The Sad Truth

I have noticed some changes in my life since I have pursued a Wall Street career, and most of which are pretty sad and disturbing to me. I am still in undergrad, but I spend almost all of my time away from friends, and anyone else for that matter, because I am doing internships, networking and teaching myself Finance. Sure I go out with them, but it isn't the same now.

I have noticed, I cant even be around my group of friends without completely judging them now. It is fucking sad. Its like I ALWAYS have to be around kids that want to be on the street like myself, which is fine, and I really do prefer it. But to think that I dislike my previous group of friends because of my career path is sad, and pathetic even. I also find myself extremely hostile, and even angry, and minuscule things or small stuff that my friends try to say to joke about the industry or wall street in general. Its like I get pissed off because they just have no clue what we go through and how hard I work to get to where I am, but they still make jokes about wall street and how "they will make more money than any wall street guy." Retarded friends right? I feel like everyone has this, although maybe not, but its weird and it doesn't feel normal that I get so engaged over small comments like that, and how I judge everyone now because of this career path. Similarly, I walk down Madison ave and see a guy in a black suit with thick and wide pinstripes, and I say to myself "what the fuck is this guy doing?" I immediately think to myself afterward why I have such a ridiculous thought process now and how judgmental I am on everyone. I truly don't like this, and maybe it is because I am young or something, but I hope that others have been through this before and its not just me. I honestly feel like.... Feel like a fucking dick.

Help intervene me from douchiness and close-mindedness. I really do not like it.

 

don't be a dick, the world doesn't revolve around your career and frankly people don't give a shit about "how hard you worked to get where you are today". if this is how you are acting/feeling in undergrad, you're gonna be fucking miserable down the road and most people will probably despise you. understand that people value different things in life and have different ways of spending their time and care about accomplishing different shit with their time here on earth. if you can't go out with people that aren't interested/working in finance and have fun, i feel incredibly sorry for you.

 

You are literally the only person that can solve this problem. Get some hobbies and diversify your friend group. Don't let your career, which hasn't even started, define how you treat others and your entire perspective.

 

Family is the thing that has kept me grounded - you just need to be put in your place. As a young person, you have so much that you have not experienced. Hardships, heartbreak, things that take a toll on your life. These are the things that will define you, not a Brioni suit (as nice as it may be). We see examples of people all the time that think their job or title makes them better than others.

Honestly, that's what your friends may think of you. If they are your real friends they likely sense the newly developed anger and frustration that you are referring to. It likely puts them in an uncomfortable position and the best way they know how to deal with it is to make it a joke, knock you down a peg and make you realize you haven't done anything yet.

All of your accomplishments are a product of your hard work and perseverance. But it does not stop here. There will always be a new job, a new girl, a new idea that you will chase that tears you away from your old life. What is important is understanding who and what is important you throughout those experiences. I suggest taking a step back sometimes, thinking about what really makes you tick and enjoying your successes.

Whenever you feel a wave of arrogance overcoming you, just remind yourself, you havent done shit yet. Wait until your a BSD. Then itll be hard when your stuntin on a jumbotron

 

Couldn't agree with you guys any more. I really think this whole hustle-hustle-hustle mentality and period in my life has become everything I am, right now at least. Its terrible, and I agree with everything that you all said. Its not that I think I am better than them, it's not that. Its more like I think "they have no fucking clue how anything works" type of thoughts.

"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest." - Benjamin Franklin
 
StudentLoanBackedSecurities:

Couldn't agree with you guys any more. I really think this whole hustle-hustle-hustle mentality and period in my life has become everything I am, right now at least. Its terrible, and I agree with everything that you all said. Its not that I think I am better than them, it's not that. Its more like I think "they have no fucking clue how anything works" type of thoughts.

Dude no one can specialize in everything. I'm sure you're a smart guy and know this. But you have to internally accept that people have different skills and abilities than you. I'm far from a fashion expert but I can still critique my friends' outfits. If we were to only talk about topics that we specialize in, do you know how dry human interactions would become?

Yeah people talk about things they know nothing about. It's how you react to it that reveal your core beliefs. We can only point out the obvious. Only you can internalize and re-align your values towards a more positive realm.

 
BlackHat:

Have you considered the possibility that you're just an asshole? You can fix this, but we can't fix it for you.

Maybe I am, considering I chuckled when reading this...

No, im actually not at all. Its really only with my friends, not family or co workers or anyone else.

"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest." - Benjamin Franklin
 
BepBep12:

Another great thread in a series of great threads... OP keep it up brah. Haters 'gon hate.

If you're referring to the one last night, that was not me. go read it again..

"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest." - Benjamin Franklin
 
JYFresh:
StudentLoanBackedSecurities:

Couldn't agree with you guys any more. I really think this whole hustle-hustle-hustle mentality and period in my life has become everything I am, right now at least. Its terrible, and I agree with everything that you all said. Its not that I think I am better than them, it's not that. Its more like I think "they have no fucking clue how anything works" type of thoughts.

Dude no one can specialize in everything. I'm sure you're a smart guy and know this. But you have to internally accept that people have different skills and abilities than you. I'm far from a fashion expert but I can still critique my friends' outfits. If we were to only talk about topics that we specialize in, do you know how dry human interactions would become?

Yeah people talk about things they know nothing about. It's how you react to it that reveal your core beliefs. We can only point out the obvious. Only you can internalize and re-align your values towards a more positive realm.

This is probably the best response. Thanks

"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest." - Benjamin Franklin
 
Best Response
  1. Your friends in college probably won't be your friends when you're 40, no matter what career path you take. Correlation does not mean causation.
  2. Wanting to only hang out with finance dudes is pretty lame of you. Especially as a college student.
  3. Working on Wall Street will definitely make you more of an asshole. I know that for sure (just read some of my stupid posts on this website to get a flavor of what I'm referring to). But, it is also likely that just getting older makes you more of an asshole. I don't know that for sure though, because this is all I've ever done professionally. Maybe just getting out in the real world makes you a little more like some crusty old man.
  4. Being judgmental is sort of part of life, I think. Everybody does it, but few admit it. The guy playing ukulele on the subway looks at the suits and thinks 'what a bunch of sell-outs'. Of course, the suits think 'what a bum'. I think recognizing this tendency in yourself and trying to actively counteract it is healthy. We all make trade-offs in life, few of these choices are absolutely right or absolutely wrong, just preferences.
 

I can't speak to whether or not you're an asshole, but impatience with other people is a byproduct of working in this industry. Of course, you don't work in this industry yet, but I'm not surprised to see it rub off on you early on. Once you get good at what you do and you have a few people under you who execute your commands instantaneously and without question, you will really see how impatience spills out into your home life and relationships with friends. If you're not careful, "Because I fucking said so" will become your default answer in life any time someone asks you "Why?"

 

According to your profile, you're born in March 1993. That means you've just recently stopped being a teenager and mentally you're still in the age where self-affirmation comes from all sorts of silly things; how much money your parents have, being "cool", telling other people they suck etc.

If you're aware of your shortcomings, try to change them. Everything that you deem "cool" now will have changed (unless you for some reason stay the exact same forever) in five years and you will be looking back at your own attitude and laugh because you're almost embarrassed how silly you used to bee. That's how growing up and maturing work like.

 

Going through this also. I'm losing friends left and right because they don't understand why I can't hang out over the weekend. The GF is losing patience as well. I'm humbled by the amount of sacrifice others have put in before me. This industry takes a toll on you and does impact your personality for the worse. It's much easier to hang out with other finance types [or consultants in my case], as they are the only ones who understand what you go through on day to day basis.

It's important that you take a step back and truly evaluate what you want in life. Not sure where you live, but if you have any hiking trails or mountains nearby, take a day to just hike and think alone. It really helps you clear your thoughts and put things into perspective. Just the ability to escape the hustle and grind for a day is extremely valuable in terms how pleasant your personality is.

 

Your friends that you have now, probably aren't even your real friends. They like having you around because they find joy in calling you an A-Hole. If you really want to see who your true friends are... move. The ones that are helping you pack up the truck or unload the truck are the real friends. Unless of course you are such a big a-hole that EVERYONE helps pack you up so you can leave faster.

Don't let Wall street be your life. If it wasn't for networking events to better my career prospects and my friends that I had prior to them working in banking, outside of work, I wouldn't talk finance, or hang out with finance people on purpose. I'd cut myself off. My job is not my life. I have hobbies, a fiance, a puppy, friends, etc all to take my attention away from my job after I leave. When I hang out with my friends we rarely ever talk about work aside from, "how's your job" and then pretty much that's it. We have other things that we talk about or do. If all we talked about was finance, they wouldn't be my friend anymore because I wouldn't ever talk to them.

Also, because you aren't even in the industry yet, don't let your future salary aspirations make you feel superior. My hometown where most of my friends are, 60k a year a really good salary. Half of my friends haven't even attended college. Do I look down on them for that? Of course not. I'm not interviewing them for a job and that has no effect on the person they are.

I'm ranting now and lost my train of thought so I'm just going to submit it here.

tl;dr

Don' be an asshole because you want to work in finance. Don't judge your friends because they don't care about finance. As a person, you're no better than anyone else.

make it hard to spot the general by working like a soldier
 

I've realized that I have experienced the same issue, but to a smaller degree. I just came to the conclusion that friends/family deserve respect, and that there is no real excuse to be an asshole to them. Even though I may have a shitty/stressful day at the office, I need to realize that this should never translate to my interactions with people outside of work.

I also have rarely been a judgmental person, so it rarely bothers me what other people do. All my friends and family are respectful of my career and personal choices, and even though they sometimes toss jokes around (about bankers stealing stuff, or about different SEC court cases), I know they are rarely serious, so I often joke around as well and play the asshole banker persona.

 

Telling people you work for GS IBD will give finance nerds a hard on. Other than that I can't say anyone really cares. It does not entitle you to judge people or feel superior to them.

As a side note: the most successful people are usually humble, it's usually some guy in BO pounding his chest.

 

One of the most difficult things about coming from a non-target that people seem to overlook is the complete lack of ambition by 90% of your peers. I'm not talking Wall Street ambition, but any goals or ideas whatsoever. Most people I know will occasionally talk about "making it" but have no clue the steps to take to get there.

Your friends will have many dumb thoughts on the industry, just laugh and move on. But whatever you do don't let them hold you back. Most of them are too fearful of change to persue their dreams. Enjoy your friends, don't be an awful person, but realize that you are looking for different things in life

 
MonkeyNoise:

One of the most difficult things about coming from a non-target that people seem to overlook is the complete lack of ambition by 90% of your peers. I'm not talking Wall Street ambition, but any goals or ideas whatsoever. Most people I know will occasionally talk about "making it" but have no clue the steps to take to get there.

Your friends will have many dumb thoughts on the industry, just laugh and move on. But whatever you do don't let them hold you back. Most of them are too fearful of change to persue their dreams. Enjoy your friends, don't be an awful person, but realize that you are looking for different things in life

This is spot on. Thanks for the feedback

"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest." - Benjamin Franklin
 

No problem. Some of the best decisions in life I have made were things that many of my friends simply didn't understand. I frequently heard "why are you joining x organization", "why x top ranked grad school, why not go to big local state school", "why go abroad", "why this top internship in another state, work locally"

You got to bust through it man, it's tough but trust me in the end it is worth it

 

People in this industry, especially ones at the top, are generally miserable. Actually, any professional services firm under a partnership structure are infested with people that are generally overworked, overweight, and miserable.

That said, the vast, vast majority of people in this world comprise of a big cesspool of resource devouring organisms that spend most of their lives worrying about how to get a larger share of the shrinking pie, rather than trying to enlarge the pie so everyone is better off. Hey, if people are cheating to get ahead (and society apparently rewards and accepts many of them), why not?

But don't fall into that pathetic pile of mediocrity. People are generally assholes because either 1) some asshole has treated them very poorly over a prolonged period of time, whether it be family, school, or work; or 2) something in their life is making them miserable and they have never emerged from puberty to learn to deal with it like an adult.

Set your sights on something larger than just bi-weekly paychecks. Try to accomplish a goal that would propel mankind or society a step forward, regardless of how small of a step it may be. Build small, achievable milestones and gradually progress towards this goal, and always remember that you are not perfect, you have your strengths and weaknesses, and you always need team members to mitigate what you lack to help you accomplish what you've set out to do. Show respect when respect is due, but know when to put your foot down when you need to.

Then, when you've finally achieved some degree of success, be sure to remember to share your wealth to others.

 
MonkeyNoise:

One of the most difficult things about coming from a non-target that people seem to overlook is the complete lack of ambition by 90% of your peers. I'm not talking Wall Street ambition, but any goals or ideas whatsoever. Most people I know will occasionally talk about "making it" but have no clue the steps to take to get there.

Your friends will have many dumb thoughts on the industry, just laugh and move on. But whatever you do don't let them hold you back. Most of them are too fearful of change to persue their dreams. Enjoy your friends, don't be an awful person, but realize that you are looking for different things in life

this is good advice and i will take it a step further. most of my friends in high school came from very working class, blue collar families and as i became somewhat successfull (im not even talking anything major, just graduated college, got a decent job, etc) I would get alot of shitt from them about having changed, being a pussy, etc. The bottom line is that most people have herd mentality and they do not want others to succeed even if they are so-called friends because it highlights their own failures. This isnt just about finance or your job its about everything in life. When people see you doing something new or unique to better yourself you ALWAYS will get pushabck...as I get older in fact I realize this pushback is actually a great indicator that i am doing somehting right, not wrong. Experience has actually taught me that alot of success is just about being able to plow through the negativity of others and being strong enough to go your own way.

Bottom line: friends who dont support your goals arent friends, they are selfish people and you need to ditch them ASAP and find new friends who are positive people. And the converse is that you should always be supportive of other people...when a friend tells you some plan he has to do something new your first reaction shouldnt be "you cant do that" it should be more like "that sounds fukking awesome, how can i help?"

(there is also an outside chance you are just acting like a douchebag in which case the above may not apply)

 

It looks to me like there is a difference between how you think now and how you used to think. You are changing and your friends don't change in the same way and that will cause some frictions. Generally we don't get to spend a lot of our free time with our co-workers, so emotionally they don't tend to matter that much. Also family is given and you can't really change it, you have been used to this for a long time. With friends is a completely different story: these are the people that you choose to spend a lot of your free time with and normally you would expect them to support you. For you a career in finance seems to be quite important and obviously it will bug you that your friends don't seem to have your back. What you have to understand is that they probably just don't have the knowledge to help you out; they might have done so in the past and if they are good friends they will help you in the future in other areas, but not in this one as they just can't do it. One way to cope with this is to relax when your friends make jokes, just remember the good things they have done for you in the past. Finance is filled with dickheads, there will come a time when you will need your friends to remind you that there is a life outside finance. Remember that life isn't all about money; and while they are important, for some people it will matter more, for some less. The financial sector tends to be a different world than the regular one and it's not all happy and rosy, otherwise there wouldn't be so many sad and miserable people in it. You can also meet and hang out with people that share your interest in finance: in that way you can discuss career plans etc. with them.

 
Toshi83:

People in this industry, especially ones at the top, are generally miserable. Actually, any professional services firm under a partnership structure are infested with people that are generally overworked, overweight, and miserable.

That said, the vast, vast majority of people in this world comprise of a big cesspool of resource devouring organisms that spend most of their lives worrying about how to get a larger share of the shrinking pie, rather than trying to enlarge the pie so everyone is better off. Hey, if people are cheating to get ahead (and society apparently rewards and accepts many of them), why not?

But don't fall into that pathetic pile of mediocrity. People are generally assholes because either 1) some asshole has treated them very poorly over a prolonged period of time, whether it be family, school, or work; or 2) something in their life is making them miserable and they have never emerged from puberty to learn to deal with it like an adult.

Set your sights on something larger than just bi-weekly paychecks. Try to accomplish a goal that would propel mankind or society a step forward, regardless of how small of a step it may be. Build small, achievable milestones and gradually progress towards this goal, and always remember that you are not perfect, you have your strengths and weaknesses, and you always need team members to mitigate what you lack to help you accomplish what you've set out to do. Show respect when respect is due, but know when to put your foot down when you need to.

Then, when you've finally achieved some degree of success, be sure to remember to share your wealth to others.

Great post. Will banana later.

 
Bondarb:
MonkeyNoise:

One of the most difficult things about coming from a non-target that people seem to overlook is the complete lack of ambition by 90% of your peers. I'm not talking Wall Street ambition, but any goals or ideas whatsoever. Most people I know will occasionally talk about "making it" but have no clue the steps to take to get there.

Your friends will have many dumb thoughts on the industry, just laugh and move on. But whatever you do don't let them hold you back. Most of them are too fearful of change to persue their dreams. Enjoy your friends, don't be an awful person, but realize that you are looking for different things in life

this is good advice and i will take it a step further. most of my friends in high school came from very working class, blue collar families and as i became somewhat successfull (im not even talking anything major, just graduated college, got a decent job, etc) I would get alot of shitt from them about having changed, being a pussy, etc. The bottom line is that most people have herd mentality and they do not want others to succeed even if they are so-called friends because it highlights their own failures. This isnt just about finance or your job its about everything in life. When people see you doing something new or unique to better yourself you ALWAYS will get pushabck...as I get older in fact I realize this pushback is actually a great indicator that i am doing somehting right, not wrong. Experience has actually taught me that alot of success is just about being able to plow through the negativity of others and being strong enough to go your own way.

Bottom line: friends who dont support your goals arent friends, they are selfish people and you need to ditch them ASAP and find new friends who are positive people. And the converse is that you should always be supportive of other people...when a friend tells you some plan he has to do something new your first reaction shouldnt be "you cant do that" it should be more like "that sounds fukking awesome, how can i help?"

(there is also an outside chance you are just acting like a douchebag in which case the above may not apply)

Great post, outstanding really. Reminds me why I haven't spoken to anyone from high school in 15 years
 
Bondarb:
The bottom line is that most people have herd mentality and they do not want others to succeed even if they are so-called friends because it highlights their own failures. This isnt just about finance or your job its about everything in life. When people see you doing something new or unique to better yourself you ALWAYS will get pushabck...as I get older in fact I realize this pushback is actually a great indicator that i am doing somehting right, not wrong. Experience has actually taught me that alot of success is just about being able to plow through the negativity of others and being strong enough to go your own way.

Excellent post very well put.

I think I can probably count on one hand the people I knew from high school or middle school that I would bother even saying hi to now if I saw them somewhere. And I consider myself a relatively nice guy...

 
Bondarb:

this is good advice and i will take it a step further. most of my friends in high school came from very working class, blue collar families and as i became somewhat successfull (im not even talking anything major, just graduated college, got a decent job, etc) I would get alot of shitt from them about having changed, being a pussy, etc. The bottom line is that most people have herd mentality and they do not want others to succeed even if they are so-called friends because it highlights their own failures. This isnt just about finance or your job its about everything in life. When people see you doing something new or unique to better yourself you ALWAYS will get pushabck...as I get older in fact I realize this pushback is actually a great indicator that i am doing somehting right, not wrong. Experience has actually taught me that alot of success is just about being able to plow through the negativity of others and being strong enough to go your own way.

Bottom line: friends who dont support your goals arent friends, they are selfish people and you need to ditch them ASAP and find new friends who are positive people. And the converse is that you should always be supportive of other people...when a friend tells you some plan he has to do something new your first reaction shouldnt be "you cant do that" it should be more like "that sounds fukking awesome, how can i help?"

(there is also an outside chance you are just acting like a douchebag in which case the above may not apply)

This is spot-on. Most people don't want to see you succeed, including and especially other finance guys. In general, everyone other than your closest, most loyal friends would rather see the success gap between you and them minimized than for you to dramatically outperform them. And, ironically, a lot of times, success will cost you more "friends" than it will gain you.

The epitome of this is around the PE recruiting cycle: all the first years frantically running around asking each other where they are in the interview process, if they have jobs, etc. Ostensibly, they pretend to care about your well being; in truth, they are just trying to benchmark their performance against that of their peers. This is quite prominently displayed when the first analyst picks up some top-notch offer, and everyone replies - with a suspiciously high pitch - "ohhhh that's great!!! Congrats!!" In truth, most are probably thinking, "How did HE get that offer over me? Must have family connections or something, surely..."

"For all the tribulations in our lives, for all the troubles that remain in the world, the decline of violence is an accomplishment we can savor, and an impetus to cherish the forces of civilization and enlightenment that made it possible."
 

I have to admit, I think like that too a bit. Coming out of undergrad, I had friends who were working at Evercore and GS and top shit an I was so jealous. Of course, instead of congratulating them all I could think of was "how could that incompetent fuck get that instead of me". I have always benchmarked myself versus everyone else; you cannot underestimate how valuable it is to just be satisfied with where you are. I guess I'm glad in that respect that I got out of the rat race and work in an environment where there's less competitiveness. I've been in this rat race my entire life from high school where people would compare SATs, then compare college acceptances, then in college where you would compare internships, and now in the professional world where people do it with titles or firm reputation. Maybe one day I'll reach a point where I can just be content with my career path and not constantly be worrying about how to network or switch jobs to gain some incremental increase in salary or prestige.

 
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

Maybe I'm still too young to have seen the worst of it, but up to this point I'd have thought they were some of my best friends.

I hate victims who respect their executioners
 
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

Maybe I'm still too young to have seen the worst of it, but up to this point I'd have thought they were some of my best friends.

Yeah, I'm not 100% on board with this notion either. I'm still pals with a few guys from back in the day, and that's over 20 years now. There's definitely an element of competition in the business and a lot of guys will screw you for an opportunity without giving it a second thought, but some of the guys I encountered in the business were rock solid and we've been friends ever since.

 
UFOinsider:
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

I'm coming to terms with this lately

As long as a workplace has benefits (tangible or intangible) that are scarce and unevenly distributed and interchangeable (what can be given to one can instead be given to another), this is spot on.

 
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

Maybe I'm still too young to have seen the worst of it, but up to this point I'd have thought they were some of my best friends.

I am good friends with plenty of former colleagues. But, it's not really the same while you're working together. Too much competitiveness. Or, maybe I'm just an asshole....
 
SirTradesaLot:
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

Maybe I'm still too young to have seen the worst of it, but up to this point I'd have thought they were some of my best friends.

I am good friends with plenty of former colleagues. But, it's not really the same while you're working together. Too much competitiveness. Or, maybe I'm just an asshole....

When everyone is comped based on the fund's performance, it's kind of hard to want to stab anyone in the back. But I'll bet your experience is a lot more common at big shops and/or in banking or any other structure where your pay/mobility is a function of your performance relative to your coworkers. Even then, there's good people out there no matter what, though I'd agree they're harder to find in this industry (especially in banking!)

I hate victims who respect their executioners
 
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

Maybe I'm still too young to have seen the worst of it, but up to this point I'd have thought they were some of my best friends.

I am good friends with plenty of former colleagues. But, it's not really the same while you're working together. Too much competitiveness. Or, maybe I'm just an asshole....

When everyone is comped based on the fund's performance, it's kind of hard to want to stab anyone in the back. But I'll bet your experience is a lot more common at big shops and/or in banking or any other structure where your pay/mobility is a function of your performance relative to your coworkers. Even then, there's good people out there no matter what, though I'd agree they're harder to find in this industry (especially in banking!)

My last firm was like that. Everybody had a pre-defined piece of the action. Many people were pretty good friends with each other. I was not. I like keeping some level of professional distance, in general, for a number of reasons, including not wanting to feel some false sense of loyalty to the firm because my 'friends' are there. I'm not saying I don't want to be friends with people because I want to stab them in the back, but more I like to keep business as business. (More specifically to the people in that firm, most of the people were good co-workers, but weren't the type of people I would have been friends with anyway.). I think you're more likely to have some sort of emotional blow out with 'friends' vs. people where it's strictly business. In the bigger firms, it's pretty important to be more distant because you never know when you will become someone's boss or they could become yours. It's harder to fire a friend, even if it's the right thing to do.
 

just remember, even if you get an IBD job, you will still be a poor dad and a someone elses lackey

if you started a business from scratch, you'd have every right to be a douche to people, but you're just a nerd who thinks hes better than everyone because of some preconceived notion that you think people give a fuck about banking

alpha currency trader wanna-be
 
watersign:

just remember, even if you get an IBD job, you will still be a poor dad and a someone elses lackey

if you started a business from scratch, you'd have every right to be a douche to people, but you're just a nerd who thinks hes better than everyone because of some preconceived notion that you think people give a fuck about banking

You do realize that you sound even more pretentious than the biggest finance jerks I have ever met?

It's very odd that society scorns bankers who think they are important, but applauds entrepreneurs who think they are the rulers of the universe. Let me tell you: Facebook is not important. It's more meaningful work than being an MD, but it's not justification for being a certified prick.

"For all the tribulations in our lives, for all the troubles that remain in the world, the decline of violence is an accomplishment we can savor, and an impetus to cherish the forces of civilization and enlightenment that made it possible."
 
NorthSider:
watersign:

just remember, even if you get an IBD job, you will still be a poor dad and a someone elses lackey

if you started a business from scratch, you'd have every right to be a douche to people, but you're just a nerd who thinks hes better than everyone because of some preconceived notion that you think people give a fuck about banking

You do realize that you sound even more pretentious than the biggest finance jerks I have ever met?

It's very odd that society scorns bankers who think they are important, but applauds entrepreneurs who think they are the rulers of the universe. Let me tell you: Facebook is not important. It's more meaningful work than being an MD, but it's not justification for being a certified prick.

did i say start a tech company and work with bankers to IPO useless companies?? no

if you're going to be a douche about something, atleast build it yourself..not compete with the other hamsters such as the majority of this site over "prestige" and "exit opp"

please, give me a fucking break. the only exit opps these days are to throw your own sail into the winds, not begging someone else for the opportunity to hoist theirs

alpha currency trader wanna-be
 
SirTradesaLot:
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:
BlackHat:
SirTradesaLot:

Your co-workers are never your friends. Many young people don't get that.

Maybe I'm still too young to have seen the worst of it, but up to this point I'd have thought they were some of my best friends.

I am good friends with plenty of former colleagues. But, it's not really the same while you're working together. Too much competitiveness. Or, maybe I'm just an asshole....

When everyone is comped based on the fund's performance, it's kind of hard to want to stab anyone in the back. But I'll bet your experience is a lot more common at big shops and/or in banking or any other structure where your pay/mobility is a function of your performance relative to your coworkers. Even then, there's good people out there no matter what, though I'd agree they're harder to find in this industry (especially in banking!)

My last firm was like that. Everybody had a pre-defined piece of the action. Many people were pretty good friends with each other. I was not. I like keeping some level of professional distance, in general, for a number of reasons, including not wanting to feel some false sense of loyalty to the firm because my 'friends' are there. I'm not saying I don't want to be friends with people because I want to stab them in the back, but more I like to keep business as business. (More specifically to the people in that firm, most of the people were good co-workers, but weren't the type of people I would have been friends with anyway.). I think you're more likely to have some sort of emotional blow out with 'friends' vs. people where it's strictly business. In the bigger firms, it's pretty important to be more distant because you never know when you will become someone's boss or they could become yours. It's harder to fire a friend, even if it's the right thing to do.

It's sad but absolutely true. I find it's easier to be friends with former colleauges, co-workers from different teams or those with different life priorities (other than their career). Some of them are truely amazing people. But you are unlikely to be friends with people whose interest may potentially conflict with yours, e.g. current co-workers... Blame no one. It's just human nature.

The Auto Show
 
SirTradesaLot:
I'm not saying I don't want to be friends with people because I want to stab them in the back, but more I like to keep business as business.
SirTradesaLot:
It's harder to fire a friend, even if it's the right thing to do.

In other words...stab in the FRONT.

On a really good day, set phasers to stun. pew pew. pew.

To be honest, I'm not sure I could ever pull the trigger to 'fire' at someone, not that I've ever had the chance to do so. Maybe that's why I'll never get to be a manager of any kind.

 
Going Concern:
SirTradesaLot:

I'm not saying I don't want to be friends with people because I want to stab them in the back, but more I like to keep business as business.

SirTradesaLot:

It's harder to fire a friend, even if it's the right thing to do.

In other words...stab in the FRONT.

On a really good day, set phasers to stun. pew pew. pew.

To be honest, I'm not sure I could ever pull the trigger to 'fire' at someone, not that I've ever had the chance to do so. Maybe that's why I'll never get to be a manager of any kind.

That is correct. You can't see their eyes if you stab them in the back. (not srs)

Believe it or not, I'm actually firing someone tomorrow. 5-10 years ago, I would have lost sleep over it. This time, I didn't even remember I was going to fire someone until this evening when I checked my calendar for tomorrow. This is what I was referring to about becoming an asshole (I was not kidding or exaggerating). You really become desensitized to things if you do them enough. It's the nature of the beast. I'm not so sadistic that I take pleasure in it, but I'm definitely not losing any sleep over it.

Also, trust me, you could fire someone. Usually, you're doing them a favor, assuming they are ambitious. It's better to fire them and let them find a better path than to have them stagnate in a position for a long time.

 
SirTradesaLot:
Going Concern:
SirTradesaLot:

I'm not saying I don't want to be friends with people because I want to stab them in the back, but more I like to keep business as business.

SirTradesaLot:

It's harder to fire a friend, even if it's the right thing to do.

In other words...stab in the FRONT.

On a really good day, set phasers to stun. pew pew. pew.

To be honest, I'm not sure I could ever pull the trigger to 'fire' at someone, not that I've ever had the chance to do so. Maybe that's why I'll never get to be a manager of any kind.

That is correct. You can't see their eyes if you stab them in the back. (not srs)

Believe it or not, I'm actually firing someone tomorrow. 5-10 years ago, I would have lost sleep over it. This time, I didn't even remember I was going to fire someone until this evening when I checked my calendar for tomorrow. This is what I was referring to about becoming an asshole (I was not kidding or exaggerating). You really become desensitized to things if you do them enough. It's the nature of the beast. I'm not so sadistic that I take pleasure in it, but I'm definitely not losing any sleep over it.

Also, trust me, you could fire someone. Usually, you're doing them a favor, assuming they are ambitious. It's better to fire them and let them find a better path than to have them stagnate in a position for a long time.

LOL, wow. If it were me I would reduce their bonus and responsibility and let them quit on their own. Maybe you are setting them on a better path, but I think I would still feel way too guilty on the possibility that this isn't the case.

 
Going Concern:
SirTradesaLot:

LOL, wow. If it were me I would reduce their bonus and responsibility and let them quit on their own. Maybe you are setting them on a better path, but I think I would still feel way too guilty on the possibility that this isn't the case.

You can't let mediocrity infect your team, it's contagious. Harsh? Maybe, but it's true.
 
Going Concern:

LOL, wow. If it were me I would reduce their bonus and responsibility and let them quit on their own. Maybe you are setting them on a better path, but I think I would still feel way too guilty on the possibility that this isn't the case.

In case you were wondering, the firing today went delightfully well.
 

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