Which non-target would I be better off at?

slapshot101303's picture
Rank: Monkey | 30

Well I have been accepted into IU Kelley and Colgate university and was wondering which one would increase my odds at landing an Ibanking gig. It seems that both schools send some people to Ibanks, and I'm currently leaning towards IU Kelley because it will be about 21k as opposed to 50k at Colgate but I want wanted to make sure I'm not screwing myself in the long run.

Comments (32)

Apr 2, 2010

My understanding is that Colgate is the better school, and has stronger East Coast connections.

The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.

    • 1
Apr 2, 2010

IU Kelley: business program, more relevant education, but more competition from like-minded students
Colgate: liberal arts education, "slightly smarter alumni" (does that equate to more successful alumni- not sure), much smaller class which is better for alumni connections

It's really a toss up and hard to decide. If you think you can get top grades at Kelley and shine then I would go there.

Apr 2, 2010

toothpaste?

Apr 2, 2010

kelley. no offense, but these schools will do jack shit for you when an employer sees these names on a resume.

go to the cheaper one. might as well get a business education.

Apr 2, 2010

I think Kelley is your choice for the following reasons:

A) Huge Alumni base. There are enough alumni that I'm sure out there in the world there are more than a few Kelley grads who have somehow or another gotten into the finance world, and I would like to think that they woudl be ecstatic to help out another IU alum, seeing as to how it is so rare to see one. Big Ten schools are known for looking after their own, when a school has competitive sports teams, it really brings the students together. Also, if an IU grad can't help you, there's a big enough Big Ten alumni base that will be willing to help you since, for the same reasons, they feel like their own kind is not well represented (this is of course excluding Northwestern and Michigan who will probably look down on IU, but the others would probably be willing to help).

B) Kelley actually is a decent business school compared to other non-targets, that tends to rank at least in the top 50 usually. Can't say the same about Colgate. It's good enough that I wouldn't be surprised if a few local boutiques go to recruit there (Indiana boutiques know they aren't getting Harvard kids). OK, so it's not Goldman Sachs, but it will give you something to work with and to work your way up with.

Apr 2, 2010

Colgate had lots of Bear Stearns connections, and so now JPM connections.

  • vanillathunder12
  •  Apr 2, 2010

So I came across some information that might actually be relevant.

For SA internships the summer of 2010 (not FT), Kelley placed the following:

1 - Nomura - Corp. Fin.
2 - Deutsche Bank - Corp. Fin.
1 - Leerink Swann - Corp. Fin.
7 - BAML - 5 Corp. Fin., 2 PWM
4 - UBS - Corp Fin.
1 - William Blair - Corp Fin
1 - SEO - Corp Fin
7 - JP Morgan - 1 Corp Fin, 6 PWM
3 - Houlihan Lokey - Corp Fin
1 - Perella Weinberg - Corp Fin
1 - Morgan Stanley - Corp Fin
1 - HSBC - Corp Fin
1 - CitiGroup - Corp Fin
1 - BB&T - Corp Fin
1 - Sandler O'Neill - Corp Fin
1 - Lazard - Corp Fin
4 - Goldman Sachs - Corp Fin
2 - BP Integrated Trading - Sales & Trading
2 - Keybanc Capital Markets - 1 Research, 1 Sales & Trading
1 - Birinyi Associates - Research
1 - RBC Capital Markets - Research
2 - Group One Trading - Sales & Trading
1 - Permal Group - Research
1 - Royal Bank of Scotland - Corp Fin
1 - Grosvenor Capital Management - Long/short

I was told FT is about the same.

Apr 2, 2010

The Kelley Investment Banking Workshop has been sending 20+ kids to Wall Street for a while now. Getting in to the IBW is challenging, but once in opportunities are available at top shops.

Apr 2, 2010
buffalo banker:

The Kelley Investment Banking Workshop has been sending 20+ kids to Wall Street for a while now. Getting in to the IBW is challenging, but once in opportunities are available at top shops.

This is the same thing I was gonna talk about. If you get in this program, you will likely get an IB gig. If you're not in this program though, it's gonna be a lot more difficult. If you're a hard, motivated worker, then take Kelley.

Side note, I think lots of big 10 programs are stepping up their walls street placement. I'm a state over at UIUC and we just became a target for Goldman, and I know people SAing at Lazard, JP, Citi, many others.

Apr 2, 2010
Yamas:
buffalo banker:

The Kelley Investment Banking Workshop has been sending 20+ kids to Wall Street for a while now. Getting in to the IBW is challenging, but once in opportunities are available at top shops.

Side note, I think lots of big 10 programs are stepping up their walls street placement. I'm a state over at UIUC and we just became a target for Goldman, and I know people SAing at Lazard, JP, Citi, many others.

Agreed, especially for Chicago BBs

Apr 2, 2010

IU Kelley without a doubt. I've met tons of kids from that school on the street, never seen anyone from Colgate. The cheaper price on top of that makes it a no brainer.

Apr 2, 2010

I would choose colgate.

Apr 2, 2010

If you think your able to get into IBD then you should be able to show that in the application process of the Investment Banking Workshop for IU.

If you don't think your going to get in after your freshmen year, try to transfer to Michigan, NW or something of that status.

Big Ten IB placement programs work because you have a lot of alum working hard for you. You're basically set if you get into Wisconsin's IB Club, U of Illinois's FRIM?, IU's IBW, Michigan State's FMI?, or Iowa's Hawkinson Institute (BTW IU's group was the original I believe and the best currently, and props to Wisconsin and U of Illinois, because I believe your programs are not funded by the the college). I would say its almost harder coming from a UofM or NW if your middle of the pack. Those 2 schools send maybe 40-50 to good firms each out of how many that try to place at those firms (100-200)? The other programs probably place 10-30 per year when only 20-60 apply (I am trying to say that 50% get it in)

Indiana because of the IBW placement, but for both you will have to be top of your class

Apr 2, 2010

I'd go with Indiana. The workshop definitely helps out and adds a certain amount of legitimacy to these otherwise non-targets. If you are confident you can bust out a 3.8+ GPA right away and show a true interest/passion for getting on to Wall St., these programs should be very realistic to get in.

A lot of where you end up is directly correlated to where you have alum - so given the proximity of Indiana to Chi, there's probably a bigger likelihood you end up there but by no means do you need to rule out NYC.

Finally, consider the atmosphere of the schools. Big 10 in general, while not known as being prestigious, have sick campuses with fun kids. When you go out, you'll have a blast. Colgate... can't say from experience but I doubt it compares. Going to a Big 10 and getting into one of these programs will definitely take a commitment on your part to not completely get caught up in the party scene with the majority of degens who go to these schools but just keep your eye on the prize.

Apr 2, 2010
PaperTrail:

Finally, consider the atmosphere of the schools. Big 10 in general, while not known as being prestigious, have sick campuses with fun kids. When you go out, you'll have a blast. Colgate... can't say from experience but I doubt it compares. Going to a Big 10 and getting into one of these programs will definitely take a commitment on your part to not completely get caught up in the party scene with the majority of degens who go to these schools but just keep your eye on the prize.

I'd say that the Big 10 is the third, tied with the Pac 10, most academically prestigious major conference after Ivy and ACC. It's not like it's the Big 12 or Mountain West.

Northwestern, Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois and to a lesser extent Penn State/IU/OSU are all top schools. I'd hardly call the majority of the people who attend these schools degenerates.

Apr 2, 2010
Affirmative_Action_Walrus][quote=PaperTrail:

Northwestern, Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois and to a lesser extent Penn State/IU/OSU are all top schools. I'd hardly call the majority of the people who attend these schools degenerates.

haha, just to clarify - I use the term "degens" loosely and half-jokingly. Interesting to note you'd place the Big 10 after Ivy and ACC. Never really thought about that, but seems like you might have a good point w/ schools like UM and NW.

  • vanillathunder12
  •  Apr 2, 2010

With the stats I posted above for Kelley; here are are locations those students will be interning:

1 Hong Kong
21 New York
3 San Francisco
16 Chicago
1 Richmond
1 Minneapolis
2 Cleveland
1 Greenwich
1 Houston
1 Dallas
1 Indianapolis
1 Philadelphia
1 Columbus
1 New Jersey (I know it's not a city, but that is what the info I got says)

Apr 2, 2010

IU Kelley

"Whenever I'm about to do something, I think, 'Would an idiot do that?' And if they would, I do NOT do that thing."
-Dwight Schrute, "The Office"-

Apr 2, 2010

Almost went to Colgate, seemed like they had a strong alumni base on Wall Street. My buddy transfered there and is now with a BB in NY.

Apr 2, 2010

that's strange b/c im fairly confident the OP made a direct inquiry about IU bloomington fucksville

Apr 2, 2010

im sorry the fucksville relevance pertains to the Investment banking society they have over there. Fucking morons have a whole group to help them learn how to plug in numbers.

Best Response
  • vanillathunder12
  •  Apr 2, 2010

Woah woah woah, slow down there. All I have done is post stats about a school the OP specifically asked about. These stats will probably be found useful for the OP and has contributed to this thread. You have not posted any facts and have only given your opinion based on no data presented. I think you are reverting to curse words and insults to make up for your lack of quality reasons to attend Colgate.

If you want to turn this into a 7th grade insult fest then your mother died suffocating on my cock and I proceeded to fuck her in the ear after she died. Your sister joined in and then commented I was much better than you at satisfying her. After I finished and was in your living room your father came out of the closet and mentioned that he never loved your mother. We all then went to coldstone and had icecream.

    • 3
Apr 2, 2010

We are called the Aristocrats!

Apr 2, 2010

buddy, you are f'ing hilarious. Im glad you enjoyed my mother and non existent sister, still doesn't change the fact that you probably got a 1800 on your SAT's and you are at an academic institution that is ranked around 70th in the nation according to US News. Either way, still doesn't change the fact that you are a dumb fuck and i'm sorry i was going to fast for you.

  • all in good fun don't take it personally
  • vanillathunder12
  •  Apr 2, 2010

^ Those are legitimate reasons against IU. It is true that Indiana is not ranked very high in US News and the average SAT score is not stellar. They are certainly factors the OP should take into account.

Apr 2, 2010

Colgate over IU in a heartbeat. IU is a joke of a school...

    • 1
Apr 2, 2010

to the OP

if you are positive you will get into the IU Business School and that banking club or whatever is and do well academically, then IU is the cheaper and better choice. If you aren't sure about this, go to Colgate as it is a much more highly regarded (overall) institution.

Apr 2, 2010

Lets try and keep this civil people. Jesus, any mention of a schools name bring an onslaught of insults.

Colgate is a solid liberal arts college. IU is a large state university. Both have pro's and cons. I think both will require effort to break into banking. My advice is to pick the school that you like better. This is 4 years of your life, some would argue the best 4 year. Pick the place that you will be able to have the best experiences and make the most friends while still obtaining a quality education.

Apr 3, 2010

To add to AnthonyD's post above, keep in mind it takes effort to break into banking regardless of where you go to school. Obviously some places make it easier than others, but by no means are you guaranteed to succeed. With that said, I think its fair to say the two schools you're looking at are pretty close. If you will do well at one, most likely you'll do well at the other. From my perspective, I'd go with IU, if for no other reason than saving 6figs over your college career.

Apr 5, 2010
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Apr 5, 2010