Why doesn't BAM have an intern/graduate L/S program?
Why don't they have a program similar to CAP or P72 Academy? It's probably the best way I can think of to funnel top undergrad talent & it's a great talent pipeline. Is it intentional since they have the Bridger program?
Seems like they're losing out on cohort of undergrads that are increasingly interested in HFs. If they already have the bridger program (and it's already built out), why aren't they taking batches of 5-10 sharp undergrads and putting them in Bridger along with bankers/PE associates?
If they did, would they just end up hiring people who don't convert their Citadel internships /s
But what's wrong with that? I can tell you right now there are tons of kids that would rather work at BAM than XYZ EB or MF PE analyst program.
I was being facetious, I'm sure that's still a very talented crop of talent vs someone that converted a BB SA.
I wouldn't want to go to BAM out of school vs a top banking program. It may even be slightly myopic to do so.
They do, it was posted on target handshakes a few months ago
Interesting (I'm not recruiting at the moment and am interning at another firm). Is it an internship program or an official full-time graduate program like CAP?
Don’t know, was for jr summer and titled L/S Equities summer intern or something along those lines
As far as I know they don't have a structured program, I've seen some postings for specific pods (usually internships) and for MBAs too.
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Probably isn't a priority for them (yet).
You could also ask why Millennium outsources its graduate program to UBS, and why Citadel's program is still very small compared to P72's despite the relative sizes of the businesses. It is a function of firm strategy, philosophy, and potentially even resources.
I haven't worked at BAM but worked at one of the firms you menitoned
OP is right that these programs are excellent ways to secure the top undergrad talent, mold them / teach them a process, and have a pipeline of juniors that can grow into senior analysts who can grow into PMs one day. BAM has a lot going for it and their equities business is on the upswing (new senior PMs joining, Longaeva launch, seems to be some shuffling around). Maybe the next leg is building out something like what Citadel / P72 have for undergrads.
If BAM has the Bridger program (I don't know anything about it, but it seems like a training program for folks coming out of IB or PE), why don't they put undergrads in it?
I'm not arguing that having these programs (if done well) is a net asset to the firm. I'm just saying it might not be a priority like it is for Point72.
CAP and Millennium's UBS programs are still relatively small in intake, they'll likely scale it but there's a very good chance they never even try to build out something akin to P72's scope. P72 invests a lot into analyst development and retainment (even beyond the Academy), the culture is just different from CAP where I've seen people finish their 6 months of training and then not get placed into a pod.
It's challenging to make a program that's worth having it seems. And Bridger already assumes people have a strong basis of technical knowledge coming in, similar to Marshal Wace's Elevate program, so you probably can't chuck undergrads into it. CAP was also overhauled by hiring an ex-P72 academy coach. Millennium basically sends their hires to UBS and hopes they learn enough to join a pod, although recently have started incorporating their own training and are looking to overhaul their program.
When you don't have a culture that's as focused on analyst development, training, and retention, building a massive undergrad pipeline to feed the majority of your analyst cohorts is less of a priority.
At least in my opinion. These programs will continue to scale and get better but I'm unsure if they are even trying to replicate the Academy at this point, where analyst retention is pretty high even 3-4 years after joining a pod and they make up the vast majority of analysts hired.
Please I'm more than confident my intern could demolish anything these Bridger people throw at him this stuff isn't rocket science. Guess we found with P72 Academy alum (not a dis, also an alum)
Yeah, I did Academy, pretty open about that. I'm just saying I get why it makes sense for P72 to have a big UG pipeline but for Citadel/MLP to have much smaller ones. The way they approach junior development and retention is different.
It is indeed not rocket science, but whatever bridger is, it was designed under the assumption the intake has been slaving away, cranking out models at PE/IB for 2 years. Every undergrad they take is one less from IB.
And yes, you do need to teach undergrads more basic finance than someone who's done 2 years of IB, and they will take longer to build models etc. I'm guessing Bridger just wants to focus on the plug-and-play aspects of the job, and trust the finance background is already there.
This is coming from a STEM major who built maybe 2-3 models in my entire internship before joining FT. The academy was right for me, I don't know if Elevate/Bridger would have been.
Quality over quantity. I didn't work at P72, but I've met a lot of people who've gone through the academy, and there seems to be material degradation in associate quality every single year. Maybe that's a function of scale dynamics you mentioned and how the academy has grown to be so large vs the other programs keeping a leaner program of higher quality associates - again, just my outside perspective having met tons of folks in these programs. Not a knock on the academy, I'm sure it's still great training, just not sure they've been taking the best kids possibly available out of the pool
Haven't met anyone that worked at MLP out of undergrad I didn't realize they even have a program.
I've noticed this at an earlier level, at the intern level where I've had some rotate with me...but my understanding was at the end of the Academy the level of qualified analysts being produced is largely the same, for those that get through anyway. I'm not sure if its a scaling issue as much as it is with the Academy coaches taking more punts on people. Time will tell, I left the fund this year.
Yes MLP's program tends to run under the radar. I'm only well versed in it because a kid I'm mentoring got an offer there this year (after interning for me a few years ago funnily enough).
Effectively they grab up top talent early but don't then invest in the same structured training. They send them to UBS Research for a year and they do the CFA or something akin to it before joining a pod. As previously mentioned seems like they're also incorporating classes when they join Millennium now and are hiring to improve the program.
Looking back on it, would you rather do the Academy all over again or do IB for a year or two then join C/P/M?
Obviously the academy if I want to work in HFs. That is a no-brainer choice. To be clear, I'm not talking about the academy itself - I'm just saying the quality of the kids they have has gotten worse. That's most likely because the size is what 30-40 kids versus once at 5 or 10? The leaner HF programs tend to have clusters of much brighter/more impressive kids because they have a smaller n. Not a dig at P72 Academy to be clear - I think it's excellent training. If you're a smart eager hardworking junior then this doesn't apply to you. All I'm saying is the kids have been less impressive...that obviously excludes the top few kids in the academy, whom I'm positive get their pick at teams and will do very well. If you're in that cohort, then this is a no-brainer, though I'm less qualified to tell you the differences between all these programs. If you're an average joe who finagled your way into the program and will go through the motions and place on a subpar/underscaled/small team, then it's a different conversation. Again I'm not as close to this stuff anymore, but general vibe check: P72 is the oldest and has long training, classroom-style; Citadel seems the most prestigious, emphasizes getting many reps in and getting on the desk quicker, and they teach you their process; MLP (I don't know anyone that's done this program) puts you in UBS for a year. For what it's worth, I've met impressive kids from P72's and Citadel's programs, but the frequency of impressive kids is seemingly much higher at the latter than the former (again, probably due to the smaller n). Some smart guys in the earliest cohorts of P72 academy years ago - guys that have gone on to do very, very well (at other firms or still at P72)
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