Would you want your wife to take on your last name?
I was having a casual conversation with my current GF and some of her friends on their thoughts on marriage and the topic came up on whether or not they would take on a potential husband's last name. Every single one said she would never do it as it is an outdated tradition and would want to remain their own independent self. Personally, I had always thought it would be nice to have my potential wife take on my last name in order to be one cohesive family unit, but I had never really thought about it until they brought it up.
I'm not looking to marry this girl (or any for that matter) anytime soon (25 here), more-so just curious on what everyone's philosophy on this is? On one hand, it doesn't seem like like that big of a deal, especially in the case of career women or those with special family situations, but I do find it funny how this particular tradition seems to have been more or less abandoned by our generation, and something as seemingly simple as changing a last name is made out to be such a big deal but yet the man is still expected to spend a certain amount on an engagement ring or make other traditional relationship-related sacrifices.
My wife didn't take my name and that was a decision we were pretty aligned on together from the early days
Did she take her boyfriend's name?
No, she took the name of the guy she is in 'entanglement' with
does your wife's boyfriend let you stay on the internet for more than 2 hours?
Oh I gotcha, she took her bull's name instead. Checks out
Know a VP whose wife didn't take his and he was OK with it. She was actually pretty vocal about correcting people who tried to call her by his last name.
I have to believe she married him for the money if she was embarrassed to even be publicly associated with him (her vehemently trying to correct others regarding her name).
She also has a pretty successful career. It's more that they're supporters of gender equality.
Probably the opposite - her family has money and the name rings stronger than his. Weird though that she corrects people on it.
If she wants her daddy's last name so bad she should've married him 😂
I guess the difference is for one of those she had a choice, for one she didn't.
I am more old-fashioned than many my age. I wouldn't ask a partner to take my surname, but I would like it very much if she wanted to.
It's a sort of circular loop. Obviously a woman is her own person with her own identity and background that's completely equal in value to mine, so demanding that she give hers up is illogical. The man's last name isn't automatically the right answer.
I've worked hard to make my name something, not in terms of publicity, but rather values or mindset. If a woman sees that on her own and appreciates it or identifies with it strongly enough to choose my name voluntarily, that would be gratifying and attractive to me. It indicates a symmetry of character (values) and thinking (mindset), which I've found to be remarkably rare and therefore invaluable.
What if your partner also worked hard to "make their name something in values and mindset?" Then should she change it? Should you take hers? Not actually advocating for that, just food for thought
I would be grateful to meet someone with a similar mindset and feel fortunate to find a compatible partner. The only conversation I'd raise about names would be about the kids'.
It's illogical to say "Because I work hard for the benefit of my future family, you have to sacrifice your last name", because a partner (in my case, a wife) can work just as hard (not everything can be measured in financial contribution) or earn as much or more. I recognize that, and I believe addressed it in my comment.
My comment was less prescriptive and more unique to me. Like "I am proud of what you've worked so hard to achieve, and joining you in that where people immediately know from my name I am with you feels special." I had that once, and while I chose not to progress to a marriage in that relationship, it was very meaningful to me.
Totally agree "I wouldn't ask a partner to take my surname, but I would like it very much if she wanted to"
In the US, most women adopt their husband’s family name when they get married – around 70%
At least they admitted they don't believe in marriage and are looking for an easy out should they actually go through with it. Also pretty obvious they don't want kids either, so another easy flag to pass on them and avoid that debacle when that comes up.
Gotta give them credit that they let men know ahead of time they just want a smash and pass.
They didn't say they didn't believe in marriage, just taking on the last name. Although I will admit that I have a hard time believing someone was truly committed and a genuine/quality life partner if it would be so appalling to consider it. Adds one less aspect of "skin in the game" in a society that seems to value the bond less and less. Issue is that as far as I can tell this is the current norm for the younger generations.
The problem with feminists is it’s not that simple. They want all the benefits of having a man while making 0 sacrifices. You better believe if a divorce happens the man is getting taken out to the cleaners irregardless of the fairness regarding how hard he worked to get the money, or the reason for divorce. Oh and you’ll need to pay up for a ring, every single vacation, meal and luxury gift that the woman wants but if you have even a simple request such as taking a last name? Now you’re part of the patriarchy.
Yeah if a girl is straightforward that she doesn't want it, then you know it's a pump and dump & you can move on. Honestly this is not a bad outcome as you now know where the relationship is going (or rather where it isn't)
Mine did, it was a deal breaker.
Gentlemen. You really don't want to be in a marriage and raise kids without a wife with your last name. You as men have so much at stake, to protect your wife, look after he best interests and be head of the household, even if you aren't the breadwinner. If she doesn't agree to this, she might not be the woman to want to be with someone long term.
Plus, with kids, imagine your wife not having their last name? Now caveat is I know professional women who keep their last name for work, doctors, etc. BUT, when it comes to family they are Mrs.. so and so.
-There is always the funny anecdote where women don't want to take a "man's" last name, but they want to keep their father's last name.
Yep. When things are comfortable and easy in a relationship it's easy to call it 'an outdated tradition' or that 'we are equal partners' in this relationship or some BS. Let them believe that if they want, but as a man you have to know it isnt true. If when chaos happens and you turn to her in that situation you will lose respect, trust, and your family.
As the male in a marriage you are the rock. Someone is getting sick and dying? You are the support base. There is some external danger? You are the protector. Both of you lose your jobs? You have to find the way to provide. That is your role. New age feminists try to have their cake and eat it too. But why as a man should you be willing to commit your life to your partner and your offspring if they arent even willing to commit their last name?
Lmao bro are you aware that some people's ideal relationship is different from your own? I don't understand the "traditional man's" insatiable desire to define other people's relationships/needs within the mold of his own.
I think the point is these, for the most part, are more traditional views. Men have so much at stake, but women don't have as much at stake? Why is that? What do men have at stake that women don't (taking away money since you said the woman could be the breadwinner). You could argue that it is the opposite - if the marriage doesn't work out, many men get a second, better shot, at marriage. From a societal view, men tend to become more attractive as they age (physically, emotionally and usually financially), whereas a divorced woman over 40 has it much much harder.
How are men protecting their wives in ways that the woman is not doing the same? I honestly haven't been in a physical fight since I was 11, so this hasn't come in to play for me.
Being a man in a relationship is like being enclosed in the 'break in case of an emergency' glass box. No, you arent going to be getting in fights every year. But when shit goes south - and it will over the course of the relationship - you are the one that needs to lead through it
My husband and I took each other’s last names—combined them together. Our marriage is equal on every respect and I could not be more madly in love and devoted to him after being together for 6 years. Nor he to me.
100% true. Obviously you can't ask a girl in a first date if she'd take your name if you got married but lots of other markers will indicate if she's family oriented or not
Most of the girls I have dated wanted my last name.
Most women should want to take their husbands last name. Means you a worth something.
I'm a guy, but losing your lastname just seems so weird to me. Didn't even know it was a thing until I was around 15 years old.
I couldn't ever imagine myself doing that so I'll never ask it of anyone.
Well the idea behind it isn't losing a last name but gaining a new one, as a woman joins her husband's family
Wow, what a PUSSY.
Is that all it took to trigger you?
Well the sex your wife has with her future bull won't be as exciting but that's ok, I'm sure they'll make it work!
Wow you are the fucking definition of boomer (especially as a 2nd year analyst).
What about keeping everything you said the same but you take her name? You have the job, she raises the kids, good old traditional family split of responsibilities, but you take your wife's name as you're also very obsessed with her. How would that sound?
Bruvver Hmmmmm.... Maybe because, in the event that one partner does indeed take the other partner’s last name, it is 99.99% done the way of the women taking the man’s.... But ya go ahead and argue something that <0.01% of the population does to push your poor position.
(In response to your reply, him saying "she's mine" is quite insecure yes haha; however, flipping the argument does not work when it's against 99.99% of common practice).
---
Based and trad-pilled
Do you even earn enough to fund your wacko 1950s worldview lifestyle? lmfao
Agree with you 100%. Too bad those commenting were feed with the feminist bullshit. No surprise that the current western world is also one where most men are sexless and virgins in their 30s.
Well testosterone has been declining in Western men for decades now...along with declining fertility...surprise surprise when you get boys who never grow up to be men
Fucking A, thanks for being a man and saying what should be said. Based af
So successful? I would like to see some facts because last time I checked all these minorities (including latinos who also "value" these traditional family values) are not doing very well
I think it would be nice for her to have my last name. I really like my last name and it means a lot to me. If she kept her family name in a professional setting, I would understand. My aunt uses the name Jane Smith (Doe) on linkedin.
I am not married and there is a chance I might never be.
Had this discussion with various gfs, and the result was about 50-50. Half of them would want to change their family name, the other half would prefer to keep their own.
Personally, I wouldn't want my future wife to take my last name. Not because of some feminist theory or anything. My last name is mine and belongs to me, I don't want to give it to anyone else - I own it just like I own other things in my life.
Also, coming from a family with a lot of medical doctors, scientists and researchers - in many cases the women kept their own name also.
Not really an issue where I am at (HK). Chinese don't change family name. If I have kids I may even have them take my wife's last name. She has a very unusual last name and mine is extremely common.
For all my people saying women who don't change their last name aren't marriage material, my parents marriage of 30+ years would like a word. But in all seriousness, I don't see this as a dealbreaker. It would be nice but its not a huge deal, especially when you are at the point in a relationship where both of you are considering spending the rest of your lives together.
I think its the fact that most women doing this right now dont have good reason, they want to be "independent" of there husbands. Newsflash you should both be able to depend on each other if you are married neither of you should really strive to be "independent" of the other.
If you are equally dependent on each other (which, hopefully those getting married will be), why would one party change their name based on the party's gender? I feel like there is a breakdown of logic here...
I bet your mom has a boyfriend.
lmao yeah bro, my ultra family-oriented, lifelong catholic mother definitely has a boyfriend. You got me there
God brainwashed liberals are the worst
So they dont want to take a mans name, they choose to keep .... their fathers name?
What will your kids be called? At the end of the day the male is responsible for the wellbeing of the family. Doesnt mean he has to earn the most, but when shit goes south it will be your head on the chopping block. That can mean financially, that can mean danger (what happens if your house is on fire), that can mean physically (if you are confronted with a mugger) - the least she can do is take your last name and become one family unit.
The least she can do is take your last name? That's the support you're looking for in all of those scenarios? Also, where do you live and what are you doing? You care about your wife changing her last name (yes hers, not her father's - it's what she was given at birth) in case of a fire or a mugging?!
Also this financial stuff keeps getting brought up. What if she's also financially supportive? What if she comes in with a trust fund?
Better than thoughtless conservatives!
No, it's their name. You know, the name they've been known by their whole life, the one that's part of their identity, the one they've (perhaps) built a life and a career around?
Not always. And you're touching on the justification for all of this without realizing it. When women had no earning power and were reliant on their husband for literal sustenance, they took their husband's name. They lost their own identity and had to forge a new one as an appurtance to their husband.
How does not taking your last name make you less of a family unit? Anyone who is putting this much stock into the appearance of being a family is going to be completely incapable of actually forging a family unit.
What you want is a bunch of dependents you can order around, not a family.
I'm old, compared to college kids, I'm based in NYC, where I grew up(a liberal bastion)
Taking the husbands last name is the norm here too. Only on a handful of occasions has it not been the case. I'm old enough to see that women use this as a shit test or virtue signaling to their friends in their early 20s. To use modern "red pill" lingo.
Accurate. She may not want your name, for the right guy she will. The more you placate these thoughts from women the less they respect you and the unhappier they get. Funny how that works
I agree, dont tell a white night this though they will fight you to the death
What the "norm" is doesn't really matter. If someone wants to keep their name, what's the problem? And even if women are using it to virtue signal... look at this thread! You've got a bunch of guys, most of whom are probably teenagers or in their very early 20s and nowhere near marriage, doing the same exact thing around demanding someone take their name.
People are really bad at examining the rationale for why they do things. Traditional does not mean sanctified. The many sociological reasons women might have taken a husband's name 100 years ago really may not apply anymore. If the only reason you have for why your wife should take your last name is "because that's how it's done" then you really don't have much of an argument at all. Certainly a woman's desire to maintain a large part of her identity is a better justification than an appeal to tradition.
In a lot of European and Asian cultures, you keep your surname as your bloodline is the most important.
Regardless, I wouldn't want my wife to take mine for the sake of taking mine. I wouldn't mind a hyphenated version though. Mine-Hers or vice-versa.
If my wife wanted to take my name I'd be happy about it, wouldn't be upset about it if she didn't though.
The idea of a hyphenated name appeals to me, however, my European last name is complicated and long enough that I wouldn't want to deal with a hyphenated version.
By the time your girlfriend and her friends are 32 and still unmarried because no one other than them thinks that they're special, beautiful, intelligent, brave, and worth giving the world to instead of self-absorbed and annoying af, they'll be desperate to take a dude's last name.
I kind of agree, funny how no women gave a crap about this until the media started pushing it and making it seem like a bad thing to take on a mans last name. In fact most actually really chased it. Being independent of your husband doesnt exactly make it seem like you are wanting to join with him forever
Being independent of your wife's name doesn't exactly make it seem like you are wanting to join her forever.
See how that works? It's not a justification, it's idiocy.
Saying "the media" is pushing something is the last resort of small minded fools. Maybe, just maybe, some of this has to do with the fact that women are more prevalent in the workplace, have the ability to rise higher in said workplace, and a lot of that is tied to the name around which they build their career? You want your wife to take your name because it's a sign she's committed to you, to raising your family, that her priority is that she'll subsume her identity into yours.
Well, guess what? Employers can understand that too. If the explicit reason you want your wife to take your name is so she loses a piece of her own identity and independence, why wouldn't an employer also say "hey, when shit hits the fan, this woman is choosing her husband over her job" and maybe sidetrack her from any possible promotion? And why wouldn't a woman understand that as well?
But her family name dying out is unimportant? You don't see the hypocrisy here, at all?
my wife has not taken my last name and we've been together for 4 presidents (not all of that is marriage). quite frankly I don't care and I always thought it was a bit odd. plenty of other cultures don't do it like india, most of latin america, italy, france, etc., and since she has a beautiful italian last name I've never felt the urge to ask her to do it.
I have plenty of clients where the wives kept their given name and it's never an issue for the kids, even less so if they come from one of the aforementioned cultures. I'm very much for tradition in the sense of monogamy, breastfeeding, no elbows on the table, men do certain things around the house and women do others (my wife is actually more traditional than me on this front), and all of that, but the name change is a uniquely anglo saxon thing, not a YOU MUST DO THIS IF YOU WANT TO HAVE A HAPPY MARRIAGE.
and as for if we talked about it beforehand, I cannot recall, I just remember saying I didn't give a shit whether or not she did
I think it only really needs to be discussed if it's a priority for you. it's on you, the man, to share that if it really matters. I think the more important things that should be discussed are future plans, values, do you want children, where do you want to live, religion, are they a materialistic person versus experiential, etc.
Wow, a sign of a healthy relationship, shocking on this forum.
secrets to a happy relationship
shared values
open communication
regular sex
the rest is gravy
I get that you don't care and your wife probably didn't need to lobby to keep her last name, but did she lobby you at some point and say that it's common for women to keep their names in Italy? My family is originally from Italy, still have a bunch of family that lives there, and grew up in an area where everyone was Italian and/or Irish, and the wife keeping their last name is definitely not a common thing in Italy or in Italian-American culture.
Not trying to be a dick - just genuinely curious where that notion came from.
my notion is not from them, it's from my experience working with various clients from India, Spain, Portugal, Mexico, Brazil, Italy, and France. some did take their spouses name, but they were in the minority. perhaps it's regional, or if google is correct, perhaps it's for legal reasons (women aren't allowed to change their surname after marriage, just add on the husband's) - https://time.com/3940094/maiden-married-names-countries/
but nah, it wasn't any pressure from the in laws, and actually I'm the odd man out there, my only point was that it's not as uncommon as people may perceive and in some cultures (perhaps Italy less so than Spain or Brazil) it's actually rarer for the wife to take the husband's name. look no further than the king and queen of Spain, she doesn't have any of his names
I've also thought more about this in the past 24 hours and this may be selection bias as many of my clients who were females already had their own careers/success, so perhaps if my clients weren't of that ilk my sample would look differently (for the italians and french mainly, I still stand by spanish and brazilian)
I don't think this is only a WASP thing to do.
Quite frankly, it's weird not to take the husband's name.
In that case we're weird and happy
do you bro
why is it weird?
My wife also didn't take my last name. She comes from a different culture and was just really attached to it as she had to leave behind basically everything else from her home country. Our kid has my last name.
Sounds like she is probably a little feminist or anti men. I mean I dont want to get married anytime soon but what is the point in getting married if your wife isnt willing to do that and join you together? You are her husband why would she want to be independent of you, dont encourage that behavior.
Why don’t you take her name? To show you want to be “one family”. There are some pretty strong (and to me ridiculous, but realize everyone is different) views here, including lots of assumptions and what to me comes off as negative views of women (women can also make money, shocking).
I didn’t care about the name. My wife is successful, has a career and wants to keep her name, great. She doesn’t need me in life, she wants to be with me (and vice versa), and that’s all I need. So many people here are focused on these notion that women are somehow dependent on men, I’ve never had that be the case in any relationship I’ve been in.
If my wife doesnt want my name specifically because she wants to be "independent" of me that's not a good sign. We are doing nothing but dating then, why marry at that point? I want her to take my name specifically because of religious reasons but if she is hell bent against that just because it looks a certain way then Id never marry her anyway. The fact that anyone would respond to such a thing with " well why dont you take mine" is petty and I would never consider them because that is a women with a clear mission of being seen as separate from her husband not together.
Well, enjoy watching her get reamed by a couple guys in your marriage bed in the not too distant future. What a great marriage!
Yeah if she's not willing to take your last name, she's not willing to make any level of real compromise in your future marriage. Though such signs should become apparent far before you even need to have a conversation on this while you're dating
My wife took my last name, no hyphens, and there was never any discussion as to any other path. I'll leave those shenanigans to you new dudes.
woahhhhh based and boomer pilled. you are such an alpha bro. all of us gen z folk are huge betas. I wish i could be a real man like you some day
You are a simp
You are a future c*ck, if not a current one
Don't agree with a lot of what you say but gotta admire this
my gf hates her dad so it was an easy sell lol
Would never date or marry a girl not willing to take my last name.
My wife has the same last name as me so was never a problem. Plus, we both like being Targaryens.
Truly didn't care. Not sure why I would. A word on a document doesn't define values, our communication, etc. I honestly felt similarly (though less so) about even getting married (very happy we did).
My wife ended up taking my last name. It was important to her to go through the motions of "we are a family." And I get it. But again, when I asked her if she would change her last name, and she said yes, my response was okay, cool, whatever you want.
When you have kids, having the same last name does make it 100x easier. If she were to travel alone with them, she would need documentation showing she was their mother. Having the same last name for school purposes simplifies the process, etc.
She kept her last name for work / professional.
My personal view is if it means so much to you for her to take your last name, you should be asking yourself why and analyzing that reason
This is a really good point. My mom kept her last name and told me this was a common issue at my school when I was a kid so she hyphenated it. I didn't realize this why until I was older.
Bro you are hanging out with the wrong women...All my married couple friends had the wive take the last name of the man and it was no issue.
From what I know (as someone in their 20s in NYC), this is no longer the norm but the exception. Hence why I was curious to see what everyone thinks. I tend to agree with your point but seems like some of the social changes in the younger generations paint a different reality.
I'm in my twenties too. You just have fringey feminist friends.
But who cares? Why do you even care if your wife takes your last name? What does that add to your life or your happiness?
This is what I don't understand. If you (generically) are getting that much pleasure from your wife taking your last name, then maybe examine why that is. Why should it matter? It has nothing to do with you!
Ozy you are such a massive simp. Here you are with like 20 comments stating that it's the root of all evil that a woman should take a man's last name when they get married...seriously, is Drumpfy your alternate account? I could see how a guy who feels the need to post 20x on one page would also make alternate accounts spouting the same feminist, soy boy ideology in hopes that it'll get them laid
Shit, I almost called off the wedding when she balked at taking my first name too. Also got her to change her middle name so the initials would be the same. The synergies with monogrammed clothing alone is worth it. Also, make sure you get that dowry, wives are a serious financial burden.
So many garbage takes here. I don't care either way, but I just don't see the point of changing a name. Like what is the reason for women to do it? How is someone a "man-hater" if they simply want to keep the name they always had. It is so weird that we want women to change their legal identity to get married. You can still have defined and traditional gender roles without a name change a la latin america and other places if that is important. It is also extremely reasonable that someone who had a 20-30 year identity wouldn't want to shed that, and I can't imagine shedding my identity either. There don't seem to be many reasons to change names apart from having a cohesive family unit when kids are involved, and with the prevalence of divorce, a name seems the least of our worries on that societal front....
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