Haas MBA for finance?
Not much here about haas. It seems like haas is ok in consulting and tech but very weak for finance. Would it be a mistake to attend haas with the intention of getting a finance job coming out?
Hi Derivatives, this board is very New York centric, and "M7" centric, which,I had never really spent much time on until getting involved here. If you are interested in tech investment banking, Haas would be a good place to consider. Also, there are a lot of investment managers in California -- ranging from quantitative (lots of financial engineering types because of BlackRock and the former BGI) to an a smattering of hedge funds and fundamental guys.
So, just as an experiment, I went into LinkedIn, plugged in "Haas School of Business" for those who graduated in 2011 (just as a test) and put in MBA as a key word. You'll see people in IB and on the buy side, some big firms (Morgan Stanley), smaller (GCA Savvian). And on the buy side some at BlackRock, some in real estate, and a bunch in the finance offices of companies, mostly on the west coast.
So no, it's not a mistake to go there, but my recommendation would be to first do your research and talk to people who are there who have gone through recruiting!
Haas' finance faculty is pretty impressive, btw, if you are interested in the academic side of things, and they have an impressive finance conference every year. Here is the speaker list from last year: http://berkeleyfinanceconference.com/speaker-bios/
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[quote=Betsy Massar]Hi Derivatives, this board is very New York centric, and "M7" centric, which,I had never really spent much time on until getting involved here. If you are interested in tech investment banking, Haas would be a good place to consider. Also, there are a lot of investment managers in California -- ranging from quantitative (lots of financial engineering types because of BlackRock and the former BGI) to an a smattering of hedge funds and fundamental guys.
So, just as an experiment, I went into LinkedIn, plugged in "Haas School of Business" for those who graduated in 2011 (just as a test) and put in MBA as a key word. You'll see people in IB and on the buy side, some big firms (Morgan Stanley), smaller (GCA Savvian). And on the buy side some at BlackRock, some in real estate, and a bunch in the finance offices of companies, mostly on the west coast.
So no, it's not a mistake to go there, but my recommendation would be to first do your research and talk to people who are there who have gone through recruiting!
Haas' finance faculty is pretty impressive, btw, if you are interested in the academic side of things, and they have an impressive finance conference every year. Here is the speaker list from last year: http://berkeleyfinanceconference.com/speaker-bios/[/quote]
Besty, thanks for the response.
I do have some interest in west coast finance firms like BlackRock, PIMCO, capital group, dodge and cox, etc. However, my worry is that i will be severely handicapped since i would have to compete against stanford gsb students, who are much more coveted by recruiters than haas. And obviously, haas is a no-go for NYC finance jobs.
Derivatives,
I would check the job placement stats for Stanford GSB, and you may find that you're not as handicapped as you think. It is becoming increasingly common for Stanford GSB graduates to pursue the entrepreneurship route. In getting there, many I know are favoring a multi-faceted startup role or an early stage VC role over IB and Asset Management.
Again, this is just judging from the Stanford GSBers that I personally know. I would check the job placement stats to see if this holds true
Here is the link for the class of 2011 placement. Pretty dismal for finance. Only 16% overall went into it-6% for investment and portfolio management. No finance firm hired more than 2 people from haas that year. I know 2011 was a rough year for finance, but this data does seem to lend credence to my earlier view that one should not go to haas unless you are interested in consulting or tech.
http://www.haas.berkeley.edu/groups/careercenter/reports/11_12Stats.htm…
Agreed. Also, don't let a little competition get to you. I'm a financial industry resume coach at the GSB and it's ture, I see quite GSB students who are looking for some traditional roles like at PIMCO and Capital Group and of course the PE and VC shops, but that doesn't mean there's not room for you too.
If you're confident you want finance and not open to consulting/tech/F500, then you should not apply to haas. Even if you get in and attend, you won't get that much out of it. Betsy is right that some west coast investment management shops do recruit there, but they hire VERY few people. PIMCO hires maybe 1 or 2 from haas at most in a given year; booth this year hired 20! Sorry for being a party-pooper here, but haas is just not the right place for finance.
Hi Brady! I still think there's a west coast advantage. I also did notice in its employment report Stanford had a similar percentage into straight investment investment management as Haas. They broke out hedge funds and PE, and indeed, if you are thinking of going to PE, I would say probably not Haas, but that's not really traditional Asset Management. As for hedge funds, I think most are on the east coast.
I still think Haas is not necessarily a bad idea, and worth talking to students who have gone through the recruiting process directly. In the end, we are all a bunch of folks who are interpreting hearsay, and anyone even remotely interested should probably get some first-hand examples
@Derivatives, I'm much less worried that certain houses recruited "less than 2 people" per shop. That's no indicator -- in fact, Stanford boasts that 384 students went to 270 companies. The say that means there's something for everyone.
The other question -- if you are a career switcher, that will also matter. So again, it's worth talking to real Haas grads.
Hey Brady,
I would stick with only M7. None of the other MBA programs get any finance jobs. There are actually only about 3000 MBA jobs available per year and the M7s get all of them.
You guys are acting like he's deciding between GSB and Haas. That's not the issue here. I think Haas can get you into investment management , just fine. And then you can build a track record and move to other shops/hedge funds. After the first post-MBA job , it's all on you anyway.
PE from Haas would be tough though.
@Betsy: Would you say that Stanford GSB has a greater tolerance for non-traditional paths than HBS? Because it seems like the percentage of the Stanford class that is McKinsey/Bain/BCG far outstrips that of HBS. Is it mostly eyewash?
Hi GS, are you talking about non-traditional paths before b-school? I do see a lot of students from those traditional firms, also form traditional IB and PE firms as well. But I don't know if it is any more than HBS. The class is still far smaller than HBS, so that could explain it. I try not to wrap my brain too much around reverse engineering these paths, because it often ends in false causalities.
The more interesting question is: what does it mean for the actual applicant? If you aren't McKinsey, but want to go to Stanford, do you have a shot? Well, um, yes, (provided you have great numbers).
Yeah, glad you clarified on the OP's question, he's not deciding between those two schools. Point taken.
Well, a post MBA non-traditional path would be irrelevant to pre-MBA admissions now wouldnt it - lol!! So , let's ask a simpler question. How many admits have you met with , say , startup jobs pre GSB?
Now, I dont mean Mckinsey + startup , or Goldman Sachs + startup. Obviously , I dont expect hard numbers here, but could you eyeball them for us please?
damn didn't realize HAAS was soo small, ~210 class size. Thought Stern was small at like 400ish per class.
Yes, it's very small, which can be a disadvantage since alumni network is so key in finance. Haas, tuck, sloan, all suffer immensely as a result of this.
Hi again Brady, I bet there would be a whole lot of Tuckies who would argue that their alumni network isn't as strong as any other school on the planet. And... to further play devil's advocate, the Berkeley and MIT are powerhouses in financial engineering and masters of finance, so that the theoretical MBA candidate could network through those relations if so inclined.
Brady and derivatives in the same thread again.
Hey Brady, you are right about the distinction between the MFin and MBA finance jobs in recruiting during school.
But I was thinking of longer-term benefits later in in one's career. I have seen people connect across disciplines from their old schools, hence my comment. I saw this at BGI (now BlackRock) here in the US and in other shops when I worked in Asia.
Bulge Bracket recruiting at Haas MBA (Originally Posted: 11/27/2012)
A lot of people on this forum use the term M7 to refer to MBA schools where a lot of bulge brackets recruit. Does it make sense to accept an MBA offer from a top 10 program if you want to break into IB?
For those of you who don't know:
M7 is HBS, Stanford, Wharton, Chicago, MIT, Kellogg and Columbia.
By top 10 I include Ross, Tuck and Haas.
The school in question here is Haas.
If so, to what extend does it make a difference whether you attend RTH or a lower-tier M7 program (Columbia, Chicago, MIT, Kellogg)? Are there significantly more spots available for people from Columbia and such?
I believe Haas places 0-2 people in the Bay Area offices of all the BBs. Probably 0-3 people total go to NY BB and even less abroad.
Off the top of my head, I know at least 3 people from Haas MBA who interned at BBs in the Bay Area. If you don't know what you're talking about, don't post. You're not helping anybody by making uneducated guesses.
I would have thought Andersen> Haas for IB?
doesnt apply to haas persay but i spoke with a 2nd year student at ross who told me that about 60 people were recruiting for IB (not necessarily BB) internships and about 30 got them.
Fuqua and Stern>>Ross and Haas for IBD Recruiting bro.
These stats are pretty easily available on the employment reports. Haas placed 5% of their 2011 class into IBD and no bank (bulge or otherwise) was among their top 10 hiring firms. Compare that to Booth who placed 20% of the class in IBD with BAML, CS, GS, and MS all in the top 10 of hiring firms.
Remember, some of this is self-selection. Not everyone at Haas wants to be in IB - in fact, a school like Haas has a reputation as being sort of anti-finance, whereas somewhere like Booth is obviously a big finance school.
Curious how is Haas' VC placement? Remember they're a pretty tiny class too, and I think they tend to like tech and entrepreneurial stuff more.
Bottomline - it's safe to say Haas is not ideal if you have a better option (Columbia) lined up?
Could anybody pass me a link with BB placements among top MBA schools?
P.s. I am not a troll. Obviously, I would have done extensive research before I apply to any MBA program, but it's a hypothetical scenario and prefer to do an MBA at the West Coast for personal reasons. Stanford seems to be a bit out of reach, but Columbia / Haas / NYU / Booth are all realistic options. Various sites show different statistics, so I am looking for a reliable source :-)
I don't think there's a link like that, but I could be wrong. Your best bet is to just go to each school's website and look at their employment reports. Some are extremely detailed (Kellogg), others are decent (Columbia, Booth) and others absolutely suck (NYU) but you should be able to get a good idea of their recruiting if you just take the time to visit the sites of the schools you're interested in.
UC Berkeley Haas MBA (Originally Posted: 07/12/2008)
Does anyone have any thoughts or information about UC Berkeley Haas' MBA program? How well does Haas place into San Francisco investment banking? They have a reputation as being a very technology/entrepeneurship oriented school, and not so much a finance school, but I am wondering if anyone can chime in here.
From what I know, it's pretty limited. Getting placed into an SF office at most IBs is very competitive (it's one of the hardest simply because so many people want it) that a good chunk of the associates are from the core recruiting schools (Chicago, Columbia, Wharton, HBS, Kellogg, Sloan, Stanford, Tuck).
Alex Chu
As I understand it, the Haas MBA is one of the better ones for real estate. Doubt anyone will know this, but any idea about real estate recruitment out of Haas (e.g. Development Associate for Kettler, for example)?
Berkeley MBA - will it get me into the door..? (Originally Posted: 05/18/2012)
Was wondering what are the chances of breaking into S&T from Berkeley MBA. There are some firms in the San Francisco area, so I am assuming at least some of them should be actively recruiting, but does anyone have an opinion/insights on this?
Check the placements, they should have a published list.
S&T is really hard out of any mba. Berkeley would be your worst choice if you can attend any other top 10 program.
Forgot to mention that I have 5+ years buy side experience, of which ~3 years as a trade room analyst. I got your point that it is hard and even harder from Haas vs. other target schools, but is it possible, i.e. any on-campus recruiting going on?
anything is possible. you should be dealing in probabilities. and you've already been told that the probability is extremely low. Don't think the work experience changes that.
Exactly. Trading is much more about whether you have the skill to make money or not. No MBA is going to teach you that, especially not a school that is known to be finance-lite relative to some of the other top 10 programs. I think this would be an extreme long shot for the OP.
Very unlikely. BB S&T has been extremely tough for MBAs lately. Even people at wharton/booth/columbia are having a tough time, and most of those who get placed at a desk are in sales, NOT trading.
Your previous job was middle-office; you were not a trader. And haas is pathetically weak in finance. It's a great place for consulting and tech but not finance. Some buyside shops like pimco and dodge&cox do hire a few haas MBAs per year, but that's about it. And in trading, there is almost nothing out there for haas students.
My advice is for you to re-apply to M7 programs next year. That's your only hope.
Why is Berkeley so poorly looked upon?
It's a great school for certain areas. If you want to do consulting, tech, venture capital, haas is great. For east coast finance jobs though, like in trading, hege funds, and investment management, it's very weak. Some west coast shops do recruit there, most notably PIMCO, but by and large haas is not a place to go to if your primary goal is finance.
Berkeley MBA - will it help to get the foot in the door? (Originally Posted: 04/27/2012)
I have been in fixed income management for ~5 years, got an admission offer from Haas MBA full-time program. Was wondering if this help me get into a decent HF post-graduation, given that I do not have an IB experience (have a CFA, though...). Thanks!
Yes
haas is one of those top-rated MBAs that people don't talk about much here on WSO. i really have no idea why... east coast bias i guess?
Haas is great for consulting and tech but very weak in finance. This could be due to self-selection of the student body, but very few haas alums get buyside gigs aside from a few slots at PIMCO each year.
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