Can we talk about the insanity of the NYC rental market right now? Coupled with the broader food and cost of living inflation in the past year, I imagine that many people (even those with high salaries) are feeling the pain.
Record-high New York City rents, following a pandemic-era plunge into record lows, continue to hit all-time, and bank-busting, highs — and July was no different.
That’s according to the latest rental market report from Douglas Elliman and Miller Samuel — a monthly release tracking pricing in Manhattan, Brooklyn and parts of Queens — which found that median and average rents in Manhattan climbed to a respective $4,150 and $5,113 per month.
Those figures surpass already-historic highs. The June rental report, released last month, found that the average rental price in Manhattan broke the $5,000 threshold for the first time ever. In May, the median rent price reached $4,000 for the first time.
Real estate and PE really is just a wealth transfer mechanism from the middle class to the upper class
RE has jackasses raising rents as much as they possibly can while justifying it by buying a new microwave
PE has outsourced a billion jobs to Asia and routinely fires workers because muh synergies
If I wasn’t in finance myself I’d be rioting
Keepin it real
Couldn’t agree more.
inb4 the real estate clowns come on here and say “well people are willing to PAY it, then it MUST be an ethical price!!!” Really genius? My 15% broker fee for leaving the keys under the doormat was totally justified. Also my 70% rent increase makes sense too. I despise these weasels.
inb4 PE nerds start going on about “bringing efficiency” to the market. Bruh, something like 40% of all jobs in the US are not necessary, you’re just hurting normal people when you trim fat lol. And most of the time, they don’t even do do that - just playing musical chairs to pass their portcos off to the next fund and for the public markets to eventually be the bag holder.
“And I'm getting madder and madder and I ask this guy how he sleeps at night knowing he's ripping off working people and he just leaves. He doesn't say a word. He just walks away from the lunch. So am I fucked up or is he?”
- Mark Baum
Nobody forced you to use a broker. Don't like paying the fee? Do the leg work yourself.
And if your rent went up 70% and someone is paying that, then that is, by definition, the market price.
You are lazy and entitled and want all the benefits of government intervention in the market when it comes to your problems, but I'd bet good money you're one of these pseudo-libertarians who think "taxation is theft"
Have some ethical consistency. And more to the point, if you don't like paying a broker fee, find a no-fee apartment. Take a day or three off work. You have all sorts of choices, but you choose convenience and then bitch about it.
Once again it is mind blowing to me that in 2022, we have WSO conservatives echoing talking points from Bernie, Liz Warren, and the Occupy Wall Street movement that this website ridiculed 10 years ago…
You have a very binary view of the two parties. You need to reassess.
That’s because its become the position of the Republican Party post trump. Tucker says these things on his show constantly.
It is perfectly consistent, no reason for surprise. Socialism is good when it helps the right people, and bad when it helps the wrong people. So when conservatives are paying more and the free market isn't being used as an excuse for huge salaries and bonuses (well that's what they're willing to pay!) or for why the poor should suck it up and accept a low minimum wage because "that is what the market dictates for unskilled labor", all of a sudden it's a crime.
Rules for thee, not for me. Or, privatized gain and socialized losses. Take your pick for what hypocrisy of the day you want to ascribe, it'll fit.
But... someone has to actually rent the apartment. I'm not sure you understand how a "free market" works.
This isn’t accurate.
Large property management companies that have the financial means to do so can easily choose to keep property off the market. When a few do so, prices are going to rise in the market even if occupancy isn’t full (due to less supply).
Basically the idea would be instead of leasing 100% of available properties today, lease 70-80% at the market rate today and then hope the market appreciates enough so that holding the remaining 20-30% is profitable. If you have a staggered release of properties this works.
A very crude example would be
80% occupancy @ $2400/month or
100% occupancy @ $2000/month
If we factor in variable costs, it’s definitely within reason that the 80% option is the more favorable.
So it’s inaccurate to say that free markets necessarily dictates 100% occupancy.
I have 0 pity for people living in Manhattan / Brooklyn. Either a) move out into Queens / Jersey or b) move into a different locale. In an era of remote work like we're living in, you can live a fantastic life living in a much lower COL T1 city like Chicago or even T2 / T3 cities
Literally could not care less about this, even if you're in finance there are plenty of great places you can go which are much cheaper than Manhattan (Miami, Chicago, Boston, etc)
Lmao some little pussies got triggered that I said they don't have a God-given right to live inexpensively in the most expensive place in the entire country and MS'd me. Keep em coming, I stand by my words 100% you soft shits. You don't have the right to live in NYC, if you can afford it then do it. But if you can't, then move out
Whose triggered now?
Of course, people are a bit entitled about living Manhattan (especially young people who have largely only experienced the post-COVID market in the past few years).
That said, you are exaggerating the ease with which people can just pick up their lives and move elsewhere. People have goodwill accumulation at firms, non-competes / other handcuffs at firms, and significant others who would have to sort out new employment as well. Plus, by far the highest concentration of best jobs in finance is located here in New York - you can cut COL by moving elsewhere, but it may come at the cost of current income and career path. For instance, I would love to live in Washington - not an option really based on lack of industry presence. I would also love to live in London (still cheaper than NY) and it is complicated with work visas.
On second thought: Ignorance is a choice.
Miami and Boston are expensive as well. Chicago is the only affordable big city.
yeah but chicago is cheaper because your odds of getting clipped by some shots out of the blicky are significantly higher
Crime is still a thing in NYC obviously - but the stories from Chicago buddies are way worse
Yes they're expensive in an abs sense but still relatively much cheaper than Manhattan
Couple things:
1) I'm specifically talking about white collar workers here given how much the finance guys on this forum are complaining about the Manhattan rents, they of all people shouldn't be
2) all those jobs you mentioned are in high demand with a lack of worker supply. So yes, those workers have significantly more power in determining where they want to work. Why do you have to be a cop in Manhattan? Why not be a cop in Weschester or Philly? Why do you have to be a plumber in Manhattan? Why not in Boston or Pittsburgh? Truth is, most people are doing it because they really want to live in Manhattan -- but you can't have your cake and eat it too
Fine, cops and teachers can't afford to live in Soho today, when in 1992 they could have. Why am I or anyone else supposed to care? They can still afford to live in Flatbush, or Washington Heights.
exactly, I was going to blame it on politicians for discouraging developers, but in those areas of new York its just there isn't anyway to develop further, if all these bankers want to live 5 min away from work then pay up otherwise just don't complain or move elsewhere
Couldn't agree more. I believe everyone has a right to a safe, clean place to live. No one has a right to that housing being in Midtown Manhattan.
Besides, rents aren't actually up a crazy amount if you trend them. The problem is that so many people got used to COVID discounts and now they're looking at 50% rent bumps and thinking it is crazy, when really all we're seeing is a snap back to pre-COVID rents.
I also find it insanely amusing that the people complaining about this, at least on these boards, are pretty often the same ones who have no pity for someone making minimum wage, because they don't have skills to demand higher wages. As always, when it is someone else suffering, it's just the free market doing its thing. When all of a sudden 22 year old Johnny can't afford to live in a brand new luxury apartment in Chelsea, and might have to move to an outer borough, that is when something is wrong and needs to be done.
What about people from this area? When my grandparents came to this country, they could easily live in NYC on a normal working class salary. This is some people's home, not just a place for young transplants.
Sucks as a resident, but it’s all supply and demand. Lots of people want to live in NYC, and lots of those can make the numbers work.
What we really need to do is remove barriers to building (eg, zoning restrictions) and let the city grow. Lots of single family houses in Queens and Brooklyn that could be 4-10 unit multifamily properties, and lots of 4-10 unit buildings in Manhattan that could be 100+ units. Not to mention tons of legacy 1-2 story commercial spaces that should have residential on top of them
Supply and demand? Nonsense. Rent regulation and people taking advantage of it have distorted the numbers. Tons of units remain vacant because they are not incentivized to be rented out
yeah what people miss is that this is not at all a failure of capitalism...
capitalism would have developers building much higher density units all over Manhattan and SF bc rents are way higher than construction costs
its government regulation preventing any building that is fucking us all
same old story
Spoken like a true renter… instead of wishing that all these rules will change to accommodate YOUR rent, just accept the system as it is and position yourself to win by owning. You’re not entitled to low rent.
Oh my goodness!
Anyway...
Not a problem for me. I have plenty of liquidity due to my hefty base ($140k as an1 at FTP btw)
Pretty soon your FT partners base won’t be enough
Yeah $140K isn’t enough anymore for Manhattan.
”Adding salt to the wound, many landlords require lease applicants to earn an annual salary equal to some 40 times their monthly rent, otherwise known as the “40 times rent rule.” For the July Manhattan median, that would equal a salary of $166,000; for the Manhattan average, that’s $204,520.”
Not surprising. Apartments are still seeing ridiculous bidding wars, even for low-quality places that are already listed above their true value. Don't see this going away anytime soon
Aren't most cities at record levels of rent and home prices right now? I get that NYC is higher relatively to them, but I think this is a broader problem with the real estate market in general
And by most cities, I mean the larger ones. Don't come at with "I live in X tier 6 market and my rent is lower these days"
My tier 6 market is more prestigious than yours./s
No other city outside SF or NYC metro is coming close to the 4.1k median rent for a 2 bed in Manhattan. That's a full mortgage payment with PITI anywhere in the country
https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2022/07/14/new-york-city-rent…
Congrats on winning the award for highest rent. I actually said I understand that New York is higher priced relative to other markets
Correct. The underbuilding/zoning/land use crisis a lot of the coastal cities have been experiencing for the last 40+ years has finally come for the rest of the country. When you should be building 10 (not a real number, used for benchmarking) units of housing every year, the cities that build 3 (NYC, LA, Boston among others) get hit first, but those that build 8 (Charlotte, Austin, Dallas) will eventually get whacked too - it just takes longer for the deficit to build up.
Totally agree, it's more of a timing thing but all of these cities are now getting squeezed. Some are certainly feeling the impact more than others, but all are starting to feel it. I live in one of those 6 cities and have friends in the others - all of us are some degree of pissed about rent prices
NIMBYs deserve the guillotine
I hope Fed cranks up interest rates and real estate plummets
Honestly, whatever it takes. It’s ridiculous
Sorry if I understand this incorrectly but wouldn't that cause rents to still increase. The asset price of apartments/homes would decrease but less people would be willing to purchase in a high interest rate environment leading to more renters?
depends on how you think about it. I would rather buy an apartment for $800k at 6% than for $1M at 4.5%, because I will refinance it later in a couple of years at 4.5%.
That's what's causing the problem. Fed raises rates -> mortgage rates go up -> buying a home becomes more expensive -> more people stay renters -> rents go up.
depends on how you think about it. I would rather buy an apartment for $800k at 6% than for $1M at 4.5%, because I will refinance it later in a couple of years at 4.5%.
They'll continue to charge what you're willing to pay. Retarded Manhattan-middle-class finance clowns making 300K-500K gross, who think they're elite ballers, will continue to willingly donate 30%-50% of their after-tax pay for their elite 1,000 sq. ft. apartment with aMeNiTiEs, so management companies will continue to cash the checks.
Same applies for transplant gig economy workers whose entire identity revolves around BrUnChEs and the MaNhAtTaN ExPeRiEnCe paying 65%+ of their net earnings for a grimy Manhattan walk-up that hasn't been renovated since 1985, or alternatively rooming with 10 people while in their late 20s / early 30s.
Sad stuff.
reads like you've never actually lived in NYC or tried to rent. Not all juniors are morons - but even $175k for associates doesn't go very far when shithole studios without in unit washer/dryer are $3,500/month
Been in the city since 2004, thanks for the 2 cents bud
Lmao nyc is the biggest con that ever fucking existed. So many people move there because prestige, the “city experience” (aka overpriced restaurants and stupid themed bars), the chance to grow their career (why does it matter if half of that money is going to a shithole apartment and you can’t afford anything else) , and the chance to be around other ‘enlightened’ individuals aka other yuppies who bought the same con and regurgitate hand to mouth the same leftist talking points to sound intelligent over a $50 brunch
all that for the privilege to live in a 500 sq ft apartment without central ac, or a washer/dryer, or modern appliances. All that to have a city that smells like a sewer, and public transport that hasn’t improved in 40 years. All that to not save a penny or pay off your likely massive student loans because the cost of everything is absurd
but there’s “so much to do!”. Except good luck if any of your hobbies involve the outdoors, things that take space, driving somewhere, require equipment, etc. when Wall Street oasis professionals are complaining about rent then you know prices are fucking up the average individual.
have your fun there in your 20s when you are used to living in squalor and are single and can sleep around, network, etc. But after that gtfo
^ basically this
Or people actually, you know, like it?
This is why Wall Street professionals are so boring man. Yeah if you love getting shitfaced at bars (great in your early-mid 20s, just sad if you're past that point) then sure. But if you have real hobbies (i.e. golfing, scuba diving, surfing, etc) Manhattan is a shithole
Nice cope for someone whose wealth stagnated/flatlined in late 20’s. If you can hack it and continue growing your $$$ (and there are many opportunities to living in NYC), there is no place like it. You wouldn’t be talking crap on how inaccessible outdoors is if you had a place in the Hamptons or Catskills. Good luck in Nashville/Charlotte/Austin with your backyard bbq and occasional hiking and 3 live music bars you always go to! So much better for the kids, right?
But the homeless guy jerking off in front of your office building is authentic though!
Planning to live in Manhattan with roommates, I found a cheap area (not downtown) that isn’t “trendy” or “cool” but it’s safe and a short commute to my office. People that complain want to live in a 1 bedroom bachelor pad in a place like West Village.
Obviously NYC rent is ridiculously high, but it’s not that bad if you make some adjustments, like moving to Queens or Jersey City, but some New Yorkers refuse to swallow their pride.
You mean transplants refuse to swallow their pride. The population that this post mostly targets is probably around 500k people absolute max out of a city of 8.5 million where 70% of the population lives in Brooklyn or Queens.
Yes, you are absolutely right. The men transplants want The Wolf of Wallstreer type of lifestyle and the transplant women want The Sex and the City lifestyle.
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