Mod Note (Andy): Best of Eddie, this was originally posted on 9/27/12.
I was talking to a female friend of mine who happens to be an atheist last week, and she was telling me about how she attended a church in NYC just to get into the good books of the head of admissions at the preschool she wanted her son to attend, who also happened to be a member of that church. Ultimately, her kid didn't make the cut. We laughed about it, of course, but it shows the lengths to which some parents will go to give their kid a leg up in life.
So I guess it stands to reason that some parents think it makes sense to spend $43,000 a year for high school. Yup, you read that right. 43 GRAND. A year. As in $200,000 for a high school diploma.
Predictably, 47 of the 50 most expensive high schools in America are located in the Northeast, with the three outliers located in California. And I think it's important to note that the quoted tuition figures do not include room and board; it's just straight tuition. So what exactly are you walking away with (aside from a high school diploma and a bunch of Marc Ecko gear) after your folks cough up two hundred grand?
Are you pretty much guaranteed a Goldman internship the summer before your freshman year at Yale? Or are you already too rich to concern yourself with such menial things as gainful employment? I'm only half joking here. Part of me is really curious about what you're getting for all the money.
It might surprise some of you but I actually went to prep school, where I found new and exciting ways to disappoint my parents almost daily. At the time it was one of the most expensive high schools in Northern California (this was still before Silicon Valley got completely out of hand). I remember my parents struggling mightily to make those $2,500 annual tuition payments (and probably asking themselves why they were doing it every time they got a call from the dean or another letter threatening my suspension).
When I was doing research for this post I thought I'd check in with my alma mater and see what they were gouging parents for these days. $17,000 a year, and I graduated 25 years ago. So, definitely not cheap but not crazy expensive like the schools on this list.
I'll be the first to admit that I didn't leverage the potential network I had access to. Some of the guys I graduated with went on to do some interesting stuff (one of them was the Chief Privacy Officer for Facebook and was nearly elected California Attorney General in the last election). But if I didn't like hanging out with them then I can't imagine they're any more tolerable today. I'm sure the feeling's mutual; out of a graduating class of 287 all but one went on to college. I'll give you three guesses as to who fucked up my class's perfect record.
Anyway, I'd love to hear from any of you who attended any of the schools on this list. Is there such a thing as a "target" high school? There must be, right? Otherwise, why would you spend this kind of dough on a surly teenager who's probably gonna wreck your new Mercedes and/or impregnate some underage girl (or, if he's particularly gifted, accomplish both feats simultaneously)?
It just doesn't get more WASPy than forty grand a year for high school.
There are a lot of such schools in the EU (International Schools etc..). Its filled with kids from expats and most of the time the company pays for the school as part of the relocation package. I can safely say from personal experience that its VERY good in terms of early networking. Most of the kids I know from there went to good universities and have great jobs today.
Is it because of connections or because of their hard work at a top high-school ? (about 90% of people I know either took the IB or AP exams) Up to you to judge... I personally think its a bit of everything.
Raises Hand. I was one of those third world kids. However in my own experience probably just like in public school there were a lot of superstars and a lot of fuckups. Some of my peers have good jobs and some 'work' for their dads.
Yeah, trust me on that, there was also its fair share of fuck-ups too... some chick in one year close to mine became a cheap internet pr0n "star".. (and since i know ur going to ask, no, she was fucking ugly).
One of my friends claims that he pays £40,000 p.a. as primary/elementary school fees for his two girls. The average masters at the LSE or Oxbridge costs between £13,000 to £25,000 depending on the subject... Bewildering.
I went to college with NE prep school grads, and honestly think that I would want my kid to go to one if I have the means. It does confer an advantage,aside from the overall quality of education being markedly better than a public school.
(a) You are exposed to more competitive peers. Having a driven peer group pushes you to succeed. Achievement is normal.
(b) Students are indoctrinated into the elite. They develop the "correct" world views for somebody in the upper class. They develop interests in common with their affluent peers. The learn what investment banking is freshman year of HS instead of sophomore year of college.
(c) The network and shared experience with other prep school grads. Use it like a college alumni network. The parents there are likely to extremely successful as well.
I agree with all these points. A and C are fairly obvious, but I think B is also very important too.
Also - the schools on this list were among the top high schools represented at my college (HYP) aside from the magnet schools like TJ/Bronx Science/Stuyvesant/etc.
It's true. I can tell you right now I can point out of a group of uber successful people which ones went to " elite prep" schools and which ones didn't. You are at an age where you wholly adopt that mentality unlike after college. You can tell the ones who were trained to act a certain way and the ones who naturally are just that way.
It's pretty much dead-on correct, though.
I know a girl at Columbia who's Russian, like daughter of an oligarch Russian. She went to some private school in the Swiss alps that I looked up once, tuition+r&b was ~100k/year. Obviously after that I got down on one knee but us commoner scum are not allowed into her picky incestuous bloodline.
Le Rosey, I'm guessing; not too bad a school. Their winter campus is near to my city but I'm surprised she made it into Columbia.
So I went to a prep school in my area (~15k a year) and I have a few opinions on the matter. First off, I ended up at a great college and it has paid dividends but I don't attribute that to my prep school. I was near top of my class, all AP classes, and 3 varsity sports. That is why I got into the college I did. I know numerous kids who went to my school and their parents paid that 60K for a high school diploma for their child to go to the local state school and the parents end up paying less for college than high school. Its all what you make of it and no matter how much money your parents through at your education, the fact is that colleges want the top scoring (SAT/ACT) students and from various backgrounds. Every prep school has students on both ends of the spectrum and its only marginally better than going to a good public school.
Now for uber-selective prep schools (Exeter, Andover, etc.) they are a cut above and I would say they are more worth the time.
http://www.forbes.com/2010/04/29/best-prep-schools-2010-opinions-privat…
something to make you laugh...school in my area (Cambridge) has a school that starts preK at 21 K and moves up to 28K by 8th grade
http://www.cfsmass.org/admission/affording/payment_options
[quote=hockey1316]something to make you laugh...school in my area (Cambridge) has a school that starts preK at 21 K and moves up to 28K by 8th grade
http://www.cfsmass.org/admission/affording/payment_options[/quote] That's nothing. Try $40,000 for Pre-K.
I would never in a million years send my kids to a school like that. My worry is that they could become a pretentious d-bag...,it's hard enough to prevent that if you're living in a nice area that has good public schools. I ascribe some value to my kids not thinking that medical doctors are 'poor'.
To be fair, I grew up in the boonies and didn't go to or know anybody who went to, schools like that growing up, so maybe my impression is off. Also, I'm not sure it makes a huge difference by sending your kids to the public school in Greenwich.
I feel like if you can't make it from a very good public school, it's probably a waste of time/money going to a very expensive private school.
If your kids can cut it, the top high schools in Paris are public and free and they make the academics at any of the aforementioned private high schools look like a joke.
Only time I could see private school being justified is if the local public schools are just awful. But, chances are that if you're making good money, you live in an area with good public schools. I went to a great public high school and turned out just fine, as did 99% of my high school class.
Spending college money on high school just seems insane, in my view.
New York exists. If you have the cash and don't want to move to the suburbs, private is your only options and demand blows supply out of the water.
I also don't think many of those people end up with the bearing that Heister mentioned. New York is too much of a melting pot of influences. You tend to see that much more often in European old money or first-generation European expats from families with emerging market money.
As far as correct world views, those places turn out as many flaming liberals that reject the system as they do clean-cut conservatives looking to work within it. Arguably more, there is a quantum of wealth for whom tax rates are irrelevant.
candidates must include le rosey, brillemont, eton.
in the US, i think the collegiate school and st. paul's still has that level of exclusivity.
when your football team is nationally ranked, you're at a preftigious high school
All my brothers and sisters ended up going to private boarding schools, but I begged my parents to let me go to the local public school so I could play sports at a more competitive level. Eventually, they gave in and I don't regret it one bit. I got to play along side and make good friends with a few guys who are currently playing at the pro level. My brothers and sisters didn't turn out to be shit heads either, which is good.
I will never send my kid to a prestigious school. There are lots of good public schools and many good private/catholic schools. If the kid is going to do well it won't be because of the school it will be because of what he teaches himself.
Went to catholic HS..will send my kid to same HS i went to if I end up living in the same area..good hockey team and plan on breeding my kid to lay people out like Dion Pheneuf from an early early age
I like Tony P's style.... You can get into your "target" school with sports, school will take care of its self(if you're a good parent). Half of the kids play sports at these target schools any ways...
I know that I would not have worked as hard in high school if I wasn't surrounded by people all working extremely hard and caring about things like extracurriculars, getting into college, APs, etc. It's hard to realize how important grades are when you enter high school at 12 years old. I certainly would not have cared.
In middle school I was in a pretty underrepresented weight class (119, I weight almost 150 now though lol). In my 8th grade I was getting recruited by Fieldston, Riverdale, Horace Mann, Tabor, Taft, among others for a wrestling scholarship. All schools more or less gave me half off, but my dad gave me the option that "either I'll pay for your college, or I'll pay for high school."
I eventually chose for my dad to help pay college. The reasoning was because I wanted to go to school in NYC no matter what, and so there were only two schools that I was hoping (okay, I was begging) to get into: NYU and Columbia. Anyways, 100K dollars for High School is no joke. When I visited the schools I would venture to say almost half of the kids had parents who were HNWI. (1 million in assets besides their homes).
Would I send my kids to private school? It's way too early to think (I'm 20), but I would definitely think about it and give them that option.
I went to one of these schools and I will absolutely send my boy (all boy's school) there when I have kids. The network alone is worth it as well as the education. The placement out of my school in particular is borderline insane.
But it was damn near some of my toughest years.
I mean, that's what I heard about Regis.
Man, I give these schools credit, and when I find a way to profit from prestige/status whores, I will do so.
I send two of my crumbsnatchers to a Catholic school in Chicago because CPS blows. I pay 6-7k annually for both. We have parents whose children went to preschool with ours, and they opted to get into a more 'prestigious' Catholic school with a tuition of ~$20K. We're talking early grade schoolers, and I'm not sure how different the "exit opps" are for this school to get into high school. I tell ya though, this sort of competition happens at every level, you just have to step back and laugh at it sometimes.
My wife (who is a public school administrator) and I have vaguely talked about this already even though we don't have kids yet. We have a pretty nice house in an area with very good k-8 schools and probably an above average high school. We would never spring for $40k/year schools, but there is a pretty good catholic school in our area that some of the kids in the surrounding areas go to. It is "relatively" inexpensive, but would still be a stretch for us if we have a few kids attending.
Assuming we have 2 or 3 kids, tuition for them to go to the private high school will realistically cost us $150k or so. I'd rather sink that money into upgrading to a new house in 10-15 years that will get us into one of the very good public school districts in the area. While I don't expect to get rich off real estate, I'd much rather put that money into an asset than the expense of a high school.
If you're really worried about them turning into d-bags, can't you just have them read a bit of Marx? Ha ha (only half joking).
I went to 6 or so different schools in 2-3 countries before university with two very different high school experiences. If I ever have children I will want to give them an egalitarian upbringing. If at that time state run schools are poor academically and I end up taking them to privately run schools that just means that they'll have to spend more time doing charity/community work. But I also prefer to live in mixed neighborhoods, not exclusively affluent/gated communities.
It's one thing to understand the role of networks, affiliations and social status, quite another to have them define you.
great point, +1
I do not want my kid to be exposed to pompous D-bags. That really is my concern that they have their heads soo far up their asses from hanging around other spoiled privileged kids they don't understand the real world and how hard it is to earn a living. Plus if I have enough money to pay 100k a year for high school, I would probably have enough money to "donate" to HYP to increase my kids chances of enrollment. High School is afterall the stepping stone to HYP or other top colleges.
The amount of money you have to donate to get your kid into HYP is a pretty considerable sum.
funny that you'd think good high schools are filled with "pompous D-bags" but that HYP isn't
i think its a bit dumb to do this if you are living in CT, LI, westchester, NJ etc with a great public school system which you are being already raped on taxes for but then again it depends on your family's income stream and all
You know, I never even really thought about that. When I look at my buddies' property tax bills in New Jersey, to think that you'd have to spend another $40,000 on tuition makes it seem borderline retarded. One of my buddies pays $55,000 a year in property tax on his place, which isn't unusual in NJ, and he sends his kids to public school.
I went to both a great public high school and an elite prep school. I will say that the education and network at the prep school I attended was far superior to the public HS, but the kids I met there made my skin crawl. These kids were pretentious, self-absorbed, and entitled. I think I'll end up sending my children to prep schools simply for athletics, but it scares me to think of them being D-bags who are completely detached from reality.
Another clip that comes to mind.
http://www.youtube.com/embed/5UH2raPtbw4
Went to a well known public HS with the top sports and academics in the area, feel no need to send my kids elsewhere. If you consider that you have to make enough money to live in the district it's not a whole lot different than paying tuition, in a roundabout sort of way.
Shoot me in the fucking head.
My kid ain't going to private school.
I went to one of those Northeast Prep Schools (in the founder's league) that is a big "target" for hockey. There are different schools for different professions - some are better than others in sports and really push their program, others are better in academics and spend a lot of money on that. If you want to play in the NHL and are good, you go to Avon Old Farms. If you want to go to Harvard, you got Phillips Exeter or Andover. Taft, Hotchkiss, Choate, Deerfield, Salisbury, Kent, Loomis Chaffee, Westminster, Trinity Pawling and Northfield Mt. Hermon are all really good schools too and are recruit for sports and are very similar to college (they also cost $50k+ per year).
You can get recruited and get a scholarship to play sports at these schools, its just like college. You sleep there, eat there, attend classes there, and have practice there. Wednesdays are half days, you go to school on Saturdays for a half day, but those two days are also spent traveling to other prep schools across the northeast to play them in hockey, soccer, etc.
It was the best 4 years of my life so far (I am a sophomore in college) and I will do everything in my power to have my children attend the same school I did so they can get the same experience. The lifelong friendships you make from kids across the world - Korea, China, UK, South America, alone is worth it. Classes are extremely small (10-15 kids tops, my English class had 8) so you really get a lot of attention and get to know the teachers really well. Also, the teachers live on campus so you can meet with them anytime you need to for extra help. Some of them are your coaches as well. Everyone becomes a family and the sense of camaraderie is overwhelming - especially when you have 5 coach buses and 400 kids headed up to Salem MA to cheer your hockey team on in the finals.
It's a completely different environment than public school. The curriculum is different, the network of Alumni is exclusive and you will almost always have a better shot at getting into a good college if you apply yourself.
This. I also went to a school in the Founders League and will send my kids there. The best experience I've had so far in terms of education. I think there is such as thing as a target high school. Here is a BI article on 10 of them. The alumni are one way of rating the schools. http://www.businessinsider.com/prep-schools-for-getting-to-wall-street-2013-2
I wish I went to CPS, would be easy to be valedictorian.
one thing that i took from prep school was that the school itself was way harder than college was since i actually had to stay awake in class and put on a jacket and tie
but the other thing that was rough was the real competition in sports... a lot of the teams were pretty slapdick and i was in HS the same time guys like Ray Rice and Courtney Green were tearing it up, not to mention a handful of guys who went on to play college/pro baseball... i never got threatened during a football game in prep school but the public school kids (especially when we played the Yonkers HS teams) were talking about eating children and ripping faces off
wait
I went to a school in NYC on this list and I would absolutely send my kids there. (Most) ppl go to HS to get into a good college and while there are amazing school districts in some places, the y really don't exist in NYC. Other than the typical Hunter, Stuy, Bronx Sci, etc. you'd be hard pressed to find a public school in NYC that consistently sends the majority of its grads to top 15 schools including a very strong contingent to Ivies + Stanford + MIT/Caltech (albeit to a lesser extent) every year. It's easy to say "just send them to Stuy" bit you have to get in first which isn't easy and in some ways harder than the schools on that list. If you get in great and if my kid got in that's great too but there was no way a 13-14 year old me was getting into Stuy so my parents sent me to prep school and I ended up at a top target school. In fact, at many Ivies you see mediocre prep school kids because of the relationships that have been established and because an admissions board knows what they're going to get from a kid with a 3.4 and a 2200 SAT who goes to Horace Mann. They may not be a rock star but they're the safe choice.
And then there's the experience. Prep school was some of the most fun I've had an the people were amazing; smart, driven, fun, and most importantly well connected. To be blunt: a lot of prep school kids have influential parents. You don't think that when you're 16 and trying to bang a congressman's daughter but it's true. I remember speaking to very senior people at my current BB during the placement process, all through prep school connections. There's also the fact that if you go to a top college, you go in knowing a bunch of people and it's easier to fit in and relate because you have that prep school experience in common
And look I'm not saying that some of these kids aren't huge d-bags; they are. But in my experience, kids that are huge douches have parent that are huge douches. I've heard friends/classmates say some of the most ridiculous things like just yesterday "I refuse to take the subway ever...the people down there are surfs." Now I've been pretty fortunate and privileged, but of I ever said that shit I would be immediately cut-off and disowned. In all honesty, the world is full of huge d-bags and it may be better to learn how to deal with them sooner rather than later.
At the end of the day, do I think it's worth it? Yes, of you can afford it. I think the experience that I had, the friendships, an the opportunities make it worth while but the key is being able to afford it. My $0.02.
FYP
I went to a high school that is now being criticized as one of the worst high schools in New York State,
See http://www.lohud.com/flash/eastramapo/ for stats.
As long as the individual is able to teach themselves and is self-motivated to learn despite a shitty education system, I would argue that low-scoring inner city public high schools are actually better in some respects because they provide students with real world abilities that are hard to pick up in sheltered public schools and especially prep schools. Being able to think quick on your feet, detect bullshit, and understand that you need to work hard if you want something is, in my opinion, truly valuable skills that most prep school students won't fully grasp until after college.
Going from a school where weapon-use and gang violence was a common day occurrence to a semi target business school with over 50% of the student body coming from very expensive prep schools it was a culture shock to see how naive and sheltered some students are.
That said, I wouldn't want my future children going to an inner-city high school cause truth be told, alot of opportunities, especially artistically, are denied to the student body. Its good to find a school where you won't be coddled, but won't be denied a proper education and the opportunity to develop artistic skills.
Will never send my kids to private school. Maybe it just comes down to how you were raised, but the last thing I want would be to come home to my kid and his friends comparing business cards like Bateman and Van Patten. I'd rather him be a normal kid who acts like a kid, not a banker, at age 16.
Just because someone goes to a public school doesnt mean they can never go to a top school and be a banker, if thats even what they themselves actually want. Raise em right, and they'll be ok as long as its not a really shit school.
Wow. So many typos in my post above...typing on a phone sucks hah
Holy shit, you did that on a phone?
Girl I went to college with went to a school on that list: 4 years of high school ~200k. She then went to a private college: 4 years of college ~250k. Then she had the balls to brag about getting into a middle of the road medical school. Yea, I'm super fucking impressed that you were able to do that after your parents threw ~450k at you before you even started med school.
Damn, the WSO monkey is already recruiting at Andover...
http://www.andover.edu/Pages/default.aspx
Honestly, the majority of these arguments blatantly neglect the fact that success in school is just as influenced by your parenting and upbringing. Doesn't fucking matter if your rich uncle got you into Andover and you're roommates with the King of Jordan's son: if you were raised without consequence or without learning the true value of money, or without learning to respect people and discipline yourself, then you're more fucked than a chinese mainlander at a mediocre public school. If you weren't raised and disciplined growing up, do you really think the marginal difference between a top public school and an ivy-feeder is going to change your outcome?
Does the 4.0 student from Andover stand a better chance getting into Yale than the 4.0 student from Cherry Creek in CO or Glenbrook North in Chicago? Sure. Of course a quarter million dollar education will look better to adcom--not to mention making the varsity basketball team competing with a hundred kids is a fuck ton easier than competing with 4,100. But if a kid's goal is to go Ivy from a young age, with the right support, they can do it from anywhere.
I did half and half. First two years at prep school on the east coast, last two at a top public school. From my personal experience, there was a higher concentration of talent at the prep school because, obviously, you had to pass admissions to get in and be able to afford it. But the smart kids at my public school worked infinitely harder, and will ultimately go much further because they weren't handed college admission slips on silver platters. My friends that went to Yale and Princeton from public would murder my prep-school ivy buddies in almost any facet of life, whether it be sports, discipline, intellect, etc..(maybe not inherited wealth).
I think what Eddie is asking is whether that quarter million dollars is worth it--I say that if your kid is driven and disciplined, no shot. Unless your doing it for cultural or traditional reasons, thus making you somewhat of a douche nozzle, I say save the cash for college or a new gold plated shark tank.
Well said amigo. As an Andover man myself, I pulled myself up from my own bootstraps even though I didn't have boots.
This.
I tend to think high achievers are going to be brought about by their upbringing, just like fuck ups. If a kid is so inclined to be a high achiever they will do well at a public or private school, however sending them to a private may allow them to have access to more kids that can stimulate them intellectually and get all the goodies like an astrophysics lab too.
Private schools really help kids like I was in high school (though I went public) where they're naturally intelligent but have no clue what jobs there are to aim for and the kids they would hang out with have no inclination to achieve. Place them in a private school where achievement is the norm and you really get your money's worth. Yes I do wish I had gone to a private school, wouldn't have taken until last year of university to start achieving.
Haha yea bored at work.
I attended Servite in Orange County and we're seen as a target school for sports.In my Sophomore year I already had offers by USC, UCLA, Stafford, and other highly thought of west coast universities, as did a lot of my other peers. Now, if you asked me if I thought I wouldn't of had the same offers going to another school in the area I would have to say no, but I don't think they would of came as early as they did. I would also be hard-pressed to say my parent's didn't waste their money considering the public high school that i would of gone to is raked higher or on par with Servite academic wise.
Sounds like you grew up near me.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this "target" shit literally start at the pre-k level? Like aren't there "target" nursery schools... I'm not kidding btw.
You are completely correct. It all starts when you are around 4, you either have to call the pre-scools to interview or you hire an agency to call on your behalf, then you go interview (with the agency's recommendation.)
Certain pre-schools feed into certain schools, and they help the parents with the process and set up interviews to get the kid into kindergarten. When placing for kindergarten, there are tests, more interviews, and the kid gets to sit in a room and play with blocks while the school counselor takes notes.
If I still live in or around NYC when I start pumping out kids, I definitely plan to send my sons to one of the all-boys Catholic schools in the area (Delbarton, Regis, Chaminade, Xavier, etc.). I absolutely loved my high school.
I attended one of these schools in New York, and I just checked the price, it is $40,000 a year now. I did not graduate from there though (my parents took an early retirement and we moved to Florida) so I missed on the networking opportunities to get into H/Y/P and Deepsprings (for that one person every four years that wanted to go) or the other colleges that we fed into. However, I still stay in contact with the alumni office and I actually got my PWM internship from one of my friend's father (his daughter went there the same time as me.) Before I transferred out (9th grade), all I remember is 3 hours of homework every night, the admissions office pushing you to visit colleges and take summer classes to schmooze the admissions officers and the pressure to join several ET activities. We students pushed back by smoking in the stairwells, being precocious, skipping class and drawing boobs on the dry erase boards and lockers at the start of each term in permanent marker.
I will definitely send my children to these schools, as I feel the public schools in New York (besides Stuyvesant and Hunter) won't give them the kind of preparation and education I want them to have.
I think there is value to a private school since you can avoid a lot of the BS. I'd pay a premium to have my niece taught by someone with a masters in their subject instead of people with a masters in education. Plus I think uniforms should be mandatory and private schools generally insist on this.
The truth is public schools spend so much time and money getting the losers to simply pass that they ignore the winners. Private schools to a large extent don't have to deal with this because it is self selecting.
Americans have a 7th grade reading level. That is what public schools shit out.
Eloquently put, amigo.
Poor middle class Americans can barely string together a few sentences before sounding like they have a speech disorder. Have you ever witnessed a public schooler struggling to read the Financial Times? It's a sight to see, LOL!! Something that really belongs in a zoo.
That's why you need to send your kids to schools like Andover and Deerfield and Choate, which spit out men like me, men of class and prestige.
All Deerfield spits out are lacrosse/hockey PGs who weren't smart or talented enough to get into college the first time around.
I'll also say this. I think there is a big benefit from going from public school to a general private school. The benefit from getting into one of these super elite schools is much less. From a pure educational and return on investment perspective it is probably better to send your kid to a normal private school and get the a tutor over the summer than spend college tuition on a brand name high school.
I'd like to see the legacy benefit scrubbed from these elite schools and see how well students do. Is it a feeder because of the school or is it a feeder because people who can afford and get their kids in these schools are super starts themselves.
If you have the athletic ability to get a full-ride, do it...
Everyone talks about the "network" you get from an MBA program. I don't know what to make of that, but playing on a varsity team really does give you a network for the rest of your life...
As for the sweater-vest kids who make up the rest of private school classes, fuck 'em
Outside of networking (which i'm sure is amazing) I can't really see where the value is. How much better can the quality of education be than in a top notch public school or a reasonably priced private school?
Then again, if you can afford to spend 40k a year on a hs degree i doubt money means much to you. But hell what do I know, i'm just a poor kid who went to public school.
First world problems.
I've seen people drop 30K on a random Thursday night in NYC. If you have that type of money, 30k seems like 30 dollars when it comes to sending your kids to school.
For the anti-private school crowd....if money wasn't an issue, would you send them to private school?
Like a few previous posters, I also went to one of the schools on the list (only for a year) and attended a top private school in NJ. If i'm talking to someone and the topic turns to where I went to high school, people either give me the "oh you're a dbag" look or the "oh great for you, respect" look. I've gotten both tons and tons of times. Yes, my school did have it's share of dbags and still does and always will. Did they become a dbag because they went to this school? No, it was already instilled that they were better than everyone else for some asinine reason and they were going to stick with it. Do I consider myself a dbag? No, but then again who does? There was a post earlier that said something along the lines that you have values and whatnot before you get to your high school. If you think because you have a rich dad that you're automatically better than someone, you clearly have issues and are a dbag.
It's making sure your kid understands that they have to work for every inch of what they want in life and that nothing will be given to them. I'm lucky in that my dad instilled this in me from a very early age and I will never forget it (or thank him enough). Plenty of people don't make this clear to their children and dbags grow out of it.
Bottom line is would I send my kids to the school I went to? Absolutely. I had a blast and they would too. Being around motivated people in an institution that knows what it is doing was the best thing for me. Would I honestly be where I am right now if it wasn't for that school? Probably not. Doors were opened that wouldn't have been otherwise.
ps: if you haven't gone to one of these places or something similar, you really don't know what you're talking about. And hearing "stories" about some kids you know through a friend doesn't count either.
Sorry, but to be perfectly blunt, a private HS is pointless. All that matters is your INTERNAL motivation, and how well your parents have raised you to care about your grades.
Case in point: My older brother --> public school --> D1 athlete @ an Ivy. And he could have gotten in without tennis, ie: all APs, top scores, etc. Hopefully I'll share the same fate :)
-TheChicagoan
Definitely a biased opinion here, but I can vouch for the effectiveness of a Jesuit all-boys prep school education. Not only did we get to fuck around all the time because no one worried about impressing girls, but when push came to shove we were super competitive about everything, school and sports included. You were cool if you were funny or an athlete, or both, but either way you had to be smart; I happen to think this environment churns out some well-rounded individuals.
Considering I plan on being wealthy and living in a baller house in a great 'hood, my kids will go to top PUBLIC schools. I also plan on keepig my genes within the same race, so yes, my kid will likely be blessed athletically. I will save approx. $150K per child (conservative est.), and invest that money instead.
My kids will then get into a top college, not Ivy, but more like Gtown. As a result, they will have a great chance on becoming an Ibanker. My present to them for possibly jeopardizing their chances of eliteness will be lambos for college graduation, from the money I saved by not being a dbag.
Went to a cool high school in the burbs, nationally ranked baseball, football, and basketball programs. Tons of smoking hot chicks who didn't have to cover up in some stupid uniform. 7 Junior Highs were feeders schools into the high school. Alot of kids coming from upper class families but also the chance to bs around with kids from the working class or even kids from the one hood grade school in the area that ended up at our high school. Fun experience though, I had friends in about every single genre of people in high school.
If I have the means in the future to send my kid to private school, I most likely will.
My parents didn't have the means to send my older brother and I to private schools, but we went to a pretty good high school that sends the top 15 kids on to ivy's HYP. I went to an inner city exam/magnet high school. We were a pretty good school, but often times you would have your gang fights and the few knuckle heads that went and did stupid things.
Like one of the poster's earlier said, coming from an inner city public school, to a semi target where most of the kids coming from top/expensive prep schools, was a culture shock to me. And I remember how my high school sociology teacher use to tell me how much of the culture shock college was going to be for most of my peers but I always thought it was BS until I got on campus. Some of these kids have been sheltered all of their lives and so naive, it's unbelievable. At the same time, some of them are really cool kids who are very humble.
Currently I have 3 roommates, 2 went to top NE prep schools and the other went to a top public school in CT. They're all cool and down to earth. But I took one of them to my neighborhood a few weeks ago, Jesus Christ, this kid seem like he had never seen a corner store before and was cared to park around the corner form my house, thinking his car was going to get carjacked lol. I got off topic.
Going to prep school has its pros and cons but ultimately the values come from home and if the kids have a strong foundation and support system, it's going to take more than private school to turn them into D-bags. I know for sure if my parents don't move out by the time my younger siblings are entering HS, I will definitely try to get them into private school, as the opportunities there are ample and will explore more than I ever did during my HS days,
On the West Coast it's all about the "top" public schools. Mission San Jose, Whitney High, Gunn High, etc. Harker, Harvard-Westlake, I guess, are "known" private schools, but there just aren't very many of them for it to be a thing. The public schools definitely have a different vibe from what I'm reading here with the private schools. More cut-throat, extra-curricular obsessed. Lots of cheating. Clique-y. I liked my experience alright, though. Definitely teaches you to compete. (Go to a target, and high school seemed harder, but I might be remembering it wrong.)
I've never been overly impressed with the prep school kids, and considering my school was free and they paid ~$200k for high school alone, we're at the same college (and my school sent a lot of kids here), not sure where the value is.
That being said, not everyone has access to great public schools, and if I was trying to raise a family in NY, not sure if public school would be an option.
The public schools surrounding NYC (in Nassau, Westchester, NJ, etc.) can be fantastic, but if you send your kids to a non-magnet public school in NYC you're a moron.
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Eton or St Pauls yet... Having either of those on your resume will get it past a few HR screens...
Eton = for children of russian oligarchs and chinese sweatshop owners
It's not just about getting into the right university or getting good grades.
Parents who send their children to such schools want their offspring to be part of a certain segment of society and to have social relationships with a set of people with certain shared values or socioeconomic status.
Just a description of what i've seen in some instances. Not necessarily passing judgement.
A lot depends on context. I have friends in Texas who send their children to international schools because they want them to speak French fluently. I have other friends who choose private run schools because the students come from upper middle class and wealthier backgrounds and they want their kids to be well connected in life.
^ Not if you wanna slay in Montreal or Paris
Important life skill
I went to a prep boarding school so let me share my thoughts. First of all, for those that say they are filled with d-bags, this is a stereotype. I actually went to public school most of my life including my first year of high school. There was plenty of bullying going around, racism through the roof, teachers who didn't care, overpacked classrooms. The boarding school I was at, had its fair amount of d-bags, but most people were nice. Even the ones that were extremely rich didn't flaunt themselves as most people would think. My boarding school also had athletic requirements and the course loads were extremely difficult. You had to be dressed properly even during dinner nights. It taught us to be mature. Sure there were some spoiled girls, but most people were not. They had families that could afford to send them there, but they went to class just like everyone else, played sports like everyone else. We even had poorer individuals with scholarships and NOBODY ever brought up their income. There was very little hierarchy compared to public school, where you have the "cool" kids and nerds. I was there for three years and they were great. If I have money to send my kids to one, I will in a heartbeat. I spent most of my life around public schools and was against my parents sending me to boarding school, but I thank them everyday for doing so. Most of the kids I graduated with didn't even go into banking, they became doctors, engineers, etc. Don't judge something just because you don't understand it.
Agree with the above. I didn't go to a prep school (went to a large public school in the south), but I'd want to send my kid to one. Not because I like elitism or the bubble being surrounded by rich kids creates, but because they're the best way to guarantee placement into a good college. Getting into HYP is much easier from a good prep school (and I'm talking anything from Exeter to a day school like Trinity or Dalton or Hotchkiss) than from public school. I have tons of friends at school who're from schools like this who definitely wouldn't have gotten in if it weren't for attending prep school. Not saying that they're not smart - just that kids who get in from regular public schools have to be incredibly smart and have achieved a lot since they're coming from such an unknown place (whereas an adcom knows someone who's 10th at Dalton is probably a smart person). Keep in mind, I'm talking about non-elite public schools (i.e. Thomas Jefferson/Stuy/Bronx Science and the like don't really fall into the regular category of public schools - they're elite in their own right). But going to prep schools confers such a huge advantage on kids that may not have had the edge for HYP or other Ivies by going to public school.
In terms of cost, I agree it's fucking absurd to pay 50K a year for high school. But if 50K a year doesn't mean that much to me (let's say I make 500K and have been for ten years by the time my kid reaches high school age), then why not?
I'm too young to be thinking on where to put my kids to school to but looking at it from the side it seems like there is somewhat of a divide between the Anglosphere and Continental Europe. In UK/USA it is pretty much what u pay for (with a few exceptions), so the best schools (high school or university) usually charge the most, which brings a logic, where the real "top" is worth it (like MBA in M7 or UG in Ivy, and real top high schools) but people usually pause when picking between second tier private choices and cheaper and good public ones. Now in Continental-Europe (maybe except Switzerland) the good choices cost usually the same amount as the average ones. In many countries everything is free (we pay a shitload of taxes later on in our life thanks to that though). The obvious choice then (if u can) is to study in Continental Europe and then work in USA/UK :)
That's true up until the point you graduate from high school. But the very best colleges and grad schools in the U.S. are worth it compared to going to school in Europe save for a few select exceptions (Oxbridge, LSE, Polytechnique…).
I have way more respect for people coming from humble backgrounds and normal school than those who've been coddled and spoonfed at a prep school while their parents were blowing an outrageous amount of money (and mommy carried their lax sticks after every practice).
A good amount of the kids I go to college with went to prep schools are some of the most ignorant and spoiled douchebags I've ever seen. Never having to try hard for anything in their lives (high school AND college), they are very entitled and think that the world owes them something, not because they actually achieved something, but because their parents provided everything to them just like that.
It's a bubble, I'd rather let my kids get a taste of what the world is like and work their way up, rather than isolating them in a bubble and letting them think that all people are elitist spoiled brats and no other world exists outside of the realm of prep school.
IMO, one who has worked to get to the places they want to be is way more respectable than someone getting to those places because of parents' money/connections/making sure they have never been deprived of anything.
It really depends how much money you have. If I was a multi multi millionaire...then price would not matter, and deciding whether or not my kids should go there would have NOTHING to do with the money, thus the analysis is different.
Now, If you make 200k pre tax...and have two kids...deciding whether or not to send you kids to a 20k/yr+ schools requires different analysis. Personally, I'm trying to avoid at all costs becoming a slave to my life, so I will not shell out for anything like that unless it is financially easy for me/my family at the time. I went to a great public school that had great academic resources so I know they exist.
I've met too many older people in finance who make a lot of money, but have built their lives up to be so expensive that they don't actually have very much money beyond what is in motion, and they feel this pressure, now they HAVE to make X amount of money and even NEED more and it traps them and turns them into the generally miserable people in finance that we see everyday. I have made it my goal for this not to happen to me - I will not let this happen.
I go to school with a ton of kids whose parents dropped 40k/year on private school. I find it funny that they spent 160k to get to the same college that I got to just by going to public school. I get it if you live in an area with bad public schools, but otherwise it seems to be a waste.
This fits perfectly into context:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bD7U8kqI8A
I know exactly why, because I have gone to one of these schools. They basically do not let their students get low grades...They will curve their GPAs close to graduation to be sufficient for admission into colleges the student is looking at attending. Doesn't mean that is worth $40,000; but if you want your son/daughter to attend a top elite college after school, you can make sure the school's "college counselor's" know this. They will make sure to make that student look very competitive whether he is or is not.
So much of this thread triggers the gag reflex.
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