Just saw on Instagram that BMO let go of all of its Houston-based bankers (~60 people) today.
https://www.instagram.com/stories/litquidity/2454…
https://www.instagram.com/stories/litquidity/2454…
Makes me worried about my career. Will be joining a top 5 group in Houston as a summer analyst this summer. If anyone knows more, would be happy to hear about it.
More discussion here:
Follow-Up on BMO Layoffs: Can You Go Wrong with Technology IB?
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Also curious to hear if the sentiment within HOU offices is bear amongst analysts and associates and if people are navigating an exit out of energy.
Definitely hard to get that without being in the office (but yes -- O&G PE is way down, I've been told generalist is the only way to go now)
From direct experience the answer is yes, even for folks who have worked on O&G mega deals from the past 1-2 years.
are most analysts recruiting for PE shooting for generalist roles now that energy pe is more or less dead?
As someone who works at a Canadian peer bank down in Houston, that’s a resounding yes to both questions.
RBC?
BMO is no good. Stay away. I'm saying this as a current employee.
Can you spill the beans on the metals and mining group, I've heard it's next-level toxic but nobody's every specified why or how
Consistently ranked the best mining group in the world but MDs are psychopaths which leads to a tougher work environment. Lot's of the MDs like to create 80 page decks for M&A and pitches which involves a ton of random analysis that you're going to be up till 4AM doing every other week. Although after going through that, the juniors come out with a much stronger skill set compared to other groups at different banks.
Hey, can I ask how BMO’s consumer group is? I’m most interested in Consumer but can’t really find any info about it. And “stay away” for all groups or just certain ones?
Don’t know a ton about the consumer group at BMO but they only sit in the Chicago office, not the New York office. Since BMO recruits by office you need to make sure to target the Chicago office. That said they are one of the better groups but they worked their interns pretty hard this summer.
Work at BMO in NYC, lot of layoffs across the org today. Group head in tech gone, some MD’s in industrial, and the energy group all gone. They haven’t really told us anything. No emails or team meetings. We are all kind of wondering what’s going on.. best guess is realignment of company priorities.
What kind of company does internal/employee restructuring like this?
Consulting firms? Another investment bank? Or just BMO’s leadership
Every company in corporate America does this. My old company fired 100 people in our accounting shared services org in an afternoon to move the jobs abroad. If you can save money or the business unit isn’t driving the returns you want you sell it or shut it down. This is not a unique thing to BMO. Now how they handled it appears to be poorly done. Don’t do it a week before bonuses and during the holidays. Give them a month notice so they can sharpen their resumes, but I digress.
Every company does.
I hope by now you have seen the other replies and have come to terms with your previous (erroneous) view. ALL companies do this; you need to get very comfortable with the phrase "at will employment" because if you're not, then HR will be explaining it to you on the day they lay you off :)
is it safe to say that this isn't representative of what other banks in HOU will do?
Correct -- although no guarantees. BMO bought DB's book and was in a lot of bank groups/bond/equity deals, but don't know what they've done besides selling Ovintiv's EF acreage.
I'd doubt other banks will initiate mass layoffs a week before bonus, especially after a stressful covid environment
Never say never
Bonuses will probably be pretty limited for almost everyone.
Really? Even though M&A is down, a lot of BBs are having record profits.
A week before bonus? Did I miss that in the article somewhere? For most of us it's not quite bonus season yet, more like January/February.
Canadian banks have an Oct 31 YE. Bonuses announced in early Dec and paid in mid to late Dec.
Buying that DB O&G portfolio just two years ago sure looks great..
I’m hearing Ibank O&G emails already bouncing back. Wow
Emails were cut at midnight
This happened one time where a kid got fired, but the MD/HR had not told him yet, but IT cut his email. It's a burial way to go.
With the way O&G is I'm surprised it took this long. If I had to guess TD should be next in Houston along with other smaller players.
Which other banks would you say could expect cuts in Houston?
As someone who may or may not work in that office, we’ve had bloated overhead for a while and nothing has happened. Curious to see if BMO may have started the domino effect for the Canadian banks down in Houston.
What is the scene with Scotiabank in Houston? Have heard it's one of the better Canadian banks in Houston.
can't speak to HOU but their Toronto metals and mining team has a reputation of being a sweatshop, Guys constantly stay until 3am.
when I was recruiting summer, I asked an alum at BMO for a mock and the guy scheduled the mock for 1:30 AM cause he didn't have time off.
That's extremely depressing and sad
This is true. Toronto metals & mining is as sweaty as they get but good deal flow. One of the analysts quit after 6 months of joining without having a job lined up cuz he had to work 4am back to backs for weeks on end.
anyone know what groups were cut in Toronto
cuts were across a bunch of groups in Toronto
I’ll say this, they were doing well enough to recruit for FT pre vaccine announcement. Multiple guys said it was one of their better years and that natural gas was strong even if oil was weak. If they got cut with all this I’d be trying to dodge Houston Energy IB.
I actually interviewed for this group and the day after my interview they told me they went on hiring freeze, so they weren’t doing too well lol
I interviewed too, they went on the freeze because they were deciding about this axe, they were up on deal flow compared to the past few years. BMO was doing zero hiring for Chicago and one spot in NYC. Considering these guys had been approved for a FT hiring process they had to have been doing fine
Really tough to see.
My thoughts: sure, BMO wasn't a top dog in Houston, but that isn't the issue. Nobody is saying Citi or Barclays or JPM is going to pull one of these and totally shut down. What is does demonstrate though, is that the ladder to climb is narrowing. If you are starting post-MBA at a top shop, that's great, but the reality is a fraction of your class will make VP and there are fewer seats at other firms to move to within the space. BMO had associates/VPs+ from top tier shops--what do they do now?
The top BBs are likely not expanding and will hold steady at best with fewer promotions, and that is a really tough environment to be building your career in.
I don't think this is as true for other verticals/sectors within IB, but with O&G and as another user said -- bloated overheads will continue to strangle the more cyclical teams for sure.
I agree with this but the same logic applies in reverse if commodity prices go up and activity spikes.
O&G IB MDs probably made more money 2010-2013 than they did 2014-2020.
Would be one thing if a return to "normal" was high activity. Pre-Covid dealflow was heavily subdued and the capital markets were dead long before that. A 30%+ WTI increase brings us back to a mediocre enrivonment at best.
Terrible situation for the employees involved, but a good reminder for all - never have any sort of loyalty to a firm as they will not hesitate to fuck you if it’s in their best interest
Don't ever think for a second that your company gives a fuck about you. Milk as much as you can from your employer and by that I mean more than money. Learn as much as you can, form good relationships with your peers, etc. so that if you get fired you leave with some savings AND skills and a network
tell that to the other guy in the thread who said he'd hand over his terminally ill mother with months to live to a caretaker because he didn't want to sacrifice his career.
...what? What does this have to do with learning as much as you can and forming good relationships?
Wondering if they had any incoming interns for SA 2021 and what happened to them.
This is scary - getting to OP's real question though - is all of Houston IBD in danger now? Are smaller IBD cities like Chicago going to follow suite.... this is a bad sign
My take is that not all of HOU is in danger of an office shutdown, but even the top firms are going to be lower activity and likely to limit promotions or downsize where possible.
Depressed deal flow, at lower valuations = fewer fees to go around. If you are married to O&G/Hou that's fine, but if you have options, take an objective look at the career ladder ahead.
Lol why would any other cities be in danger? This incident is isolated to O&G...
This is brutal
For people who dump on prestige... I get it, screw prestige, 90% of the time.
That being said, if you get laid off at Goldman there might be a spot for you at BMO. If you get laid off at BMO there probably isn't a spot for you at Goldman. Just a thought, could be totally wrong.
On that note, BMO had people who joined from GS, MS, Citi, etc.
The reason this should scare you if you're at one of those "top" shops is that if that door upward is blocked (which it will be for many), the other options are looking fewer and fewer. That is frightening.
BD? Lateraling to a MM / boutique bank? Going into industry? Unless you're in a niche industry group like O&G that is simultaneously also getting hammered, you shouldn't have a tough time landing on your feet if you get cut
They just posted a hiring for IB Analyst in Healthcare out of NYC per LinkedIn. So if that’s your group, you guys got that going for you, which is nice.
That’s because everyone on the healthcare group either leaves banking entirely or laterals as soon as they can.
BMO healthcare known for being really sweaty? I know must HC groups tend to grind/have a lot of dealflow so I wouldn't be surprised.
not really true - HC is one of the top groups in US at BMO. People just get poached cause they get solid experience.
Same group is hiring for an associate role as well. My take from friends in NYC IB (all post-MBA associates and higher) is that healthcare is booming, tech is steady, and every other industry group is a crap shoot. DCM & ECM are steady as well.
False, HC at BMO is 24/7 pitch bitch work with no deal flow. Source: used to work there. As an aside, KYS for trying to come across as "knowledgeable" and "in" and stfu if you don't know what you're talking about. Thx.
This is why you always save for a rainy day. That next bonus cycle is not guaranteed.
None of these firms give a fuck about you so move accordingly
BMO is resource sector heavy. They're usually near the top of M&A in Canada, but the slump in energy and slowness in mining has really hurt them in 2020. Houston bankers are much more expensive than those in Calgary. Canadian ASOs make $120k CAD base. Makes sense they would axe significantly in Houston but I know deal flow in Calgary is sour right now as well.
What's your source on this? Ive heard associates at bmo mining (and other reputable groups in Canada) in Toronto clear $350k+ CAD regularly
That's base salary. No one's making a 200% bonus when times aren't good. What's the USD equivalent and compare that to what ASOs make the US. Easy executive decision.
That means the Associate base salary hasn't budged in at least 5+ years.
Pretty sad
What happens to people's outstanding PE gigs in this type of event? Do they let you go too?
Would probably take everything outta me not to burn down both firms if that was me lol
It's time to face it.... Energy, specifically in the HY side and low IG rated names at risk of becoming fallen angels, is becoming un-investable. Sure you can trade it around but the core investor base (long only, insurance, "real money", etc.) is starting to realize renewable, batteries, electric, etc. cost curves are are coming down fast to price parity. The ESG (fad?) has become a buzzword mainly for marketing, but that doesn't make it irrelevant. That makes the sector un-bankable, especially oil. The fixed income and credit markets are the life blood of corporate activity and if that market is closed then the equity market is irrelevant.
If you want a comparison, look at the coal industry. Yes 1 or maybe 2 companies can access debt markets. But they still struggle and the investor base is tiny.
Energy is significantly bigger than coal but that also makes it more devastating. It will move into insignificance eventually, but will be faster than most expect.
I am aware that my response is not addressing what other teams are at risk of being fired in Houston in the near future. Maybe someone here has the inside track to senior level decisions that aren't yet leaking within or outside the company. Though I highly doubt anyone here has access to that info. But what you can do is step back and assess what's happening at a more macro level and infer the direction of things. Usually humans are unable to grasp how quickly change can happen.
As a junior banker, get experience and keep what I said in mind. Put a few years on you resume and transition into other things. When opportunities present themselves, evaluate and make a move if it makes sense (not too soon so you dont look like you bounce around the street).
Looks like an energy banker (i.e. 1-2 year analyst) was in his feelings. Keep throwing monkey shit. Fight it all you want, but you got triggered because I'm speaking the truth.
Today must be bonus day for the Canadian banks?
wonder how the non energy BMO guys did from bonus perspectivve.
Nope, BMO pays bonuses mid-December but they do decide bonuses around this time of the year, normally before this actually
I think they find out this month. But payment can be made later but that’s not the point here
“Houston, we have a problem”
Not the time.
So many super bearish comments.
Oil and gas isn't going anywhere.
O&G demand will continue to grow.
It's boom and bust pussies.
Not for everybody.
it will boom and bust. but the booms will be smaller and smaller (already are) and the busts will keep happening. zoom out and take a look. the trend is down.... hard. stay in denial if you'd like. oil and gas is going down a lot, not to zero. But it doesnt have to for the industry to be irrelevant.
This reminds me so much of when I worked in Calgary in 2015-16 and all the industry people were like 'We'VE seEn tHIs All beFOre, it's CYLICAL'. And yet, here we are 6 years later, with oil struggling to stay above 40 bucks. This prolonged downturn is not cyclical, it's largely secular, because the bust was not driven by demand factors - it was supply, which will continue to remain plentiful and demand will crest and start to wane over the longer-term. I left Calgary in 2017 and never worked in energy again.
Did you work in IBD in Calgary? Curious as to how you were able to transition out of energy when already starting in an energy role?
Really brutal to see, however let this serve as a cautionary tale for many here who think "this can't happen to me".
A lot of those guys felt the same way 90 days ago.
Someone in Houston correct me if I'm wrong, but feel like the O&G/energy scene is controlled by guys like JEF/EVR/CS/GS/TPH/SIM etc. Point being a smaller pool of players relative to other industries. So those not included in that pool are being squeezed out
I don't think Simmons is as big anymore, and I would add Citi and Barclays to that list but yes. I agree with the view. There's gonna be fewer fees going around and the smaller offices will downsize a lot or just shut shop.
I share similar opinions. I think even some of these shops will have to downsize just a tad bit but agree with your view.
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