Title. Incoming summer intern at a place where it has historically been difficult to secure return offers due to headcount.
What are people's thoughts on me asking right at the beginning if they have headcount for a return? I want to know as early as possible so that I can begin networking during the internship and land something for FT.
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Demonstrate that you can do the job first. Then ask.
appreciate the response and your time. when do you think i should ask assuming that my feedback is all positive?
Settle down. You haven't even started yet. If you're not networking regardless of return offer availability, you're doing it wrong and frankly wouldn't deserve one even if they did have it. It's not an "if then", it's something you should prioritize naturally.
did you mean that i should be nextworking externally at all times? if my current intern place found out, wouldn't that complete eliminate my chances of a return since they would feel like I don't want a return?
Externally & internally, this entire career is defined by your ability to build a network not an excel model or slide deck. I'm not talking about networking in the college kid sense of "let me talk to as many people as possible so I can hopefully find an internship/job" but to actually develop contacts across numerous fields who you can recommend to other people, go to for insights, and of course eventually to ask for favors/look to for job opportunities. You obviously don't open conversations with "are you guys hiring?" or only speak to them under such pretenses. No internship in the history of ever has fired a kid for networking in the real sense of the word.
Bad take. You think this kid automatically doesn’t “deserve” a return spot just because he doesn’t automatically assume he needs to be networking 24/7 while working a job he’s trying to perform his best in? Really?
It’s objectively bad advice to tell this kid it’s a good idea to ask about a return offer from the start or before he’s even started. This is maybe par for the course in banking but I think can only harm your chances vs support them. We take on interns every year, and while there’s no formal pipeline of providing interns analyst offers post-grad, if you’re impressive we will bring it up and make a seat for you.
At the very least, wait until you’ve shown what you can do closer to the end of your internship. As someone hiring said intern, I’m less inclined to even give you a real answer tbh. Think about it this way as well. If you ask me if there’s availability to convert to full-time and I say NO before you’ve even started, how invested do you think this intern will be in actually giving a shit vs showing up whenever (which certainly happens).
I don't think anyone in this industry "deserves" anything unless they operate the assumption that their network is the biggest thing that brings them value (aside from subject matter expertise obv). I didn't say the kid needs to be putting off work to go out of their way to have random fucking coffee chats about other job/internship opportunities - that's not what networking is. But getting a job, especially nowadays, if a knife fight and a numbers game so any sensible graduate should be taking every possible opportunity to create contacts they can approach should the need arise unless they're some nepo baby with dad's rolodex encoded into their DNA. This is IB/PE, when you're junior everyone knows that there's another opportunity around the corner and isn't about to penalize you just for speaking to people. If they're dumb enough to be spreading around they're looking for a job/not expecting to stay at their current one in a way that gets back to their bosses that's a competency problem.
I think it’s fine to ask if there’s a theoretical chance. Or you can simply tell them that you’d love to be FT etc if the opportunity was there but that you understand it’s very difficult, so if they could do you the courtesy to let you know if they decide against you at any point it’d be great so you have your expectations managed and can allocate some time to FT opportunities
The thing is, there is always a seat if you’re good enough.
boomer ahhh take - "Just go in and show that manager whos boss!!!"
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