Q&A - Non Target -> BB IB -> MF PE
Hi All,
Owe a lot of my success to this forum right here and the help it’s given me over the years + people I’ve met. Wanted to help with AMA to give any guidance that can be help for the recruiting process for SA’s, FT’s and PE!
Background: MM IBD SA (JEFF, GUGGS, RAINE)-> TOP BB IBD FT (GS/MS/EVR)-> MF PE (WP/SLP/TPG)
Incoming IBD SA, what do I need to do to ensure I convert to FT?
How should I pick my group for the best and most options when exiting?
What does the end to end MFPE recruiting process look like? And would you be able to break in from a shop like RBC/HSBC/Nomura?
On converting:
1) As much as banks don't admit it, we are in 2024 but banks are still old school, hence would highly recommend to be the first one in the office and the last one out
2) Smile :) It does not hurt to bring positive energy into the office and at least give the impression that are you excited to work with the team you are in
3) Coffee's: Try to grab a coffee with EVERYONE on the team
4) Never make the same mistake twice and try to get as many feedback sessions in as much as possible (I did 15 min every friday when I was an intern, mind you my Staffer at the time was very kind enough to be honest on things i needed to work on and making the time to actually chat)
On group:
I would go based on historical evidence of people exiting from your group, look to be frank, I picked the group I did because it was the best team at my bank (especially considering exits) and could not care less about the people I worked with (this end up hurting mainly because of the people), a lot of these "Top" groups come with excessive pressure, attention and expectations but would do it if you are purely focusing on exits.
I would look for the team that historically has had the best exits from a quick Linkedin search.
If not, please please please actually looking into the culture of the teams you will be joining. This has an impact that no one takes into account when joining the industry and can cause so much headache.
On PE recruiting:
Don't get lost in the hype of size. MFPE actually tends to limit your opportunity set given the size constraint you need to solve for in all the opportunities you hold. I was lucky enough to have had prepped significantly ahead of On-Cycle and land at my number 1 choice by the stroke of luck. But most of the firms I was gunning for after this were what this forum would consider "MM" or "UMM". Did a model test with 10 rounds following that covering a range of questions across technicals, Investor Acumen, Behavs, brainteasers, deal walkthroughs, case studies etc. Your Bank will realistically have an impact on your opportunity, but to be honest, if you're good enough, you will succeed. All that this means in your case is that you need to be a killer in the interview room given likely less room to wiggle.
10 rounds damn
Incoming SA at one of the top secondaries advisory shop (evr/pjt/jeff). Do you think secondaries is a good space to be in down the road?
Can I recruit for MF PE/ UMM PE with this background? Or top secondaries investing shops (Alp/BX Strategic Partners/Ardian)?
If not, would it be a good background for b-school?
Great space and awesome tailwinds, whoever is smart enough can be the new Larry Fink of our era with how much money is flowing into this. A lot of great friends in the space who really enjoy it, its potential and the comp is great!
On the direct PE route, what I understand is that a lot of secondaries people who switch have more of a GP led role instead of looking at LP level work, given how much more relatable that is to Direct PE, so would keep that in mind, seen a couple cases of MF Secondaries folks switch to Direct PE albeit at a smaller shop. Definitely doable for top secondaries investing shops (look at your group exits ;) )
B School: To be honest with you, not completely sure but would assume so? I've always dreamed of being an investor hence solved for funds that did not require me to head back to school and fully focus on investing!
Can you give an overview/timeline on your networking & interview process moving upstream from MM SA to BB FT? Appreciate it.
+, wondering the same thing
Start early.
Recruiting has many things you need to get right simultaneously, (interview prep, networking, someone nice enough to actually push after all the calls, someone giving you a break in a shit interview round and somehow moving you to the next round, the school you go to, the internships pre banking etc etc etc).
But one thing that's always helped me was building a very strong network and hence I ultimately leveraged a lot of the relationships I had built from my SA recruiting process and mentionned I did not want to be stuck at a specific sector early on, wanted something bigger etc (basically the opposite to the MM firm i was heading too).
People were also aware that I had happened to sign very early on in my process for the summer (early March in my sophomore year, with 2-day exploding timeline), so I would argue I had pretty solid technical skills as well (EVR/CVP/MOL offers also gotten in the process for FT which I did not take).
I finally caught a break to work for the bank I went FT to through a random alumni I had spoken to who also worked at a niche HC bank and had moved to the BB I work at in their HC team. That MM networking call turned into someone who fought tooth and nail for me at the recruiting process one year later. Funny how life goes. As howard marks says: I'd rather be lucky than smart :)
More practical advice:
1. Start networking ASAP
2. Most processes for FT start the instant moment returns are out which is in mid in August and are very informal hence making your networking absolutely critical
3. Build 2-3 relationships at the top 6-8 places you want to be and MAKE SURE to follow up and grab a coffee in July once your internship has started (Keep your head down at the desk in June ;) )
4. Use your July lunches to meet with people in the city (particularly if you're in NYC), if you're not but have a place in mind you want to be (lets say LA), take a week before the summer, line up all your chats and go to LA or whichever City you want to attend and be on the sideline ready to go early August for any whisper's on availabilities that might come out. Do good in your current internship, 3/4 first rounds I did had the same first question ( did you enjoy interning at X, did you get a return offer at X?)
5. There are no shortcuts to this i converted over 250 networking calls in my first 2 years of college into a nice but small offer for my SA, which ultimtately translated into a larger offer in FT, through a combination of luck, good technical preparation, the right alumni who happened to be kind enough to push and enough coffees in one summer to fuel all of NYC
Happy to expand on any of the above if helpful
Thanks for the response. just to double check you think its best to start networking now? (Amidst all the junior SA recruiting)? If it's now did you leave ur incoming bank on your resume?
Does it feel weird when you're reaching out to people again when you're asking for help after you've been rejected/ process fell through?
My biggest hurdle (could be just a mental block) is the networking aspect of FT recruiting. The technicals/interview part isn't the daunting process but rather the part re: how to network and get your foot in the door.
Thanks man.
Thanks for this. Some recommend delaying networking for FT until a few weeks into your SA so you don't seem overeager to jump ship from your MM. To verify, you don't think this could be a concern of networking asap?
Should we be prepping for private equity technical interviews in our senior year and take the GMAT during this time?
Ideally would like to go to a top bschool after PE and then work in PE after
How did you approach FT recruitment? Especially interested in your networking strategy. Incoming SA at a top IB in London with US citizenship looking to switch over to the US for FT.
.
I noticed that you had substantial preparation prior to on-cycle. What steps did you take to get ready? Thanks!
See above for some resources to refer too. Let me know if anything specific you want to know
U might want to go anonymous for this one. Think i have a good idea of who u are already
Cool :)
How should I approach ft recruiting? I’m in a very similar boat as ur path.
should I start networking now? How did u approach ft recruiting without pissing off your current form at the time?
Answered Above, let me know if anything in particular you want to know.
I'd love to get a breakdown of your approach to re-recruiting for FT and how it differed from SA for going to a top group.
I'm currently at a non-target who got a Mid-Tier BB and it seems exit opps just aren't as good as top BBs (GS/JPM/MS) or EBs (EVR/PJT/Moelis), especially with an undecided group.
I've seen the posts on the platform, but no one ever really gets into the nitty gritty of what I should do in this scenario. Should I reach out now before the summer or during the summer? Should I angle it as informational chats?
Is it even worth it to make the move for MFPE or should I roll my marbles where I am?
Also in a similar situation and curious
Est ducimus similique est nam pariatur voluptas quas. Similique mollitia aliquam autem explicabo. Libero officiis consequatur cumque veritatis quia necessitatibus.
Omnis ab inventore corporis dolorum. Aliquam dolores enim est blanditiis. Qui ex sit sequi sapiente quisquam expedita placeat. Non laboriosam libero ducimus maiores earum quo. Nam quia ut consequatur.
Reiciendis voluptas id facilis aut numquam aut. Doloribus aut nesciunt est veritatis dolorum. Beatae deleniti perspiciatis ut ex. Sapiente officiis molestias et labore soluta voluptatibus iusto. Dignissimos tenetur voluptatibus vero iusto ipsam rerum facere. Et in non perspiciatis dolorem. Ullam mollitia culpa autem quidem ea dolores ea.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Assumenda qui ut vel excepturi culpa qui. Quibusdam quisquam totam vel sint ut explicabo. Et aliquid iste cupiditate est. Illum quia sit accusamus consequatur. Rerum dolorem soluta numquam architecto libero. Dolor et rerum pariatur odit. Tempore dignissimos mollitia voluptatibus perspiciatis.