Is fundamental analysis better than technical?

Feel free to call me out if I'm misinformed, but it seems that most of the more successful investors/traders are fundamental analysis type people? which one has been proven over time to generate more money, the trader or the investor?

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Comments (87)

Apr 23, 2013

They for different type of investors. Technical analysis is used for day/swing trading.
Fundamental analysis is usually used for long term investing/value investing.

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Apr 23, 2013

At the end of their careers, who made more, the trader of the investor?

"Hold on a sec...you mean they made all this money without doing IB --> PE --> HBS --> PE --> God?
How is this possible?!?!?!!??" - TheKing

Apr 23, 2013

*or

"Hold on a sec...you mean they made all this money without doing IB --> PE --> HBS --> PE --> God?
How is this possible?!?!?!!??" - TheKing

Apr 23, 2013

Dickenscharles, for the sort of advice you're looking for, I think you'd be better off reading some books rather than asking questions on a forum. There's just no way to give a clear answer in this format.

Try The Intelligent Investor, by Benjamin Graham with the commentary by Jason Zweig. It contains two things you may find useful: one is a book about investing by one of the first rigorous fundamental analysts (at least, the first one who is widely known), and a commentary by a financial journalist that connects the lessons from the book to events in the history of the stock market, such as the dot-com crash. The original book is a classic, while the commentary already feels dated, but both will make the basics of investing more clear to you.

Apr 23, 2013

I am amazed this question has come up. Technical analysis in and of itself does not make sense. The only power it has is to identify where other muppets may try and trade the stock so there may be small pockets of resistance which survive until the size players (who are 100% fundamental analysis) drive over them.

If your goal is to pip $300/$400 on a good day, you may be able to play these 'technicals' as nothing more than self fulfilling but anyone who uses them in the realm of professional investing (beyond coming up with arbitrary entry points to build a fundamental position) doesn't deserve to earn the money they are being payed.

I get hit with a good 10 - 15 emails a day from brokers shifting technical levels because they want to get face time with me but have nothing better to write and sometimes these levels are correct, sometimes they are not correct. Sometimes (more often than not) brokers will give 'bands of resistance/support' so they are more likely to be correct but this defeats the whole point.

I have trawled through a tonne of research regarding back testing technical indicators and have never found a detailed, unbiased conclusion that any specific strategy works and if you have 30 different technical indicators to choose from, you can confirm any technical hypothesis by conveniently ignoring the techs that tell you what you don't want to hear.

By looking at volume and price you can sometimes determine where large buyers may be sitting but these buyers may be wrong in the end or may be over-run by even bigger sellers.

If I were you, I would spend my time trawling through company reports and broker research in order to understand a holistic approach to investing and instead of technicals, concentrate on macro indicators.

TL;DR Technicals are god awful

1percentblog.com

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Apr 23, 2013

technical analysis = astrology

''You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you need to concentrate on.'' -- President George W. Bush
0.5 bb

Apr 23, 2013

are apples better than oranges?

Apr 23, 2013

For those of you bashing technical analysis---I'd love to hear your personal stories as to why it doesn't work. I've seen a number of traders (in the commodities and fx space) who trade on ONLY technicals and consistently beat the market. I've also seen technical traders fail as I have with fundamental traders. My favorite type of trader is the one that rolls out of bed 30 minutes before the bell, listens to his IPOD on the train in the morning, updates his fantasy team pre-open, and then walks into the pit or up to his screen and prints money during the day.

I'm not arguing this is the proper way to prepare for a day in the market but it goes to the point I am trying to make. Trading is 100% about feel and whatever structure or system trader's create to explain their trading strategy or whatever data or charts they use to justify decisions are all part of a general "feel" for the market. Some traders develop feel through fundamentals, others charts, others can walk into a pit and smell the market.

***This does not apply to black box systems or algo-trading

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Apr 23, 2013
CornTrader wrote:

For those of you bashing technical analysis---I'd love to hear your personal stories as to why it doesn't work. I've seen a number of traders (in the commodities and fx space) who trade on ONLY technicals and consistently beat the market. I've also seen technical traders fail as I have with fundamental traders. My favorite type of trader is the one that rolls out of bed 30 minutes before the bell, listens to his IPOD on the train in the morning, updates his fantasy team pre-open, and then walks into the pit or up to his screen and prints money during the day.

I'm not arguing this is the proper way to prepare for a day in the market but it goes to the point I am trying to make. Trading is 100% about feel and whatever structure or system trader's create to explain their trading strategy or whatever data or charts they use to justify decisions are all part of a general "feel" for the market. Some traders develop feel through fundamentals, others charts, others can walk into a pit and smell the market.

***This does not apply to black box systems or algo-trading

You're talking about trading in the pits which isn't solely based on technical trading. You have and know customer orders, resting bids/ offers, speed of execution, different flow not seen by other participants are all things that lead to asynchronous information which can give you an edge.

These 'feel' traders are becoming less and less profitable in general or have already died when expectation finally caught up with them. But trust me I'm not saying that technicals don't provide any value though.

Apr 23, 2013

I can smell the monkey shlt I threw at you bra

1percentblog.com

Apr 23, 2013

fundamental is used to find what to buy, technical is used to find when to buy it

Apr 23, 2013

@wilder a small part of my experience is based on trading in the pit and your certainly right about the "feel" traders in the pit. Those guys are a dying breed. My point on feel was clouded in my op. Great traders get comfortable with a system whether that be the method redrut suggests or a technical approach and develop feel based on that system. I agree with @redrut that you can't pay attention to 30 charts sent from 10 different analysts. I do believe that if you are trading one particular product and you have a series of charts and indicators that you like to look at---it is possible to develop feel around those indicators and be a succesful trader based solely on technicals.

I am now done arguing this because I don't really care, never used technicals when I did trade, and have since transitioned to a sales desk. I've seen what I've seen Redrut your monkey shit smells like strawberries.

Apr 23, 2013

Paul Tudor Jones had a good interview where he mentioned how half the money he's made. The other half is from fundamentals. He said how when he was starting out, there was a lot of volatility in the markets and not enough information to make sense of it all. Fundamental analysis wasn't as practical back then and so he said a lot of traders from his generation make money using technicals. Then, when data was available, and finance began to catch the eye of academics, people naturally felt a need to explain what was happening and fundamentals became more and more mainstream. However, there isn't always an explanation and factors are constantly changing, so a lot of fundamental analysis is just junk as well.

There are studies on how fundamental analysis is just as poor as technicals. the market is basically efficient so you really need to know your shit to get anywhere. The recent ER post mentioned how a good chunk of the job is just sales.

Apr 24, 2013

couchy amazed you can see fundamental analysis as poor as technicals, can you send me the study link. Furthermore, a lot of ER is adjusting WACC's to be on the right side of your corporate access and it's really the buy side or untainted research that would be of most value

1percentblog.com

Jun 5, 2013

bump

"Hold on a sec...you mean they made all this money without doing IB --> PE --> HBS --> PE --> God?
How is this possible?!?!?!!??" - TheKing

Jun 5, 2013

there was a huge thread on fundamentals v. pig entrails/astrology and other technicals not too long ago. Play with that search function.

Jun 5, 2013
Cartwright wrote:

there was a huge thread on fundamentals v. pig entrails/astrology and other technicals not too long ago. Play with that search function.

And I thought I was the moron.

Jun 5, 2013

I think almost all retail people that actively trade, or so they think they classify themselves as traders, are gambling. I'm still of the belief that there is a prominent split b/w FA and TA - I use charts more than fundamentals, but would not classify myself as either.

One point someone made to me a while back is worth considering regarding charting. If everyone uses charts then many times things are self-fulfilling prophesies, so to speak. For example, if there is clearly a down channel on a chart that you can almost guarantee some type of bounce b/c everyone sees it and will act accordingly. Granted, this is a 50,000 foot view of things, but I think you get my point. If everyone believes something will happen then there's a good chance it will if they're all putting on the same trade.

Or, this can all make no sense and I'm talking out of my ass. I'm sure someone will point that out.

Jun 5, 2013

Anyone who completely dismisses technical analysis is foolish.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

Jun 5, 2013
happypantsmcgee:

Anyone who completely dismisses technical analysis is foolish.

I think you're absolutely right. I think fundamental analysis is much more important and valid for long-only funds, investors and value investors. Most people don't have that time frame and technical analysis is much more useful.

Jun 5, 2013
happypantsmcgee wrote:

Anyone who completely dismisses technical analysis is foolish.

Not only do I completely dismiss technical analysis. I make fun of those who even consider this alchemic endeavor. I also make fun of those who try to "time" their buy and sells.

Jun 5, 2013
New Yorker wrote:
happypantsmcgee wrote:

Anyone who completely dismisses technical analysis is foolish.

Not only do I completely dismiss technical analysis. I make fun of those who even consider this alchemic endeavor. I also make fun of those who try to "time" their buy and sells.

Well technicals relate to price, so when GS JPM BAC CS all say that XYZ is supposed to be priced at $40 dollars wouldn't you expect there to be a lot of people selling at $40 dollars (ie resistance level)? They base their pricing on fundamentals (earnings,etc.) but technical analysis can show if that is a place where there are a lot of seller at that $40 price. Technical analysis is really just basic common sense supply and demand. All that MACD and Stochastics bullshit doesn't really mean anything. Tech. analysis does not necessarily mean that it is about "timing" (which i also concur with you that it's essentially stupid to "time" something) but rather where a stock/bond/swap has a buyer or seller at a price. The market wants a product at a specific price and technicals try to show what that price is. Basing positions purely on technicals is foolish but there are too many people in the market that base there trades/positions on technicals which validates its existence and it is up to you if you want to adapt to it or not.

Jun 5, 2013
New Yorker:
happypantsmcgee:

Anyone who completely dismisses technical analysis is foolish.

Not only do I completely dismiss technical analysis. I make fun of those who even consider this alchemic endeavor. I also make fun of those who try to "time" their buy and sells.

Hmmm... So you are saying not only are u foolish, but you are also (insecurely) arrogant? It's a fact that many commodity traders use technical analysis... So to get in their head, you have to learn it. Check out Mark Fisher's book.

Jun 5, 2013

Technicals matter a great deal for timing, including on fundamental trades unless you have a multi-year time frame. A lot of the biggest macro guys use both. Say you wanted to express a fundamental view on currencies, looking at technical factors before loading up on spot/futures could be the difference between getting stopped out and riding something huge (said the actress to the bishop).

Jun 5, 2013

Ok, i only dismiss it a little bit.

Jun 5, 2013

Use fundamentals to get an idea of what your play look like, use technicals to time your entry/exit.

Jun 5, 2013
oSnap wrote:

Use fundamentals to get an idea of what your play look like, use technicals to time your entry/exit.

This.

Jun 5, 2013

oSnap is absolutely right. People who ignore technical analysis need to know that market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent. In crude oil trading, I know candlesticks are used very often by traders. At the same time, keep your technical simple...

Jun 5, 2013

I can't remember who said it, but trading is like being lost in the woods behind your house. Your house has a light on the porch that you can barely make out, but which keeps you on the right track. Those are the fundamentals. Yet you also need a lantern to see what is right in front of you. Those are the technicals. Without either one of them you will spend a lot of time lost in the woods.

Jun 5, 2013

Technical analysis is nonsense unless there is a fundamental reason underlying the technical. For instance if China is stepping in and buying treasuries everytime yields hit 3%, then there is gonna be a resistence level at 3%. When people start talking about "head and shoulders" patterns and "death crosses" that stuff is nonsense. I personally know of algo traders who manipulate these self-defeating patterns and do it alot faster than you can.

Jun 5, 2013

Some questions that I like to think about:

Does everyone viewing a chart interpret the technicals the same way? For example Tyrets, many can see a downward trend and some interpretations will be favoring momentum while others will be betting on mean-reversion. Why do you expect a bounce in a downtrend versus further liquidation/shorting pressure?

Just because a price level has increased buying and selling pressure, does that necessarily mean changes in price won't be random?

Technical analysis is a lagging indicator. In what instances does TA lead to a verifiable and quantifiable edge versus all the empirically tested instances in which it does not?

Even if you know there has been buying/selling pressure at a level before (the example above using China buying at 3%), do you know that it will happen again with the same size and that you can take advantage of it before price impacts and HFTs?

Jun 5, 2013

Ibreitst, those are some really good questions and I hesitate to weigh in as there are others that have more experience than myself but I will say this, there are other kinds of technical analysis beyond charts with Bollinger bands and the like. There are firms that base a huge amount of their analysis on technicals and do very well and there is a certification devoted to the practice so I feel like those two facts, among others, lend some credibility to it, even in the eyes of people like New Yorker.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

Jun 5, 2013

the only places where people really use technicals in an investment bank is in FX (and some cash equities traders).

More important is finding out the flows of money.

Jun 5, 2013

I have a question. When talking about "technicals" do you guys mean quantitative methods in general?

Jun 5, 2013

They are both useful, I don't understand why people think they have to chose one or the other

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Jun 5, 2013

I tend to take a fundamental view on Rates markets. However I always confirm through price action/technicals. In order to truly analyse a market/company, you must understand the fundamentals of it. In order to make money, you have to select smart entries/exits, which is easier using a hybrid of fundamental and technical analysis.

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Jun 5, 2013

Both will come into play - depending on time horizon, both are usually used together.

differenct fundamentals for different energy products: NG vs Crude etc.

For energy, Macro events and indicators (payroll #'s, central bank decisions, political disruption) play more into price movements than pure supply/demand numbers (such as doe, api, etc). and currency movements will affect the WTI-Brent spread as well.

When dealing with spreads such as crack spreads - supply/demand indicators and technicals can come into play moreso than macro events.

Also, some traders like different technicals -- I know that candles, and bollinger bands are used by some for crude oil moreso than Fib retracements and the others.

Jun 5, 2013

Both. Depends on product and term.

Jun 5, 2013

Thanks for the input guys I really appreciate it. I go to school in Texas and I'm hoping to get an internship in energy trading next summer.

Are there any resources in particular (books/websites/etc) that would be useful to learn more about becoming a successful energy trader?

Jun 5, 2013

KeepYourDistance, what are you majoring in?

(I want to become an energy trader myself)

Jun 5, 2013

Monty has listed all the books. I would say start at the EIA website too.

Jun 5, 2013

Also, some traders like different technicals -- I know that candles, and bollinger bands are used by some for crude oil moreso than Fib retracements and the others.

Oh you know this? Really? Please reread what you wrote and realize how stupid it sounds!

"Oh the ladies ever tell you that you look like a fucking optical illusion" - Frank Slaughtery 25th Hour.

Jun 5, 2013
trade4size:

Also, some traders like different technicals -- I know that candles, and bollinger bands are used by some for crude oil moreso than Fib retracements and the others.

Oh you know this? Really? Please reread what you wrote and realize how stupid it sounds!

I was thinking the exact thing.

Jun 5, 2013

please explain why you would say that- different traders like different technicals for different products
whats wrong with that statement?

why is it so neccesary to be a dousche on here. Either help or don't, make a statement or correct one...it goes to show the true nerds - because if you were in normal social situations with normal people and were condescending like this, someone would open you up.

Jun 5, 2013

Oh you again...

Because it just sounds ridiculous the way you are saying it as if the norm for energy traders is a certain set of technicals vs another. The real answer is it varies a lot. I am becoming increasingly annoyed with people that spout off like they know everything. I am not even going to pretend i know which technicals an energy trader uses because I dont know.

Unless you work in the area then neither do you.

You do not have thick skin you need to get off wall street asap. You obviously dont work on a desk because if you had you would know the short fuses that traders have and will easily rip into others.

"Oh the ladies ever tell you that you look like a fucking optical illusion" - Frank Slaughtery 25th Hour.

Jun 5, 2013

Anyways...

Back to the topic, @marcellus thanks for the recommendation on the EIA website. I've been reading through that and it's really good. Where can I find Monty's list of books? I looked on his profile and threads but had trouble finding it

Jun 5, 2013

http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/new-wso-reco...
But after this week, I would say neither fundamentals/technical matter in this annoying stupid short-term focused congested market. Hoping and praying we keep getting record weather is the way to go.

Jun 5, 2013
marcellus_wallace:

http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/new-wso-reco...
But after this week, I would say neither fundamentals/technical matter in this annoying stupid short-term focused congested market. Hoping and praying we keep getting record weather is the way to go.

PJM is my baby.... hehe

Jun 5, 2013
monty09:
marcellus_wallace:

//www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/new-wso-recommended...

But after this week, I would say neither fundamentals/technical matter in this annoying stupid short-term focused congested market. Hoping and praying we keep getting record weather is the way to go.

PJM is my baby.... hehe

I do not want to imagine how trading term PJM has been lately. Even short-term yikes. This madness lasted 3 days this time. But I bet we see it again in August.

Jun 5, 2013
marcellus_wallace:
monty09:
marcellus_wallace:

//www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/new-wso-recommended...

But after this week, I would say neither fundamentals/technical matter in this annoying stupid short-term focused congested market. Hoping and praying we keep getting record weather is the way to go.

PJM is my baby.... hehe

I do not want to imagine how trading term PJM has been lately. Even short-term yikes. This madness lasted 3 days this time. But I bet we see it again in August.

BC was at $410 less then a hour ago

Jun 5, 2013
marcellus_wallace wrote:
monty09 wrote:
marcellus_wallace wrote:

//www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/new-wso-recommended...

But after this week, I would say neither fundamentals/technical matter in this annoying stupid short-term focused congested market. Hoping and praying we keep getting record weather is the way to go.

PJM is my baby.... hehe

I do not want to imagine how trading term PJM has been lately. Even short-term yikes. This madness lasted 3 days this time. But I bet we see it again in August.

Term hasn't really been that volatile. It has moved, but nothing like cash, which had $100 range Thursday, and damn near that on Friday. I think Aug PJM actually sold off Thursday. Thank god for tobacco products or I think I'd have lost it over the past week.

To answer the question on tech vs. fundamental, it really depends on desk and person. In power, lots of guys take huge positions based on fundamentals, while others take smaller positions but trade in and out based on technicals. To each their own...

Jun 5, 2013

Electricity Markets: Pricing, Structures and Economics
Energy Trading and Investing
Liar's Poker
Moneyball
Monkey Business
The King of Oil
The New New Thing
The Smartest Guys in The Room
Trading Commodities and Financial Futures: A Step by Step Guide to Mastering the Markets, 3rd
Trading Natural Gas
Understanding Today's Electricity Business
Understanding Today's Natural Gas Business

pass the SB's now

if anyone is in Houston I could toss you most of these as they are sitting on my shelf

Jun 5, 2013

Best book I seen on physcial trading of crude and products...Crude 101. Tough read because its more of a textbook rather than a novel..

Jun 5, 2013

Energy trading and Investing blows "Oil 101" out of the water. Although totally different books, Oil 101 is way too much in-depth

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Jun 5, 2013
Revolution:

Energy trading and Investing blows "Oil 101" out of the water. Although totally different books, Oil 101 is way too much in-depth

agreed. '"oil 101" is great if you want to get acquainted with oil markets and gain a solid foundation for understanding up-/mid-/dowstream developments. but, unless you're trading wet barrels, some of the chapters may not be all that helpful (i.e. make you a better trader).

Jun 5, 2013

Currently reading Trading Natural Gas. Goes pretty in-depth on the different hedging techniques(swings, index, basis swaps). Great book on nat gas trading

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Jun 5, 2013

Thanks guys I appreciate all the input. I just started reading Energy Trading and Investing by Davis Edwards and so far it seems to be a good introductory book.

Jun 5, 2013

Can't wait to read King of Oil monty, heard it is excellent. Gonna pick it up after work for a weekend read.

Jun 5, 2013
porkbellies wrote:

Can't wait to read King of Oil monty, heard it is excellent. Gonna pick it up after work for a weekend read.

i liked it

Jun 5, 2013

I just started reading Trader's First Book on Commodities. Anyone read this yet? It seems pretty accessible so far.

Jun 5, 2013
NorthEastIdiot wrote:

I just started reading Trader's First Book on Commodities. Anyone read this yet? It seems pretty accessible so far.

I have not. Can you post a link and your thoughts on it?

Jun 5, 2013

http://www.amazon.com/Traders-First-Book-Commoditi...
So far, I think it gives a decent overview of futures and the commodities market, in general; however, my background is in equity research (with a focus on ag and metals) so I have zero trading experience. For me so far this is a perfect primer: it's easy to read, very dumbed down, and the breadth is wide. It's exactly what I wanted so that I could get a better grasp on the markets that so largely affect the equities I cover.

Amazon reviews are largely positive and it costs $3 for the Kindle copy.

Considering I may want to go into commodities trading in the future I feel this book is giving me a sense of the risks of doing so (the author is very honest about the pitfalls of commodities).

Jun 5, 2013

In case of this kind of Trading, I say Technical and fundamental should be use at the same time. Instances may occur that your fundamentals will or can further make your technical reliable enough.

Jun 5, 2013

Just bought The King of Oil. Gonna read it as soon as I'm done with Liar's Poker (tomorrow).

Jun 5, 2013

Trading Commodities and Financial Futures: A Step by Step Guide to Mastering the Markets, 3rd

How is that book for someone about to enter commodities trading? I want to learn the basics of the mechanics of commodities futures and maybe some fundamental aspects as well but across commodity classes not just oil and natural gas.

Jun 5, 2013

The two used in concert make a powerful combination

Jun 5, 2013

For crude: Fundamentals -- Physical arbs and re-negotiating contracts at the lease. Only have experience with crude and bio diesel, so I'm not going to chime in on any other commodities.

Jun 5, 2013

i look at correlations between different products, such as how AAPL moves relative to the S&P in the short term. or RSI when something is oversold. In my opinion, the most important part about fundamental investing is that you should build your position overtime rather than all at once

Jun 5, 2013

http://markets.ft.com/screener/predefinedscreens.asp

Also check out the magic formula investing method of Greenblatt. Ranking of companies by earnings yield and return on invested capital.

"...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

  • Schopenhauer
Jun 5, 2013
seabird:

http://markets.ft.com/screener/predefinedscreens.asp

Also check out the magic formula investing method of Greenblatt. Ranking of companies by earnings yield and return on invested capital.

These look like screens for finding stocks. I was referring more of technical analysis to try to time the entry/addition/trim/exit of stocks within a portfolio. Specifically, a lot of time my PMs will ask when I recommend buying or selling shares and I usually answer with fundamentals. I'm trying to increase my technical skills to complement my fundamental analysis skills.

Jun 5, 2013

In that case, you should look in to the magic formula investing method specifically. He discussed in his book "the little book that beats the market" the timing for entering positions, and when to exit (he doesnt hold for more than a year, and recommends a rotating selection of stocks based off of his criteria) and given that his method is quantitative, it should be relevant. Also, in general, the value investors would recommend getting in to a stock when its 30-50% below what they consider to be "intrinsic value" or whatever.

"...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

  • Schopenhauer
Jun 5, 2013
seabird:

In that case, you should look in to the magic formula investing method specifically. He discussed in his book "the little book that beats the market" the timing for entering positions, and when to exit (he doesnt hold for more than a year, and recommends a rotating selection of stocks based off of his criteria) and given that his method is quantitative, it should be relevant. Also, in general, the value investors would recommend getting in to a stock when its 30-50% below what they consider to be "intrinsic value" or whatever.

aren't the two ratios used in the magic formula EBIT / net working capital + net tangible assets, and EBIT / EV to determine rankings?

Jun 5, 2013
packmate:

aren't the two ratios used in the magic formula EBIT / net working capital + net tangible assets, and EBIT / EV to determine rankings?

Ya, a ranking of those two, ranking stocks with a minimum size (50m) and then adding them up and making investments based off of the highest ranked ones.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_formula_investing

"...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

  • Schopenhauer
Jun 5, 2013

MACD confirmation, stochastics, RSI, ATR

Disclaimer for the Kids: Any forward-looking statements are solely for informational purposes and cannot be taken as investment advice. Consult your moms before deciding where to invest.

Jun 5, 2013

I know Mike Burry supposedly used technicals to time his entries. Only hard and fast rule of his I know though is "Sell on new lows."

Jun 5, 2013

RSI and MACD

Jun 5, 2013
NYarb:

RSI and MACD

I'm starting go love the rsi

Jun 5, 2013

I'm a big fan of the triple inverted backflip candlestick flame

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Jun 5, 2013

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