How to Deal With Volatile and Toxic MD
Boys I’m kind of at a loss rn. I work in a small group (1 MD) at a MM IB and have quite a bit of direct interaction with the group head. The problem is that this guy fuckin sucks to work for.
For example, he will ask for deck, I will take a first cut, check it over thoroughly and then send it off to him. He will then send me back an absolute chicken scratch mess of comments from his iPad in 12pt marker that is basically all illegible. I am constantly pinging other analysts screen shots of this shit just trying to decipher what he is saying. Anyway, I’ll do what I can and then ask him for clarification on wherever I can’t read his handwriting (basically everywhere). He typically acts like I am being a complete idiot and wasting his time, giving me one word answers and inaudible grunts - pretty much a fruitless exercise every time, but I try anyway. I’ll then go back and turn more comments and send it to him and this is where the real fun starts. He will then berate me for lack of attention to detail and sloppy work and how his comments were not adequate captured.
I just fuckin can’t with it anymore bro. There is no winning with this guy and it’s basically becoming a weekly occurrence at this point. I have genuinely tried so many things to address these issues with him, but he is so unapproachable and it seems like he views me as just an annoying nuisance every time I try to ask questions. Constantly walking on eggshells worrying if im going to piss him off or about what kind of mood he’s in at any particular moment. Regularly getting chewed out for lack of attention to detail when I do everything I possibly can to ensure a good work product. I think one of the main issues lies with the fact that there are not many mid level people to separate me from him and he is constantly calling on me directly to do things. I don’t even know if there’s anything I can even do at this point other than leave. Anyone have any advice? Although I don’t wish this on anyone, I’m pretty sure there are a few people like this in banking and I’d love to hear about you experiences.
What a pain. Sorry to hear about your situation. One thing I’d suggest is to understand his style of decks. Pull out old decks that he was responsible for. You’ll see common themes emerging in style, content, and flow. Perform your diligence and set up a call with him to align on his “best practices” you’ve discovered. He might appreciate that you’ve done some proactive work to understand his style. Minimize mentioning his preferences, potentially implying arbitrary choices, and orient the conversation more to what looks like a good deck based on his extensive experience.
If this doesn’t work, I would ask him directly to write clearer. I understand that he’s hostile but he may not know how bad his writing is and would probably alleviate a lot of issues. Tell him you’ve been working hard to address his update requests but to expedite them and to create more effective work products, you need to understand his concerns faster without having to call him.
you could always do what i did
entered the industry straight young and starry eyed, exited with lockjaw and a permanently defective gag reflex
I would do some dilligence on his track record of fees generated (annualized at a per annum rate of course), and compare that with his salary+bonus, and then make a reccomendation to the CEO or head of investment banking to terminate his employment without severance and provide them with a detailed three pager on the numbers, make it look pretty and be very serious about it. Then if the guy gives you a shitty performance review allege that it was retaliation for making a good faith reccomendation to senior leadership. If they are not receptive, would just jump ship and find a new gig and the guy will destroy himself eventually.
Fucking Legend! Well done, mate!
on the "make it look pretty", for reference OP, guide yourself on the best response above
so the last thing the MD sees are the most perfect 3 pages in his career made by an analyst
#analystsrising
That sounds horrendous — sorry to hear that you are going thru this
NGL, I would just leave.
this is me, literally.
and I left. painful to work with these type of guys.
What do you do now?
This MD sounds like he's on the spectrum.
Female aspies are the best!
.
Push back on this MD.
"Sorry but I cannot read this markup, can we discuss directly?"
I has an MD like this. I would call him and force him to explain his chicken scratch. Key is being so nice he's just so annoyed by all the phone calls he just starts giving you better markups.
Don't ask other people to read his handwriting. Man up and take it up with him. If he blows you off be nice but tell him you need his explanations to successfully turn his comments. If he refuse to cooperate tell the staffers. We had an MD like this and he was basically blackballed by the staffers....he never got any junior resources on our team (had to work with the sector team juniors vs product partner juniors).
Yeah, you'll probably get shit on by your MD for doing this, but you're going to get shit on for not doing this too. All things held equal, better to get shit on for trying to understand him on the front end than for not understanding him on the back end.
The worst shit though is that in many cases these types of Managing Directors don't actually know what they want on the front end and will get pissy with you for trying to ascertain it and put the ball in their court to be clear and intentional so you can cut back on iterations.
TL;DR, leave when you can. Healthcare (certain verticals) is still fairly active so recruiting for IB/PE gigs within the sector, if you like it, shouldn't be impossible rn.
Please dox this shop. Need to know where not to go, as a student.
Aspergers is more prevalent in finance over other domains. Neurotypicals won’t answer their phone at 2 am much less write a grammatically correct email or have good work ready to send out by 10 the same morning. Lmao all firms know this and hire aspies because they’ll work more for less pay and have less ego. Better ROI all around. Can also blame divorces on being aspie over working conditions. Win-win for the firm.
.
That sounds like one of my MDs. That makes you wanna quit right away…
Grow a spine and tell him outright that you cannot read the handwriting for the comments on slides 18, 23, 24, 25, 29, and 38, and would like to have a call to discuss how to best make the changes he’d like. Do it nicely, but do it firmly.
There are unappealing people in every industry. If you let those people push you around, they will do it at every turn.
SUCK HIS ASS ANALYST 2!!!!!
Is this MD a healthcare MD at Houlihan Lokey Dallas? XMFD, what a fucking cuck shop.
Im so sorry you’re going through this. I was wondering if you could you pm the firm or location?
A few suggestions:
Long term, you either are going to need to not take his work style personally or leave and work somewhere else, there's no other alternatives. There are lots of places to work and many bosses who aren't assholes. A normal, well adjusted person's response to you not being able to read their writing is, "Sorry, had this issue with teachers in elementary school and it never went away, let me know if this is a problem in the future and I'll clarify. Appreciate your help with all this"
A lot of people can't manage because they don't have empathy. Since you are an analyst, learn from him how to be a bad communicator (so you can do the opposite), don't take what he does personally, and either come to peace with his behavior and justify that it is worth it because he's smart or you like your job and there are worse things than just someone being an ass, or come up with a plan to leave the firm. At the end of the day, the analyst role is about running out the clock. It's an unsustainable pace of work and abuse that gets better/easier as you move up in the organization or you use the skills you learn to find another role that puts you in a better spot. Good luck.
You could be a good counsel.
.
I am almost 40 years old and I think this is one of the best pieces of advice I've seen on these forums, since (IMO) it's very applicable to both (i) a junior IB analyst <> IB MD relationship dynamic and (ii) a mid/senior level PE professional <> mercurial and domineering PE partner relationship dynamic.
Nice work.
My favorite senior partner quote:
”Being a good manager is like being a good parent, there’s many who are just inconceivably terrible, many who try really hard and are ultimately really bad, a couple who are flawed, but ultimately mediocre, and very few who are genuinely inspiring and life changing”
Management and leadership is such a unique skill. So few people have the drive and empathy to do it right. Funny enough, I think like parents, people expect their managers to be flawless and it’s a shocking realization that the person you work for is deeply flawed. There’s also a solid shot that a junior would handle things better and be a better manger than a parent—much in the same way kids are often critical of their parents and genuinely become better parents than their own.
.
discussion thread of MDs detailing actions
.
.
Hate to say this but sometimes people are unchangeable and they have been tolerated for so long that they get away with everything. This is especially the case for seniors that have been there for a while. It's the same kind of guy who says "I suffered so you will too. You have no idea how good you have it compared to when I was coming up." You decide for yourself if you can handle the abuse because that's just what it is. Some people have more of an ability to compartmentalize or ignore it. Maybe one day you ingratiate yourself with him so much that he appreciates it 10 years down the line. Personally, I'd try to lateral to a different group. It's not worth the mental health wounds that will no doubt trickle into every other part of my life.
.
my comment has been deleted by the WSO Nazis.
Id occaecati iusto accusantium minus. Voluptatibus nostrum ut eum quaerat ab quo. Consequatur iste aut non iusto.
Eaque corporis nihil eaque. Ratione dicta temporibus ex officia. Est delectus autem vel corrupti nihil sit et.
Dolor laboriosam reiciendis necessitatibus ipsum sit. Eos quae distinctio voluptate maxime voluptatum vitae dolores.
Et maiores eum et dolore est. Aliquam voluptates possimus repellat eaque dolor dolores. Corporis totam nam est molestiae dolores.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Quisquam dicta assumenda quis libero sapiente. Facere nostrum est eos illo. Qui placeat quis quod veritatis impedit. Nihil quisquam aperiam porro repellat fugit.
Culpa repudiandae iste voluptates suscipit harum fuga. In quod nesciunt voluptatem ut accusamus. Molestiae omnis ab repellendus quia assumenda est doloribus.