why I believe that men do in fact somewhat judge a woman based on what she does.
High maintenance is high maintenance at the end of the day. It doesn't just refer to money but also emotionally / time-wise. Sure if you spend your own money for those things that's not necessarily bad (unless it's a spending problem, but that goes both ways of course). But lot of high maintenance girls require massive emotional investment & time investment that just becomes tiresome to deal with. Know a guy who's gf calls him 5 times a day, I would feel extremely smothered by that personally
Yes, guys do judge on what a girl does professionally -- for good or for ill. Personally would never date a girl in finance or law (too type-A), otherwise I'm pretty open. Know a lot of my friends who are the same way
Agree on the emotional aspect. Would be very annoyed if a guy was consistently clingy or calling repeatedly during work hours. That said, I don't usually advertise that I work in finance/PE soon so its quite enjoyable when I meet other finance guys who proceed to fluff up their role/job, only for me to call them out. Seriously, don't understand the need for guys to gloat/brag about their professions to women at bars/events.
theres high maintenance and then theres a leech. the former will push you in a constructive way to achieve all that you can in life. recognize the difference. i married the former and she out-earned me many years until we started having kids, she is reaping the rewards now
Woman here, can she be high maintenance but she covers it all herself? For example, I bought a dyson airwrap on a whim, it’s $600. I can afford it and I would never look to a guy to buy me something like that. Is it high maintenance if she makes good money and is financially responsible?
From my perspective, and I know this is a bit controversial, I don’t date typically date outside of my income levels because I don’t want to subsidize someone else. I’ve worked hard in my career and earned a very comfortable life. I sacrificed my twenties so I can live in a nice apartment in NYC and never have to worry about money. With that said, it’s a bit of a outlook on life for me as well. When you choose your career, you know roughly what you will be paid. I chose finance because I loved it, was good at it, and it paid very well. I would struggle to not feel like a meal ticket to someone who will never make more than five figures.
In summary, I don’t date down in income (within reason) because I don’t think our values would align (you chose a career with limited upside) and I would struggle to not feel like sugar momma because I want to go on nice vacations and live well but he doesn’t pull his weight. And to be self aware, I split costs evenly in every relationship I’ve been in and when I date. Men don’t have to worry about an expectation of buying things for me.
Highly doubt any sane guy cares what hair dryer a girl buys with her own money.. no buying things with your own money isn’t high maintenance
High maintenance is when you ask your bf to buy you the airwrap and the hairdryer both in limited edition prussian blue, and on top of that you ask him to buy an extra one so he can keep it in his guest bedroom, so you’re not hauling an extra hairdryer around. Then when you travel he packs his guest hairdryer because your luggage is too full. That’s where it crosses into high maintenance. But as someone else said, I still think there’s a big difference between an ungrateful, ungracious leech and high maintenance.
Dyson makes great products, if anything a man should appreciate that you like high quality engineering and technology.
The older you get the more you realize high maintenance women are just not worth it in the long term.
I think it makes sense to add one more thing to your list.
What I mean is most of us (I am assuming if you’re on this board your rich or smart enough to become rich, good looking or smart enough to know working out is important, better than the average guy) want someone who is loyal, pretty, and hard working. Those are universal things successful people look for in a mate.
But why not add rich or smart enough to get rich to that list? Than the high maintenance takes care of itself. So many people in finance just go the hot route with their wives, it never makes any sense to me.
And obviously I get it that not everyone in finance is good looking, and if you’re fat and ugly then getting a hot chick at all costs is important to you since high school and college sucked, but I see good looking colleagues still choose looks over everything and it never ends well. You can go for hot, but just add in rich family or high paying job to your criteria. Why don’t more guys do this?
And yea, if you live some tier 3 city I get it, but most of us live in tier 1 cities and rich or successful girls are everywhere. I just don’t get it. The girl being rich or a lawyer or something isn’t the only wife criteria, but it was to be a large consideration.
i completely agree but tbf, how many girls in your orbit are: loyal + pretty + hard working + accomplished/well-off + relatively normal (not batshit crazy) + *still single*?? certainly next to none for me (and i'm a relatively social guy in NYC).
I feel like in our circles it’s very possible. My b school class was full of such girls.
Of the traits you mentioned the hardest for me to find was a hot girl that you knew cared enough to stay hot after kids and well off. I’ve found girls to be way more loyal than guys lol.
The still single comment is funny lol. I guess that’s true, they always get snapped up.
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