I'm a senior who just got a BB offer and have a 3.7 right now from a semi target.
Interviews really took a toll and in the worst case scenario I'll end the school year w/ a 3.6.
Do PE firms care or is it one of those things where work experience and a 3.5+ cutoff makes you pass the first test?
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Congrats! From what I hear most PE firms look for 3.5+, but please take this with a grain of salt. This is a good summary: http://gottamentor.com/ViewGeneralAdvice.aspx?g=213, http://gottamentor.com/ViewGeneralAdvice.aspx?g=212
Do top places like Bain Capital/KKR/Blackstone typically look for 3.8+/3.9+ for associates? On all their websites pretty much everyone was Phi Beta Kappa, I know correlation isn't causation (smartest kids get good grades and do well in PE), but it looks like many places do care, especially Bain Cap's where everyone is from HBS and was summa cum laude.
Would coming from Ivy/top b-school and top BB, for example with a 3.5 hurt for KKR-type place?
Yikes.
Well, I would take the offer at the BB. From what I've read PE is sort of an end of career goal or genius level entry. Congrats. Which BB is it?
You're fine. Knock it out of the park during your analyst stint and learn to interview well for PE when the time comes, and 3.6 or 3.7 is no problem.
what about 3.4-3.5, especially for places like KKR (assuming Columbia/Duke/Cornell + MS/JPM/CS)
Take the BB job... after that so long as you don't have a "bad" GPA I think you'll be fine....
While it's hard to say and there are plenty of people who make it with 3.2 s (particularly if they were at a great school), in my mind, "bad" is >3.499 .... after that level the only marginal increase in your resume is when you get to "over-acheiver" level... 3.9
Do you have dyslexia?
(I'm really not being a dick, I'm just curious)
My dude do you not know how to use the "greater than" and "less than" signs?
"Bad" would be 3.499 and "over-achiever" would be >3.9
GPA matters for PE recruiting, but it matters far less than it does out of undergrad. The impact of going from a 3.7 to a 3.6 will barely be noticeable. You're fine.
What if you were a standout analyst for 2 years...but graduated with a 3.3 or 3.4? I was under the impression that after working for a few years your GPA wasn't very important as long as you performed well in your position.
How does a 3.4 GPA play out for PE recruiting? I'm not talking top shops like KKR/BX, but more so solid upper MM places?
I am actually rather curious, why does GPA matter at all supposing you worked for 3 years at a BB or MM firm?
GPA is probably the most important and accurate determinant of one's career potential. For instance, my uncle is CEO of a midsized fortune 1000 company and the only reason he kept getting promoted was because of his GPA. And he even rounds its down.
That can't possibly be true. Every school is different and there is no standardization among GPAs from one professor to another, so that is a silly remark. You have different professors, different majors, different schools, etc. that will all impact your GPA, so I am not sure how it can possibly be the most accurate determinate of one's career potential. How do you account for entrepreneurs who failed out of school or just dropped out?
Anyways, I do agree it is probably the most important determinant for one's career potential, at least through the first few years.
Also, are you saying your uncle is lazy and dumb and doesn't do a good job at work but still gets promoted because of his GPA? Has anyone ever seen a senior level executive that has a GPA listed on their resume?
I'm lost.
Regards
Is it very important though? Going through a place like Bain Capital, almost everyone graduated summa cum laude and got Baker Scholar (top 5%) from HBS. I guess smart people do well at HBS and smart people get into Bain Cap, but pretty much 90% of the guys are HBS Scholars
Totally disagree with you @WallStreetKid.
If you're an all-star, you're an all-star. If I have a 3.5 I know I can knock out a kid with a 3.9 from my school any day.
I am pretty sure WallStreetKid was being sarcastic because otherwise that comment would be absolutely asinine.
I'm glad somebody else picked up the sarcasm. I was a little thrown off that it took like 3 comments lol
Sadly some would label me the king of sarcasm and I surely just overlooked it when I posted my response. Looking back this morning it's clearly sarcasm but last night I was like, "WTF, mate?!?!" Sometimes we get some people in here that make you question the validity of outrageous responses. Anyways, my apologizes WallStreetKid, for being slow on the uptake, lol.
Regards
I actually don't, but I see those errors now... it was a long weekend.
I guess I still feel like a dick. Sorry about that.
PE recruiting with low GPA (Originally Posted: 12/17/2013)
Just wondering since I was reading a similar post, but if you are from a top tier group (GS/BX/MS) that recruiters traditionally target but have a low GPA, does it make PE recruiting difficult?
Unfortunately yes. The bigger problem is less the funds themselves (though they do care) but rather headhunters. If they see over and over again tons of resumes with GS 3.9, GS 3.8, GS 3.7, MS 3.7, BX 3.9, etc. etc. it becomes very easy to use things like GPA and school to choose which 50-100 resumes they send not only to KKR/TPG, but also to upper MMs like WCAS, LGP, GTCR etc. Your school also matters; being an engineering D1 athlete from HYP makes a 2.9 much more understandable than being an english major from a top public. That said,
If you can blow headhunters away with your confidence, knowledge, and a good reason for your grades that could overcome your initial hurdle
How did you get the offer in the first place with
agree that your biggest bottleneck may be with HHs
some advice - if you trust midlevel or senior bankers at your firm who have buyside contacts, could see who they know + if they are willing to give intros
if your bank has a sponsors group + you know/trust someone there, could be good starting point
Unfortunately that's gonna hurt, unless you've got a really good reason for it (like you studied math at CalTech while playing on their basketball team). Even then, it's certainly not a plus.
Didn't the CalTech basketball team go some ridiculous number of years without winning a game? Not the point of your post, but ironic that this was the extracurricular you chose to include
Edit: Upon fact checking it was indeed a 21 year losing streak.
Thanks for the responses. Would you guys recommend networking with people directly at funds instead of getting filtered by HHs? Would HHs even meet you if they see a low GPA for there to be a chance to demonstrate ability/personality in person?
You'll still get the introductory HH meetings if you're at a good group. Knock them out of the park and directly address your GPA really early in the meeting. It's unlikely you'll be competitive for megafunds because there are so many total-package applicants, but that's not the end of the universe. I mean, there are a shitload of good upper-MM funds you'll get looks from.
As for networking directly...at megafunds, you basically only get hired by going through the HHs. Couldn't hurt to try and network, but at some point the HH needs to arrange the interview for you.
On the other hand, if your grades are 3.7+ from non-HW Ivy but you are from a group a tier below, how does this affect things? Are HHs less receptive?
^You'll probably get a shot at 1 or 2 megafunds.
Hmm surprised that even after a year or two out of college GPA can have that much influence. I wouldve thought group + experience would trump at this point.
how were you able to land a spot with a top tier group with a sub 3.0 gpa? Just curious as to the methods you used
GPA definitely plays a role for pre MBA pe recruiting. There are firms that care less and firms that care more, but as people have said in this thread, MFs can have their pick of the litter. The reality is if you're in a "top" IBD group, you probably interviewed well when you were in college and MAYBE you have had a slightly more rigorous experience than your peers, but that doesn't mean you walk on water and that being in GS TMT alone will trump all other aspects of your candidacy.
Keep GPA off resume for PE recruiting? (Originally Posted: 02/10/2010)
Do you include your GPA on your resume when you are sending it off to PE firms? I have a 3.3 coming from a semitarget and am at a BB, and am thinking of keeping it off my resume. Would this hurt my chances of recruiting for megafunds and top MM PE firms?
Leave it off and your resume shall be ditched
So even with a 3.3 I should keep it on there? Is this going to hurt my chances? 3.3 seems pretty low for megafunds and top MM PE shops.
I always thought once you've worked for a couple years you're supposed to take your GPA off, so PE shops wouldn't automatically assume you have 3.0
Not sure how leaving your gpa on would make them assume you have 3.0...
From reading these forums and various blogs, it seems like companies assume you have 3.0 if you leave your GPA off your resume. That was mostly for undergraduate recruiting, so I'm not sure whether this applies for someone 2 years out aiming for PE.
egg mcmuffin,
You're right, after you've been out of college for enough years it is normal to leave your GPA off your resume. Unfortunately, 2 years is not enough, especially for PE recruiting. I'd say a minimum of 5 years in the work is necessary before you can leave it off and they won't assume you have less than a 3.0. You're going to be hurting your chances pretty significantly if you leave it off now.
Hi CompBanker,
Interestingly enough, I am in the exact same situation as OP (albeit starting IBD in July 2016). I will be joining a MM IB and would love to work in MM/Lower-MM PE in the future. How badly will my 3.3 GPA in Economics hinder my chances at landing a PE gig? Should I pursue a certification such as CFA/CPA to improve my resume and alleviate the 3.3? Would a high gmat score make up for the low GPA?
Really appreciate you sharing.
Clear
I would focus on making sure that you're a rockstar during your analyst stint first. If you're in a good group and are a 'top bucket' analyst, the GPA becomes less relevant when the time comes for PE recruiting.
I would definitely leave your resume on it for now. Hiring managers like quantitative data. If you don't have the transactional work to demonstrate on your resume, your GPA can be a great signifier of your work ethic. 3.3 isn't going to blow anyone over, but it isn't the worst I've come across either. What school are you coming out of?
I'm coming from a semi-target. How much would a 3.3 hinder me from megafunds and top MM PE?
PE Recruiting: How Long Will My GPA Be Relevant? (Originally Posted: 04/20/2015)
Was able to maintain 3.6/3.7 at a non-target throughout the recruiting process and will be heading to a BB. I am interested in going to the buyside but my GPA will have slipped significantly before graduating (3.2-3.4). I know that headhunters screen hard for SAT GPA. Are my chances cut for being competitive in the buyside recruiting process and will staying in banking be a better option than the places that would actually give me looks? If this is the case after how many years would I be able to remove my GPA?
Every resume I've seen come through has GPA on it. I am not on the finance side and my undergrad GPA was 3.1 - I left it off and was asked about it in my interviews. It wasn't a huge deal. My in-major GPA was ~3.6 in engineering and I just didn't care about anything else.
My experience is limited to the one firm I've worked at, but the offices are small. References/Networking and your personality and interview smarts will count far more than your GPA. The more structured the recruiting, the narrower the filters get.
This is a classic case of worrying about something you have no control over. It's a waste of mental energy until you have to make a decision - which will occur when you begin interviewing for PE in a couple years. Take a chill pill.
finished my MBA last year and started networking / recruiting without my GPA on my resume. I think I was asked by 4 out of the first 5 people I met so I put it back there (pre MBA background is 3 years BB, 2 years PE). I also got asked pretty often about my SAT scores. Anyway, the bottom line is, it follows you for a long time so make sure it doesn't slip in your last year.
It'll definitely be relevant for buyside recruiting out of banking. Whether it will preclude you from places that are better than staying in banking is something you won't know until you've given it a shot. If you want to work in PE, go through recruiting and see what you end up with. Then decide whether it's worth leaving banking. People differ regarding their goals and expectations for buyside recruiting; I know plenty of people who'd leave banking for just about any PE firm and others who're expecting something like $3bn+ aum, and even some who aren't interested in PE at all and are holding out for hedge funds or other opportunities.
I'd imagine that once you're 4-5 years out of college it won't matter much because you'd be recruiting for post-MBA positions at that point, although I could see it still being relevant if you don't pursue an MBA. Obviously it's a less important factor than your performance on the job, though, and it will become less and less important the more years out of college you are.
Impact of GPA on PE recruiting (Originally Posted: 06/29/2009)
Here's another one for experienced folks. What impact does GPA have on PE recruitment? Is it critical in getting an interview/offer? Do PE firms have GPA cutoffs for prospective applicants?
bump
Some do, some don't. For the ones that do, it's critical to get the interview but not the offer and it's usually predetermined by GPA cutoffs. I've seen usually 3.5+ though I have seen listings from funds with a 3.8+ required GPA.
PE GPA School (Originally Posted: 12/12/2011)
How much does GPA and school matter for PE recruiting?
Do headhunters look at your gpa and undergrad school or just bank and group?
I'm going to be joining a non GS/MS/JPM or UBS bulge bracket after graduation. 3.5 GPA. Non HYPS top ten school. Will my GPA put me at a disadvantage? I've seen gpa cut offs (3.7, 3.8) for some job listings.
From what I've observed from a friend in PE, I don't think undergrad GPA is considered that much. Undergrad school will continue to remain extremely important for a quite a few years after your IB Analyst stint, however.
Your analyst experience will be the most critical assessment factor in your candidature for PE. Non-BBs and GPAs matter lesser for PE recruiting as opposed to IBD recruiting at the undergrad level. That said, the only way it can be a hindrance is that people already in PE who went to targets will be biased to pick someone from those schools to interview. However, if you approach the recruiting process smartly, this shouldn't be a big problem to deal with.
What exactly do you mean by this? What does approaching the process "smartly" entail?
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