in my quest to not be the old man yelling at a cloud or lamenting the younger generation (when really those archetypal dudes just don't understand because they've never tried to understand), I want to know: what do you want out of life?
no, I don't mean job titles, but broad brushes. if you had to paint a picture of your life in 5, 10, 15 years, what are you doing? what's your relationship status? family status? location? day to day life? interests outside of work?
I'm being deliberately vague so please answer as stream of consciousness as you like. I'm also not going to offer any advice unless asked, I just want to learn where y'all are at because it's clear the worlds in which we grew up respectively are quite different.
bump
This was just posted today. Where are you bumping it from, exactly?
thought I was on page 2
gotta love the hustle
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i come from a society where casual sex is impossible. i just wanna live the high life with lots of 4 lips
if you're not trolling, I'm curious as to why?
also, what specifically do you mean by the high life and why do you want this?
no I am not trying to trap you, I'm genuinely curious
india . it is like amish, conservative christian islamic societies. mommy said htis. daddy said that. after marriage only. ugh
Been thinking about this a lot recently. 31 years old, married with a 9-month old. Acquired a business two years ago that I ended up having to shut down late last year, which put a dent in our finances. Back to working in commercial RE debt, which is a good role, but not something I particularly enjoy or find intellectually stimulating. I often think about going off on my own again and the next venture in general, but healthcare costs alone put a stop to that almost immediately. Mid-term (next 5 years) would like to explore living abroad with my family (thinking Argentina or somewhere in Asia). My wife is on board with the plan, but is terrified of moving so far from her parents, especially with her dad's health getting worse. We'll see. I'm too young to stop the grind and I enjoy working, but I hope to find something stimulating that I can enjoy working on every day. Financially, don't think I need too much, and that number is far less than it was 3-4 years ago. I care more about time freedom and spending as much time as I can with my kids. Have spent months abroad at a time before and would love to travel with my family and show them the world.
"Financially, don't think I need too much" As long as you figure out medical care costs and insurance.
I'm 34.
5 years - Our family is established in Manhattan and my kids are in good schools. My wife is happy and has found purpose after SAHM life. I'm pushing 2000 USCF. I'm in good shape with great health markers. Continue international travel to see the world.
10 years - I'm close to FatFIRE numbers. I've done a really good job at managing my health and so have my parents. Start to make biology research my main interest. Don't take foot off the gas but find more time for leisure and hedonism.
say more about fat FIRE. I've heard about this but am hesitant to postpone experiences. how have you approached this personally?
also curious how you will find more time for leisure etc in 10y? will you be your own boss? change careers? sabbatical? what?
34. Want to get to the financial independence portion of my life especially given how bleak employment in finance looks with AI.
Secondly I want to travel once that is comfortably accomplished. Exercise in ways I enjoy particularly golf and tennis. Volunteer in making places better around my community (this is also intentionally vague). If you asked me this question 2 years ago there would be more material possessions involved but now I feel like those don’t matter nearly as much
how do you feel about your prospects for financial independence?
did anything in particular drive the change from material things? say more about that
@thebrofessor brofessor is back!!! what's up dawg
His last post was a week ago...
just enjoying dad life my guy
I am roughly around where you are asking, in my late 20s to mid 30s. Married to a wonderful woman. I am fortunate to be doing very well for my age group (probably a top 2% outcome so far among my age group, which maybe doesn't say that much). I am fortunate to be married. I see my single friends who want to be married struggling way harder than they should be given dating app culture and social media driving insane standards
I suppose what I truly want in 10-15yrs, beyond a wonderful family life w/ a couple kids, is financial independence. The ability to spend my days working for myself instead of for the man.
I want upward mobility. This feels increasingly harder to find. My top 2% outcome (Analyst at a solid LO) would've netted me total financial independence by 50 if I'd started my career in 2005. Comp has only gone down since then in absolute terms (and way more post inflation). Feels like it's a rigged game in that back in the day, if most things went right you could easily get that independence by 50. Now if most things work right, you are looking at least until age 60. Which sucks a lot given your 50s are often some of your most productive years, where you have combo of incredible experience / your mind is sharp / physically you have the energy
Good question on location. Certainly not CA given that state from a govt perspective is going down the toilet (though SF is hot as ever rejuvenated by AI). Not West Coast in general. Probably Chicago area or DC area or thereabouts, maybe northern NJ. Or maybe not in the US at all, I've always wanted to live in Singapore. The wife would be on board here given we are both from Asia originally. Increasingly feels like America is on a slow downward spiral trapped in extreme politics and an inevitable drift towards socialism as capitalists are increasingly vilified. Would love to be traveling 2mo out of every year ideally
your 2nd paragraph, how are you working towards that?
when would you like to have children?
Saving & investing at a good clip, I'm just around the ~40% savings mark currently as % of my pre tax income
Would like to have children in next few years
28m
At a stage agnostic fund, married no intent on having a kid before 32-33. My aim in the next 5 years is to launch a side business that nets me at least 2-5k post tax, I have a few ideas on how to go about this, mostly a motivation issue / work timing issue to launch. With that money, I want to buy a porsche (i’m in mcol). Just a discretionary fund, while I maximize savings from income.
In 10 years, I want to position myself such that I am able to buy and run a 15-20m TEV business and / or launch my own - I have some thoughts on how to go about this, and have a few sectors that I have my eyes on. My wife will be a surgeon by then hopefully, allowing me to take unlimited business risk / devote full-time.
I’m in no rush in the near term, outside of discretionary pocket money. Otherwise, I do want to build substantial equity by 40-45.
Worst case, I keep my job (people like me and I have good upward momentum) and my wife becomes a surgeon. We still net a good income.
I want to be able to buy a 3 bedroom single family home in my hometown (LA, or anywhere in Southern California) and be able to support a family of 4 with one income.
I want to have enough freedom in my schedule to see my kids grow up, be able to take them to school, be at all their games/concerts/whatever and never miss a milestone birthday or holiday due to work.
I want to live around interesting people, I love my line of work from an intellectually stimulating standpoint but I don’t feel alive at work. I want to be able to connect with cool humans outside of finance that have hobbies other than fine dining, traveling, and networking sports like golf. I think artists and athletes and academics are all fascinating and I wish I had more community with people who are very different than me.
On that note, I would love to live in a walkable community where I know my neighbors. My grandparents and parents always talk about how when they were kids they were close with the neighbors kids, sometimes families would go Nextdoor to eat dinner with the neighbors, my dad had a neighbor with fruit trees and would bring fresh fruit over for the boys out of kindness some days. Obviously I’m sure it wasn’t all peachy keen 24/7 but living in a few different apartments now as a 28 year old, it’s almost as if neighbors are afraid to look you in the eye in the rare case you pass each other in the hallway. Generally social interactions with strangers has gone to zero since college and I wish people were more social.
This was the life I was promised but it just feels exceedingly out of reach, like I’ve been priced out before I could even get started. If I don’t trade the next 20 years of my life like a slave I won’t have a shot on most of the things on this list and still even then with the rapidly rising cost of living / inflation etc. it’s a pipe dream.
To me, making it now no longer feels like a function of your ability and willingness to work hard, but more like we just live in a lottery economy. Lucky enough that your startup takes off? American dream for you (the same dream my relatively lower middle class ass grandparents and parents had in the 50s-80s as postmen, public service workers, and teachers btw). Lucky enough to get in the right AI startup early enough before it IPOs? American dream for you. I’m extremely jaded, but still trudging along.
how are you working towards any of those things you list? it does sound like a good life, for what it's worth
del
banging chicks and clubbing at night and chilling on the beach during the day. most likely in Thailand or Philippines.
Genuinely curious, how is this a satisfying lifestyle for a man who's around 40? Really no desire to settle down at all?
I mean, do what makes you happy long-term but just wondering
I'm around 30yo and am settled down: have a fiancee who I've been with for 7 years. Luckily my fiancee is chill and doesn't mind me hooking up with other girls as long as it's just hookups (which is why she became my fiancee).
sounds like you're doing what you want, do you think you'll always do this? as in the same thing at 40, 50, 60 & beyond? if not, when will the shift happen and what changes will there be?
yes, always. I don't get tired of good things, and I don't need to dilute them with worse things just to have some change. maybe short breaks here and there, but I can see myself being absolutely happy while having the aforementioned lifestyle in my 40s, 50s, 60s, and beyond.
Had a close friend die in his 20s and went to his funeral. He was an exceptional person and a pillar of the communities he was a part of. I remember there being a huge sea of family, friends, colleagues, ex professors from college, senior leadership of his bank, etc. Everyone came out of the woodwork for this guy and were genuinely affected beyond “going through the motions” for a funeral.
Changed the way I look at my own life. I want to live well for the people close to me and for the communities I am part of so that one day, when I inevitably pass, people turn out for me. Not in a narcissistic way but as a framework for thinking through how to act and making the most of my time.
To that end, I want to earn the reputation for being loving and warm with friends and family, doing “the right thing”, working hard (but not too much), and being involved in the world outside the finance bubble we live in. The money in this industry is nice, but it’s just a cherry on top / window dressing to the more important things.
I'm 25. I'm going to keep spending a lot of time with my parents and grandparents (very lucky to have 4 currently but they're getting older) over the next five years. Lucky my parents are quite healthy still. By 30 I want to be married or seriously on that trajectory so I'm not a super old dad. Before 35 start my own fund or purchase a business and run it. I will probably need to get an MBA but I honestly prefer working to school. I want to work internationally sometime in the next five years too, so an MBA could be a good reason to be in certain countries.
More than anything going to continue to appreciate my friends, invite them to stuff, and just be grateful for the 1-2x a year hangouts since my network has dispersed significantly. Really need to be able to just pick right up where we left off because the weekly hang isn't feasible for a good 60%+ of my friend group despite shared interests, compatible personalities. Watering friendships is so key. When I'm in certain cities for work I will literally book myself with friends for breakfast lunch and dinner between meetings. Only way to see a dozen people in a week. Favorite thing is getting a big table at a chinese spot near friends offices so people can swing through and graze dim sum without committing to a whole dinner. In new york I have a good core group I see weekly as well who are mostly younger than me.
Life is really great and I'm just trying to keep it going with eyes wide open that as people settle down it will evolve into a new season of life with new experiences and social dynamics. A wife and kid would provide the most purpose. I love my niece, so awesome.
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@thebrofessor - sorry for the stream of consciousness
32 years old. started my career in IB as an analyst then pivoted to a role within commercial real estate acquisitions. Now at a VP level within my career. with a girlfriend of 2 years who i see myself with long term.
As far as what I want, not sure in terms of 5, 10, 15 years, but generally, I want to be completely in control of my own time and not answer to anyone. I feel that through my 20's, I missed out on a lot of life experiences because I was so focused on my career. I really envy the people who backpacked asia / latin america when they had nothing to lose in their early 20's. Of course I could also do that now, but it's not quite the same. Even for my friends who didn't do extensive travel and just worked normal corporate jobs, they had time every night on weekdays and every weekend to go out, explore and really enjoy themselves whereas I was frequently in the office until like 2-3 am working on some random PPT aligning logos. Don't get me wrong, the sacrifices I made put me at a very good spot and have been able to accumulate a large nest egg. I suppose the grass is always greener. These days I care less and less about career and am essentially quiet quitting and would like to take some sabbatical to play "catch up" on time lost during my 20's. So I guess for my next 5 years, I want to have as much fun as possible that I missed out on in my 20's. I've been adopting this more and TBH it is a lot harder as a 32 year old vs. early 20's.
I don't necessarily hate working, but I would like to do something that is fully on my own time, with deadlines set by myself. I also want to be remote and a digital nomad out of a country in Southeast Asia and actually get bang for my buck in the place I live. I have a good gig right now with decent work life balance, but the problem is that it's not that bad, but it also indirectly controls my time/freedom. Admittedly, I do follow the FIRE mindset though I may not actually pull the trigger and retire, but just step back. Right now I have a decent net worth and am getting closer to the transition point where I take my foot off the gas. The problem is that while a few months off purely to focus on leisure / travel would be fun, I ultimately want to think about what I want to build towards (and frankly, I don't know what that is which is something I'm struggling with).
In terms of work - I don't love real estate or finance and am definitely not passionate about it. As I look to how careers progress in this industry, I don't look up to MDs in IB or Partners in PE. I can respect their work and their wealth, sure, but I in no way envy their lives and wouldn't trade my life for theirs. That said, this industry has given me the skills I have so I'd like to find some way to monetize it in a way that gives me a flexible lifestyle (i.e. consulting or contracting). I've tried doing some freelance modeling for one of the AI training companies and I actually enjoyed that because I could start and stop whenever I wanted. That said, eventually those roles will disappear or pay a lot less because once the AI is trained, in theory those jobs disappear.
In terms of lifestyle - my main hobbies are soccer and I'm pretty into fitness generally. Would also want to pick up new skills such as muy thai or maybe even an instrument. On day-to-day basis, I want time every day to go to lift weights for 1 hour, cardio (either soccer or walking) for 1 hour, get 8 hours of sleep, leisurely lunches/dinners every day and with the remainder of the time dedicated to work. Weekends I'd want to explore new restaurants, go to bars, and occasionally go clubbing (while it's still fun for me). More macro, I'd like to have 3 places - one place in the US, one place in Europe, and one place in Southeast Asia. All of which I could airbnb and they break even on monthly expenses so that I can just block off time whenever I want and go to each place for a few months at a time.
Kids/family - I am still undecided on whether or not I want kids (I lean no). I think if you made me choose right now as a 32 year old either have kids or never have kids, I would easily choose never have kids. My GF thinks the same way. That said, I could change my mind down the line (as could my GF). My parents are definitely getting older now and I'd like to be able to have time, flexibility and money to take care of them as well.
Generally speaking, I guess I'm at a point now where I'm reflecting on my life a lot more recently. I'm no longer "young and full of potential" and am very much so the product of my choices from late teens through twenties. I did well in school, got into a good college, got into IB and held a good job through now, and for that I'm grateful. On the other hand, however, it feels like I gave a top 1% effort and have achieved top 1% outcomes (for my age cohort), yet I'm still not balling out or anything. It's not like I'm worth tens of millions and can just do/buy whatever I want - I'm just living a very normal upper middle class lifestyle. Also now that I feel that a lot of my college friends are growing more and more distant as we settle in our own lives and that in itself feels sad to me in many ways. I feel like I'll never been in an environment of my peers where everyone is open to being friends and socializing on a daily basis, so in some ways I miss the community that college fosters. I guess overall, on paper I have a life that people would kill to have, but at the same time I don't know if I've truly built a life that makes me happy yet. There are still a lot of big questions that I don't know the answer to (i.e. what do I want to do for work) that I thought I would have answered by now. No real conclusion here and no real lesson for anyone else - just another monkey navigating the world.
Your point on college really hits true. College is a very special time for those exact reasons.
I think each decade and stage of life brings different types of enjoyment, you have to enjoy the next leg and appreciate that it will be amazing but a different kind of amazing than the last leg. The joy you felt at the simplest things when you were 5 will not be felt again, but you had different joys in your teens and then in college and then after etc etc. They're all special for diff reasons
It is a little sad to see college friends growing more distant, I've seen the same but everyone moves on with their lives. It's not that they are running away from you, it's just a simple drift. Two observations are that 1) you have to move on with your own life (which you are with this girl that you see yourself marrying) -- because your friends will certainly move on with theirs and 2) with your friends, you've just gotta be the guy keeping in touch and constantly reaching out.
Most people have no idea how to maintain friendships, which means for the ones you really care about you've generally got to pick up the slack. It's more work to be the guy reaching out 90% of the time, but much more rewarding in the long term to have friendships that are 10+yrs old or more vs. new friends every stage of your life
Funny thing was, when I was single I was the guy always doing the reaching out -- where every friend was receptive and was happy to chat over the phone or make plans to do stuff -- to every single friend. Now I'm married so my free time has shrunk a lot, as has my willingness to always be the guy reaching out to everyone. So I've prioritized keeping in touch with only my close friends (about ~60% of the amount I used to regularly ping maybe 3yrs ago), and even that frequency has just come down like 30% due to time constraints. I'm still the one reaching out most of the time to this now smaller group of ~15 people, but it's more manageable now where I've got time to focus on my career, spend time with my wife, call my parents regularly, work out, and read.
For the 40% I don't really keep in touch with anymore, they've kind of fallen by the wayside as they also haven't been good about reaching out. But what can I do? I've already invested more than enough so my conscience is clear, and I can't run myself ragged & stressed to making everything work 100% with everyone when there isn't reciprocal effort. Though it is a little sad to see some of these relationships gradually fade out, esp. as you have some amazing memories. Lots of rambles here but maybe something coherent
@thebrofessor I have read a lot of your longer musings on various topics, wonder what you think of the above and your experience with friendships over time & how that's evolved. If you are open to sharing
Yeah totally hear you on the making the effort to keep up. I guess what I miss from the college years was how seamless/natural every interaction was. Many moments of spontaneity which honestly built many moments of true happiness. Now everything is scheduled and more difficult. I suppose that's just how it goes in adulthood. I know some people kind of get that resurgence in social life from B school, but my guess is over time those connections also grow distant
funny you should ask about friendships, I was thinking about this the other day
when I was 25, I had maybe 15 good friends with whom I regularly interacted. I wasn't yet married (dating my now wife), there were 4 of us in the same house downtown that was the center of gravity for all pregames, and I had regular golf outings with some of the others
when I was 30, that had shrunk to maybe 10
pushing 40, there's 6. my best friend from high school, one of my best friends from high school days (didn't go to the same school as me but we went to same college and are from same town), and 4 of my fraternity brothers. though if I'm honest, I speak to only 3 of them every month.
that's the bad part. we all live in different cities, with busy lives, and given the choice of driving 35 minutes to see my friend, his wife and girls or staying at home with my wife, son, and dog, I'm picking my family all day long. and I know they would too, and neither side faults the other for it. so get togethers are less spontaneous than they were in the frathouse days where we would just be drinking beers on the porch and people would drop by to see what was going on. but then again, life as a 40 year old isn't ever spontaneous if you're married with a family, so I guess it's the natural evolution of life.
now the good part. instead of those drop bys, you plan for weeks on end to get together for cocktails or dinner or someone's kid's bday party, and when you do, you have 5-10min of small talk that your 25yo self never would've dreamed of (diapers, strollers, nap schedules) but then you pick right up wherever you left off. the friendships that took years to build don't suffer from neglect. rather than being like a fussy orchid that needs constant attention, they're like an oak tree. solid, limited maintenance required, and when you're back, you find the roots are strong as fuck.
now that doesn't touch the other aspects of making a life with career, money, family, etc., but that's a long ass musing in and of itself. maybe another day
God fearing family and a big ass house.
30, married 4 years today, and first child on the way in 3 months. Wife and I both have solid jobs and bought a house last year (major TX city). Life is good and we aren't wanting for anything although we aren't "well off" by any means. That being said, we are able to go on trips, have a good work/life balance, and really not have to say no to much things. Just trying to live within our means.
To your question, I want a job I really enjoy that doesn't feel like work (if this exists). I'm at a multi-family office in more of a wealth management/allocator role for client capital. You've been helpful on this forum in my career journey so thank you for that. I'm a CFP, have good experience, but I just don't think I like the client facing role and would rather do something more analytical.
Trying to pivot by getting my CFA (on L2 in August) and ideally would end up in an allocator seat at an endowment, SFO, or foundation. I'm finding the pivot tough and my current job is stressful. I'm extroverted and things always go well but still feel a bit of imposter syndrome speaking with clients who are all sophisticated.
Anyways, in 5 years I hope to be in a role I really enjoy with my wife and kid(s) happy as can be and taken care of.
imposter syndrome is real, I still have it. the best way I can describe how you can manage it (because it's never fully overcome, just managed) is you accumulate stories over the years. since I never had firsthand experience (I grew up lower middle class to a civil servant and local banker, my cul de sac was immigrants or other civil servants, and a drug dealer!), I just got loads of knowledge when I was in my 20s through early 30s, and then you talk to enough clients you accumulate enough stories + knowledge to gain trust and feel like you belong in the room. you then realize that people aren't actually smarter than you, they just have had a different path. resist the urge to resent it, and more as an opportunity to hone your craft.
here's another little secret - you'll never be "in," and that's OK. they know you're part of the out group, but family money needs trusted counselors, even if you'll never be welcomed into the inner circle, that's fine. you just need to be able to do high quality work to make your own life, and be refined enough to be invited to a garden party and not stick out like a sore thumb.
congratulations on becoming a dad, it's the best!
Not having to do the things I don't want to do so I can spend more time doing the things that I love. There's nothing better in my opinion.
I spent the last 6 years investing a shit ton of time getting really good at my job, only to feel that there was a gaping hole somewhere. It took me a long time to realize what that hole was (which I won't get into). While I love many aspects of my job, this one missing piece makes it unlikely for me to stick to the field I'm in. I'm now figuring out if I can find a new job, possibly in a new field, that fills this hole while maintaining the aspects that I love. (If I've learned anything, while it may be hard to find the "perfect" job, there are MANY jobs out there that are significantly better than the previous jobs you've had.)
Early in my career, I was in a completely different coast from where all my friends ended up, so I'd only see them 1-2 times per year around the holidays or for our planned trips. This let me focus full time on my gf, job, and hobbies, all of which turned out pretty well. Now that I'm back in New York, I realized that I don't necessarily feel the need to see my friends that often. Texting and a phone call here and there is plenty enough. I might see them maybe 2-3 times now, but that's sufficient for me. I don't want to get drinks at a bar or go to the club, which, as someone in their early 30s in a long-term relationship, is less appealing. I only drank to bang chicks, not sit around with a bunch of other dude. I'd rather spend my time on my hobbies or spend that time with friends ideating on interesting business ideas or having debates on whether we are in a simulation.
I had an interesting conversation with my gf a couple weeks ago around money. She may potentially have an exit for a company that she started a few years ago, and she jokingly asked whether I would just retire and go traveling. While that sounds like a lot of fun, retired people are some of the most miserable people I've seen. After a few years of traveling and fucking around, they become bored. They then realize that they've become irrelevant and out of touch with what's happening with the world. There's only so much time you can spend with loved ones before the marginal utility of spending another minute drops precipitously. It's the longing for the next big catch that keeps someone excited about life. That could be a new business exit, a car, or an AP. I couldn't care less about what that "thing" is as long as it keeps you hungry. Who knows, maybe my gf's exit may never happen and crash and burn. But it's that hope that keeps us excited about the future.
As Immanuel Kant said, the rules for happiness are something to do, someone to love, and something to hope for. The latter two are pretty set for me. I just need to find something better to do.
Not having to do the things I don't want to do so I can spend more time doing the things that I love. There's nothing better in my opinion.
I spent the last 6 years investing a shit ton of time getting really good at my job, only to feel that there was a gaping hole somewhere. It took me a long time to realize what that hole was (which I won't get into). While I love many aspects of my job, this one missing piece makes it unlikely for me to stick to the field I'm in. I'm now figuring out if I can find a new job, possibly in a new field, that fills this hole while maintaining the aspects that I love. (If I've learned anything, while it may be hard to find the "perfect" job, there are MANY jobs out there that are significantly better than the previous jobs you've had.)
Early in my career, I was in a completely different coast from where all my friends ended up, so I'd only see them 1-2 times per year around the holidays or for our planned trips. This let me focus full time on my gf, job, and hobbies, all of which turned out pretty well. Now that I'm back in New York, I realized that I don't necessarily feel the need to see my friends that often. Texting and a phone call here and there is plenty enough. I might see them maybe 2-3 times now, but that's sufficient for me. I don't want to get drinks at a bar or go to the club, which, as someone in their early 30s in a long-term relationship, is less appealing. I only drank to bang chicks, not sit around with a bunch of other dude. I'd rather spend my time on my hobbies or spend that time with friends ideating on interesting business ideas or having debates on whether we are in a simulation.
I had an interesting conversation with my gf a couple weeks ago around money. She may potentially have an exit for a company that she started a few years ago, and she jokingly asked whether I would just retire and go traveling. While that sounds like a lot of fun, retired people are some of the most miserable people I've seen. After a few years of traveling and fucking around, they become bored. They then realize that they've become irrelevant and out of touch with what's happening with the world. There's only so much time you can spend with loved ones before the marginal utility of spending another minute drops precipitously. It's the longing for the next big catch that keeps someone excited about life. That could be a new business exit, a car, or an AP. I couldn't care less about what that "thing" is as long as it keeps you hungry. Who knows, maybe my gf's exit may never happen and crash and burn. But it's that hope that keeps us excited about the future.
As Immanuel Kant said, the rules for happiness are something to do, someone to love, and something to hope for. The latter two are pretty set for me. I just need to find something better to do.
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