College Student interested in learning to Trade

Is this a real question? You're not just going to walk in and get a trading job because you say you know what you're doing. I'd suggest you use the search function and go through the archives

I mean, the kid's willing to give the learning process FOUR WHOLE MONTHS while he's kicking back over the summer.

I'd be surprised if Goldman and Morgan Stanley didn't get into a bidding war over this kid in the fall.

After all, he watches CNBC all day, every day.

First lesson of trading, kid: Develop thick skin.

I'm not sure you can really "learn to trade". I guess you can buy one of those scams they advertise on CNBC?

But seriously, your best bet would probably be to read the news, learn about catalysts in certain markets and develop a view on everything (FX, rates, equities) based on what you read.

And change your god damn username you ASU f*ckin meat head

Don't worry I have a sense of humor, I would have slapped myself if i re-read my first post. I'll look into getting that book, I have a couple of Kramer's books but havn't found all the time in the world to complete them due to school. When learning the fundamentals should I really start with the series 7?, because I have a copy. Or is there a better resource such as online class or good stocks for dummies or something like that? i really would like something hands on but can't find too much in my budget in my area. i'm going to check out the other discussion now. Thanks for your help Edmundo.

unless you have to pass the test.

The real world is so different from what you need to know to pass the test, it is ridiculous. So study the material if you have to pass the test, otherwise look for real world instruction.

In response to your previous post I'll give you my story.

When I was 15, I thought that I was the smartest person in the world and could easily get rich in the stock market. My parents let me open up an account, and I quickly proceeded to blow out my 10k account (that's a lot of money for a 15 year old). I got pretty pissed off and only then did I develop the necessary mindset to learn how to trade. I also picked up amateur bodybuilding to structure my life around discipline.

Judging from the absolute ignorance that you showed in the first post as well as the fact that you're an ASU frat boy, I can't say that you've displayed either the intellect or discipline so far in your life necessary to be a profitable trader.

Basically, you have a very flawed perception of trading at the moment, and I can't suggest going into it until you are 1) willing to lose plenty of money or 2) change your mindset.

Kramer? you better look into a character named tim sykes as well. I hear he is up a few hundred percent this year. He's probably the greatest trader ever. I can't believe he's selling his trades for $30/month, what a steal!

Monkeyface, you're an idiot. Do you think traders are born with an understanding of fundamentals/technicals/macro-top down,bottom up, valuation techniques, indicators, ratios, etc?

For equities read the great fundamental guys...Lynch, Buffet, Graham. I also think Cramer is worth reading. Read WSJ, smartmoney, bloomberg etc. Just realize that trading your PA is very different from traditional prop trading at a traditional BB or buyside shop but it will at least get you comfortable with valuing companies/stocks/bonds.

Damn MIT Trader you must be on your steroid cycle...

Pick what you want to trade, read everything you can about trading and that product specifically, trade using a practice account then move to the real thing when you are ready

funnymentals! - Richard Dennis

They stopped working in September

Junkbond: At least reference something in my post that you thought made me sound like an "idiot". Besides, you just echoed my advice which was to read the news...does that also make you an idiot?

This link and the products sold here is all you need to learn how to be a top 1% of the world's traders

www.timothysykes.com

I think someone mentioned this above but failed to provide link

Thanks algorithMIT Trader, junkbondswap, and trailmix8. I was looking for personal stories and i'm going to also check out timothy skykes and try get some of his material. And for the people that hate that I was in a fraternity.. 1) you don't know me 2) that's how I got into the industry 3)I did it mainly to network.. don't judge. And AlgorithMIT Trader I do appreciate your input about your past experience, that's what I was looking for in this forum (personal experiences when you were young). I am willing to loose money, I just need to make more first. And about the ASU frat boy? I wake up every morning at 5 to watch the market go to school and work my ass off at Northwestern Mutual Financial, my mind set has changed.. and that's why i'm looking to learn more in the summer.

Do not get Tim Sykes shit, MIT was joking

Sigmachi5:

Hey everyone.

I am going to graduate school this spring and am very interested in learning how to trade. I am looking to travel and take it more easy this summer and most likely try to start at a financial firm in the fall. I've had experience such as an internship with Merrill and 2 small private firms on NYSE and AMEX. I would just like to hear where people learned how to trade at a young age.. whether reading books, attending seminars, online classes, or mentors? etc. ? I work for Northwestern Mutual Financial right now but dealing more with insurance and annuities.

Thanks for your help

Northwestern Mutual? I guess u had one of those sales job. You better off to be a salesperson than a trader. Plus your frat personality can be a bonus in out going personality shared by all good sales.

Don't listen to anyone telling you Timothy Sykes is a joke, they're just trying to keep all his secrets to themselves. Dude is up 260%, obviously no amount of money is too much to pay for his material.

Hey man, don't mind some of the guys on the forum...they aren't getting laid. I'd be bitter too if I thought that my degrees and job would make it rain vagina.

But hopefully I'm wrong and they were just giving you a NYC rib. If you ever work in this city, you'll see what I mean. Its kinda like how you would talk to the pledges sans the good humor but twice the douchebaggery.

But back to your question....

bondarb had a great post about trading. Search for it and read his archive. good info

I know eastcoast mentality, if I wasn't so new to this i'd rip on all the haters but i'm just trying to network and be friendly. ANYWAYS,I only came to Arizona to party, get laid, and meet new people and i don't regret it for a second. Now it's time to buckle down and work hard. I actually did work in NYC and lived in northern NJ up until college,(funny story one of my friends messaged me yesterday who works at Barclay's in the city. Read my profile and knew it was me haha)thanks drex, summa, and alpha i appreciate the posts. Sigma chi's working at NWM..?? no clue, but that's interesting. Nationwide we are top 3, but to answer the question..it's because alumni take care of eachother, that's why 70% of politicians and presidents have been apart of greek life or secret societies.

Good book... Alexandra Robins- secret of the tomb, skull and bones, the ivy league, and hidden paths of power. Read it, and you'll know where i'm coming from.

Ps- elitetrader looks like it'll keep me busy for a while, even after a long ass day.. take care everyone

I already wrote the definitive thread on how to learn to trade! ...i copied and pasted it below. ...I do love a dude from New Jersey, going to ASU, and having his fraternity as his screen name...if ur going to embody a stereotype u might as well take it all the way! But seriously, good luck..i wish i was going to college in Arizona right now.

Here is how you learn about trading: 1) Have at least 5k. If you dont have that then get it somehow. Sell drugs, suck dick, etc. 2) Set up an account on Interactive Brokers that allows your to trade futures. 3) Pick one product that has a small sized contract...when i did this I could only trade at night so I picked Hang Seng Index Futures. 4) Read up on the leverage inherent in futures and create a risk management plan...ie how you are going to size trades, use stops, add to positions, etc. notice you do this before you know anything about the market because it is by far the most important part of being a good trader. Discipline is what is going to make you a good trader not brilliant ideas. On 5k you will probably be trading 1 lots...ie 1 contract. That is fine. 5) Learn how to account for your performance. Every day you should know how much you made or lost and have a good log of it. Not what the broker sends you...you should do it yourself and use them as a check. You are your own back-office and middle-office. 5) Learn the interactive brokers execution platform inside and out. The IB platform is not much different then one I use at a large hedge fund so when your done with this you should be able to execute in a professional manner. 6) Learn everything about the market you trade. For the case of hong Kong if thats what you picked you should know how the central bank works in that country, the politics, the composition of the stock index, valuations, etc. This will take awhile. Start by finding a local newspaper to read every day. Then go to the central bank website. Find yourself an economic calendar that shows what data is coming out in your market (they are not hard to find for free). Start very basic. Notice that you do this only after you are ready to handle all the real business of trading. Also, you should do this even if you intend on trading using mostly technical analysis...it will help. 7) Start trading. Be careful. Your goal #1, #2, and #3 is preservation of capital. This is a learning experience you arent going to get rich trading 1 lots. Trade defensively at first. If you turn out to be a good trader what you think is defensive now you will probably realize later was insane so heir on the side of caution. 8) If you actually do all these steps you will be a better trader and know more about markets then most kids do AFTER they complete an analyst or associate stint on a sales and trading desk...i gaurantee it. 9) Remember what you are doing is learning a trade...you arent learning how to sell bonds to dumb central banks or how to kiss some bankers ass you are learning a skill that few have and makes you very valuable if you become good at it. Treat your work with due seriousness and you will be paid back many-fold.

For anyone that does decide to follow the above advice I HIGHLY recommend Velocity Futures and using the X_Trader Platform for futures trading. It is basically the industry standard for futures trading and far superior to Interactive Brokers. Aside from that follow his advice.

...agree that it is better the IB...i just didnt realize any retail brokers that provide a range of products would let you trade on it for free. IB made it really easy for me to get setup at low cost...but this was more then 5 years ago now!

Bondarb, I enjoyed reading all you had to say.. someone earlier actually told me to check out your forum discussion, I just didn't get a chance to search for it. I do already have an account with Ameritrade, you still think I should switch over to Interactive Brokers/ or X Trader? I looked at both for about an hour last night, it might also be a preferance thing (between IB and XTrader) but i'll do some more research about both of them... I checked out sykes as well, dude seems like a badass...probably would be way too risky for me at this point because i'm starting with the basics, but i'm following his next attempt to turn 13,000 to 1.65m. Anyways, thanks for the advice.

you forgot "fully audited pretax sum"

IB are solid they give you access to basically every market on the planet under one platform.

As a further aside to bondarb's post I pose a couple questions to you first. What do you want to trade? Stocks Futures and FX are your main 3 choices for now. You could do options but your transaction costs are going to be high and that requires more capital if you want to do the more advanced strategies.

If you want to trade stocks you get 5k and open a retail prop account (if available) with firms such as

Use the following link for you to begin your research on a Equity/Futures Broker http://www.elitetrader.com/br I hate sending traffic over to ET but WSO is not really made for the independent traders.

Brokers Lightspeed (What I use) Genesis Assent Interactive Brokers

If you want to trade futures which it sounds like your interested in, follow bondarbs advice and pick an execution platform broker, and a product.

Brokers- Velocity Futures Interactive Brokers Global Futures Tradestation Alaron Ninja Trader

Platforms - The platform is what you use to physically execute your trades on.

X_Trader IB - TWS Ninja Trader CQG J-Trader (I hated this I used it when i was with Global Futures)

In addition if want charting really the standard is Esignal. If that is too pricey you can check out Sierra Charts, QuoteTracker. Just go on elite trader and start doing research everyone has their own tastes.

I personally use Lightspeed with Esignal for Charting.

lol@Tim Sykes you are ridiculous to think a guy is good because he is lucky.

check out his myspace: http://www.myspace.com/richassjew I'm not kidding, that is his myspace.

He started a hedge fund, it closed down because of one investment which made him lose 1/3 of the money in the fund. The guy is an amateur.

This TinyURL redirects to:

<a href="http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sarcasm">http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sarcasm</a>

Many of the above posts regarding sykes were sarcastic but sigmachi's didn't seem like it.

Actually Leeson WAS killing it last I heard.

haha I didn't realize how much of a joke sykes was until I watched his rap video and saw his interview with his myspace name being "rich ass jew." Dude showed up in a robe to an award party for top trader under 30..I learned enough in finance classes to not mess with penny stocks, he's entertaining that's all.. brings some lovin' and sunrays to people sitting in cubicals stroking themselves..Glad there's people out there who arn't totally stone cold serious all the time

i know trading with real money is much different but is there any site where i could get a live feed to use with a reasonably decent platform to paper trade without holding 5k in the account? wouldn't mind paying a small amount for the feed.

Lightspeed.

thanks for the quick reply, call me a noob but i see the $18/mo for feeds but it says i need to open a cash account with 10k unless there is another way to download the platform

Monkeyface, I didnt think I needed to actually reference your moronic comment but here it is "I'm not sure you can really "learn to trade". Trading is no different than riding a bike or jerking off...these are skills that are learned and honed over time.

I would open an online brokerage account (scottrade/etrade are simple enough and provide you with all of the tools that you need to set up a PA). Trading lessons are much more meaningful when you have skin in the game so if you can open up a small account 5k-10k and open 5 positions you would be better off. Otherwise, just back test some of your ideas and build a spread sheet that has buy date, price, # of shares, cost of purchase, hypo sell price/date, profit/loss (tax consequences), annualized return, etc. Familiarize yourself with all of the important industry multiples and buy things that you are familiar with. PM me if you have any specific questions.

Monkeyface, just messing with you Everyone have a good Thursday night

the title of the thread interested me as i would like to start trading more as i finish up college and will have some money to play with.

Is there a certain amount of time it takes "guru's" to prove themselves like this Tim Sykes guy?

or is it just better to follow something like alphaclone?

Sigmachi5:

I work for Northwestern Mutual Financial right now

If you enjoy the sales side you should also consider that, especially if you don't have the quant skills to get through trading interviews which can be pretty tough, especially if you're coming from a non-target

Sigmachi5:

Hey everyone.

I am going to graduate school this spring and am very interested in learning how to trade. I am looking to travel and take it more easy this summer and most likely try to start at a financial firm in the fall. I've had experience such as an internship with Merrill and 2 small private firms on NYSE and AMEX. I would just like to hear where people learned how to trade at a young age.. whether reading books, attending seminars, online classes, or mentors? etc. ? I work for Northwestern Mutual Financial right now but dealing more with insurance and annuities.

Thanks for your help

I came across this post looking for something else, but I was so appalled by the BS you have been given by other that I felt compelled to reply.

History Lesson: 10 year ago I sat down and decided I was going to learn to trade. It took me 3 years before I knew what it is I needed to know and other 3 years learning what I needed to know. It was So HARD! I sat in front of the screen for 3 years, taking notes, studying charts, and no listening to anyone who said they could trade. I now know how to trade and have an income beyond my wildest imaginings.. All the time and effort (and poverty) was so worth it....Trading can be learnt, but you have to nearly go mad learning it.
All the best to you,, AU