How much do your bosses make per year?
A majority of us are analyst/associate level. I've read through the salary thread on this forum and most of the postings are from junior level. I thought it would be beneficial for most of us to see what jobs down the line are making. Obviously, these are not going to be spot on and be closer to a range, but could be useful information as a lot of us are deciding what we want to do long term. I'll start.
I work for one of the main brokerages and work mainly for 3 producers on the debt side. I'm in NYC. Head MD - ~$1.2M MD - ~$700K Director - ~$700K
What makes you think these figures you are providing are correct?
Its pretty easy to estimate in brokerage. Probably harder in other fields, but most of my friends in PE have some idea of what their bosses are pulling.
Development; we had a land rezoning/flip recently where each of the founding principals cleared $1MM. I believe the one with the most equity in that particular deal made ~$2.6MM.
Anecdotes aside, it’s hard to give an annual number because this business is so lumpy. But these boys do very very well.
How big is your shop/what market?
Total guess because my boss downplays his level of income big time IMO but based on the fact his wife does not work and the value of his house, min $500-600k here in the bay area. Beyond that just to afford his costs (home, kids private school etc) I would have no clue...could be more but I don't see it being less at all. Throwing that figure into a generic google calculator, after tax it says $23-24k a month. So I am going to say he must be on much more than $500k.
Working in residential brokerage while still in undergrad. Person directly above me pulls in $400-500k net before taxes depending on the sales volume year to year (after splits and I happen to know the exact expenses). Approx 25 years in the business.
Most years, $5-$6 million. This year, $15-$20 million. Each.
Why was this year so different?
There are usually 3-4 starts and 3-4 sales every year. This year was one of those award-winning home runs.
So they sold a property or two this year? I don’t see how $5-$6 mil could be made in a year where there are no liquidity events unless you’re one of the top guys at a massive fund or developer
3-4 sales/liquidity events every year. We're a pretty small shop though.
In South Carolina? With that cost of living and stretch of the dollar, dear god.
No, not in SC, although we develop there
Does your shop only play with its own capital or do you have lp investors?
LP investors for sure
$100,000,000,000
At my old job in debt brokerage, the producers I worked for all cleared $500K
With market conditions like we've had the last several years, $500k can happen pretty easily. Especially with MF loans where Fannie and Freddie pay such large rebates.
As a megafund partner I cleared $27MM
Ouch, that comment couldn't have been worth the damage to your MS/SB ratio
Lmao I couldn't care less, I enjoyed it lol
how are you guys ok going into work every morning knowing it takes you weeks/months/(a year) to make what your director/MD/(CEO) makes in 1 day?
maybe I don't take shit from other people. whatever.
lol monaco monkey, I know you are a troll but this is weak. I went through this phase too a while ago, so I know exactly what your doing. Your goal is to make people feel bad, but jokes on you. I am content. If I am content, you cannot make me feel bad :)
I will tell you why I am content. Our incomes may not be that much especially when you compare us to few other professions. A top law student coming out of a top 20 law school can make 160K out of law school working for a big law firm. A first year engineer at a big tech company or even a smaller companies now days can make 120-150K out of college. Doctors can obviously make a lot more over the course of their careers even with medical school debt. All those professions gives you a massive head start in terms of building wealth as most of us are starting at 50-80K base out of college or grad school. You will not be content if you constantly compare yourself to others and be disgruntled on how much less money you make.
In my view life is a bell curve. This can be applied to be many things like income, economics, social status, etc,. Most members of any category will be grouped in the middle, with fewer members at the either extremes. This probabilistic density and distribution can be applied to anything in life. In the 19th century, Victor Pareto explained the concept of how 80% of the land in Italy is owned by 20% of the people. The distribution was pretty much in the shape of a bell. This income distribution was later called the Pareto's principle. Now in the 21st' century, you have Bernie Sanders stating how the top 1/10th of one percent owns as much as wealth as the bottom 90 percent, is anything changed? or will anything will? I realize that and thats why I am content :) Also, I feel a lot better knowing that I am still extremely privileged (sometimes we take it for granted that six figures is a shit ton of money) and am making a lot more than even some very educated folks. So, I am still living a good life.
So, 99% of us here in the real estate field are looking at making 200-300K or so at the very top end of our careers after a 30 year stint. While most of us in real estate want to be entrepreneurs, only 1% or so will end up being the entrepreneurs that we wanted to become when we entered the field (Sam Zell). Some of us that become entrepreneurs are fixing and flipping single family homes and duplexes. The rest are all making a good living but are still only brokers, underwriters, originators, appraisers, consultants, acquisition or asset management professionals in private equity or development shops. And that is fine! The key in life is to realize that life is a bell curve, make sure you are at the very least in the middle part of the bell along with most other people and to be content :)
IMO those numbers are stupid. They do not account for lifecycle wealth. Ie you start at 22 with debt. So most of the bottom people are actually in debt but that doesn’t mean they won’t be wealthy someday. Even within families it works out that way. Take a family with a rich grandpa. Eventually the kids inherit the money. But within family sample he might have 95% of the wealth. Doesn’t mean everyone else is poor.
Damn lies with statistics.
Very helpful perspective
It does blow and I think about it. CRE is a pyramid in terms of comp structure. However, there is so much young hungry talent vying for limited positions, so these guys do w/e TF they want...
I work for a NY family office focused on a niche sector, so we tend to run a very lean shop.
I make $75k, my boss makes ~$2 million (chief investment officer), his boss makes ~$150 million (head of family office). If I can just join the family, I'll be set...
I find it tough to believe anyone is making $150mm a year at a small family office. Jonathan Gray makes like ~250/yr running a fund orders of magnitude bigger than what you guys are (I assume, since you're at a lean shop and he's at f**king Blackstone). Maybe in an amazing year where you have a huge capital event, but I'm skeptical that he's pulling down those numbers on a consistent basis.
$150 mil per year isn’t realistic at all. Maybe he’s referring to a member of the family who is worth $1 billion and made 15% annual returns implying he made $150 million? Only logical explanation I can think of.
yup, jsmith, that's the only way. and to be fair, OP didn't say the shop was a small shop. extell/zeckendorf/etc are technically all lean family offices that focus on a niche sector - i wouldn't be surprised if gary barnett/the zeckendorf brothers were clearing that much in a good year
is there a daughter? If not, hit up his wife
One year the top broker at our firm did $20mm+ in fees personally. My boss (SMD) probably pulls in $1mm per year after split with the house.
SM 280k Partner 1.1M
Deleted: not relevant to RE.
Is anyone like me and really doesn't have a clue?
I mean I have seen brokers fee and price of an asset but not so sure on their tax rate,company splits and senior broker splits.
Same thing with principals in PE funds yeah they made a huge capital gain in a liquidity event but do they have passive losses covering their taxes? How is the entity structured taking that inflow? how many people were on the pay roll to make that happen in the meantime?
Unless you work as a W-2 Employee not tied to a performance bonus that is very predictable which really only is in asset management on the RE side it is going to be hard to really nail down an accurate number. Yeah you can guess based on certain things, but I be when you really break it down its not even close to what you imagine. Not trying to dash any ones dreams but I think some people need to get brought back to reality who have commented in here.
Was in investment sales. Last boss was VP level and starting clearing the $900k - $1.2MM range the last several years.
New boss (MD/Principal/Partner) in debt/equity/loan sales is making $5MM+
Anecdotally, I know of an agency debt guy at one of the big brokerages has done $10MM+ gross fees the last few years trailing.
There's really good years where there are capital events (ig. sale/refi) and then there's decent years based on "the fee machine". Anywhere from $1m/ partner (small boutique development/investment shop) to some nice payouts of $4-5m/partner /year. We act as the GP, so it's investment/fund specific (we have a cross collateralized fund, as well as syndicate on a one off basis where there's no crossing).
Don’t have a boss anymore since I opened my own shop, but my last boss made ~ 1 million a year, and his bosses (the three partners) made about 5 million each per year
What does your shop do?
Elevator pitch is Full service boutique real estate brokerage. 5 employees. Investment sales, leasing, and starting to segway into development deals. All focused on retail properties.
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